[Poll] What do you think the price will be 7 days froim now?

[teflone]

Im just frightened that the evil smack down aka manipulator is just bitcoinica adjusting its hedges.. and having cascading effects when liquidations happen...

Food for thought albeit paranoid ones..  

I have been saying this for a while now. This is why I have submitted it as a question to be asked during Zhou's interview.

I believe this will prove to be paranoia.  You don't have to be Zhoutong to profit from the liquidations.

Not saying that you do,  Of course everyone can profit from others liquidations..  what is your point ?

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[Serge]

very interesting what's going on now
market is stable, yet very fragile
no one wants to say which direction it will go
no one wants to give up their current position
and so we're on pause

[notme]

Im just frightened that the evil smack down aka manipulator is just bitcoinica adjusting its hedges.. and having cascading effects when liquidations happen...

Food for thought albeit paranoid ones..  

I have been saying this for a while now. This is why I have submitted it as a question to be asked during Zhou's interview.

I believe this will prove to be paranoia.  You don't have to be Zhoutong to profit from the liquidations.

Not saying that you do,  Of course everyone can profit from others liquidations..  what is your point ?

My point is Bitcoinica doesn't adjust hedges unless a trader adjusts their position.  What's your point?

[teflone]

Im just frightened that the evil smack down aka manipulator is just bitcoinica adjusting its hedges.. and having cascading effects when liquidations happen...

Food for thought albeit paranoid ones..  

I have been saying this for a while now. This is why I have submitted it as a question to be asked during Zhou's interview.

I believe this will prove to be paranoia.  You don't have to be Zhoutong to profit from the liquidations.

Not saying that you do,  Of course everyone can profit from others liquidations..  what is your point ?

My point is Bitcoinica doesn't adjust hedges unless a trader adjusts their position.  What's your point?

Nevermind, you are very very pro bitcoinica, I get it, you've made it abundantly clear to me.

  
I also like bitcoinica, but it has some serious issues it needs to address.

That is all

[StewartJ]

very interesting what's going on now
market is stable, yet very fragile
no one wants to say which direction it will go
no one wants to give up their current position
and so we're on pause

If you look at at the month of December, prices were trending in sideways movement for a week at a time,
then we'd get a slight bump up past resistance, then another week of sideways movement, bump up, repeat.

Wondering if we're reverting to this pattern. Or we're just still shell shocked from recent Smack-Down.

It feels very neutral to me.

[notme]

It has its limits, but 99% of the accusations levied against it are unfounded.  Instead of even making a clear accusation, you just make vague statements that breed FUD.  Can we focus on information please so we can help people understand the real limitations of Bitcoinica?

[teflone]

It has its limits, but 99% of the accusations levied against it are unfounded.  Instead of even making a clear accusation, you just make vague statements that breed FUD.  Can we focus on information please so we can help people understand the real limitations of Bitcoinica?

Tell us pro?

Tell us all how you make your money from the "suckers" getting liquidated.. ?

Just because your praying on the less informed dosent make my thoughts disinformation.

Am I ruining your game?   My bad.

[notme]

1. Reserves are finite.  Too much speculation in one direction locks it up in that direction until someone takes profit or is liquidated.
2. There is slippage risk.  If someone tries to exploit this, they can hit Bitcoinica hard.  To do so would take quite a bit of capital.
3.  Zhoutong could be dishonest and force liquidations by trading on mtgox, but there is no evidence of such behavior.  Such behavior was once used by so called bucket shops to mitigate the slippage risk, which was more severe for them due to them hedging partially with manual decision making.  Bitcoinica now covers all positions, so unless slippage becomes a problem due to targeted attacks, Zhoutong will make more money by playing fair.

[teflone]

1. Reserves are finite.  Too much speculation in one direction locks it up in that direction until someone takes profit or is liquidated.
2. There is slippage risk.  If someone tries to exploit this, they can hit Bitcoinica hard.  To do so would take quite a bit of capital.
3.  Zhoutong could be dishonest and force liquidations by trading on mtgox, but there is no evidence of such behavior.  Such behavior was once used by so called bucket shops to mitigate the slippage risk, which was more severe for them due to them hedging partially with manual decision making.  Bitcoinica now covers all positions, so unless slippage becomes a problem due to targeted attacks, Zhoutong will make more money by playing fair.

Number 2, is EXACTLY what im talking about... 

