Anyone Making Money With Contracts?

[iGROWyourBiz]

It seems to me that there are a lot of companies saying they have x number of TH/s on their sparkly ASICS farms. They do the mining (you don't do any) with their machines and power.

And all you have to do is buy a "contract" for a year or two to help cover the costs.  They will pay out daily or weekly a portion of the bitcoins they mine.

Sounds good in theory.

Here is my question.

ARE PEOPLE MAKING PROFIT? (besides the owners)

To get a few satoshi a day or week, can take a long time to get to the break even point.

IS THERE A such a MINING sharing company that you actually will MAKE MORE than you put in?

Which company is actually doing this (restrictively) so ALL members actually make a PROFIT?

or does that not even matter to the people spending money?

[1714042693]

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[Bit_Happy]

I will also be trading on cex.io soon.
They seem to have a strong concept and well run site.

[iGROWyourBiz]

well i am trying on cex.io, i have about 130 ghs FHM (meaning they will become instant *cloud* GHS miners on May 26 2014. They are very cheap right now. it looks like i should *?* reap investment of 3x on 5/26/2014, however, i dont understand the difficulty and hash rates and all that shit, so who knows. what i look at now, shows i should get my investment back, considering most went in when btc was over 600.  ... Bleh.. we'll see.  i should just join /r/buttcoin unless things get better... i hate being late to the party!    

ps  i will edit this come June and let you know. i hope/pray btc goes back to moon in the interim, or at least what it was. fucking china. wtf.. lol..  

So you gave them X amount of dollars today.

Then on 5.26 you will get 3X what you paid?

[olliec420]

well i am trying on cex.io, i have about 130 ghs FHM (meaning they will become instant *cloud* GHS miners on May 26 2014. They are very cheap right now. it looks like i should *?* reap investment of 3x on 5/26/2014, however, i dont understand the difficulty and hash rates and all that shit, so who knows. what i look at now, shows i should get my investment back, considering most went in when btc was over 600.  ... Bleh.. we'll see.  i should just join /r/buttcoin unless things get better... i hate being late to the party!    

ps  i will edit this come June and let you know. i hope/pray btc goes back to moon in the interim, or at least what it was. fucking china. wtf.. lol..  

Wait wait, you don't understand difficulty and hash rate?  You need to get out now.

[sorryforthat]

I havent cashed out yet, but I have 75 GHs that I use for mining and another 25 GHs that I use primarily for trading. If I were to sell at current price everything I have I will leave with about 50 dollar profit and I have been there for about 3 weeks
Posted from Bitcointa.lk - #xhrXpMH9ZHJzeZSD

[iGROWyourBiz]

I havent cashed out yet, but I have 75 GHs that I use for mining and another 25 GHs that I use primarily for trading. If I were to sell at current price everything I have I will leave with about 50 dollar profit and I have been there for about 3 weeks
Posted from Bitcointa.lk - #xhrXpMH9ZHJzeZSD

how much have you spent total over 3 weeks to make the $50?

[sorryforthat]

I put into about 350 dollars out of pocket and add more from my mined blocks. I bought these at about .0105500 per GH/s and there was a high of .0107000 I sold all and made another 6 dollars, which isn't much, but it didn't take me any time to do it and it all adds up. Now the prices are back down to 0.01051133 so I bought my shares back sent my profits to my wallet. I plan to put some into the upcoming fund.

I suggest if you do plan to invest, watch it for a few days before. Get a feel for the prices and the times that are best to buy and price that feels right for you. when it goes low, people get scared and sell in bulk, 100 at a time, those are the ones I go for. I can get all that I want if I'm fast enough before price jumps up and I wont have to wait for it to go down to get the remaining balance I wanted. There are a lot of people there who are impatient and want a fast payout. You will see the price that is just right and before you know it, its all the way up again. Don't let this deter you. There was a lot of reviews I read and the majority of them were negative. I decided that I wanted to do it because it was what I wanted and just because someone was bad with their investment shouldn't effect my thought. So I ask you to not put a lot into what I say, but do what you want, and what you feel is comfortable. It isn't for everyone, especially those who are not willing to invest the time and money into it. It takes patience to come out on top.

[jparsley]

0.01 /ghs is quite expensive how long before profit from mining

[fattypig]

0.01 /ghs is quite expensive how long before profit from mining

Never...

[dddbtc]

ARE PEOPLE MAKING PROFIT? (besides the owners)

Yes, even a small commercial mining operation creates jobs.  If someone runs a reputable business, the success of mining contract customers is key to the reputation of the business.  A good friend of mine has built a company offering mining striving to do just that, which has several employees.

