[2014-04-29] ‘Dark Wallet’ Is About to Make Bitcoin Money Laundering Easier...

[sgk]

Isn't the developer shooting his own foot by openly admitting he wants his wallet to be used for illegal activities and black market?

Yes, but strong ethics, courage, and convection often lead to this.  One extreme example to make the point clear: the tank man of Tiananmen Square fame really shot himself in the foot when he decided to block a chain of advancing tanks rather than go home and watch some TV.

Understand; however he could have made his point just by releasing the wallet. He didn't have to BRAG about the illegal usage. Its like bragging about the crimes you committed when the feds are arresting you.

"Anything you say can be used against you. You have the right to remain silent"

[teukon]

Isn't the developer shooting his own foot by openly admitting he wants his wallet to be used for illegal activities and black market?

Yes, but strong ethics, courage, and convection often lead to this.  One extreme example to make the point clear: the tank man of Tiananmen Square fame really shot himself in the foot when he decided to block a chain of advancing tanks rather than go home and watch some TV.

Understand; however he could have made his point just by releasing the wallet. He didn't have to BRAG about the illegal usage. Its like bragging about the crimes you committed when the feds are arresting you.

"Anything you say can be used against you. You have the right to remain silent"

Releasing the wallet quietly would have made a very different point.  Everyone has the right to remain silent, but if no-one ever speaks up then why bother with freedom of speech?

[hilariousandco]

Isn't the developer shooting his own foot by openly admitting he wants his wallet to be used for illegal activities and black market?

Yes, but strong ethics, courage, and convection often lead to this.  

Or just stupidity  . Stand up like a nail and you're likely to be knocked down.

I lack such courage myself, but have enough to openly declare (with this pseudonym which is loosely linked to my real identity) that I support Dark Wallet and what it stands for, and that I donated 1 BTC yesterday.  It would be great to see Dark Wallet used to make the online drug marketplace safer for consumers and dealers alike.

I really hope it does work out. I think being decentralised is the only way to go really. At the moment these sort of markets just seem like hotbeds for scammers, whether from the operators themselves or the vendors that use them and then on top of that all the hackers trying to break in and steal everyone's funds.

[PatMan]

Don't think that Government organizations won't be using it also, the CIA (Americas largest drug smuggling cartel) will love this 

[Dogtanian]

Don't think that Government organizations won't be using it also, the CIA (Americas largest drug smuggling cartel) will love this 

I don't think they'll need to use it. They seem to be able to launder money just fine.

[cr1776]

Isn't the developer shooting his own foot by openly admitting he wants his wallet to be used for illegal activities and black market?

Yes, but strong ethics, courage, and convection often lead to this.  One extreme example to make the point clear: the tank man of Tiananmen Square fame really shot himself in the foot when he decided to block a chain of advancing tanks rather than go home and watch some TV.

Understand; however he could have made his point just by releasing the wallet. He didn't have to BRAG about the illegal usage. Its like bragging about the crimes you committed when the feds are arresting you.

"Anything you say can be used against you. You have the right to remain silent"

It is important to note that there are two main people involved and that one is doing more advocacy, one more coding.  Amir Taaki doing the coding (Britain), and Cody Wilson (US) doing advocacy, iirc.  The difference between the two jurisdictions and the two roles is important since it has lots of non-illegal uses too - and the definition of illegal depends on your jurisdiction of course.  It is more difficult for the US to attack the advocacy portion due to the Constitution and 1st Amendment.

I don't know what will happen, if anything, to them, but if Amir is concentrating on the privacy aspects and Cody is doing the advocacy it seems to make it more difficult for the authorities.

It is an important project.

[Dogtanian]

Isn't the developer shooting his own foot by openly admitting he wants his wallet to be used for illegal activities and black market?

Yes, but strong ethics, courage, and convection often lead to this.  One extreme example to make the point clear: the tank man of Tiananmen Square fame really shot himself in the foot when he decided to block a chain of advancing tanks rather than go home and watch some TV.

