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Author Topic: Commission agreed to $62, app error. Can I get the money back?  (Read 195 times)
1Game1Over (OP)
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October 06, 2025, 01:25:45 AM
 #1

Bitcoin Client Software and Version Number: Electrum 4.6.2
Operating System: Android 14
System Hardware Specs: Samsung S23 Ultra
Description of Problem:
I sent 0.00057092
The commission was 0.00000172
0.00007092 came to my wallet.
Please return the money. The commission was 80% deposit. How did this happen?
Please help.

Any Related Addresses: bc1qqs7jtca2xhcl2khk4z3mgm4w2d99ll9k99peqn
Any Related Transaction IDs: ee26b424ae4329beb570ed0821f481cfe4c86543abf72f6f75382012a3a3d856
Screenshot of the problem: https://imgur.com/a/oatWIlB
Log Files from the Bitcoin Client: Sorry, I don't know where to watch it.

P.S. I don't know the address. It automatically went into my payment -
bc1qhk005gllfhq34n2ckn4r5v6p4xnew6yx4m0fyv
LoyceV
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October 06, 2025, 09:10:57 AM
Merited by ABCbits (1)
 #2

You probably created an Electrum "Wallet with two-factor authentication". Then this happens:
It's a business model, partially earning from people who don't read:
Image loading...
I've seen many topics about this.

I think the "small fee" is misleading though: pay 0.0005 BTC every 20 transactions: that's $56.60! I wouldn't call that a "small fee" (even when divided by 20).

¡uʍop ǝpᴉsdn pɐǝɥ ɹnoʎ ɥʇᴉʍ ʎuunɟ ʞool no⅄
1Game1Over (OP)
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October 06, 2025, 09:42:43 AM
 #3

You probably created an Electrum "Wallet with two-factor authentication". Then this happens:
It's a business model, partially earning from people who don't read:
https://loyce.club/other/Electrum2FA.png
I've seen many topics about this.

I think the "small fee" is misleading though: pay 0.0005 BTC every 20 transactions: that's $56.60! I wouldn't call that a "small fee" (even when divided by 20).

Thank you for the advice.

I've used the 2FA wallet several times before, and there's never been such a big commission.
When choosing a transaction, I checked that the fee was minimal, Bitcoin address, and sent the money. I didn't specify any other addresses in the transaction.
But most of the money went to an unused Bitcoin address.
If you look at the old 2FA transactions, the recipient's address is the same. There were two of them in this transaction.
I hope the technical support will help bring them back.
Do you think I can get my money back?
ABCbits
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October 06, 2025, 09:51:34 AM
 #4

I've used the 2FA wallet several times before, and there's never been such a big commission.

Price of 2FA service haven't changed in many years, which is fixed rather than considering amount of Bitcoin you own/send. Although you only pay the cost every 20 or 100 TX, depending on your past choice.

Do you think I can get my money back?

You can give it a try. But i don't remember anyone claim they got their money back after creating 2FA wallet without knowledge about price of their 2FA service.

1Game1Over (OP)
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October 06, 2025, 10:44:25 AM
 #5

I've used the 2FA wallet several times before, and there's never been such a big commission.

Price of 2FA service haven't changed in many years, which is fixed rather than considering amount of Bitcoin you own/send. Although you only pay the cost every 20 or 100 TX, depending on your past choice.

Do you think I can get my money back?

You can give it a try. But i don't remember anyone claim they got their money back after creating 2FA wallet without knowledge about price of their 2FA service.

That's right.
The settings include a payment choice for every 100 transactions.

I've got a confusing story.
I made a transfer with payment for every 20 transactions, saw a high commission, and canceled the transfer.
The money went back to the wallet.
I changed the settings to pay for every 100 transactions and made a new transfer, with a minimum fee.
I guess there was a problem with the high commission because of this situation.
The money went to an address that has never been used and may not be used.
The money is frozen, as far as I'm concerned.
I'd like to try to get my money back. It's not a small amount for me now.

Tell me who I can ask for help?

