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Author Topic: [XMR] Monero - A secure, private, untraceable cryptocurrency  (Read 4531403 times)
arnuschky
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February 23, 2015, 02:18:19 PM
 #20281

Great work by the core team! Updating that broken website was long overdue. Thanks. Smiley

And now it also become much clearer which forum is the main one.

Regarding the missives: great that this is continuing - good idea to "outsource" it. Personally, I am not such a fan of the podcast format, as it doesn't allow me to quickly scan over the news but forces me to focus for a long time (I am a crap multitasker Wink) However this problem is nicely fixed by the on-page summary, and, as I said, just a personal opinion on the format. Overall, great!

edit: you no look?
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February 23, 2015, 02:19:28 PM
 #20282

summary of the missive? I don't want to listen to some people drone on and on unprofessionally about some mundane esoteric mess

I need a succinct outline. don't like surprises.

For 10 monero I will provide you with a summary.

41nAXFnYwhyDgWt2KAy1XFeZyDUWktkhGDA774NyY9qc1jg4MPH33oLD4tBMnQwVmMcktaUFMcKdJTW dkqRyrVXHNh88QUa

failed to decode address

also invalid payment id, both simplewallet and mymonero said this

try again?
stslimited
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February 23, 2015, 02:20:31 PM
 #20283

summary of the missive? I don't want to listen to some people drone on and on unprofessionally about some mundane esoteric mess

I need a succinct outline. don't like surprises.

I like Ginger and Fluffy's chemistry, but anyway....

Nice new missives.

Cliffnotes:

 - NEW WEBSITE! www.getmonero.org (monero.cc redirects to it)

- MRL-0004 (Improving Obfuscation in the Cryptonote Protocol) (http://lab.monero.cc/pubs/MRL-0004.pdf):
Mixins: low-mixins can result in a cascading reduction in privacy. XMR will be moving very soon to a minimum mixin of 2. the reason mixin-0 is allowed in the first place is because mixin-0 is useful for sending dust. the solution in MRL-0004 is for mixin-0  to be allowed under special circumstances. these circumstances include a) when the transaction is dust, and b) when the transaction won't create new dust. thus, these specially-allowed transactions will gradually remove dust from the system. eventually the minimum mixin will be mixin-4. increasing the minimum mixin is considered critical in improving cryptonote.

temporal-association: in XMR, there's an age-based association problem where observers can tell how old coins are when they're spent due to the way that outputs are chosen for mixing. ideally, it should not be easy to do this. people might panic if very old coins are moving, as would be the case if satoshi started moving coins from 2009. this is not critical but being worked on as well.

- design and research goals: http://getmonero.org/design-goals/
not a timeline, but it shows what must come before what.



So you can't be bothered to peruse ONE PAGE and see the thing you are asking for. You're like my dad yelling for the hat that's on his head. "Where's my hat! ARRRRR!"



I saw that, is that really it? I needed to confirm that the price is going up over this inconsequential stuff?
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February 23, 2015, 02:23:54 PM
 #20284

summary of the missive? I don't want to listen to some people drone on and on unprofessionally about some mundane esoteric mess

I need a succinct outline. don't like surprises.

For 10 monero I will provide you with a summary.

41nAXFnYwhyDgWt2KAy1XFeZyDUWktkhGDA774NyY9qc1jg4MPH33oLD4tBMnQwVmMcktaUFMcKdJTW dkqRyrVXHNh88QUa

failed to decode address

also invalid payment id, both simplewallet and mymonero said this

try again?