IS THERE A such a MINING sharing company that you actually will MAKE MORE than you put in?

That outcome is dependant on a variety of factors. No one will make a promise like that to you as a legal guarantee.  It also depends on what you do with your coins.  

However, the goal of ✰ WeMineCoins, LLC ✰ is to provide an experience where both the buyer and the business are satisfied with their purchase at both the beginning and the end of the contract.  Purchasing hardware in bulk orders from the manufacturer makes this goal much more plausible to achieve.

Which company is actually doing this (restrictively) so ALL members actually make a PROFIT?

I purchased a contract for a 600gh/s machine from WeMineCoins.

Contact information is available on the site and no one is hiding who they are, I'm sure they would be happy to answer any questions.

Keep an eye on http://www.weminecoins.com - Contracts will be available for purchase through a cart coming soon.
Ideally and hopefully, payment methods such as credit cards that inspire buyer confidence and trust will be offered.  If you are currently interested, similar payment methods are avaliable and professionally written contracts can be signed outside of the automated system.  See contact page for details.

or does that not even matter to the people spending money?

It definitely matters, if you've gotten this far, you know the level of risk associated with the bitcoin economy and you choose to tolerate them every time you participate in it.  Just be sure you're doing business with a company that actually cares about its customers.

[iGROWyourBiz]

I put into about 350 dollars out of pocket and add more from my mined blocks. I bought these at about .0105500 per GH/s and there was a high of .0107000 I sold all and made another 6 dollars, which isn't much, but it didn't take me any time to do it and it all adds up. Now the prices are back down to 0.01051133 so I bought my shares back sent my profits to my wallet. I plan to put some into the upcoming fund.

I suggest if you do plan to invest, watch it for a few days before. Get a feel for the prices and the times that are best to buy and price that feels right for you. when it goes low, people get scared and sell in bulk, 100 at a time, those are the ones I go for. I can get all that I want if I'm fast enough before price jumps up and I wont have to wait for it to go down to get the remaining balance I wanted. There are a lot of people there who are impatient and want a fast payout. You will see the price that is just right and before you know it, its all the way up again. Don't let this deter you. There was a lot of reviews I read and the majority of them were negative. I decided that I wanted to do it because it was what I wanted and just because someone was bad with their investment shouldn't effect my thought. So I ask you to not put a lot into what I say, but do what you want, and what you feel is comfortable. It isn't for everyone, especially those who are not willing to invest the time and money into it. It takes patience to come out on top.

sounds like you are doing the equivalent of day trading.

Would you mind spending a few moments on SKYPE with me? I have a few private questions to ask you.

Thanks

SKYPE/GMAIL: iGROWyourBiz

[Bit_Happy]

0.01 /ghs is quite expensive how long before profit from mining

Currently profit from trading and the mining is a small bonus.
When BTC rallies the mining part will pay much better.

[m3]

at current prices. The Scrypt and Scrypt-N 24 hour contracts should bring you profit if you buy from http://www.altcc.com It is a very simple calculation to make. go to coinwarz and put in the hashrate that you want to order and see how much profit you will get, then compare that to the price. No ponzi no scam you put your own pool and see the worker and the hashrate within 24 hours.

[FalconFly]

It seems to me that there are a lot of companies saying they have x number of TH/s on their sparkly ASICS farms. They do the mining (you don't do any) with their machines and power.

And all you have to do is buy a "contract" for a year or two to help cover the costs.  They will pay out daily or weekly a portion of the bitcoins they mine.

Sounds good in theory.

Here is my question.

ARE PEOPLE MAKING PROFIT? (besides the owners)

To get a few satoshi a day or week, can take a long time to get to the break even point.

IS THERE A such a MINING sharing company that you actually will MAKE MORE than you put in?

Which company is actually doing this (restrictively) so ALL members actually make a PROFIT?

or does that not even matter to the people spending money?

Based on what I saw so far : No.

Either you're entering a legit money-losing scheme (counting on unwary users that i.e. forget gobal/pool hashrate increase rates and diff increases; or forget to read the fine-print, i.e. cex.io's ludicrous maintenance fee) - or they are outright scams or ponzis.
Rules of thumb :
- the nicer they are being advertised, the more you should stay away from them.
- the more spamming you see being done for them, the more you should stay away from them.

Always remember Bitcoin is a shark tank with pretty window dressing - all commercial enterprises operating in them only want your best : your money.
There are no "good Samaritans" that just want to give you profits because they're just nice guys. Won't happen.

