[XMR] Monero - A secure, private, untraceable cryptocurrency

[myagui]

It's likely that it's just that MyMonero hasn't been updated to work with the replacement seed words, or something like that.
A certain small equus ferus caballus of fluffy nature will know best! 

[1714046525]

1714046525

[slavo]

ok thanks.

that was a long time i didn't use that forum great to see the xmr thread is still friendly; gg guys

now i'll hope that those precious xmr are still mine somewhere

cheers

[dEBRUYNE]

I stumbled upon this comment from tacotime in another topic and found it cross-postworthy:

We need a review of this technology. Something brilliant and clever like this should not be ignored. Even satoshi made some comments on the essence of Cryptonote. Maybe he contributed in some way or another towards its development

Apparently it was in development since a few years and was intended to be a step ahead in the right direction, that is transaction privacy. Cryptonote is the tech which should have been bitcoin in the first place. If it had surfaced a year later after bitcoin, things could have been different

Um. What do you want to know? I'll talk about Monero since that's the CN chain I've worked on the most.

(1) It uses a different elliptic curve than Bitcoin for signing (EdDSA, which uses Schnorr signatures on a Twisted Edwards curve).
(2) It uses a different hashing algorithm than Bitcoin for PoW, which is AES heavy and currently performs similarly on GPUs and CPUs. One of the main downsides to this is that sidechains are currently impossible (validation takes too long), however as sidechains don't actually exist right now we've been ignoring this. If we want to add sidechain support in the future, the hashing algorithm can be change to something simple. In the meantime, the algorithm is relatively "egalitarian" in that no specialized hardware is required.
(3) One time use addresses ("stealth addressing") is mandatory for all transactions. This makes light clients very difficult to secure or create in general, but it dramatically enhances privacy because it's impossible to ever reuse an address.
(4) All transactions are denominated in base 10, and fractionated by mantissa.
(5) Ring signatures obfuscate spending of outputs by allowing you to do a 1-of-N input for a transaction where you spend funds from Bob OR Alice OR Michael OR Claire OR et cetera. Like one time use addresses, this is a passive privacy technology that doesn't require any active participation of anyone in the network (unlike DarkCoin, CoinJoin, and so on).
(6) A single pair of private keys is used for the recovery of all outputs owned by a wallet, but with a different type of data structure than BIP32 has (viewkey/secretkey).
(7) An implicit, silent multisig implementation centered around Schnorr signatures is being researched and developed (thanks andytoshi/gmaxwell).
( 8 ) Research is ongoing into ways to break our privacy technology and improve it. See: https://lab.monero.cc/
(9) Monero is readily auditable from a regulatory perspective (you can easily prove your ownership of funds if you need to, for example to tax agencies).
(10) It has a much faster emissions (subsidy/reward) curve than Bitcoin. 80% is mined within 4 years. The emissions curve is also much smoother than for Bitcoin, with reward decreasing every block.
(11) Unlike Bitcoin, Monero will have long term perpetual inflation. Subsidy will become fixed in about 10 years time at a flat rate of less than 1%, to keep the chain from becoming fully deflationary and to better incentivize miners. This makes it more likely to be useful as a currency than Bitcoin, in my opinion.

Props to tacotime for explaining everything in detail.

[GreekBitcoin]

MoneroWorld Digest #4

https://forum.getmonero.org/20/general-discussion/200/moneroworld-digest-4-3-4-2015

Very helpful! Keep em coming!

[dEBRUYNE]

ok thanks.

that was a long time i didn't use that forum great to see the xmr thread is still friendly; gg guys

now i'll hope that those precious xmr are still mine somewhere

cheers

Btw, you could also try the #monero or #monero-dev channel on freenode. You'll probably get a faster response there. Just state your question there and most of the time someone will respond very fast.

If you are not familiar with IRC, just use this -> http://webchat.freenode.net/ , set your nickname and set the channel to #monero and/or #monero-dev

[fluffypony]

Btw, you could also try the #monero or #monero-dev channel on freenode. You'll probably get a faster response there. Just state your question there and most of the time someone will respond very fast.