He should have posted in code, so that copy pasting works.
Same addy as above, but in code:

Code:
41nAXFnYwhyDgWt2KAy1XFeZyDUWktkhGDA774NyY9qc1jg4MPH33oLD4tBMnQwVmMcktaUFMcKdJTWdkqRyrVXHNh88QUa

Thank you Fluffy & Co for this update (even though I'm not much of a fan of the format, I understand why it makes a difference to you).

arnuschky
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February 23, 2015, 02:25:13 PM
 #20285

Wallet             Official       Graphical                       Binaries                   Notes
                                                Windows       Mac       Linux    FreeBSD
simplewallet                                   (d/l)     (d/l)     (d/l)     (d/l)    source
Monero Client .NET                             (d/l)                                  full node or remote node
Qt GUI                                                                                source. Full node only
lightWallet                                   (d/l)                                  source. Full node or remote node. Torrent with binaries + blockchain
mymonero.com                                                                          author is a core dev
CryptoNoteWallet                                                            


Great overview! Should go on the monero.cc website, I guess? Some small corrections:

  • if not open-source, I would maybe indicate "closed source", as this is a critical thing in crypto currencies (Monero Client .NET and mymonero.com as well, strictly speaking)
  • mymonero.com should maybe have dashes for all "binary" flags
  • an API/RPC column would be really helpful (only simplewallet, I think?)
  • BitKoot's CryptoNoteWallet is graphical
  • What makes BitKoot's CryptoNoteWallet "official"?
argentinx
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February 23, 2015, 02:25:49 PM
 #20286

the missive in audio is ok
but who dont talk english?Huh
you can make a summary???
wpalczynski
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February 23, 2015, 02:27:08 PM
 #20287

Im sure someone will make a summary soon and post it.

the missive in audio is ok
but who dont talk english?Huh
you can make a summary???
stslimited
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February 23, 2015, 02:29:23 PM
 #20288

summary of the missive? I don't want to listen to some people drone on and on unprofessionally about some mundane esoteric mess

I need a succinct outline. don't like surprises.

For 10 monero I will provide you with a summary.

41nAXFnYwhyDgWt2KAy1XFeZyDUWktkhGDA774NyY9qc1jg4MPH33oLD4tBMnQwVmMcktaUFMcKdJTW dkqRyrVXHNh88QUa

ok sent.
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February 23, 2015, 02:30:29 PM
 #20289

the missive in audio is ok
but who dont talk english?Huh
you can make a summary???

The first thing said in the missive is actually asking the community to contribute by writing down what is said in the missive. So I'm sure you'll be soon able to read a version of it.
 

Monero's privacy and therefore fungibility are MUCH stronger than Bitcoin's. 
This makes Monero a better candidate to deserve the term "digital cash".
generalizethis
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February 23, 2015, 02:34:13 PM
 #20290




I saw that, is that really it? I needed to confirm that the price is going up over this ?


Everyone has their own view-key of "inconsequential stuff," but the price is Risto's endeavor, not a reaction to any great breakthrough in the DB or a shiny new GUI or any other major announcement. But I thought you knew that, so I'm confused as to why you are confused. But maybe you'll be confused why I'm confused to as why you're confused and we'll create a really confused rip in space-time--which would be pretty kick ass if you ask me.

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February 23, 2015, 02:42:30 PM
Last edit: February 23, 2015, 02:54:37 PM by David Latapie
 #20291

summary of the missive? I don't want to listen to some people drone on and on unprofessionally about some mundane esoteric mess

I need a succinct outline. don't like surprises.
Volunteers needed to create subtitles and summary. Effort go here: https://forum.monero.cc/1/news-and-announcements/161/monday-monero-missives-23-february-23rd-2015 (let's make this "moving away from bitcointalk" a reality)

Quote
Bitcointalk is not a good environment if we want serious discussion about Monero. That much should be obvious. At some point we have to start cutting the apron strings and disconnecting from Bitcoin, especially since we share few common goals and no common code. It would be unfair of us to force newcomers interested in Monero to dig through thousands of scamcoin, shill, and troll posts on bitcointalk to find the occasional gem of information.

