URGENT: drop MTGOX class action lawyers! contact WSJ about their lies URGENT!

[DrApricot]

Quote from: DrApricot on April 29, 2014, 07:15:09 PM

>> much better offers can be made

Actually, Sunlot's offer is not economically rational unless they have some kind of inside knowledge that the still missing 650,000 bitcoins are very likely to be soon recovered.

Quote from: btcusury on April 29, 2014, 07:15:09

That's exactly what I think. Although not necessarily inside knowledge -- it could be just an understanding of a high probability of finding the missing BTC. If you assume Karpeles is an incompetent idiot rather than a fraudster, you can take his IRC statement seriously that the BTC are "not technically lost, just temporarily unavailable".

Actually, there is entirely another possibility that at least partly exonerates MK. There has been a persistent rumour that the Mt. Gox losses were not merely the result of malfeasance on the part of the operators of the exchange, but rather came from a bitcoin seizure and gag order by one or more government agencies. These could either be Japanese or American agencies, or both--working in tandem. This is possibly being done as part of a prosecution against a very few of Mt. Gox's customers who may be guilty of some crimes.

I refer you to an excellent report by Tuck Fheman

Gov Most Certainly Seized Gox’s Coins
http://tuckfheman.com/post/79681539135/report-gov-most-certainly-seized-goxs-coins

The report is dated March 15, 2014, and in it Tuck states his belief that the U.S. government is behind the seizure. Were this true, it seems equally likely that the Japanese authorities are somehow involved too, if not completely behind it. He calls for an "injunction ordering the US Government to release the seized property" by May 16.

I am not in a position to know how much fact is behind this rumour of seizure and gagging, yet the case Tuck lays out certainly sounds quite convincing and worthy of further consideration.

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[Bit_Happy]

Quote from: DrApricot on April 29, 2014, 07:15:09 PM

>> much better offers can be made

Actually, Sunlot's offer is not economically rational unless they have some kind of inside knowledge that the still missing 650,000 bitcoins are very likely to be soon recovered.

Quote from: btcusury on April 29, 2014, 07:15:09

That's exactly what I think. Although not necessarily inside knowledge -- it could be just an understanding of a high probability of finding the missing BTC. If you assume Karpeles is an incompetent idiot rather than a fraudster, you can take his IRC statement seriously that the BTC are "not technically lost, just temporarily unavailable".

Actually, there is entirely another possibility that at least partly exonerates MK. There has been a persistent rumour that the Mt. Gox losses were not merely the result of malfeasance on the part of the operators of the exchange, but rather came from a bitcoin seizure and gag order by one or more government agencies. These could either be Japanese or American agencies, or both--working in tandem. This is possibly being done as part of a prosecution against a very few of Mt. Gox's customers who may be guilty of some crimes.

I refer you to an excellent report by Tuck Fheman

Gov Most Certainly Seized Gox’s Coins
http://tuckfheman.com/post/79681539135/report-gov-most-certainly-seized-goxs-coins

The report is dated March 15, 2014, and in it Tuck states his belief that the U.S. government is behind the seizure. Were this true, it seems equally likely that the Japanese authorities are somehow involved too, if not completely behind it. He calls for an "injunction ordering the US Government to release the seized property" by May 16.

I am not in a position to know how much fact is behind this rumour of seizure and gagging, yet the case Tuck lays out certainly sounds quite convincing and worthy of further consideration.

Why would they seize so many BTC, compared to what was actually used for Silk Road?

[DrApricot]

Quote from: DrApricot
I am not in a position to know how much fact is behind this rumour of seizure and gagging, yet the case Tuck lays out certainly sounds quite convincing and worthy of further consideration.

Quote from: Bit_Happy
> Why would they seize so many BTC, compared to what was actually used for Silk Road?

I am not really in any position to say, but suppose the plan was to make everyone identify themselves before having their BTC returned?

That's the sort of thing that usually happens in an asset seizure--you have to explain where you got the assets, prove that they are yours--and not part of some illicit activities.