Thank you.
LoyceV
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October 06, 2025, 10:55:42 AM
 #6

I'd like to try to get my money back. It's not a small amount for me now.
Tell me who I can ask for help?
If it's sent to Trustedcoin, they're the only ones who can help you.

Tip for next time: always click "Preview" before sending a transaction.

¡uʍop ǝpᴉsdn pɐǝɥ ɹnoʎ ɥʇᴉʍ ʎuunɟ ʞool no⅄
1Game1Over (OP)
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October 06, 2025, 04:46:09 PM
 #7

I'd like to try to get my money back. It's not a small amount for me now.
Tell me who I can ask for help?
If it's sent to Trustedcoin, they're the only ones who can help you.

Tip for next time: always click "Preview" before sending a transaction.

Support comment  trustedcoin

2FA is not a free service (this is outlined during wallet creation and in the first send dialog) and charges fees (in batches of 20 -  0.000025 BTC/tx * 20 txs = 0.0005 BTC) for spending transactions.   This service charges in batches because bitcoin network fees make charging small amounts impractical.

Given your batch payment, you will not be charged for the next 19 outgoing transactions.  Beyond that, you can avoid paying any 2FA fees by restoring your wallet from its seed phrase and choosing the option during restoration to disable 2FA.
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October 06, 2025, 04:46:39 PM
 #8

This is just a plus advice, before you lock this thread which I believe you should, buy a Trezor hardware wallet or something similar, I don't know what  you are trying to do with that electrum wallet that result in this lose and I hope the team help you out but reading about google authenticator and someone keeping your last key of 3 in the cloud turned my stomach upside down, start saving up for a hardware wallet, they offer better security and I want you to do some research on bitcoin wallets first, take care.
1Game1Over (OP)
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October 06, 2025, 04:52:20 PM
 #9

This is just a plus advice, before you lock this thread which I believe you should, buy a Trezor hardware wallet or something similar, I don't know what  you are trying to do with that electrum wallet that result in this lose and I hope the team help you out but reading about google authenticator and someone keeping your last key of 3 in the cloud turned my stomach upside down, start saving up for a hardware wallet, they offer better security and I want you to do some research on bitcoin wallets first, take care.

Thank you for the advice. I'll get acquainted with it.
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October 06, 2025, 05:03:59 PM
 #10

This is just a plus advice, before you lock this thread which I believe you should, buy a Trezor hardware wallet or something similar, I don't know what  you are trying to do with that electrum wallet that result in this lose and I hope the team help you out but reading about google authenticator and someone keeping your last key of 3 in the cloud turned my stomach upside down, start saving up for a hardware wallet, they offer better security and I want you to do some research on bitcoin wallets first, take care.
There is nothing wrong with electrum wallet, and the 2fa service in electrum is offered by Trustedcoin and it is not a free service. If OP had read the message before creating the wallet, he would have seen that there is a fee attached, as Trusted coin, which is the 2fa service provider have to sign your transactions as a co-signer, and they don't do it for free. OP, you can restore your wallet with your seed phrase and disable 2fa.

That said, there is nothing wrong in getting an open source hardware wallet, because electrum in itself is an online wallet. And except it is created in an airgapped device, it is safer to store your bitcoins in cold storage.

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1Game1Over (OP)
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October 06, 2025, 05:18:56 PM
 #11

This is just a plus advice, before you lock this thread which I believe you should, buy a Trezor hardware wallet or something similar, I don't know what  you are trying to do with that electrum wallet that result in this lose and I hope the team help you out but reading about google authenticator and someone keeping your last key of 3 in the cloud turned my stomach upside down, start saving up for a hardware wallet, they offer better security and I want you to do some research on bitcoin wallets first, take care.
There is nothing wrong with electrum wallet, and the 2fa service in electrum is offered by Trustedcoin and it is not a free service. If OP had read the message before creating the wallet, he would have seen that there is a fee attached, as Trusted coin, which is the 2fa service provider have to sign your transactions as a co-signer, and they don't do it for free. OP, you can restore your wallet with your seed phrase and disable 2fa.