Additionally, you cannot possibly convince me that people needing help in running and using Monero should all gather in a single thread on a Bitcoin forum?? Nah, we've done our time here, there's no value in maintaining all the Monero threads on Bitcointalk. Anyone here who needs to know about Monero already does know about Monero;)

Monero: the first crytocurrency to bring bank secrecy and net neutrality to the blockchain.HyperStake: pushing the limits of staking.
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stslimited
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February 23, 2015, 02:49:49 PM
 #20292




I saw that, is that really it? I needed to confirm that the price is going up over this ?


Everyone has their own view-key of "inconsequential stuff," but the price is Risto's endeavor, not a reaction to any great breakthrough in the DB or a shiny new GUI or any other major announcement. But I thought you knew that, so I'm confused as to why you are confused. But maybe you'll be confused why I'm confused to as why you're confused and we'll create a really confused rip in space-time--which would be pretty kick ass if you ask me.

Not DB related and Not GUI related? Then no rational price rise.

my conclusion exactly.
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February 23, 2015, 02:52:39 PM
 #20293

Wallet             Official       Graphical                       Binaries                   Notes
                                                Windows       Mac       Linux    FreeBSD
simplewallet                                   (d/l)     (d/l)     (d/l)     (d/l)    source
Monero Client .NET                             (d/l)                                  full node or remote node
Qt GUI                                                                                source. Full node only
lightWallet                                   (d/l)                                  source. Full node or remote node. Torrent with binaries + blockchain
mymonero.com                                                                          author is a core dev
CryptoNoteWallet                                                            


Great overview! Should go on the monero.cc website, I guess? Some small corrections:

  • if not open-source, I would maybe indicate "closed source", as this is a critical thing in crypto currencies (Monero Client .NET and mymonero.com as well, strictly speaking)
  • mymonero.com should maybe have dashes for all "binary" flags
  • an API/RPC column would be really helpful (only simplewallet, I think?)
  • BitKoot's CryptoNoteWallet is graphical
  • What makes BitKoot's CryptoNoteWallet "official"?

A bug on the forum prevents me to add it, I already created a bug report

For closed-source, I will add a column (this is only for mymonero so far and I will add a mention that it will ultimately be open-sourced). I won't do it with the present BBCode, because this is horrible to edit, Markdown is much better (essentially because you can insert HTML in Markdown)

API/RPC column: it would require more than a yes/no, right? Because not every software would accept any API/RPC

Similarly, I will add an OpenAlias column

Since this is a lot of colum, I will pivot the table, with one column per wallet (instead of one row, presently)

I will correct for cryptonote - mere oversight, when copying/pasting, thanks

Monero: the first crytocurrency to bring bank secrecy and net neutrality to the blockchain.HyperStake: pushing the limits of staking.
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arnuschky
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February 23, 2015, 02:54:14 PM
 #20294


I think forum.monero.cc just went down...  Huh

On other news: this thread is exploding! Smiley
arnuschky
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February 23, 2015, 02:54:58 PM
 #20295

I think forum.monero.cc just went down...  Huh

Nevermind, it's back.
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February 23, 2015, 02:56:01 PM
 #20296

summary of the missive? I don't want to listen to some people drone on and on unprofessionally about some mundane esoteric mess

same here, i personally doesn't like audio missive. I'm not good at listening English, i had to come here in seeking for a detailed text.
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February 23, 2015, 02:57:24 PM
 #20297




I saw that, is that really it? I needed to confirm that the price is going up over this ?


Everyone has their own view-key of "inconsequential stuff," but the price is Risto's endeavor, not a reaction to any great breakthrough in the DB or a shiny new GUI or any other major announcement. But I thought you knew that, so I'm confused as to why you are confused. But maybe you'll be confused why I'm confused to as why you're confused and we'll create a really confused rip in space-time--which would be pretty kick ass if you ask me.

Not DB related and Not GUI related? Then no rational price rise.

my conclusion exactly.