The organization(s) behind the seizure may have completely underestimated the amount of political fallout of investor dissatisfaction from a seizure of this magnitude, and are now engaged in a CYA operation. That's my SWAG on it, but I'm sure there are other equally likely scenarios or even more so.

[Bit_Happy]

Quote from: DrApricot
I am not in a position to know how much fact is behind this rumour of seizure and gagging, yet the case Tuck lays out certainly sounds quite convincing and worthy of further consideration.

Quote from: Bit_Happy
> Why would they seize so many BTC, compared to what was actually used for Silk Road?

I am not really in any position to say, but suppose the plan was to make everyone identify themselves before having their BTC returned?

That's the sort of thing that usually happens in an asset seizure--you have to explain where you got the assets, prove that they are yours--and not part of some illicit activities.

The organization(s) behind the seizure may have completely underestimated the amount of political fallout of investor dissatisfaction from a seizure of this magnitude, and are now engaged in a CYA operation. That's my SWAG on it, but I'm sure there are other equally likely scenarios or even more so.

I think there is a chance it's a massive theft by a Gov agency, with Mark K as either an unlikely looking secret agent or patsy in grave danger.

[DrApricot]

Quote from: Bit_Happy

> I think there is a chance it's a massive theft by a Gov agency, with Mark K as either an unlikely looking secret agent or patsy in grave danger.

I'd like to believe that NO government agency in the U.S. or Japan would ever stoop so low, yet until now the only charge they have been able to make stick to MK is that he is more or less of a bumbling idiot. After 9/11, that was the same excuse used for why they couldn't stop it before it happened, "we were incompetent".

However, a far simpler explanation than theft is merely that this is a cover-up to avoid having to take the blame for having collapsed Mt. Gox. That's more than enough reason to pass this hot potato.

[superduh]

and exactly how would either Jap or American gov agency get access to any of their bitcoins without Mark handing them over to them (legall or illegally to be seen)

[Bit_Happy]

Quote from: Bit_Happy

> I think there is a chance it's a massive theft by a Gov agency, with Mark K as either an unlikely looking secret agent or patsy in grave danger.

I'd like to believe that NO government agency in the U.S. or Japan would ever stoop so low, yet until now the only charge they have been able to make stick to MK is that he is more or less of a bumbling idiot. After 9/11, that was the same excuse used for why they couldn't stop it before it happened, "we were incompetent".

However, a far simpler explanation than theft is merely that this is a cover-up to avoid having to take the blame for having collapsed Mt. Gox. That's more than enough reason to pass this hot potato.

There are way too many unanswered questions.

and exactly how would either Jap or American gov agency get access to any of their bitcoins without Mark handing them over to them (legall or illegally to be seen)

An unlikely looking secret agent would complete his assignment and hand over the ~$1/2 Billion worth of BTC (with a future value much higher)
^^^
I didn't say I believe that, but it is possible.

[DrApricot]

and exactly how would either Jap or American gov agency get access to any of their bitcoins without Mark handing them over to them (legall or illegally to be seen)

MK never said the disappeared bitcoins had changed hands, but merely that they were inaccessible. If true, then that could mean a lot of things such as were he ever to touch those ones in the cold wallets, he'd be locked up or worse. Viewed from that angle, the 200,000 BTC found in the "old-format" wallet could be kind of a limited hangout.
_{(According to Wikipedia, that is a public relations or propaganda technique that involves the release of previously hidden information in order to prevent a greater exposure of more important details.)}

I agree with Bit_Happy that there are way too many unanswered questions. MK could be a secret agent man, or maybe just an innocent guy (patsy) with a tiger by the tail.

[Aquent]

"After that, if the facts do not change, there is sufficient evidence to apply for an injunction ordering the US Government to release the seized property."

If gov seized the btc, where are they on the blockchain?

[btcusury]

"After that, if the facts do not change, there is sufficient evidence to apply for an injunction ordering the US Government to release the seized property."

