trust, or the lack of it.

[WillyAp]

I'm wondering how bitcoins can be used as a business? Maybe it can be integrated in our business but that will still just make it as a payment method and nothing else.

The Saylor Method is a good example to play the system.
He sells shares, buys bitcoin, bitcoin rises, the company shines, sells more shares and so on.

But how to enter it?

1) Natural evolution - volatility is already lowering.
2) Institutional investment.
3) People need to panic less. This could be a consequence of the quite stable long term upward trend. Perhaps in the coming bear people sell less because many hope that if they hodl some years more they will again seeing better profits.
4) Perhaps some products based on moving averages (e.g. a SMA 1000 which basically only moves upwards) could help.
5) Also scalability improvements (Lightning, Ark etc.) could increase the usage of Bitcoin as a currency and thus add an use case. Merchants should love Bitcoin once it's more stable because there is no chargeback risk and no credit card fees ...

So in general I'm optimistic that the "17% ceiling" can be broken but there's still work to do.

The 17% after my understanding is for all Crypto. Bitcoin is much less.
I know people who hold one coin, they had a good year and bought a coin for 50k 
As Exchanges charge the offer of Revolut, N26 is to receive their coins but you cannot do much with it.
So will be many people.

The 17% also are limited to the US. Now is some countries it'll be just 3% while others are pass 25%.
Memecoins and NFT did not help. 
The crypto movement is divided and seem unable to form a organism.
Like exclude harmful tendencies from the crypto main body.

A change of attitude is needed. The attitude that Bitcoin, litecoin, Dash, BCH etc. does not need marketing, well that is not helping.

[sana54210]

I would see bitcoins more like an asset instead of a business. Not trusting bitcoins will never harm bitcoins as it is an entity which works without trust. Bitcoins are fully decentralized. Your trusting or not trusting bitcoins is not going to make a difference because there are thousands of people and institutions who already trust bitcoins and have major holdings. Bitcoins being decentralized makes them trust-able at least for me.

The data you used was published in late 2024. I am sure that after that thousands of Americans have already joined cryptos as crossing $100,000 was a great achievement and has created a hype. I'm sure a lot of people do not want to miss this opportunity and sooner or later, they will join cryptos in some or other way.

[WillyAp]

The data you used was published in late 2024. I am sure that after that thousands of Americans have already joined cryptos as crossing $100,000 was a great achievement and has created a hype.

Yes the data is from 2024, just the price hike won't change much. If between 2017 and 2021 nothing changed why should a hike over 100k move a lot of people? Also the uncertain times don't make people change to crypto. Would be great if they'd change but seemingly so they don't.

Open a page where you get 100 Sats, or any other coin, per solving a game and popularity will grow.

[r_victory]

One way to make it more popular is to use it for the purpose for which it was created, as a currency, a form of payment, because currently it is not popular, but rather famous, and for the wrong reason, it is seen as the "asset" that appreciated by +217518450.41% (according to the CMC). Is it good? Yes, it certainly is, but that doesn't make Bitcoin something that everyone uses, because most people do not understand it.

[348Judah]

Most of us complained a lot about other things, whereas if we are to be in control, ours could be worst, when we are not yet in control of something, then we should not join attacking over it, except we already had a similar experience, trust is not what has been found that easy to get, because at some level of time, even individually, we don't seem to trust on our own self talk less of others, just try to do your best and leave the rest.

[Panos Markovits]

The Saylor Method is a good example to play the system.
He sells shares, buys bitcoin, bitcoin rises, the company shines, sells more shares and so on.

In my opinion Mr. Saylor a sound concept and doesn't disrupt the market price; he buys specifically to balance the balance sheet, and doesn't sell recklessly, creating chaos in the market. Many parties are always waiting for his actions when the market is correcting. Other exchanges, for example, sometimes cheat and often cause BTC prices to fall when they need fresh funds to back up something.

[d5000]

The 17% after my understanding is for all Crypto. Bitcoin is much less.

Yes, that's probably true, although the difference is not "that" big according to estimations I have seen (crypto.com, Triple A and so on). Bitcoin seems to make up about half or a bit more of the user base.

Of course a big part of the rest of the crypto holders (i.e. those who hold altcoins) may be even more speculative-minded people, who may consider Bitcoin "too boring". A Bitcoin with lower volatility would probably not have access to this market. But a low-volatility Bitcoin would have access to the much larger market of those who hold gold, silver and other assets with a risk "score" approximately between fiat's and stocks. If this market can be accessed, that would be huge. And that's why I'm advocating for a low-volatility Bitcoin.

Memecoins and NFT did not help. 

I'm not sure about that. The last memecoin wave seems to have limited impact, that's probably true, but the pandemics wave (2020/21) probably had impact as an "entry drug" for the crypto market. I can imagine some of the NFT investors from back then shift to Bitcoin or at least more solid altcoins.

The crypto movement is divided and seem unable to form a organism.
Like exclude harmful tendencies from the crypto main body.

Here I agree. But I think the divide between premined centralized altcoin projects and decentralized coins like Bitcoin is impossible to close. The interests are too different. On one side, we have a traditional "business" using fancy blockchain tech, while on the other side, we have blockchain tech solving the trust problem of money

So I don't think the creators and (bag)holders of Ethereum, Cardano and friends will eventually advocate for Bitcoin's model to be better.

But perhaps the users will learn (or are learning already, due to the continuously increasing Bitcoin Dominance) which model is better

A change of attitude is needed. The attitude that Bitcoin, litecoin, Dash, BCH etc. does not need marketing, well that is not helping.

