[ANN][KARM] Karma / ₭ / X11

[KarmaKaguy]

I need volunteers for the keepod for kids fundraising effort. It has started allready and I will be gone soon for some weeks such that I cannot do the campaign and the xchange of coins. I can offer to set up a page in karmafund.me.

1) Somebody (known) has to setup local donation wallets on their pcs and do the exchange of coins
2) Somebody needs to create the artwork and upload it here: https://trello.com/b/dccGwPd0/keepod-campaign-xcurrency-viacoin-w2coin-partnership
3) Somebody has to coordinate twitter, facebook and establish a contact with the cryptomommy and the organizers

Please read this post from cyptommy if you are interested: http://karmashares.com/forums/index.php/topic,604.msg3629.html#msg3629

Then come together here http://karmashares.com/forums/index.php/topic,604.msg3629.html#msg3629 and coordinate on responsabilities and the workflow.


I think this are three very concrete responsabilities where everybody can participate. Please dont answer here in btt in detail but in the forum (last link). There is much less noise. I am happy to assist you where I can.

edit: This will bring exporsure to Karma as the organization team has a good marketing structure (Value).

KarmaKaguy

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[Bierworst]

Kosmost and others what i suggest:

I want to lift of the weight of the people working nearly the entire day for karma or developing things, in the meaning that i take care of the updates and the progress. I want to be the person who people send updates to and i send them out organised to the comunity. Like the android app, because this is fundamental if we want to achieve our goal of bringing karma to other countries.

Second, can there be a new thread, were there is only being brainstormed about BRINGING KARMA TO OTHER COUNTRIES LIKE THE UNBANKED PEOPLE IN THE PHILIPPINES once we agree  on certain aspects evolve and i will write a plan of what the community wants to achieve and what is needed to Achieve this project. I am talking about fundamental things that have to be done. If this is clear we can start a new way of setting people on tasks, i will help with that but before discussing this we got to have our plan ready.

So kosmost and others, or you for or against this? Because we need to be organized to achieve great goals. Control is a key aspect in achieving anything.

This is the most visited place for crypto, but the best place to do a real work is Karmashares forum - http://karmashares.com/forums/. I think that the best place for a new thread is there. Also 40 days ago a new thread was started only with a purpose to separate valuable ideas from the days pressing matters, cause it is really hard to read all the chattering here only to find one good post with real value. The thread is here - http://karmashares.com/forums/index.php/topic,516.0.html Everybody is free to add valuable ideas by following the model.

I want a new thread pure brainstorming about bringing karma to other countries, because this is what we need to focus on imo. I think with project karma can separate itself from the rest

[KarmaKaguy]

Well kosmost i feel likenyou are not helping either atm. It feels like people want to start doing stuff, but you just go further with other people and they give up, like me.

Ofcourse, you are helping, but this is how i feel after posting 30 comments that and i want to help and asking how far the development of karmX is and what is already planned or which ideas are there to bring KarmX to the philipenes. So if someone actually starts answering me and starts to answer my offer to help, i iwill do whatever non-programming stuff has to be done.

So, shoot.

I think he's just p****d about what happened and the following backlash he got.
I can see his point about people not committing to karma other than buying.
I've bought my first karma in late May/early June and I can relate to what he's saying. It's true that there's not been too much help around the coin with the exception of a few members.
I'm also guilty of this, although I've offered to do some work on the android front but since there's no API ready and my skills are limited, nothing has moved on that front. Hope now with the help of Fitamp we can move forward.
So I think we must reorganize and try to do things in another way. Don't rely too much on the community help for now but try and pay some people that can do our basic infrastructure. Then, with enough exposure, we'll get newcomers that will see the benefits of helping karma grow and use their skills to good use. Right now it's hard for people to see the big picture, kosmost says he's not too interested on the price, but the price is a good indicator and a powerful mindset helper that should not be discounted.
I wish I had better skills so I could help karma grow. Right now I can give my opinion and try to help where I can, I'm in the red and I've not lost faith in Karma.

Sorry, upset at.....? What is it that happened? This is not really clear to me. Yes, I can see that some people are expressing certain views. But are these views about an event that "happened" or the current state of affairs? I have too much experience to get my panties in a bunch every time the price goes up or down. It's not just a poker face, it's just that I have a different idea of value.

For example, it would take the equivalent of $200 to change the mood of this forum completely by buying up to 92 litoshis. For the cost of lunch I could change the mood of quite a few people here. (It's ridiculous, isn't it?) I've seen quite a few people get excited (and become more involved) recently when the price goes up a mere 10%. To me, it's ridiculous that quite a few people base their moods and feelings (and responses) on what equates to about $5.

Just different ideas of value, I suppose. My vision is more longer-term, not daytrader-like. I'm guessing that 90% of us watch the market at least 1x a day. I could be mistaken, but it seems like it.

Psychologically, the KARMA/LTC market (and, to a lesser extend the KARMA/BTC market) has become our "target". This is completely backwards but there's not much that I can do about it other than continue to talk about, and illustrate, value over price.

Our target is not the bitcointalk forum or the cryptocurrency community. That is a huge mistake that we have been making from Day 1. But we continue to act and respond as though it was. Our target should be the people who need Karma the most.

But our market now (cryptocurrency) is comprised mostly of people who don't really know what value is, unfortunately. Karma is like any other start-up, and that's what a lot of people don't seem to realize. We have customers, a community, and a team. And there is little distinction between any of it.

Our market should be completely different if we are to succeed. Our focus needs to shift to where people need it most, not to where people are entertained most. This is not a game, nor should we treat it like one.