Understand; however he could have made his point just by releasing the wallet. He didn't have to BRAG about the illegal usage. Its like bragging about the crimes you committed when the feds are arresting you.

"Anything you say can be used against you. You have the right to remain silent"

It is important to note that there are two main people involved and that one is doing more advocacy, one more coding.  Amir Taaki doing the coding (Britain), and Cody Wilson (US) doing advocacy, iirc.  

im 100% behind Amir Taaki ... even if he is a bit incoherent on stage!

Well I'm glad he isn't doing all the talking then and is sticking to being more behind the code.

[cbeast]

I don't get Dark Wallet. Few people care about anonymity, but many people fear it will empower criminality. The blowback to Dark Wallets may be outright banning of PoW coins. Maybe the developers are bullish on PoS?

[Dogtanian]

I don't get Dark Wallet. Few people care about anonymity, but many people fear it will empower criminality. The blowback to Dark Wallets may be outright banning of PoW coins. Maybe the developers are bullish on PoS?

Why how and who would outright ban them?

[cbeast]

I don't get Dark Wallet. Few people care about anonymity, but many people fear it will empower criminality. The blowback to Dark Wallets may be outright banning of PoW coins. Maybe the developers are bullish on PoS?

Why how and who would outright ban them?

Why is marijuana banned with a death sentence in most countries? Bitcoin threatens banks the same way herbs threatens Big Pharm. Bitcoin the payment system doesn't threaten law enforcement any more than PayPal, but Bitcoin the anonymous currency does. See the difference?

[Dogtanian]

I don't get Dark Wallet. Few people care about anonymity, but many people fear it will empower criminality. The blowback to Dark Wallets may be outright banning of PoW coins. Maybe the developers are bullish on PoS?

Why how and who would outright ban them?

Why is marijuana banned with a death sentence in most countries? Bitcoin threatens banks the same way herbs threatens Big Pharm. Bitcoin the payment system doesn't threaten law enforcement any more than PayPal, but Bitcoin the anonymous currency does. See the difference?

I don't think weed is threatened with a death sentance in most countries. Sure in some but not most. And cash is more anonymous than bitcoin if you want it to be.

[cbeast]

I don't get Dark Wallet. Few people care about anonymity, but many people fear it will empower criminality. The blowback to Dark Wallets may be outright banning of PoW coins. Maybe the developers are bullish on PoS?

Why how and who would outright ban them?

Why is marijuana banned with a death sentence in most countries? Bitcoin threatens banks the same way herbs threatens Big Pharm. Bitcoin the payment system doesn't threaten law enforcement any more than PayPal, but Bitcoin the anonymous currency does. See the difference?

I don't think weed is threatened with a death sentance in most countries. Sure in some but not most. And cash is more anonymous than bitcoin if you want it to be.

Cash isn't anonymous. Don't conflate anonymity with fungibility. Besides, cash may be banned for large purchases soon.

[cr1776]

I don't get Dark Wallet. Few people care about anonymity, but many people fear it will empower criminality. The blowback to Dark Wallets may be outright banning of PoW coins. Maybe the developers are bullish on PoS?

I am not sure if you say this thread, but it is quite interesting:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=279249.0

[Bit_Happy]

Isn't the developer shooting his own foot by openly admitting he wants his wallet to be used for illegal activities and black market?

It's nice that he has developed anonymous wallet but his statements give Feds and government a new opportunity of opening fire on Bitcoin.

Nor does he deny that Dark Wallet might enable heinous crimes...
He doesn't say "he wants his wallet to be used for illegal activities":
He is acknowledging that when everyone has privacy, some people will use it for crimes.

“They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.”  ~Benjamin Franklin

[Dogtanian]

I don't get Dark Wallet. Few people care about anonymity, but many people fear it will empower criminality. The blowback to Dark Wallets may be outright banning of PoW coins. Maybe the developers are bullish on PoS?

Why how and who would outright ban them?

Why is marijuana banned with a death sentence in most countries? Bitcoin threatens banks the same way herbs threatens Big Pharm. Bitcoin the payment system doesn't threaten law enforcement any more than PayPal, but Bitcoin the anonymous currency does. See the difference?