I disagree. And I believe to be rational too... Smiley
There was no official news about development for a long time. There was demand for a better website since now almost a year.
Now we get news, we have a nice website that seems very useful and community-oriented, we can see THIS and know great things are on track. It's very conforting to see the intact motivation going into core development.
Risto's transparent announcement may have its influence on the price but I don't think the last missive should be underestimated.

Monero's privacy and therefore fungibility are MUCH stronger than Bitcoin's. 
This makes Monero a better candidate to deserve the term "digital cash".
generalizethis
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February 23, 2015, 02:57:53 PM
 #20298




I saw that, is that really it? I needed to confirm that the price is going up over this ?


Everyone has their own view-key of "inconsequential stuff," but the price is Risto's endeavor, not a reaction to any great breakthrough in the DB or a shiny new GUI or any other major announcement. But I thought you knew that, so I'm confused as to why you are confused. But maybe you'll be confused why I'm confused to as why you're confused and we'll create a really confused rip in space-time--which would be pretty kick ass if you ask me.

Not DB related and Not GUI related? Then no rational price rise.

my conclusion exactly.

There was never a rationale drop either, so who cares? BCX makes an empty threat and the price tanks--meanwhile the fundamentals get better: db testing, mymonero, xmr.to, new forum(s)..... Turn about is fair play. If it goes back to pre-timewarp, I'm satisfied in the re-evaluation, and if it goes higher, I'll consider it a factoring-in of the improvements, usability and a nice bonus to liquidity.  Cheesy

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February 23, 2015, 02:58:48 PM
 #20299

summary of the missive? I don't want to listen to some people drone on and on unprofessionally about some mundane esoteric mess

same here, i personally doesn't like audio missive. I'm not good at listening English, i had to come here in seeking for a detailed text.

I am a native english speaker, but I just don't like podcasts...thankfully we have some good samaritan monero transcriber people here Smiley
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February 23, 2015, 02:59:43 PM
Last edit: February 23, 2015, 08:34:52 PM by cAPSLOCK
 #20300

summary of the missive? I don't want to listen to some people drone on and on unprofessionally about some mundane esoteric mess

I need a succinct outline. don't like surprises.

For 10 monero I will provide you with a summary.

41nAXFnYwhyDgWt2KAy1XFeZyDUWktkhGDA774NyY9qc1jg4MPH33oLD4tBMnQwVmMcktaUFMcKdJTW dkqRyrVXHNh88QUa

--  There is a new website: http://www.getmonero.org
     This features updated design
     There are sections for missives, a blog, the forum, and a work in progress knowledgebase
     There is a new design and research goals plan with a graphical map:  http://getmonero.org/design-goals/
     The website is open and stored in the git repository and the devs are welcoming community contribution

-- There is a new research paper at  http://lab.monero.cc
     MRL4 - http://lab.monero.cc/pubs/MRL-0004.pdf
     The idea is they are researching anonymity vs mixin levels and how this can be improved.  This is a furtherization of MRL 001
     They talked about unlinkability (dual key stealth addressing) and untraceability (ring sigs) ... two different things.
     They talked about disallowing a 0 mixin transaction except under special circumstances and dust removal in relation to this problem.  This could involve a hard fork where mixin 0 or 1 transaction would not be allowed into the blockchain.

--  Age based associations (temporal associations):  There is also new understanding that it is possible to determine the age of coins moved in some circumstances.  The info is based on the way inputs are chosen.   This problem is less important than the MRL 004 problem, and very simple.  The risk is basically Panic when early coins are detected as being moved.

--  Towards the end of the talk they highlight the design and development goals I mention above ^^^  http://getmonero.org/design-goals/

-- They discuss how important it is to have libraries finished for 3rd party implementations for things like iOs/Android etc so not only can the wallet be coded well, but others can develop apps etc via these tools.

-- They defend the slow development pace (<-that is semi editorial) by saying they are still carefully laying groundwork for an enterprise grade product as opposed to trying to just make things like wallets. For example the library development as opposed to a WALLET NOW.
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