With what I charge for my time I could buy 2 cars a day. I'm not saying that to boast, but to illustrate a point. I am working for the 20 year-old who put his savings into Karma and wants to see it grow. I spent hours making Karmashares certificates myself in order that Karma may grow into something great (and make sure it's done properly, of course). Database, website, graphics, text, tweets, tweaks, and just about everything else.. all from the heart. Isn't that what Karma is all about? Yes, I care that much about Karma. It's just disappointing that there are very few who are dedicated enough to "just do it" and stop talking about doing something (or telling others what needs to be done).

When I read some of the posts here all I can do is shake my head. How is it possible that the majority here don't know the value of Karma? Or the value of 1 Karma? I cherish each and every Karma. That's why I haven't spent any of your Karma yet and am very careful with how it will be spent. Because I know many of you worked hard for it. I am very careful with other people's money, even if I am not overly concerned with how I spend my own.

Some of us should do as much as we can to turn that 1 Karma into something special. It's what I am here for. Although I do not watch the markets daily, perhaps there aren't many here who are concerned with the actual value of Karma in this way.

Adding value today = adding price tomorrow. There is a correlation, of course.

I can't say that I am upset at people saying that we need to do something, yet not getting started and just doing it. It's just frustrating, not upsetting. Actually, it's been this way since the beginning (which is why I stepped up to the plate) and we have never really had an active team that was actually getting stuff done.

There is not much difference in this category from April 4, the first day I began working on Karma. We still have the same level of involvement and I continue to press others to be more active (team and community).

If 90% of us are overly concerned with price I can see to it that I am not. Besides, I tend to think more about value. My experience in having created more than 1 very successful company is not to focus on price more than adding value.

However, there aren't many examples of getting a group of volunteers together to work on something. Even the members of the A-Team got compensated for their efforts. In times of crises, sure. But perhaps not for cryptocurrency.

We can almost guarantee that if we created good-sized bounties for simple tasks that they will not be completed 100%. Anyone here is welcome to try it again.

By the way.. how would you like to re-organize?

Thanks for your suggestions

Kos, all the respect for you tremendous work and workload. However, I think that the Karmateam is also trying their best and not everybody can achieve so much in such little time like you. E.g it took me a week to get life updates on the Karmafund.me site. I tried to motivate people to give some Karma for a good cause. I know that this is not the core of our business but somebody needs to do this. I am also disapointed that the whales are not donating much but I keep on.... Please respect our contribution. We need some help as we are also a bit exhausted like who rightfully stated. Bierworst, sorry that we did not respond immediatly. You are fresh so please keep on self-organizing and get others on board.

Having said that, I will keep on as long as Karma lives.

[p4r4m0un7]

Kosmost and others what i suggest:

I want to lift of the weight of the people working nearly the entire day for karma or developing things, in the meaning that i take care of the updates and the progress. I want to be the person who people send updates to and i send them out organised to the comunity. Like the android app, because this is fundamental if we want to achieve our goal of bringing karma to other countries.

Second, can there be a new thread, were there is only being brainstormed about BRINGING KARMA TO OTHER COUNTRIES LIKE THE UNBANKED PEOPLE IN THE PHILIPPINES once we agree  on certain aspects evolve and i will write a plan of what the community wants to achieve and what is needed to Achieve this project. I am talking about fundamental things that have to be done. If this is clear we can start a new way of setting people on tasks, i will help with that but before discussing this we got to have our plan ready.

So kosmost and others, or you for or against this? Because we need to be organized to achieve great goals. Control is a key aspect in achieving anything.

This is the most visited place for crypto, but the best place to do a real work is Karmashares forum - http://karmashares.com/forums/. I think that the best place for a new thread is there. Also 40 days ago a new thread was started only with a purpose to separate valuable ideas from the days pressing matters, cause it is really hard to read all the chattering here only to find one good post with real value. The thread is here - http://karmashares.com/forums/index.php/topic,516.0.html Everybody is free to add valuable ideas by following the model.

I want a new thread pure brainstorming about bringing karma to other countries, because this is what we need to focus on imo. I think with project karma can separate itself from the rest

Yes, of course. Create a new thread into the Karmashare forum. As far as I know it is free. Maybe the only thing you should consider is where to put it. If you lack participation, you can always post here, reddit, etc.

[p4r4m0un7]

Well kosmost i feel likenyou are not helping either atm. It feels like people want to start doing stuff, but you just go further with other people and they give up, like me.

Ofcourse, you are helping, but this is how i feel after posting 30 comments that and i want to help and asking how far the development of karmX is and what is already planned or which ideas are there to bring KarmX to the philipenes. So if someone actually starts answering me and starts to answer my offer to help, i iwill do whatever non-programming stuff has to be done.

So, shoot.

I think he's just p****d about what happened and the following backlash he got.
I can see his point about people not committing to karma other than buying.
I've bought my first karma in late May/early June and I can relate to what he's saying. It's true that there's not been too much help around the coin with the exception of a few members.
I'm also guilty of this, although I've offered to do some work on the android front but since there's no API ready and my skills are limited, nothing has moved on that front. Hope now with the help of Fitamp we can move forward.
So I think we must reorganize and try to do things in another way. Don't rely too much on the community help for now but try and pay some people that can do our basic infrastructure. Then, with enough exposure, we'll get newcomers that will see the benefits of helping karma grow and use their skills to good use. Right now it's hard for people to see the big picture, kosmost says he's not too interested on the price, but the price is a good indicator and a powerful mindset helper that should not be discounted.
I wish I had better skills so I could help karma grow. Right now I can give my opinion and try to help where I can, I'm in the red and I've not lost faith in Karma.