I'm divided about "marketing", because we have no central actor who can launch a campaign. Decentralized, intelligent campaigning, like creating "Bitcoin beaches" and so on, is imo instead a good idea, but it should also not become an big expense for Bitcoin companies. What kind of marketing would you propose?

[WillyAp]

So I don't think the creators and (bag)holders of Ethereum, Cardano and friends will eventually advocate for Bitcoin's model to be better.

But perhaps the users will learn (or are learning already, due to the continuously increasing Bitcoin Dominance) which model is better

A change of attitude is needed. The attitude that Bitcoin, litecoin, Dash, BCH etc. does not need marketing, well that is not helping.

I'm divided about "marketing", because we have no central actor who can launch a campaign. Decentralized, intelligent campaigning, like creating "Bitcoin beaches" and so on, is imo instead a good idea, but it should also not become an big expense for Bitcoin companies. What kind of marketing would you propose?

The bag holders could agree to give Crypto a chance to raise awareness that should benefit everyone involved. Choose a jurisdiction where the people in charge are reasonable.

Marketing is not that expensive, there are 100 of people with social media accounts and follower ships or Website owners who gladly would their part and get paid Crypto, BTC or any other coin they dream of.

People have learned but they learned rugpulls, Pump and dump, not the environment people usually feel comfy in. They more confy with bank accounts than with the million wallets we had to go through.

Stagnation is the name of the Game, and Bag-holders of all Crypto can afford a few coins.  Or hours of their time.
if we mange to break the depressive state of finance, Crypto gets more reach.

1st step everyone interested raises his/ her hand.
2nd agree on a plan, payment, when posting should be done, what kind of quality, what is off limit and where.
Who is in charge, (you sound interested how about it?)
3rd lets do it.

In the beginning of bitcoin the marketing gigs where clicks for sats, Pizza for BTC, and other distributor-ship's action.
Which where pretty clearly marketing, just now people got older and instead of wiser they got cautious.  

In my opinion Mr. Saylor a sound concept and doesn't disrupt the market price; he buys specifically to balance the balance sheet, and doesn't sell recklessly, creating chaos in the market.

I didn't complain about Saylor, he does his thing, People celebrate him, which is not his fault.  



 

[HONDACD125]

Bitcoin has reached a point where it doesn't need people to help it increase its adoption, because after a certain point, the popularity of a thing reaches a stage at which it will keep getting free advertisement and promotion, and no one will need to do anything specific to make it reach more people. Bitcoin and cryptocurrencies are everywhere nowadays, and I don't know whether the data you shared is incorrect, outdated or what, but it can't be true that the data don't have much difference from 2021 till today, because the adoption has definitely increased during this period.

Bitcoin was created for a different purpose, but is being used for a different one now. Most people don't even know why Bitcoin was created because all they care about is how they can make money and Bitcoin helps them with that, so they don't do any research about its past and how it all started. People treat Bitcoin as an investment asset only these days, and they trust it because its history shows that it has only kept growing higher after each market cycle due to its limited supply and increasing demand, so people know they can make money if they invest in it.

[WillyAp]

Bitcoin has reached a point where it doesn't need people to help it increase its adoption, because after a certain point, the popularity of a thing reaches a stage at which it will keep getting free advertisement and promotion, and no one will need to do anything specific to make it reach more people.

This kind of thinking made a 5 year stagnation in user-base posible.
It is not the price the trust level implies, 17 % ove the last years and that is about crypto, not even Bitcoin alone.
People seem to be stuck on price, and price alone. Stagnation is not positive. 

[WillyAp]

Peter Thiel hopes that the use of AI makes a difference.

Peter Thiel’s latest warning lands with the weight of a market correction: Artificial Intelligence, for all its epochal promise, cannot singlehandedly reverse a decades-long drought in breakthrough innovation outside the digital sphere. The “stagnation thesis”—his term for the persistent slowdown in non-software technological progress—has become more urgent as capital, talent, and policy obsess over generative AI, leaving the physical economy’s engines idling. The result is a bifurcated future: one where dazzling advances in code coexist with a stubborn inertia in atoms

.

The article writer seems not be too convinced though:

https://biztechweekly.com/peter-thiel-warns-ai-alone-cant-end-tech-stagnation-calls-for-bold-innovation-beyond-artificial-intelligence/

[XOOMBOX]

Most of us complained a lot about other things, whereas if we are to be in control, ours could be worst, when we are not yet in control of something, then we should not join attacking over it, except we already had a similar experience, trust is not what has been found that easy to get, because at some level of time, even individually, we don't seem to trust on our own self talk less of others, just try to do your best and leave the rest.

We often complain about other people's problems that are beyond our control but if we had the chance, we might not have been able to handle them ourselves. It is really easy to jump into criticism when we have no control but if we have no experience, that criticism is actually worthless. The same is true about trust because it is not something that is built in a day. Trust in a person is built very slowly and sometimes it can be broken in a short time. Sometimes we cannot fully trust in ourselves so it is even more difficult to trust other people. That's why at the end of the day we should do our job properly and leave the rest to the others this way we will gradually build trust, whether in ourself or others.

[WillyAp]

That's why at the end of the day we should do our job properly and leave the rest to the others this way we will gradually build trust, whether in ourself or others.

Yeap that is true.

Complaining is something else, here I point out the state of Crypto.
it is 17% from 2017 onwards and here the US is even lower:

https://coinlaw.io/cryptocurrency-adoption-by-country-statistics/



Stablecoins are included here.