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Author Topic: AntiSec Breach - How Bitcoin Could have Helped  (Read 2641 times)
bbit
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December 29, 2011, 08:40:24 PM
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With AntiSec hacking into Stratfor's website and stealing credit card information and using the stolen cards to  pledge to charities these charities now face $35 chargeback fee's:

"There’s real possibility of damage to smaller organizations if the Anonymous donations result in massive chargebacks for fraud. For instance, the Appropriate Infrastructure Development Group (AIDG) which works on access to electricity, sanitation, and clean water tweeted earlier today: “Stratfor Global has us worried. Pls don’t donate to AIDG with stolen credit cards, we get hit $35 per fraudulent transaction! #anonymous RT”"

Another case to solely go bitcoins only I do say. Thoughts?
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December 29, 2011, 09:04:27 PM
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With AntiSec hacking into Stratfor's website and stealing credit card information and using the stolen cards to  pledge to charities these charities now face $35 chargeback fee's:

"There’s real possibility of damage to smaller organizations if the Anonymous donations result in massive chargebacks for fraud. For instance, the Appropriate Infrastructure Development Group (AIDG) which works on access to electricity, sanitation, and clean water tweeted earlier today: “Stratfor Global has us worried. Pls don’t donate to AIDG with stolen credit cards, we get hit $35 per fraudulent transaction! #anonymous RT”"

Another case to solely go bitcoins only I do say. Thoughts?

Now that was socially irresponsible.

Freedom is a state of mind, and then Bitcoin comes along.....
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December 29, 2011, 09:07:18 PM
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I'll admit that is disturbing  Shocked
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December 29, 2011, 09:11:20 PM
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Just fits with the larger problem of credit cards.

All the risk has been placed on the entity accepting them and there is no way for that entity to protect themselves from that risk.

So people/companies are irresponsible.  They face no risk/loss/damages.  Thieves steal cards and the merchant pays for it.

Indirectly responsible people pay via higher prices on goods & services.

Irresponsible people win.
VISA win.
Theives win.
Merchants lose.
Responsible people lose.

The three parties most responsible for any damages (VISA, thieves, irresponsible cardholders) are the ones insulated from the cost.  The parties least responsible and least capable of preventing it (responsible consumers and merchants) pay the cost.
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December 29, 2011, 10:03:41 PM
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FFS what a bunch of retards

WHAT THE FUCK ARE THEY DOING FUCKING IDIOTS. If you're a so called "hacker" you should fucking be able to have a faint of how credit cards fucking works. Goddamnit this pisses me off!!!

This is pretty much how socialism works, lets steal money from these people and give it to these people who need it and then society as whole wins RAIT???
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December 29, 2011, 10:11:39 PM
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FFS what a bunch of retards

WHAT THE FUCK ARE THEY DOING FUCKING IDIOTS. If you're a so called "hacker" you should fucking be able to have a faint of how credit cards fucking works. Goddamnit this pisses me off!!!

This is pretty much how socialism works, lets steal money from these people and give it to these people who need it and then society as whole wins RAIT???

It's really messed up. I don't know how in good faith you could label yourself a "hacker" and not know the consequences of using stolen credit cards? Its beyond me and your right this is steal from the rich ( actually, this is just normal people)  and give to the poor mentality. Shameful.
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December 29, 2011, 10:17:18 PM
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FFS what a bunch of retards

WHAT THE FUCK ARE THEY DOING FUCKING IDIOTS. If you're a so called "hacker" you should fucking be able to have a faint of how credit cards fucking works. Goddamnit this pisses me off!!!

This is pretty much how socialism works, lets steal money from these people and give it to these people who need it and then society as whole wins RAIT???

It's really messed up. I don't know how in good faith you could label yourself a "hacker" and not know the consequences of using stolen credit cards? Its beyond me and your right this is steal from the rich ( actually, this is just normal people)  and give to the poor mentality. Shameful.