Sorry, upset at.....? What is it that happened? This is not really clear to me. Yes, I can see that some people are expressing certain views. But are these views about an event that "happened" or the current state of affairs? I have too much experience to get my panties in a bunch every time the price goes up or down. It's not just a poker face, it's just that I have a different idea of value.

For example, it would take the equivalent of $200 to change the mood of this forum completely by buying up to 92 litoshis. For the cost of lunch I could change the mood of quite a few people here. (It's ridiculous, isn't it?) I've seen quite a few people get excited (and become more involved) recently when the price goes up a mere 10%. To me, it's ridiculous that quite a few people base their moods and feelings (and responses) on what equates to about $5.

Just different ideas of value, I suppose. My vision is more longer-term, not daytrader-like. I'm guessing that 90% of us watch the market at least 1x a day. I could be mistaken, but it seems like it.

Psychologically, the KARMA/LTC market (and, to a lesser extend the KARMA/BTC market) has become our "target". This is completely backwards but there's not much that I can do about it other than continue to talk about, and illustrate, value over price.

Our target is not the bitcointalk forum or the cryptocurrency community. That is a huge mistake that we have been making from Day 1. But we continue to act and respond as though it was. Our target should be the people who need Karma the most.

But our market now (cryptocurrency) is comprised mostly of people who don't really know what value is, unfortunately. Karma is like any other start-up, and that's what a lot of people don't seem to realize. We have customers, a community, and a team. And there is little distinction between any of it.

Our market should be completely different if we are to succeed. Our focus needs to shift to where people need it most, not to where people are entertained most. This is not a game, nor should we treat it like one.

With what I charge for my time I could buy 2 cars a day. I'm not saying that to boast, but to illustrate a point. I am working for the 20 year-old who put his savings into Karma and wants to see it grow. I spent hours making Karmashares certificates myself in order that Karma may grow into something great (and make sure it's done properly, of course). Database, website, graphics, text, tweets, tweaks, and just about everything else.. all from the heart. Isn't that what Karma is all about? Yes, I care that much about Karma. It's just disappointing that there are very few who are dedicated enough to "just do it" and stop talking about doing something (or telling others what needs to be done).

When I read some of the posts here all I can do is shake my head. How is it possible that the majority here don't know the value of Karma? Or the value of 1 Karma? I cherish each and every Karma. That's why I haven't spent any of your Karma yet and am very careful with how it will be spent. Because I know many of you worked hard for it. I am very careful with other people's money, even if I am not overly concerned with how I spend my own.

Some of us should do as much as we can to turn that 1 Karma into something special. It's what I am here for. Although I do not watch the markets daily, perhaps there aren't many here who are concerned with the actual value of Karma in this way.

Adding value today = adding price tomorrow. There is a correlation, of course.

I can't say that I am upset at people saying that we need to do something, yet not getting started and just doing it. It's just frustrating, not upsetting. Actually, it's been this way since the beginning (which is why I stepped up to the plate) and we have never really had an active team that was actually getting stuff done.

There is not much difference in this category from April 4, the first day I began working on Karma. We still have the same level of involvement and I continue to press others to be more active (team and community).

If 90% of us are overly concerned with price I can see to it that I am not. Besides, I tend to think more about value. My experience in having created more than 1 very successful company is not to focus on price more than adding value.

However, there aren't many examples of getting a group of volunteers together to work on something. Even the members of the A-Team got compensated for their efforts. In times of crises, sure. But perhaps not for cryptocurrency.

We can almost guarantee that if we created good-sized bounties for simple tasks that they will not be completed 100%. Anyone here is welcome to try it again.

By the way.. how would you like to re-organize?

Thanks for your suggestions

Kos, all the respect for you tremendous work and workload. However, I think that the Karmateam is also trying their best and not everybody can achieve so much in such little time like you. E.g it took me a week to get life updates on the Karmafund.me site. I tried to motivate people to give some Karma for a good cause. I know that this is not the core of our business but somebody needs to do this. I am also disapointed that the whales are not donating much but I keep on.... Please respect our contribution. We need some help as we are also a bit exhausted like who rightfully stated. Bierworst, sorry that we did not respond immediatly. You are fresh so please keep on self-organizing and get others on board.

Having said that, I will keep on as long as Karma lives.

It is not only kosmost who is appreciating your work. Though, I did participated just once with 400K Karma, I am also appreciating all that you do. I am sure that I am not the only one. I do not agree that what you do is not the core of the Karma business. Doing good is good. Remember? And as far as I can say, until now, the results of your hard work and dedication are very clear and helping and the most valuable for Doing good is good. Karma is not a charity coin, but a ecosystem for building good economy. Remember? And helping directly to people in need is integral part of this ecosystem. And fyi and other team members I would say that at all the time, no matter of trolling, we are very clear about these:
1. The only job for any coin developer is to create and supply the coin. After that the dev should secure the network. All should remember how many networks were compromised. That is all. All other things are happening because you are willing to.
2. Your time, personal and professional, is of the same importance to you, as ours. If you spend it to build Karma, it is because you are willing to do it, not because you have to.
3. No one is into position to demand or expect anything. No matter who he/she think he/she is and no matter what kind of experience he/she have. If you are willing to do anything, it is because you are capable to do it and because you want to do it. Not because some troll is demanding. So simple.
4. Every successful or unsuccessful move you do is highly appreciated. If it is successful we are all going to benefit. If it is not, we all have to learn valuable lessons. So both ways we gain. Only cowards doesn`t do anything at all, because they are afraid of failure.
5. Every great achievement in history is accomplished despite every great idiot in history.

So, don`t be subdued. We know very well.

[Alexandrake]

Excuse me, this will be my first post. Though I am a long time Karma "supporter". I have several hundred millions of them and I exchanged some too for karmashares.