That said, there is nothing wrong in getting an open source hardware wallet, because electrum in itself is an online wallet. And except it is created in an airgapped device, it is safer to store your bitcoins in cold storage.
You're right.
Unfortunately, I didn't see, read, or imagine that I would have a commission of 19 transactions in advance for one transaction.
This information is nowhere to be found.

I want to add more. That I conducted 2 2 transfers with 2FA protection and the commission was minimal.
So minimal that I thought it was a translation fee.

In my case, the system counted the payment for every 20 transactions instead of 100. And that's the question, why did the wallet work so well when the settings selected payment for 100 transactions?
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October 07, 2025, 05:30:15 AM
Merited by LoyceV (12), Pmalek (3), ABCbits (2)
 #12

In my case, the system counted the payment for every 20 transactions instead of 100. And that's the question, why did the wallet work so well when the settings selected payment for 100 transactions?
By saying "work so well" do you mean that it didn't charge for its 2FA fee while it's set to 'per 100txns'?

If so, its Electrum plugin code indicates that if the input(s) in a transaction doesn't have enough bitcoins to cover for the batched 2fa fee, it wont charge for that transaction.
Based from your transaction's input of ‎0.00057269 BTC which isn't enough to pay 0.00125 BTC, it looks like the case.
Here's the plugin trustedcoin.py: /electrum/plugins/trustedcoin/trustedcoin.py#L324-L330

1Game1Over (OP)
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October 07, 2025, 02:34:43 PM
 #13

Bitcoin Client Software and Version Number: Electrum 4.6.2
Operating System: Android 14
System Hardware Specs: Samsung S23 Ultra
Description of Problem:
I sent 0.00057092
The commission was 0.00000172
0.00007092 came to my wallet.
Please return the money. The commission was 80% deposit. How did this happen?
Please help.

Any Related Addresses: bc1qqs7jtca2xhcl2khk4z3mgm4w2d99ll9k99peqn
Any Related Transaction IDs: ee26b424ae4329beb570ed0821f481cfe4c86543abf72f6f75382012a3a3d856
Screenshot of the problem: https://imgur.com/a/oatWIlB
Log Files from the Bitcoin Client: Sorry, I don't know where to watch it.

P.S. I don't know the address. It automatically went into my payment -
bc1qhk005gllfhq34n2ckn4r5v6p4xnew6yx4m0fyv

Another answer to trustedcoin's technical support.

"Sorry but because the 2FA fee was cited during the wallet creation process, we do not offer refunds."

Thank you all for your attention. The topic can be closed.

2FA burn in hell.
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October 08, 2025, 01:24:00 PM
 #14

Another answer to trustedcoin's technical support.

"Sorry but because the 2FA fee was cited during the wallet creation process, we do not offer refunds."

Thank you all for your attention. The topic can be closed.

2FA burn in hell.


There's no reason to be angry at a service that offered you 2FA, and you accepted it without realizing it was a paid service. Now that you know what it's all about, you can create a new wallet without 2FA and you won't have to pay anything for your outgoing transactions anymore.

On the other hand, I believe that 2FA has saved many who have compromised their wallets over the years, and who knows, maybe it has saved you too.

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October 09, 2025, 07:26:22 AM
 #15

Since you have already paid for it, you can as well use the remaining 19 2FA-supported transactions that you have left in your wallet. Electrum and TrustedCoin won't charge you again until you have completed that batch of transactions. Be more careful in the future. It's for your own good. You would have spotted this if you previewed your trasaction before signing it.

If you want to get rid of that 2FA wallet immediately then you can do that by recovering your wallet from seed and turning off 2FA. This time, read what is shown to you on screen. If you want to stay with Electrum, use standard wallets and not 2FA wallets.

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October 26, 2025, 07:32:50 PM
Merited by ABCbits (2)
 #16

2FA burn in hell.
Just because you're not willing to gather all available information, you're mad. Seriously?

One could argue, that the service cost could be presented at an earlier stage, but It's all available when you're not deliberately blind.

Here are the main steps (some unimportant for 2FA may be missing) for anyone who hasn't seen it with the current version of Electrum 4.6.2 on Linux.