But what actually happened is Anonymous are damaging the poor because these charities are eating the $35 chargeback fees.  I'm not holding my breath over this or anything but maybe the banks will do the right thing and waive these chargeback fees for charities.

Freedom is a state of mind, and then Bitcoin comes along.....
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December 29, 2011, 10:26:36 PM
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FFS what a bunch of retards

WHAT THE FUCK ARE THEY DOING FUCKING IDIOTS. If you're a so called "hacker" you should fucking be able to have a faint of how credit cards fucking works. Goddamnit this pisses me off!!!

This is pretty much how socialism works, lets steal money from these people and give it to these people who need it and then society as whole wins RAIT???

It's really messed up. I don't know how in good faith you could label yourself a "hacker" and not know the consequences of using stolen credit cards? Its beyond me and your right this is steal from the rich ( actually, this is just normal people)  and give to the poor mentality. Shameful.

But what actually happened is Anonymous are damaging the poor because these charities are eating the $35 chargeback fees.  I'm not holding my breath over this or anything but maybe the banks will do the right thing and waive these chargeback fees for charities.

Yeah maybe the hackers are "rob from the poor and give to the rich" types aka anti-RobinHood.  Charities pay hundreds of thousands of dollars in chargeback fees (rob from poor), banks get something for nothing (give to the rich).
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December 29, 2011, 10:46:00 PM
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FFS what a bunch of retards

WHAT THE FUCK ARE THEY DOING FUCKING IDIOTS. If you're a so called "hacker" you should fucking be able to have a faint of how credit cards fucking works. Goddamnit this pisses me off!!!

This is pretty much how socialism works, lets steal money from these people and give it to these people who need it and then society as whole wins RAIT???

It's really messed up. I don't know how in good faith you could label yourself a "hacker" and not know the consequences of using stolen credit cards? Its beyond me and your right this is steal from the rich ( actually, this is just normal people)  and give to the poor mentality. Shameful.

But what actually happened is Anonymous are damaging the poor because these charities are eating the $35 chargeback fees.  I'm not holding my breath over this or anything but maybe the banks will do the right thing and waive these chargeback fees for charities.

I'm sorry, what happened to personal responsibility?

If I accept credit card payments and get hit with a fee for accepting a stolen card, when I had no way of knowing it was stolen, that sucks. If I continue to accept that method of payment knowing that I may get hit with the fee again, well color me stupid because its MY FAULT.

Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me.

Does personal responsibility apply when someone is actively engaging in a criminal attack.

For example is I burn down someone elses home in your neighborhood and you don't move I guess it is your fault when I burn your home down too. 

"Look it is one thing buying a home when you have no idea it can get burned down.  That sucks.  If you continuing living in a home which can be burned down knowing other homes have already been torched well color you stupid because it is your fault".
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December 30, 2011, 12:31:21 AM
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start shopping for someone who can provide better service. 

That someone is bitcoin Smiley
No credit card company will stop charging for chargebacks any time soon.

(BFL)^2 < 0
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December 30, 2011, 12:31:39 AM
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If they're dumps sell them for bitcoin then give the money away
All charities are at risk through paypal or CC for chargeback fees. If you wanted to ruin a charity you donate 30x through paypal then issue a chargeback for each transaction...they get hit with $35 fees every time regardless if all stolen accounts. This strategy was employed against Scilon anti drug charities with great success if I remember

There should be a donate to charity bitcoin page that's run by somebody bulletproof/trustworthy that also enables you to send money to prisoners. Dunno if anybody here has had to send cash to an imprisoned hacker friend in the US Smiley It's amazingly complicated and expensive

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December 30, 2011, 07:37:04 AM
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with all the talk about how banks should be thrilled to eliminate chargebacks by using Bitcoin, it was quite a surprise to hear from one of the original Cypherpunks that banks LOVE chargebacks.  you guessed it; the fees!

i heard this on a podcast from 2009 on Hiro's Coinbase website.
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December 30, 2011, 08:07:28 AM
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it was quite a surprise to hear from one of the original Cypherpunks that banks LOVE chargebacks.