I am happy that, a good named coin like KARMA has survived and proved that the community that took it over is not a scam and showed genuine concern for it and the people who trusted them.
Now, because of the recent events, the vibes I can read in this thread has gone to being light and happy to sad and bitter.

What is wrong?

I guess the leadership method is wrong. While the team are honest and works hard for the benefit of karma, some of them act authoritarian and cold whenever someone new express views and ideas different to what they hold as important, like kosmost will bash those who talk about the price (hey wake up value is about the price, let them talk of what is important to them, the important thing is that they trust you and make the effort to be active here). This is very unhealthy to a community that supposed to grow and help. The community may exert all their effort to bring in more karma user, but if they experience, hostility from hot headed and overly protective karma team members as though they are the only ones who have good enough ideas to pay attention to, then those new karma user will shut their mouth and be silent investors instead, that is if they even decide to stay.

This kind of community leadership is only good to the paid corporate environment. Not in a volunteer based community, which karma is still in until today. Even paid workers will appreciate being appreciated. I even read some karma team treating some posters as though they are just there to leech coins. Bad karma.

Maybe the team is made up of super rich guys that are used to looking down on their employees, or whatever it is that made some of them bossy and snob, they have good places to fill here. But not in community communication, sorry you will only negate the effort of the community to bring in more karma user base. Much less find people who will volunteer under your supervision. Look at socoban, what happened to him? Did he not volunteer and made the explorer? When he raised valid inquiries how was he treated? Like an enemy. We are not enemies here. Or maybe that's how the team feels whenever someone raises a valid question on how they conduct their affairs.

So please. I know I will be pissing many of you. But let this be a reminder, if you are not good in maintaining the small community that still shows loyalty to this Karma coin don't expect the community to grow.

Kosmost maybe good. Heck no one can do what he have done so far for this coin. But he cannot do it alone, but whenever he says his team is only talking and not doing anything, he may think he is saying the truth. But he forgets that with that kind of statements, whatever small help he is getting will also be affected. In the end, the ones who will stay with him are those who really just talk and praise him. Those community members who work for free and get that treatment will surely choose to just let go of whatever unappreciated work they are doing. So while kosmost will not be able to do this endeavor alone, the way he speaks here in this forum now will lead him to work alone.

It is evident, kosmost is good with business, but is not as good in growing and maintaining the community people. Let kosmost lead karmashares/and all karmashare businesses.
Make bitwho the leader in communicating to the community here or anyone else that you deem good in human relations. For Pete sake do not let a hot head speak for karma. If a karma representative shows aggressive behavior in public that would reflect bad for this community and the coin.

Re-organize. People who use karma, add value to it. Lose them and you lose the value you say you are working for.

Maybe this will not be important when you pay the people working for karma and you can all act as angry managers, but until then, this community will gain much in treating each other the way you may want to be treated.

And next time, don't let the community wait for something negative like a no deal. it will always look fishy.

Another thing, I understand that the coins exchanged in karmashares are fund for development. Why is it that until now, nothing is developed that was paid for by it? Are we waiting for a time when those coins' value is too little to be used? Pay the devs! Just like how you paid Hiro. pay for what karma and karmashares need. Don't expect the volunteers to churn out anything. Karma is past that point of volunteerism. There is fund now to keep things moving. Use that.

To those who work for karma and karmashare, please keep up the good works and change the bad ones. Thanks. (note* I will re-post this whenever I see someone does these things again)

[KarmaKaguy]

Well, we all have been frustrated 'cause of the recent events I guess. On the flip side, that means we will have a fresh start now. Lets come together! We can make it happen.

[Alphi]

Excuse me, this will be my first post. Though I am a long time Karma "supporter". I have several hundred millions of them and I exchanged some too for karmashares.

I am happy that, a good named coin like KARMA has survived and proved that the community that took it over is not a scam and showed genuine concern for it and the people who trusted them.
Now, because of the recent events, the vibes I can read in this thread has gone to being light and happy to sad and bitter.

What is wrong?

I guess the leadership method is wrong. While the team are honest and works hard for the benefit of karma, some of them act authoritarian and cold whenever someone new express views and ideas different to what they hold as important, like kosmost will bash those who talk about the price (hey wake up value is about the price, let them talk of what is important to them, the important thing is that they trust you and make the effort to be active here). This is very unhealthy to a community that supposed to grow and help. The community may exert all their effort to bring in more karma user, but if they experience, hostility from hot headed and overly protective karma team members as though they are the only ones who have good enough ideas to pay attention to, then those new karma user will shut their mouth and be silent investors instead, that is if they even decide to stay.

This kind of community leadership is only good to the paid corporate environment. Not in a volunteer based community, which karma is still in until today. Even paid workers will appreciate being appreciated. I even read some karma team treating some posters as though they are just there to leech coins. Bad karma.

Maybe the team is made up of super rich guys that are used to looking down on their employees, or whatever it is that made some of them bossy and snob, they have good places to fill here. But not in community communication, sorry you will only negate the effort of the community to bring in more karma user base. Much less find people who will volunteer under your supervision. Look at socoban, what happened to him? Did he not volunteer and made the explorer? When he raised valid inquiries how was he treated? Like an enemy. We are not enemies here. Or maybe that's how the team feels whenever someone raises a valid question on how they conduct their affairs.

So please. I know I will be pissing many of you. But let this be a reminder, if you are not good in maintaining the small community that still shows loyalty to this Karma coin don't expect the community to grow.

Kosmost maybe good. Heck no one can do what he have done so far for this coin. But he cannot do it alone, but whenever he says his team is only talking and not doing anything, he may think he is saying the truth. But he forgets that with that kind of statements, whatever small help he is getting will also be affected. In the end, the ones who will stay with him are those who really just talk and praise him. Those community members who work for free and get that treatment will surely choose to just let go of whatever unappreciated work they are doing. So while kosmost will not be able to do this endeavor alone, the way he speaks here in this forum now will lead him to work alone.