I don't think weed is threatened with a death sentance in most countries. Sure in some but not most. And cash is more anonymous than bitcoin if you want it to be.

Cash isn't anonymous. Don't conflate anonymity with fungibility. Besides, cash may be banned for large purchases soon.

If I meet someone on the street and give them some money that seems pretty annoymous.

[cbeast]

I don't get Dark Wallet. Few people care about anonymity, but many people fear it will empower criminality. The blowback to Dark Wallets may be outright banning of PoW coins. Maybe the developers are bullish on PoS?

Why how and who would outright ban them?

Why is marijuana banned with a death sentence in most countries? Bitcoin threatens banks the same way herbs threatens Big Pharm. Bitcoin the payment system doesn't threaten law enforcement any more than PayPal, but Bitcoin the anonymous currency does. See the difference?

I don't think weed is threatened with a death sentance in most countries. Sure in some but not most. And cash is more anonymous than bitcoin if you want it to be.

Cash isn't anonymous. Don't conflate anonymity with fungibility. Besides, cash may be banned for large purchases soon.

If I meet someone on the street and give them some money that seems pretty annoymous.

Not if I'm a cop and you are doing something bad.

[Dogtanian]

I don't get Dark Wallet. Few people care about anonymity, but many people fear it will empower criminality. The blowback to Dark Wallets may be outright banning of PoW coins. Maybe the developers are bullish on PoS?

Why how and who would outright ban them?

Why is marijuana banned with a death sentence in most countries? Bitcoin threatens banks the same way herbs threatens Big Pharm. Bitcoin the payment system doesn't threaten law enforcement any more than PayPal, but Bitcoin the anonymous currency does. See the difference?

I don't think weed is threatened with a death sentance in most countries. Sure in some but not most. And cash is more anonymous than bitcoin if you want it to be.

Cash isn't anonymous. Don't conflate anonymity with fungibility. Besides, cash may be banned for large purchases soon.

If I meet someone on the street and give them some money that seems pretty annoymous.

Not if I'm a cop and you are doing something bad.

Maybe I'll leave it at a location for him to pick up then. You can probably say nothing is anonymous if you want to nitpick.

[cbeast]

I don't get Dark Wallet. Few people care about anonymity, but many people fear it will empower criminality. The blowback to Dark Wallets may be outright banning of PoW coins. Maybe the developers are bullish on PoS?

Why how and who would outright ban them?

Why is marijuana banned with a death sentence in most countries? Bitcoin threatens banks the same way herbs threatens Big Pharm. Bitcoin the payment system doesn't threaten law enforcement any more than PayPal, but Bitcoin the anonymous currency does. See the difference?

I don't think weed is threatened with a death sentance in most countries. Sure in some but not most. And cash is more anonymous than bitcoin if you want it to be.

Cash isn't anonymous. Don't conflate anonymity with fungibility. Besides, cash may be banned for large purchases soon.

If I meet someone on the street and give them some money that seems pretty annoymous.

Not if I'm a cop and you are doing something bad.

Maybe I'll leave it at a location for him to pick up then. You can probably say nothing is anonymous if you want to nitpick.

That's not what I'm saying. Cash is private, not anonymous. You can increase privacy by risking control and dropping off the money, but you may lose it completely. OTOH, the person picking up the money is then at risk if you are the cop.

[counter]

I personally care about the need to be anonymous if there is someone infringing on my privacy rights.  I think there will be a real need for this and support the project even though it has a negative label.

[lynn_402]

Is this a good thing for Bitcoin?  I would think things like this are only going to cause more problems when it comes to legislation and the legal use of Bitcoin. 

This is a great thing for Bitcoin; there's a great need for privacy in our society where everything can be monitered, and where this data can be used against an individual that does anything which the irrational governments do not deem to be acceptable. I'd be very glad if Bitcoin was able to successfully and easily fulfill this need for privacy towards a person's use of his wealth, just like TOR does for his online activities. No legislation can destroy anything that fulfills an important need.