You decide to create a 2FA wallet here:


In the first Disclaimer there's a first mention that the service isn't for free:


After generation of mnemonic recovery words and verification you can reproduce those, TrustedCoin presents you a more detailed Terms and conditions which I quote below the screenshots for completeness. You shouldn't skip to read those, although the price isn't mentioned there.

After scanning QR code with your TOTP Authenticator (Google or similar ones like 2FAS) and verification your smartphone generates the correct code...


This is how Wallet Information looks like (Master Public Key and BIP32 root fingerprint have been blurred):


After setup when you click on the TrustedCoin icon in the bottom right corner, you see the fee per tx AND that you pay in batches, the latter for those who can read and understand the subtle semantics that you pay for 20 or 100 transactions in advance "prepaid" of course:



This is the address shown in the TrustedCoin Information: https://api.trustedcoin.com/#/electrum-help
Here you see clearly the price to pay and how all works. One should definitely take a closer look here. It's funny how people seem to ignore terms and conditions and complain or act mad only after stumbling over their own ignorance.

BTW, you can close the thread yourself. Why burden a moderator with such a task.




Quote from: TrustedCoin Terms and conditions
Electrum Two-Factor Authentication Terms and Conditions of Use

1. Terms

By accessing this service, you are agreeing to be bound by these Terms and Conditions of Use, all applicable laws and regulations, and agree that you are responsible for compliance with any applicable local laws.  If you do not agree with any of these terms, you are prohibited from using service.

2. TrustedCoin's service

TrustedCoin does not send or receive money. We cosign bitcoin transactions, and transmit them to the bitcoin network. By using TrustedCoin, you can inform the bitcoin network that you are transferring bitcoin previously associated with your bitcoin account to another bitcoin account. TrustedCoin cannot be used to cancel or reverse bitcoin-to-bitcoin transactions, as long as said transactions are accepted and confirmed on the bitcoin network.

TrustedCoin requires multiple private cryptographic keys to be associated with each bitcoin account. TrustedCoin controls only one of these private keys, and cannot initiate a bitcoin transaction unless you authorize the request by signing the transaction with one of your private cryptographic keys.

It is your responsibility to secure your private keys.  If you lose all the private keys associated with your account, neither you nor TrustedCoin will be able to access your funds.

You must be at least 18 years old, or such age required by applicable law, to register for a TrustedCoin account.

3. Integration with 3rd-Party Wallets

For customers of our two-factor authentication integration with 3rd-party wallets, you should be aware of some limitations:
    1) If we see too many unsuccessful passcode entries in a row, we may suspend your account for 24 hours.  We offer no way to reenable the account, short of waiting out the suspended state.
    2) If you forget your one-time password generator, we offer no way to recreate it.  You will need to use your second key to move your funds to a new address.

4. Use License

Permission is granted to temporarily download one copy of the materials (information or software) on TrustedCoin's service for personal, non-commercial transitory viewing only. This is the grant of a license, not a transfer of title, and under this license you may not:

    * modify or copy the materials;
    * use the materials for any commercial purpose, or for any public display (commercial or non-commercial);
    * attempt to decompile or reverse engineer any software contained on TrustedCoin's service;
    * remove any copyright or other proprietary notations from the materials; or
    * transfer the materials to another person or "mirror" the materials on any other server.

This license shall automatically terminate if you violate any of these restrictions and may be terminated by TrustedCoin at any time. Upon terminating your viewing of these materials or upon the termination of this license, you must destroy any downloaded materials in your possession whether in electronic or printed format.

5. Disclaimer

The materials on TrustedCoin's service are provided "as is". TrustedCoin makes no warranties, expressed or implied, and hereby disclaims and negates all other warranties, including without limitation, implied warranties or conditions of merchantability, fitness for a particular purpose, or non-infringement of intellectual property or other violation of rights. Further, TrustedCoin does not warrant or make any representations concerning the accuracy, likely results, or reliability of the use of the materials on its Internet web site or otherwise relating to such materials or on any sites linked to this site.