It is evident, kosmost is good with business, but is not as good in growing and maintaining the community people. Let kosmost lead karmashares/and all karmashare businesses.
Make bitwho the leader in communicating to the community here or anyone else that you deem good in human relations. For Pete sake do not let a hot head speak for karma. If a karma representative shows aggressive behavior in public that would reflect bad for this community and the coin.

Re-organize. People who use karma, add value to it. Lose them and you lose the value you say you are working for.

Maybe this will not be important when you pay the people working for karma and you can all act as angry managers, but until then, this community will gain much in treating each other the way you may want to be treated.

And next time, don't let the community wait for something negative like a no deal. it will always look fishy.

Another thing, I understand that the coins exchanged in karmashares are fund for development. Why is it that until now, nothing is developed that was paid for by it? Are we waiting for a time when those coins' value is too little to be used? Pay the devs! Just like how you paid Hiro. pay for what karma and karmashares need. Don't expect the volunteers to churn out anything. Karma is past that point of volunteerism. There is fund now to keep things moving. Use that.

To those who work for karma and karmashare, please keep up the good works and change the bad ones. Thanks. (note* I will re-post this whenever I see someone does these things again)

+1 and welcome to the thread..

this is a general discussion thread for all things Karma, so its not surprising to me at all that people are brainstorming and suggesting new ways of doing things.

I think everyone should be welcome to voice their opinion whether it is positive or negative.
Posts like this one which are well thought out and constructive should never be ignored.

[Bierworst]

take 2 minutes to read this and share your thoughts. As all of you seem very good in typing and posting ideas and thoughts, why not put them in the right place. Bringing karma to the Philipenes can grow the value of Karma extremely. So be wise and share your thoughts   

http://karmashares.com/forums/index.php/topic,608.0.html

[DStefanov]

Excuse me, this will be my first post. Though I am a long time Karma "supporter". I have several hundred millions of them and I exchanged some too for karmashares.

I am happy that, a good named coin like KARMA has survived and proved that the community that took it over is not a scam and showed genuine concern for it and the people who trusted them.
Now, because of the recent events, the vibes I can read in this thread has gone to being light and happy to sad and bitter.

What is wrong?

I guess the leadership method is wrong. While the team are honest and works hard for the benefit of karma, some of them act authoritarian and cold whenever someone new express views and ideas different to what they hold as important, like kosmost will bash those who talk about the price (hey wake up value is about the price, let them talk of what is important to them, the important thing is that they trust you and make the effort to be active here). This is very unhealthy to a community that supposed to grow and help. The community may exert all their effort to bring in more karma user, but if they experience, hostility from hot headed and overly protective karma team members as though they are the only ones who have good enough ideas to pay attention to, then those new karma user will shut their mouth and be silent investors instead, that is if they even decide to stay.

This kind of community leadership is only good to the paid corporate environment. Not in a volunteer based community, which karma is still in until today. Even paid workers will appreciate being appreciated. I even read some karma team treating some posters as though they are just there to leech coins. Bad karma.

Maybe the team is made up of super rich guys that are used to looking down on their employees, or whatever it is that made some of them bossy and snob, they have good places to fill here. But not in community communication, sorry you will only negate the effort of the community to bring in more karma user base. Much less find people who will volunteer under your supervision. Look at socoban, what happened to him? Did he not volunteer and made the explorer? When he raised valid inquiries how was he treated? Like an enemy. We are not enemies here. Or maybe that's how the team feels whenever someone raises a valid question on how they conduct their affairs.

So please. I know I will be pissing many of you. But let this be a reminder, if you are not good in maintaining the small community that still shows loyalty to this Karma coin don't expect the community to grow.

Kosmost maybe good. Heck no one can do what he have done so far for this coin. But he cannot do it alone, but whenever he says his team is only talking and not doing anything, he may think he is saying the truth. But he forgets that with that kind of statements, whatever small help he is getting will also be affected. In the end, the ones who will stay with him are those who really just talk and praise him. Those community members who work for free and get that treatment will surely choose to just let go of whatever unappreciated work they are doing. So while kosmost will not be able to do this endeavor alone, the way he speaks here in this forum now will lead him to work alone.

It is evident, kosmost is good with business, but is not as good in growing and maintaining the community people. Let kosmost lead karmashares/and all karmashare businesses.
Make bitwho the leader in communicating to the community here or anyone else that you deem good in human relations. For Pete sake do not let a hot head speak for karma. If a karma representative shows aggressive behavior in public that would reflect bad for this community and the coin.

Re-organize. People who use karma, add value to it. Lose them and you lose the value you say you are working for.

Maybe this will not be important when you pay the people working for karma and you can all act as angry managers, but until then, this community will gain much in treating each other the way you may want to be treated.

And next time, don't let the community wait for something negative like a no deal. it will always look fishy.

Another thing, I understand that the coins exchanged in karmashares are fund for development. Why is it that until now, nothing is developed that was paid for by it? Are we waiting for a time when those coins' value is too little to be used? Pay the devs! Just like how you paid Hiro. pay for what karma and karmashares need. Don't expect the volunteers to churn out anything. Karma is past that point of volunteerism. There is fund now to keep things moving. Use that.