Don't get me wrong, there are tons of legit businesses out there - but especially when it comes to mining, you got to have your math correct, otherwise you can lose alot of money in a very short time. Even with correct math and in-depth knowledge of Difficulty/Hashrate projections, it still is just a prediction leaving you with plenty of risks concerning profitability.

If aquiring Bitcoin (or altcoins) is your goal - do not mine but buy them directly from an exchange. Generating profts with mining has become extremely difficult even for the bigger guns in the house. With the typical few hundred $ investment of a private person - you're way better off not mining.

[Bit_Happy]

Based on what I saw so far : No.

Either you're entering a legit money-losing scheme (counting on unwary users that i.e. forget gobal/pool hashrate increase rates and diff increases; or forget to read the fine-print, i.e. cex.io's ludicrous maintenance fee) - or they are outright scams or ponzis.
Rules of thumb :
- the nicer they are being advertised, the more you should stay away from them.
- the more spamming you see being done for them, the more you should stay away from them.

Always remember Bitcoin is a shark tank with pretty window dressing - all commercial enterprises operating in them only want your best : your money.
There are no "good Samaritans" that just want to give you profits because they're just nice guys. Won't happen.

Don't get me wrong, there are tons of legit businesses out there - but especially when it comes to mining, you got to have your math correct, otherwise you can lose alot of money in a very short time. Even with correct math and in-depth knowledge of Difficulty/Hashrate projections, it still is just a prediction leaving you with plenty of risks concerning profitability.

If aquiring Bitcoin (or altcoins) is your goal - do not mine but buy them directly from an exchange. Generating profts with mining has become extremely difficult even for the bigger guns in the house. With the typical few hundred $ investment of a private person - you're way better off not mining.

Interesting explanation.

So is it even possible for a company to profitably offer their customers a non-money-losing contract? Perhaps maybe in the future when mining industry matures?

Just trying to figure out whether the "mining contract" business model is even possible to legitimately and profitably offer?

So is it even possible...
A company using solar power, or based in an area with super-cheap electricity would have a big advantage.
Also a company that manufactures ASICs would be ideal to run a mining contract biz.

Somewhere/someone is making good money off of mining.

[iGROWyourBiz]

Interesting explanation.

So is it even possible for a company to profitably offer their customers a non-money-losing contract? Perhaps maybe in the future when mining industry matures?

Just trying to figure out whether the "mining contract" business model is even possible to legitimately and profitably offer?

To me, it is just like any other similar leveraged situation.  Casinos, mining, etc - the house always wins.

The person OWNING it, makes a TON of money, because there are always new investors.   The "investors" are not generally people that are truly financially savvy and get involved with small amounts of money.  There are enough of them joining to have social proof for other inexperienced "investors".   I totally see how to make money SELLING mining contracts.

I don't see a ton of people around the net talking about how well their "contracts" are doing mining Crypto

[FalconFly]

Interesting explanation.

So is it even possible for a company to profitably offer their customers a non-money-losing contract? Perhaps maybe in the future when mining industry matures?

Just trying to figure out whether the "mining contract" business model is even possible to legitimately and profitably offer?

I assume there could be, if some of the factors Bit_Happy stated are present.
However, lacking any such "good Samaritans" that i.e. would honestly share the profits 50:50, you're left with the cloud mining services that tilt the profit table pretty far to their side - leaving nothing but losses for you. Everything observed so far was optimized to absolutely maximize their profits at the cost of the customers.

As said, the only one apparently getting close to such operations smells like a ponzi scheme that would collapse as soon as the operators see the right time to pull the plug.

It's sad to see - but the Bitcoin world generally isn't a nice social place (in that respect not unlike most money places). Most of the activity focuses around making profit off others by any means, be it legal, semi-legal (skinning) or outright scam/ponzi or theft. BTC possibly reintroduced the world to the term "greater fool economy" in its own, special way. It certainly did its best to take the term "counterparty risk" to a whole new quality.

[cyberpitstop]

There does seem to be a lot of Ponzi going on in the BTC game.

[kickbit]

I never saw profitable mining contracts. It's scam.

[sorryforthat]

I never saw profitable mining contracts. It's scam.

I dont know if they really are scamming you. Use that word wisely. You know exactly what you are buying, the fees you are paying and the risk involved. Thats not a scam, its just bad judgement on an investor.

[Bit_Happy]

I never saw profitable mining contracts. It's scam.