If gov seized the btc, where are they on the blockchain?

We have (apparently) found most of them on the blockchain, we just don't know who has the private keys (FBI, Karpeles, hackers, lost...).

[borninvinsible]

This pattern of exchanges going under than finding a few coins its a convenient fraud. I am glad the good guys will investigate the exchange MTgox hopefully they will arrest some bad guys - gangsters criminals and peados/// . Sunlot infomation makes everyone much more aware of the background of these people. Its all there....Bitcoin brings only bad news....My trade is over I put in what I could lose - made a raise tried to cash out the best way without fraud and meeting more freaks...lets wait til 2015 ....I think those who were verified will get something back ...besides who cares if we dont....the story teaches us more about the world , security and who really the good guys are...

[V.Kodoff]

If any of you like to start case against MtGox in court (Japanese/European) feel free to contact us via pm.

[Nagle]

Actually, Sunlot's offer is not economically rational unless they have some kind of inside knowledge that the still missing 650,000 bitcoins are very likely to be soon recovered.

That's exactly it.

1. The Sunlot deal gives them 84% of any missing assets that turn up later.
2. They're in talks with Karpeles.
3. The original founders of Mt. Gox are involved.

So they probably do know where the missing assets are.

This deal needs to be put on hold until the bankruptcy trustee and the Tokyo police have had more time to find the money.  The trustee has only had a week of being in charge at this point.

[Bit_Happy]

Actually, Sunlot's offer is not economically rational unless they have some kind of inside knowledge that the still missing 650,000 bitcoins are very likely to be soon recovered.

That's exactly it.

1. The Sunlot deal gives them 84% of any missing assets that turn up later.
2. They're in talks with Karpeles.
3. The original founders of Mt. Gox are involved.

So they probably do know where the missing assets are.

This deal needs to be put on hold until the bankruptcy trustee and the Tokyo police have had more time to find the money.  The trustee has only had a week of being in charge at this point.

What am mess:
The modern court system is truly FUBAR, how does "the system" ever get radically better?

[borninvinsible]

Actually, Sunlot's offer is not economically rational unless they have some kind of inside knowledge that the still missing 650,000 bitcoins are very likely to be soon recovered.

That's exactly it.

1. The Sunlot deal gives them 84% of any missing assets that turn up later.
2. They're in talks with Karpeles.
3. The original founders of Mt. Gox are involved.

So they probably do know where the missing assets are.

This deal needs to be put on hold until the bankruptcy trustee and the Tokyo police have had more time to find the money.  The trustee has only had a week of being in charge at this point.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kWOSy30NxCQ

The truth will come out --- it always does....with experts involved I would think that unraveling what happened will be easy - time is on our side the cause is just..- theres no dark web --- if those expert black hats think they have somewhere to hide they dont ...

[borninvinsible]

Quote from: Bit_Happy

> I think there is a chance it's a massive theft by a Gov agency, with Mark K as either an unlikely looking secret agent or patsy in grave danger.

   NO CHANCE ---

I'd like to believe that NO government agency in the U.S. or Japan would ever stoop so low, yet until now the only charge they have been able to make stick to MK is that he is more or less of a bumbling idiot.

They would not ....we did land on the moon and 9/11 was NOT an inside job.

its a snake pit of shit....and some demons will be slayed now...the bad guys better start watching their backs..

[Phinnaeus Gage]

Wait till you get a load of the team that's destined to take it over: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=590970.0

[Bit_Happy]

Wait till you get a load of the team that's destined to take it over: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=590970.0

I spent time on this yesterday, here we go again.
Wait till you get a load of the team...
How about we let Gox die and pay as much as possible to those who lost money?

[Phinnaeus Gage]

Wait till you get a load of the team that's destined to take it over: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=590970.0

I spent time on this yesterday, here we go again.
Wait till you get a load of the team...
How about we let Gox die and pay as much as possible to those who lost money?