To those who work for karma and karmashare, please keep up the good works and change the bad ones. Thanks. (note* I will re-post this whenever I see someone does these things again)

+111111
Welcome back! I support every word you said! That is why I do not write all in the subject. Several times I offered ideas that is very likely to have been stupid or not worth mentioning, but neither Kosmost nor any of the team did not even comment on them. This is the least offensive and disrespectful. There was a story that the most stupid book can learn many useful things.
Anyway! You are absolutely right and if karma team wants to have a community and wonders why no one wrote the theme to your own conclusions ..
Greetings!
Go KARMA.

[Alphi]

It's amazing how much time we waste here on immature conversations, as though our sometimes illogical and sophomoric diatribes are productive.

If we have 1,000 extended members of the Karma community and our most active members are posting here and replying to our subreddit and forum, and most of these "active" members are posting bile like the above and busy not responding to a post like this then I really don't know what to say.

I'm sorry to be blunt here.. but there is just no way that anyone is going to invest in your company if this is how you react to criticism.
legitimate questions have been asked by investors and prospective investors. So far I haven't seen many direct answers to those questions.
please feel free to ignore the trolls if you wish, but if you ignore your own investors it will only hurt your business in the long run.

to be perfectly frank.. by not answering the concerns of your investors all you are doing is feeding the mistrust and accusations.

you can consider this bile and immature conversation if you wish but I consider it firm and frank advice.

please note that I haven't asked you any questions.
this is because I am not a Karmashares investor so you are not obliged to give me any answers.

As for not responding to your post about growing Karma adoption in SE Asia, I have already made it clear what my position is that you should get your house in order before engaging on yet another campaign. This is because, while you are busy marching forward, it seems like people are increasingly reluctant to march behind you. at least not until their concerns have been addressed.

[Alphi]

take 2 minutes to read this and share your thoughts. As all of you seem very good in typing and posting ideas and thoughts, why not put them in the right place. Bringing karma to the Philipenes can grow the value of Karma extremely. So be wise and share your thoughts    

http://karmashares.com/forums/index.php/topic,608.0.html


what do you think is needed to get Karma in the philipenes    
which obstacles do we have to overcome and how
Which people do we need to get involved
Why do you think this is a good cause

most people in the third world live a hand to mouth existence.. this means that they often don't have money to invest in speculative assets like Crypt currency.
if you want to get Karma into a any third world country that doesn't have good internet infrastructure you first need to build the infrastructure.

for example a full featured wallet program that downloads the entire block chain is simply not practical for the third world.
you need to have lite web wallets which can be accessed via smart phone with OR sms.

secondly you need not only places to buy Karma but places to trade Karma for goods and services.

an example might be:

setting up an internet cafe where people can use Karma to purchase internet time, candies, drinks etc. next to the internet cafe you can have a recycling drop off where people can drop off recyclable bottles and cans and get paid in Karma which they can use in the internet cafe.

a model like this would solve two problems... 1) getting internet access to the poor, and 2) supporting recycling and helping to clean the environment.

[Alexandrake]

Excuse me, this will be my first post. Though I am a long time Karma "supporter". I have several hundred millions of them and I exchanged some too for karmashares.

I am happy that, a good named coin like KARMA has survived and proved that the community that took it over is not a scam and showed genuine concern for it and the people who trusted them.
Now, because of the recent events, the vibes I can read in this thread has gone to being light and happy to sad and bitter.

What is wrong?

I guess the leadership method is wrong. While the team are honest and works hard for the benefit of karma, some of them act authoritarian and cold whenever someone new express views and ideas different to what they hold as important, like kosmost will bash those who talk about the price (hey wake up value is about the price, let them talk of what is important to them, the important thing is that they trust you and make the effort to be active here). This is very unhealthy to a community that supposed to grow and help. The community may exert all their effort to bring in more karma user, but if they experience, hostility from hot headed and overly protective karma team members as though they are the only ones who have good enough ideas to pay attention to, then those new karma user will shut their mouth and be silent investors instead, that is if they even decide to stay.

This kind of community leadership is only good to the paid corporate environment. Not in a volunteer based community, which karma is still in until today. Even paid workers will appreciate being appreciated. I even read some karma team treating some posters as though they are just there to leech coins. Bad karma.

Maybe the team is made up of super rich guys that are used to looking down on their employees, or whatever it is that made some of them bossy and snob, they have good places to fill here. But not in community communication, sorry you will only negate the effort of the community to bring in more karma user base. Much less find people who will volunteer under your supervision. Look at socoban, what happened to him? Did he not volunteer and made the explorer? When he raised valid inquiries how was he treated? Like an enemy. We are not enemies here. Or maybe that's how the team feels whenever someone raises a valid question on how they conduct their affairs.

So please. I know I will be pissing many of you. But let this be a reminder, if you are not good in maintaining the small community that still shows loyalty to this Karma coin don't expect the community to grow.

Kosmost maybe good. Heck no one can do what he have done so far for this coin. But he cannot do it alone, but whenever he says his team is only talking and not doing anything, he may think he is saying the truth. But he forgets that with that kind of statements, whatever small help he is getting will also be affected. In the end, the ones who will stay with him are those who really just talk and praise him. Those community members who work for free and get that treatment will surely choose to just let go of whatever unappreciated work they are doing. So while kosmost will not be able to do this endeavor alone, the way he speaks here in this forum now will lead him to work alone.

It is evident, kosmost is good with business, but is not as good in growing and maintaining the community people. Let kosmost lead karmashares/and all karmashare businesses.
Make bitwho the leader in communicating to the community here or anyone else that you deem good in human relations. For Pete sake do not let a hot head speak for karma. If a karma representative shows aggressive behavior in public that would reflect bad for this community and the coin.

Re-organize. People who use karma, add value to it. Lose them and you lose the value you say you are working for.

Maybe this will not be important when you pay the people working for karma and you can all act as angry managers, but until then, this community will gain much in treating each other the way you may want to be treated.