I dont know if they really are scamming you. Use that word wisely. You know exactly what you are buying, the fees you are paying and the risk involved. Thats not a scam, its just bad judgement on an investor.

Big difference there:
The word scam is way overused around here.

[markus1000]

yep scam is way overused here. If the mining contract does have a negative expected value its not a good investment, thats all.

[kickbit]

I never saw profitable mining contracts. It's scam.

I dont know if they really are scamming you. Use that word wisely. You know exactly what you are buying, the fees you are paying and the risk involved. Thats not a scam, its just bad judgement on an investor.

Yes, you're right. But they show you profitability, they make fake calculators which calculates thousands of dollars you will earn. But in fact it's all fake. 

[Liquid71]

mining contracts are a gamble, you could make money but they are a bad bet. Odds are you will lose money, just like a casino. You could win, but odds are stacked against you.

[vnvizow]

lost ~0.2 

[blackhathasher]

every time i have run the numbers on a mining contract i keep coming to the same exact conclusion.

it appears to be more profitable to purchase mining equipment on your own to mine than to buy mining contracts...

i just don't see the profit no matter how "attractive" the contract may look.

[iGROWyourBiz]

I never saw profitable mining contracts. It's scam.

I dont know if they really are scamming you. Use that word wisely. You know exactly what you are buying, the fees you are paying and the risk involved. Thats not a scam, its just bad judgement on an investor.

Yes, you're right. But they show you profitability, they make fake calculators which calculates thousands of dollars you will earn. But in fact it's all fake. 

that by definition would be a scam (deceptive and misleading)

[anuragh27crony]

I never saw profitable mining contracts. It's scam.

I dont know if they really are scamming you. Use that word wisely. You know exactly what you are buying, the fees you are paying and the risk involved. Thats not a scam, its just bad judgement on an investor.

Yes, you're right. But they show you profitability, they make fake calculators which calculates thousands of dollars you will earn. But in fact it's all fake.  

that by definition would be a scam (deceptive and misleading)

While Investing in mining, understanding the difficulty is more important (given it raises every fortnight for BTC)...if u are looking for complete returns in short term then it's a strict no...even if ur buying contracts or mining on ur own... it may take long time...depending on ur hashing speed to break even ur investments...may b months to come.. since i have seen many people asking the same question...how many days it would take to earn my investment back...which doesn't happen unless u are trading ur mining power..

Let sites/forums not fool u...use ur wise judgement before doing it..ask as many people as u can...on different forums...

[Xyver]

every time i have run the numbers on a mining contract i keep coming to the same exact conclusion.

it appears to be more profitable to purchase mining equipment on your own to mine than to buy mining contracts...

i just don't see the profit no matter how "attractive" the contract may look.

Of course.  The mining contract company has to account for rent, electricity, and other maintenance costs that you do to (like electricity) but people hardly count that into their calculations.

Yes, electricity might be "free" because you're renting, or living at school, or at home, but someone's gotta pay for it.  And rent may be "free" for your miners, but you are owning a building that has to run them, and technically a smaller percentage that you pay goes to that bit of floor (or shelf) space that the miner sits on.

Contracts throw all those costs at you up front, so it looks more expensive, but when you run it at home there are lots of "hidden" costs that people don't factor in.

[jparsley]

How about pbmining, i thinking of starting with them. Can i trust they will be running 4 5years

[blackhathasher]

How about pbmining, i thinking of starting with them. Can i trust they will be running 4 5years

No you can't trust that at all.

and even though their prices look appealing, i simply see no way of being profitable.

[maok]

How about pbmining, i thinking of starting with them. Can i trust they will be running 4 5years

It doesn't matter because after the 1-2 years the difficulty will have increased so much that your ghs initially purchased will not generate enough bitcoins to keep you financially profitable;  just as if you were purchasing mining equipment you'd need to calculate if you'll generate back your bitcoins in the first 6-12 months, and if not then better to simply buy bitcoins and hope that the price will hike than investing in mining.

The thing about pb mining is that we don't know anything about them so if they'll decide to close their operation tomorrow we can't follow up, so better treat with caution, they're not running a ponzi scheme but they could run a scam in that they'll close their website and continue to mine for themselves so very very careful about investing too much with them.

[billysweird]

It seems to me that there are a lot of companies saying they have x number of TH/s on their sparkly ASICS farms. They do the mining (you don't do any) with their machines and power.

And all you have to do is buy a "contract" for a year or two to help cover the costs.  They will pay out daily or weekly a portion of the bitcoins they mine.

Sounds good in theory.

Here is my question.