If you are not familiar with IRC, just use this -> http://webchat.freenode.net/ , set your nickname and set the channel to #monero and/or #monero-dev

I was about to say, for MyMonero support email support@mymonero.com or #mymonero on Freenode, otherwise the regular Monero channels on Freenode won't be able to help much:)

[Anon136]

We're mainly interested in an improvement in overall complexity, and both schemes here are O(n). There is a sublinear ring signature paper that in O(log n) in size that we're looking at more closely.

I can't seem to find this paper. I found one that claims O(√n) but no O(log n). Anyone have a link?

[tacotime]

^^ Yeah it's the root(n) paper, sorry. Recalled it incorrectly off the top of my head.

http://www.cs.ucla.edu/~sahai/work/web/2007%20Publications/ICALP_Chandran2007.pdf

[Anon136]

^^ Yeah it's the root(n) paper, sorry. Recalled it incorrectly off the top of my head.

http://www.cs.ucla.edu/~sahai/work/web/2007%20Publications/ICALP_Chandran2007.pdf

Less cool but still cool for all of the same reasons. Thanks.

[celestio]

I stumbled upon this comment from tacotime in another topic and found it cross-postworthy:

We need a review of this technology. Something brilliant and clever like this should not be ignored. Even satoshi made some comments on the essence of Cryptonote. Maybe he contributed in some way or another towards its development

Apparently it was in development since a few years and was intended to be a step ahead in the right direction, that is transaction privacy. Cryptonote is the tech which should have been bitcoin in the first place. If it had surfaced a year later after bitcoin, things could have been different

Um. What do you want to know? I'll talk about Monero since that's the CN chain I've worked on the most.

(1) It uses a different elliptic curve than Bitcoin for signing (EdDSA, which uses Schnorr signatures on a Twisted Edwards curve).
(2) It uses a different hashing algorithm than Bitcoin for PoW, which is AES heavy and currently performs similarly on GPUs and CPUs. One of the main downsides to this is that sidechains are currently impossible (validation takes too long), however as sidechains don't actually exist right now we've been ignoring this. If we want to add sidechain support in the future, the hashing algorithm can be change to something simple. In the meantime, the algorithm is relatively "egalitarian" in that no specialized hardware is required.
(3) One time use addresses ("stealth addressing") is mandatory for all transactions. This makes light clients very difficult to secure or create in general, but it dramatically enhances privacy because it's impossible to ever reuse an address.
(4) All transactions are denominated in base 10, and fractionated by mantissa.
(5) Ring signatures obfuscate spending of outputs by allowing you to do a 1-of-N input for a transaction where you spend funds from Bob OR Alice OR Michael OR Claire OR et cetera. Like one time use addresses, this is a passive privacy technology that doesn't require any active participation of anyone in the network (unlike DarkCoin, CoinJoin, and so on).
(6) A single pair of private keys is used for the recovery of all outputs owned by a wallet, but with a different type of data structure than BIP32 has (viewkey/secretkey).
(7) An implicit, silent multisig implementation centered around Schnorr signatures is being researched and developed (thanks andytoshi/gmaxwell).
( 8 ) Research is ongoing into ways to break our privacy technology and improve it. See: https://lab.monero.cc/
(9) Monero is readily auditable from a regulatory perspective (you can easily prove your ownership of funds if you need to, for example to tax agencies).
(10) It has a much faster emissions (subsidy/reward) curve than Bitcoin. 80% is mined within 4 years. The emissions curve is also much smoother than for Bitcoin, with reward decreasing every block.
(11) Unlike Bitcoin, Monero will have long term perpetual inflation. Subsidy will become fixed in about 10 years time at a flat rate of less than 1%, to keep the chain from becoming fully deflationary and to better incentivize miners. This makes it more likely to be useful as a currency than Bitcoin, in my opinion.

Props to tacotime for explaining everything in detail.

Detailed explanation indeed. 

[dewdeded]

What's the status on post synchronization between BCT and forum.monero.cc? Anyone working on it?

[Kazimir]

I want to experiment a bit with Monero, I guess a webwallet at MyMonery.com is the easiest way to start.