And next time, don't let the community wait for something negative like a no deal. it will always look fishy.

Another thing, I understand that the coins exchanged in karmashares are fund for development. Why is it that until now, nothing is developed that was paid for by it? Are we waiting for a time when those coins' value is too little to be used? Pay the devs! Just like how you paid Hiro. pay for what karma and karmashares need. Don't expect the volunteers to churn out anything. Karma is past that point of volunteerism. There is fund now to keep things moving. Use that.

To those who work for karma and karmashare, please keep up the good works and change the bad ones. Thanks. (note* I will re-post this whenever I see someone does these things again)

+111111
Welcome back! I support every word you said! That is why I do not write all in the subject. Several times I offered ideas that is very likely to have been stupid or not worth mentioning, but neither Kosmost nor any of the team did not even comment on them. This is the least offensive and disrespectful. There was a story that the most stupid book can learn many useful things.
Anyway! You are absolutely right and if karma team wants to have a community and wonders why no one wrote the theme to your own conclusions ..
Greetings!
Go KARMA.

Thanks Alphi, DStefanov...Let us all hope we can pull ourselves together and work on improving things up.

[bondi]

Also don't forget Indonesia...
Check this: http://www.reddit.com/r/Karmashares/comments/2d7yol/the_developing_world_karmas_opportunity_for/
Seems we have someone who's willing to do some work there...

Some numbers for Philippines http://www.coindesk.com/bitcoin-philippines-numbers/

Those 2 markets are really a good fit for Karma.

[Bierworst]

Quoted from our reddit, this person knows what he is talking about.

"Remittance Indonesia is much like Philippines. We have a lot of people working abroad mostly as blue-collars. Data from 2013 showed the remittance values is around USD 9.6 millions which roughly 30% of national foreign income. Workers in Saudi Arabia is the number 1 sender following by worker in Korea.
Tourism We have Bali which visited by 3.2 millions foreigners by 2013 raising from 2.8 millions in 2012. By this June, it's already 1.7 millions. And those numbers are the direct visitors, people who flight directly in Bali. National total Indonesia visited by about 8.3 millions tourist in 2013. They spent averagely 7 days and spending around $1100. Last but not least, we don't only have Bali
Domestic spending on everyday consumption goods. I live in Bandung which is in Java Island and capital of Jawa Barat (West Java). So may opinions in this matters may or may not represents national. But from what i see, what happens in Bandung & Jakarta will follow by another areas. There is a tremendous growing of mini market in Indonesia. You can open Google maps and search for Circle K, Alfamart and Indomart and you will see how many they are in one street. And those mini mart not only a convenience store, they also become a payment point for cables, internet, electricity, train ticket, phone credit and selling point for music CDs. There are about 80 millions of people within age 15-35 which I think the potential user of crypto currency. I can say 80% of them have at least 1 mobile phone (oh yes, some of us have 2 or 3 lol) and I think 60% of it smartphone (android, ios, BB or win). Yes, we are BIG potential market in Southeast Asia. I think number 3 in Asia Pacific after China and India.
Now, how can Karma take part in this big potential ?
Local Exchange.
A local exchange (which is my desire for the past 2 months…looking for investor here ?) that is owned by LLC will lower the cost converting from Karm to local currency. In here there is only 1 BTC exchange which is bitcoin.co.id and they are expanding in Bali and start to approach retail market with their bitislands.co.id offering a sms based micro payment. And they charge quite a lot which is understandable because they are pioneer, starter. And because they also need to eat . At the exchange they charge total 0.6% for buy+sell and 1% or minimum USD 2.1 for withdrawal in IDR. Withdrawal in BTC cost 0.0005 which is 5x the network fee.
Remittance.
With Saudi Arabia as number 1 source of income I think it’s reasonable to have office there as the sender. That office will give buying pressure to market. The sender of course can choose if they want the receiver to get it as Karm or in local currency.. And then we set up one office in Indonesia as receiver. Their job is convert from Karm to local currency and sending it to the whatever local bank the receiver have. Some of banks here already have deposit machines so this could be a 24 hours service. The receiver office will give selling pressure to the market. Our cost would be 0.3% (buy & sell) in Mintpal and USD 0.5-1.7 per transaction for deposit to local banks account.
Tourism.
Because we need a receiver office for the remittance then it’s reasonable to have office in Bali. But then the living cost and renting cost is high in Bali. I am thinking of a small representative office. The main office could be anywhere. What this Bali office does is arranging some exchange points in the airport and tourist area. In tourism, bigger works need to be done in the western country and Australia. I am thinking about small booth in the international departure area where people can exchange their money into Karm with a big banner “ Rescue yourself from the evil Bank’s fee when travelling with Karmacoin”.
Domestic spending.
Those mini mart /convenience store is the most important part of the adoption of crypto currency because that is the place most likely people spend their money. And I am thinking globally here. You can buy clothes in overstock and computers in Dell but do you do that in daily basis ? I don’t know exactly how much is the average amount people spend at those minimarts here but from random observation is about USD 2. This could be a pack of cigarette and a bottled drink or some snacks and bottled drink. I did mention that there are about 80 millions potential users right ? With the availability of those minimarts to support Karm as payment, most likely the blue collars will send the money in Karm because they relative can use it on daily basis. In fact the receiver could ask that want it in Karm because when they spend it in minimart they will get free chocolate or 2% off or whatever. And those sporadic minimart could be the exchange point for those tourists who exchange their money in the airport before departure which they must be very glad because they were safe from the evil bank’s fee ?
Wow, that was quite a lot writing there ? I hope what I did here is good enough for the community and understandable because English is not my 1st language. In regards of the $ 2.5 millions offering for lill.com i think that is a good offer and way higher than the 1st offer. If we want doing good by building a better community, empowering people to access a better and safer payment process, to help those hard working blue collars people and some tourist from the evil bank’s fee while raising Karm popularity I think this is not a search engine could do."