That surprised you? really?

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December 30, 2011, 11:01:57 AM
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What a bunch of morons.

When will people understand that the ends do not justify the means?
You cannot do anything of "good" through "evil" means, and what's happening here is a great example.

This is pretty much how socialism works, lets steal money from these people and give it to these people who need it and then society as whole wins RAIT???

Perfect analogy. This is the spirit of the welfare state.
Sad.
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December 30, 2011, 03:24:33 PM
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with all the talk about how banks should be thrilled to eliminate chargebacks by using Bitcoin, it was quite a surprise to hear from one of the original Cypherpunks that banks LOVE chargebacks.  you guessed it; the fees!

i heard this on a podcast from 2009 on Hiro's Coinbase website.

Wait what?  I don't think anyone said the BANKS would love to eliminate chargeback fees.  Users & merchants would love to eliminate chargeback fees.  Hell banks charge overdraft fees for a "service" which costs them nothing.  Of course banks love fees. 

"Money for nothing and your chicks for free."
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December 31, 2011, 04:53:10 PM
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Quote
If there is an arsonist on the loose in my neighborhood, you can be damn certain that I'm going to install fences.
Is arsonist somewhat related with arse or anarchist?

This event is great example of problems with credit cards. The Bank or VISA/MC will never lose money. The loser is the most poorer and unprotected person. Usually the lamer whose card was stolen or merchant who accepted it. When bitcoins are stolen, they are stolen for good.

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December 31, 2011, 05:00:30 PM
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This event is great example of problems with credit cards. The Bank or VISA/MC will never lose money. The loser is the most poorer and unprotected person. Usually Never the lamer whose card was stolen, only the merchant who accepted it. When bitcoins are stolen, they are stolen for good.

FYP.  Sadly VISA/MC have contributed to this problem.  To perpetuate always increasing usage of credit cards they have remove all liability from the card user.  Some have a token $50 liability but most cards have $0 liability.  Of course VISA/MC don't care.  They aren't assume that risk they just stick it on the merchant.

The good news is it shows why Bitcoin is a better way.  Honestly if banks/credit cards were good there would be much less reason for Bitcoin to exist (it would still be a cool academic experiment though).
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January 02, 2012, 01:02:46 AM
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If there is an arsonist on the loose in my neighborhood, you can be damn certain that I'm going to install fences.
Is arsonist somewhat related with arse or anarchist?

Not sure if serious, but no.

arson: the malicious burning of another's house or property
Completely serious. I have read about arsonist long ago in some writing about direct-action anarchists causing fire. I thought that arse was prefixed to show how bad these anarchists were. I really must learn new English words properly. But people setting fire on buildings are called pyromaniacs.
Quote
To perpetuate always increasing usage of credit cards they have remove all liability from the card user
This is not nearly universal as you say. I'm responsible for all my credit card payments if I cannot prove they are fraudulent. This sucks big time, but I know how to safeguard my CC data. If merchant is hacked this is whole new story. The good point of Bitcoin is irreversibility and no outside control by third party.

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January 06, 2012, 08:14:22 PM
 #19

I'm a STRATFOR subscriber, and because of this breach I will demand that they accept bitcoin to continue my subscription.

SealsWithClubs poker room has  over 400 players online. Buy in from .01 to 60btc.      BTCSportsMatch lets you bet sports with vig free lines!  Best kept secret in bitcoin....          LocalBitcoins.com is very user-friendly now for bank transfers.  You don't have to live close to trade when in the same currency area.           
Electrum client is awesome. Try it. And please stop sending bitcoins to sites run by security newbies, or don't complain when you lose everything.
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January 06, 2012, 10:07:28 PM
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I'm a STRATFOR subscriber, and because of this breach I will demand that they accept bitcoin to continue my subscription.

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