ARE PEOPLE MAKING PROFIT? (besides the owners)

To get a few satoshi a day or week, can take a long time to get to the break even point.

IS THERE A such a MINING sharing company that you actually will MAKE MORE than you put in?

Which company is actually doing this (restrictively) so ALL members actually make a PROFIT?

or does that not even matter to the people spending money?



***************************
of course you can make profit
you can buy and sell bitcoin like stock
that is how you making profit if you are smart enough

[goggles1200]

Sounds like a lot of money for little reward.

[thy]

It seems to me that there are a lot of companies saying they have x number of TH/s on their sparkly ASICS farms. They do the mining (you don't do any) with their machines and power.

And all you have to do is buy a "contract" for a year or two to help cover the costs.  They will pay out daily or weekly a portion of the bitcoins they mine.

Sounds good in theory.

Here is my question.

ARE PEOPLE MAKING PROFIT? (besides the owners)

To get a few satoshi a day or week, can take a long time to get to the break even point.

IS THERE A such a MINING sharing company that you actually will MAKE MORE than you put in?

Which company is actually doing this (restrictively) so ALL members actually make a PROFIT?

or does that not even matter to the people spending money?

In general the answer is NO to your question about mining contracts/shares if you compare it to just hold the BTC you already own or buy BTC and hold for the period the contract would be for. So the general recomendaton would be just buy BTC and hold until there 10 000 usd / BTC or whatever price you think its ok to sell at...

That is if you talk about buying a contract on cex.io and simular and hold the investment until it no longer is returning anything or the contract period ends or if you buy shares in a mining company at to high price and just hold it passively after that.
There is better possibillitys to make profit in trading shares/contracts actively and so on and there may also be some investments like Asicminer shares bought at IPO that has been profitable investments, there has also been a number of companys/projects that has been popping up the last 6 months that has been returning 20-90% of the investments in the first 1-4 months time and you have in many cases been able to sell your shares for more than you bought it for to but you need to watch out for the obvious scams.
But like all investments you need to count on it and make educated guesses on a projects future dividends, chance the company will succeed and what you estimate the price of the stocks will be trading at in the future.

[RentaMouse]

I've been looking at several cloud mining operations recently and in terms of pure ROI none of them beat buying my own Scrypt ASICs, but that is because I can get a lower maintenance fee doing it myself. However I dont really want to invest the amount necessary to make it worthwhile for the DIY route. Its also hard to cash out by selling 2nd hand ASICs.

• CEX.io appears to be the most professional of the cloud hash trading sites, with the best liquidity, but with the current prices (0.0091/GH) you wont make money just investing and leaving your btc there. Their maintenance charges are a killer, if the USD/BTC rate goes up it improves, but their fee free hash trading distorts the market. CEX have recently introduced a futures market though which could be good value - 0.0041/GH which start mining 26th May. The good thing about CEX is the liquidity, you can always convert your GH back into BTC, and even make a profit on the trade if you time it right.
• For best returns Scrypt.cc seems to be winning currently, but it is a beta site still so I wouldnt recommend a major investment. They also allow you to trade your KHs so you have the option to trade out into BTC again if you want, but the liquidity isnt so good which is another reason again to not invest too much.
• If you have time on your hands then you will get the best cloud mining returns by hiring hash power from sites like leaserigs.net and using it to mine altcoins for yourself, but you have to do the research to get the returns. I've had a good week just now mining WhiteCoin and CINNI, averaged about 0.0075/MH/day profit after rig hire costs, but currently the amount of MH available to rent makes it a limited market. Good way to experiment if you are considering buying your own mining hardware tho. Have a look at https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=514242.0 for a good comparison of mining pool returns.
  

If any of that inspires you please feel free to use my referral links - https://cex.io/r/1/sensineCEX/0/ or http://scrypt.cc?ref=babAl

[XScrypt]

If you trade hashrate, then CEX or Scrypt.cc could be profitable. You might also end up profiting if you do dollar cost averaging on Scrypt.cc and things don't get too weird in the market. But the fees on CEX will destroy any long term holding position.

PBMining...well...let's just say I don't really trust them. A 5 year contract is just plain stupid given the rate that hashing power and difficulty increases. You'll be lucky if you make back your principal, and in a year your hashing power won't mean jack. Plus, their numbers don't make sense. After you figure out the cost for maintaining a data center, buying hardware, electricity, etc. then look at what they're charging for contracts there seems to be something missing. A couple other things don't smell right either, but to each their own.

Basically, you're just better off buying BTC directly and holding than any mining contract.