[Maurizio]

It's amazing how much time we waste here on immature conversations, as though our sometimes illogical and sophomoric diatribes are productive.

If we have 1,000 extended members of the Karma community and our most active members are posting here and replying to our subreddit and forum, and most of these "active" members are posting bile like the above and busy not responding to a post like this then I really don't know what to say.

I'm sorry to be blunt here.. but there is just no way that anyone is going to invest in your company if this is how you react to criticism.
legitimate questions have been asked by investors and prospective investors. So far I haven't seen many direct answers to those questions.
please feel free to ignore the trolls if you wish, but if you ignore your own investors it will only hurt your business in the long run.

to be perfectly frank.. by not answering the concerns of your investors all you are doing is feeding the mistrust and accusations.

you can consider this bile and immature conversation if you wish but I consider it firm and frank advice.

please note that I haven't asked you any questions.
this is because I am not a Karmashares investor so you are not obliged to give me any answers.

As for not responding to your post about growing Karma adoption in SE Asia, I have already made it clear what my position is that you should get your house in order before engaging on yet another campaign. This is because, while you are busy marching forward, it seems like people are increasingly reluctant to march behind you. at least not until their concerns have been addressed.

Thank you Alphi for your statement. What you say was also in my mind but my language skills diqualifieds me
to share my thoughts in the same was you did it with your post.

Its easy to call me a troll and for that reason not to answer my conerns.
Thats the same in politics if you call someone a conspiracy theorist.

Back to topic thank you Alphi for that ver qualified statement about whats going on atm.

[bitwho]

are we circle jerking back around to Kosmost is scamming?

If you going to call kosmost simply a scammer with out any proof or plausible theory, he is not going to respond to you with proof plausible theory why he is not. he is simply going to point out how ridicules that statement is. because it is.
Maybe this times you guys feel you need more closure from Kosmost but remember you're talking to the guy who has been drilled with questions for 5 months. believe it or not. that gets tiring. So you have to understand why his lack of response. I do

Please, Open a post in the karmashare forum or in the reddit sub r/karmateam and continue it if you feel you need closure .  


This thread was picking up some good momentum recently. Users are finnaly coming together and are offer their skill and time to build on karma. Please lets not bury that momentum with redundant topics. you want your closure? take it some where private and let move forward?

[toeshe]

However, I have asked Maurizio for a clear explanation why they think anything has been scammed ... no response. He should be more ashamed about not being able to offer an explanation than insulting another member (me) but obviously the lack of explanation for his statement does not bother him.

How the table turns..... several people have asked for  a clear explanation why they think anything has not   been a huge scam ... no response. He should be more ashamed about not being able to offer an explanation than insulting another members (all of us ) obviously the lack of explanation for his statement brings serious doubt and mistrust in the karma team.

[bitwho]

It's amazing how much time we waste here on immature conversations, as though our sometimes illogical and sophomoric diatribes are productive.

If we have 1,000 extended members of the Karma community and our most active members are posting here and replying to our subreddit and forum, and most of these "active" members are posting bile like the above and busy not responding to a post like this then I really don't know what to say.

I'm sorry to be blunt here.. but there is just no way that anyone is going to invest in your company if this is how you react to criticism.
legitimate questions have been asked by investors and prospective investors. So far I haven't seen many direct answers to those questions.
please feel free to ignore the trolls if you wish, but if you ignore your own investors it will only hurt your business in the long run.

to be perfectly frank.. by not answering the concerns of your investors all you are doing is feeding the mistrust and accusations.

you can consider this bile and immature conversation if you wish but I consider it firm and frank advice.

please note that I haven't asked you any questions.
this is because I am not a Karmashares investor so you are not obliged to give me any answers.

As for not responding to your post about growing Karma adoption in SE Asia, I have already made it clear what my position is that you should get your house in order before engaging on yet another campaign. This is because, while you are busy marching forward, it seems like people are increasingly reluctant to march behind you. at least not until their concerns have been addressed.

Thank you Alphi for your statement. What you say was also in my mind but my language skills diqualifieds me
to share my thoughts in the same was you did it with your post.

Its easy to call me a troll and for that reason not to answer my conerns.
Thats the same in politics if you call someone a conspiracy theorist.

Back to topic thank you Alphi for that ver qualified statement about whats going on atm.

not really. alphi is asking question. you are making statement with out base and accusing with out base either. there is a huge difference

anyways. you seem to be focusing your attack on "outing" kosmost for the scammer that he is.

Could you try to take this somewhere else or via PMs? 

lets move forward with better news. My karmanians went through some stress full time watching those billion being sold. i don't feel comfortable reading this circle jerk drams. go take it private. and if you want to come public , bring facts or theories.

[Bierworst]

I have the feeling some of you people read this book

I myself wanted answers on questions what happened, but i did not accuse kosmost for it or any other one from the community.

Lets stop this right now because whatever happened happened, and those billions of coins are now in the hands of more people, so we got a great distribution.

Lets focus on karma again and not on what happened because whatever was the cause for it, it is not going to improve karma. If any of you need trust in karma, just look at how the team is trying to get new projects started up, if it was a scam, would they even take time to do that? No they would not.

If any of you want to respond on what i said, feel free but i will not respond because it has no use.
/sarcasmon Maybe i shouldn't trust the germans, because from 1940-1945 they took over the Netherlands, but i dont know who of all the germans exactly did so lets just not trust all the germans and blame this random german dude in the store because he is first in line

/sarcasmoff