In order not to lose any XMR, or become too dependent on specifically MyMonery.com, what should I do to keep access to my XMR, i.e. being able to spend my XMR elsewhere in case MyMonery.com goes down?

With Bitcoin, that would be the private key (or master seed in case of HD wallets). With this MyMonero.com web wallet, I now have:

1. Login key (13 words)
2. Account Address (95 chars, starting with '4')
3. View Key (256 bit hex)
4. Spend Key (256 bit hex)

Is that enough? I guess the Login Key is something specific for MyMonero.com, which deterministically derives the View and/or Spend Keys?

Could I import the View and Spend Keys in a different? (just like you can import private keys from one Bitcoin wallet into another)

[Kazimir]

Also, are the View Key and Spend Key completely independent, and both necessary? Or can the View Key somehow be derived from the Spend Key? I know they're actually both a set of private/public key pairs, but it seems strange that something called 'view' could not be derived from something called 'spend'. Then again I'm not completely aware of all the cryptonote tech details yet.

Is there a explanation somewhere that describes the exact role of the View and Spend keypairs?

[smooth]

I want to experiment a bit with Monero, I guess a webwallet at MyMonery.com is the easiest way to start.

In order not to lose any XMR, or become too dependent on specifically MyMonery.com, what should I do to keep access to my XMR, i.e. being able to spend my XMR elsewhere in case MyMonery.com goes down?

With Bitcoin, that would be the private key (or master seed in case of HD wallets). With this MyMonero.com web wallet, I now have:

1. Login key (13 words)
2. Account Address (95 chars, starting with '4')
3. View Key (256 bit hex)
4. Spend Key (256 bit hex)

Is that enough? I guess the Login Key is something specific for MyMonero.com, which deterministically derives the View and/or Spend Keys?

Could I import the View and Spend Keys in a different? (just like you can import private keys from one Bitcoin wallet into another)

Save them all (privately, except the Account Address, which is a public address you can give out if you want).

The code to import them into the standard command line wallet exists but isn't released yet. In the event that MyMonero became unavailable before the recovery support is added to the standard wallet (unlikely), someone (me if no one else) would make sure there is a patched version for recovery.

The roles of the view key and spend key are described in the whitepaper (which uses the terminology "tracking key" for view key). I think in the MyMonero implementation the view key is indeed derived from the spend key (which is derived from the login key), but this is not necessarily the case for all wallets. In theory they can be completely independent.

[GTO911]

Interesting read - https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=241.0

Cross posting

[pippo]

No News about xmr? No updates?

[GingerAle]

No News about xmr? No updates?

u want friday content too?

it seems that monerians are straying outside of our walls.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=962235.0

Here, it seems, we are trying in vain to discuss fundamentals of XMR v DRK

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=975984.0

and here, it seems, we are trying in vain to discuss the fundamentals of cryptonote as a protocol.


Fortunately there has been some discussion that isn't "DRK RULES!!" and / or "bitcoin is the one true coin", but its somewhat buried.

(edited for spelling because yay english)

[fluffypony]

No News about xmr? No updates?

https://getmonero.org/2015/03/02/monero-missive-for-the-week-of-2015-03-02.html

[nioc]

No News about xmr? No updates?

u want friday content too?

it seems that monerians are straying outside of our walls.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=962235.0

Here, it seems, we are trying in vein to discuss fundamentals of XMR v DRK

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=975984.0

and here, it seems, we are trying in vein to discuss the fundamentals of cryptonote as a protocol.


Fortunately there has been some discussion that isn't "DRK RULES!!" and / or "bitcoin is the one true coin", but its somewhat buried.

Thank you for all that you do.

It's "in vain"

[GingerAle]

No News about xmr? No updates?

u want friday content too?

it seems that monerians are straying outside of our walls.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=962235.0

Here, it seems, we are trying in vain to discuss fundamentals of XMR v DRK

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=975984.0

and here, it seems, we are trying in vain to discuss the fundamentals of cryptonote as a protocol.


Fortunately there has been some discussion that isn't "DRK RULES!!" and / or "bitcoin is the one true coin", but its somewhat buried.

Thank you for all that you do.

It's "in vain"

All I do is get distracted at work.

Me fail english? Thats unpossible.