TrustedCoin has no control over, and makes no representations regarding the value of bitcoins, or the security of the bitcoin network. The value of bitcoin can change rapidly, increase or decrease unexpectedly, and potentially even fall to zero. You acknowledge that bitcoin ownership and participation in the bitcoin network involves risk. A bitcoin transaction may be unconfirmed for a period of time (usually less than one hour, but up to one day or longer) and may be never complete if it remains in a pending state      

6. Limitations

No Warranty. USE OF TrustedCoin IS AT YOUR SOLE RISK. TrustedCoin'S SERVICE IS "AS IS", "WITH ALL FAULTS" AND "AS AVAILABLE". TO THE MAXIMUM EXTENT PERMITTED BY APPLICABLE LAW, TrustedCoin MAKES NO (AND SPECIFICALLY DISCLAIMS ALL) REPRESENTATIONS OR WARRANTIES OF ANY KIND, WHETHER EXPRESS, IMPLIED, STATUTORY OR OTHERWISE, INCLUDING, WITHOUT LIMITATION, ANY WARRANTY THAT THE WALLET WILL BE UNINTERRUPTED, ERROR-FREE OR FREE OF HARMFUL COMPONENTS, THAT THE CONTENT WILL BE SECURE OR NOT OTHERWISE LOST OR DAMAGED, OR ANY IMPLIED WARRANTY OF MERCHANTABILITY, SATISFACTORY QUALITY, FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE, OR NON-INFRINGEMENT, AND ANY WARRANTY ARISING OUT OF ANY COURSE OF PERFORMANCE, COURSE OF DEALING OR USAGE OF TRADE. SOME JURISDICTIONS DO NOT ALLOW THE FOREGOING EXCLUSIONS. IN SUCH AN EVENT SUCH EXCLUSION WILL NOT APPLY SOLELY TO THE EXTENT PROHIBITED BY APPLICABLE LAW.

Indemnification. To the extent permitted by applicable law, you agree to indemnify, defend and hold TrustedCoin and its subsidiaries, affiliates, officers, agents, employees, partners, suppliers, and licensors harmless from any claim, action, investigation or demand, including reasonable attorneys' fees, arising out of or relating to: (a) User Content; (b) use of the Service by you or under your account; or (c) your violation of these Terms or of any third party rights. TrustedCoin will use commercially reasonable efforts to notify you of any such claim, action, investigation or demand that is subject to your indemnification obligation.

Limitation of Liability. TO THE FULLEST EXTENT PERMITTED BY LAW, IN NO EVENT WILL TrustedCoin, ITS SUBSIDIARIES, AFFILIATES, OFFICERS, AGENTS, EMPLOYEES, PARTNERS, SUPPLIERS, OR LICENSORS BE LIABLE FOR ANY INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL, PUNITIVE, OR CONSEQUENTIAL DAMAGES (INCLUDING, WITHOUT LIMITATION, DAMAGES FOR LOST PROFITS, REVENUE, GOODWILL, USE OR CONTENT) HOWEVER CAUSED, UNDER ANY THEORY OF LIABILITY, INCLUDING, WITHOUT LIMITATION, CONTRACT, TORT, WARRANTY, NEGLIGENCE OR OTHERWISE, EVEN IF TrustedCoin HAS BEEN ADVISED AS TO THE POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGES.

7. Revisions and Errata

The materials appearing on TrustedCoin's web site could include technical, typographical, or photographic errors. TrustedCoin does not warrant that any of the materials on its web site are accurate, complete, or current. TrustedCoin may make changes to the materials contained on its web site at any time without notice. TrustedCoin does not, however, make any commitment to update the materials.

8. Links

TrustedCoin has not reviewed all of the sites linked to its Internet web site and is not responsible for the contents of any such linked site. The inclusion of any link does not imply endorsement by TrustedCoin of the site. Use of any such linked web site is at the user's own risk.

9. Site Terms of Use Modifications

TrustedCoin may revise these terms of use for its web site at any time without notice. By using this service you are agreeing to be bound by the then current version of these Terms and Conditions of Use.

10. Governing Law

Any claim relating to TrustedCoin's service shall be governed by the laws of the State of California without regard to its conflict of law provisions.

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