For those bitcoiners who forgot, Bruce Wagner was kicked to the curb for posing ONCE on some other site about a three-prong attack, i.e. two adults fucking an underage boy. Brock Pierce served jail time in Spain for 1000 Xs worst, and as of six days ago was still in bed, literally and figuratively, with the others that were also accused, one of which is a registered sex offender here in the US, of which Brock Pierce has been using his last name - Brock Rector - as if to show the world they're married.

Brock Pierce has been living with Marc Collins-Rector since he was 17 years old.

http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/tech/news/2004-06-14-den-head-pleads_x.htm

Posted 6/14/2004 3:45 PM

Ex-DEN executive admits transporting minors for sex

TRENTON, N.J. (AP) — The former chairman of a Web-casting company has admitted luring five minors across state lines so he could have sex with them.
Marc Collins-Rector, who has been in custody since his capture in Spain two years ago, pleaded guilty here Thursday to charges brought by federal prosecutors in California and New Jersey.

Collins-Rector founded Digital Entertainment Network, which created video-based sites targeting 14- to 24-year-olds. Executives planned a $75 million stock offering, but Collins-Rector his partners resigned after accusations of sexual abuse became known, and the company collapsed in 2000.

Collins-Rector, 44, remains held without bail pending sentencing Sept. 9 by U.S. District Judge Mary L. Cooper.

Each of the charges carries up to 10 years in prison, but sentencing guidelines call for less than three years. Collins-Rector faces just several months because of credit for time served, public defender David Schafer told the Los Angeles Times.

Schafer did not immediately return a call seeking comment Monday.

Collins-Rector settled a five-count federal indictment from New Jersey by pleading to one charge, transporting "J.W." from New Jersey to California, Michigan and elsewhere to engage in illegal sex from 1993 to 1997.

Collins-Rector also pleaded guilty to eight charges stemming from a 21-count California federal indictment. Those eight charges deal with transporting four minors for sex: "R.G." and "J.T." from Michigan to California in the mid-1990s, "B.L." from Minnesota to California in 1997, and "D.S." from California to Arizona in 1999.

Collins-Rector, whose last known U.S. address was in Encino, Calif., was captured in May 2002 at the Spanish resort town of Marbella.

Federal authorities had been searching for him since August 2000, when he was indicted by a federal grand jury in Newark. He was extradited Oct. 24, 2003.

Several teens who worked for Collins-Rector later filed lawsuits alleging sexual abuse, claiming they were lured to his Encino mansion only to encounter drugs, threats and sexual abuse.

Collins-Rector settled a lawsuit filed in New Jersey in 1999 with no admission of guilt. A similar lawsuit was filed in California by at least three other victims who won a $4 million default judgment when he did not respond.

Collins-Rector and Chad Shackley made millions when they formed Concentrics, an Internet service provider, in Michigan in the early 1990s. They sold it in 1995 and then formed DEN.

Shackley and Brock Pierce, Collins-Rector's business partners and housemates, had also been held in Spain, but authorities had no immediate information on their status.

If I were perverted, and my better half was fucking underage boys in my presence, I sure the hell would make sure that I'm fucking the underage boys' sisters in front of her as well. Why the hell should I miss out on sticking my dick in some 12 year old's tight pussy having a couple public hairs while she has her 11 year old brother on her belly helping him getting his dick hard so that she can put it into her pussy?

Surely, you don't think that a paedo- would simply say, "I'm not involved in that any more" (to quote Dorian Satoshi)?

[Bit_Happy]

.....

If I were perverted, and my better half was fucking underage boys in my presence, I sure the hell would make sure that I'm fucking the underage boys' sisters in front of her as well. Why the hell should I miss out on sticking my dick in some 12 year old's tight pussy having a couple public hairs while she has her 11 year old brother on her belly helping him getting his dick hard so that she can put it into her pussy?

Surely, you don't think that a paedo- would simply say, "I'm not involved in that any more" (to quote Dorian Satoshi)?

"I'm not involved in that any more"
FYI: OP didn't want the kiddie sex in this thread.
Sadly, it is on topic...