So what is your issue with me ?

Wake up, people have a lot of capital..  this is happening. now...

And the locking up starfish makes it worse! If you cant understand that, I really have little more to say..
Not my job to teach you.

As long as Zhou is dealing on mtgox, there will be massive bouts of volatility from the big players screwing around with Zhou because there is a clear sign * saying, hey! come over here and abuse me!  Who wins?

Not us.

[notme]

1. Reserves are finite.  Too much speculation in one direction locks it up in that direction until someone takes profit or is liquidated.
2. There is slippage risk.  If someone tries to exploit this, they can hit Bitcoinica hard.  To do so would take quite a bit of capital.
3.  Zhoutong could be dishonest and force liquidations by trading on mtgox, but there is no evidence of such behavior.  Such behavior was once used by so called bucket shops to mitigate the slippage risk, which was more severe for them due to them hedging partially with manual decision making.  Bitcoinica now covers all positions, so unless slippage becomes a problem due to targeted attacks, Zhoutong will make more money by playing fair.

Number 2, is EXACTLY what im talking about... 

So what is your issue with me ?

Wake up, people have a lot of capital..  this is happening. now...

And the locking up starfish makes it worse! If you cant understand that, I really have little more to say..
Not my job to teach you.

As long as Zhou is dealing on mtgox, there will be massive bouts of volatility from the big players screwing around with Zhou because there is a clear sign * saying, hey! come over here and abuse me!  Who wins?

Not us.

I have no issue with you... You are the one bringing emotion into this conversation.  In fact, I'm a little taken aback by it.

The * is caused by traders.  Anyone who is holding long on Bitcoinica knows about it.  They are the ones taking the risk, and the ones who may be screwed.  If you are not one of them, why complain?  If you are one of them, why complain when you could close your long?

Should we shut down the pirate bay because it allows you to do things that may get you in trouble?

[teflone]

1. Reserves are finite.  Too much speculation in one direction locks it up in that direction until someone takes profit or is liquidated.
2. There is slippage risk.  If someone tries to exploit this, they can hit Bitcoinica hard.  To do so would take quite a bit of capital.
3.  Zhoutong could be dishonest and force liquidations by trading on mtgox, but there is no evidence of such behavior.  Such behavior was once used by so called bucket shops to mitigate the slippage risk, which was more severe for them due to them hedging partially with manual decision making.  Bitcoinica now covers all positions, so unless slippage becomes a problem due to targeted attacks, Zhoutong will make more money by playing fair.

Number 2, is EXACTLY what im talking about... 

So what is your issue with me ?

Wake up, people have a lot of capital..  this is happening. now...

And the locking up starfish makes it worse! If you cant understand that, I really have little more to say..
Not my job to teach you.

As long as Zhou is dealing on mtgox, there will be massive bouts of volatility from the big players screwing around with Zhou because there is a clear sign * saying, hey! come over here and abuse me!  Who wins?

Not us.

I have no issue with you... You are the one bringing emotion into this conversation.  In fact, I'm a little taken aback by it.

The * is caused by traders.  Anyone who is holding long on Bitcoinica knows about it.  They are the ones taking the risk, and the ones who may be screwed.  If you are not one of them, why complain?  If you are one of them, why complain when you could close your long?

Should we shut down the pirate bay because it allows you to do things that may get you in trouble?

Why complain?

Oh sorry, unlike you, I actually care and have empathy for the common bitcoiners losing their money and coins.
Because you do realize its just the common bitcoiners, the type of people that dont have a lot of disposable income that are losing.

And who said shut down bitcoinica ? I didnt, so your analogies are weak at best.
I want bitcoinica to be its own entity. End of story.

But you have fun taking money from the less informed..

I will sit on the sidelines of bitcoinica and not make things worse.

[chsados]

1. Reserves are finite.  Too much speculation in one direction locks it up in that direction until someone takes profit or is liquidated.
2. There is slippage risk.  If someone tries to exploit this, they can hit Bitcoinica hard.  To do so would take quite a bit of capital.
3.  Zhoutong could be dishonest and force liquidations by trading on mtgox, but there is no evidence of such behavior.  Such behavior was once used by so called bucket shops to mitigate the slippage risk, which was more severe for them due to them hedging partially with manual decision making.  Bitcoinica now covers all positions, so unless slippage becomes a problem due to targeted attacks, Zhoutong will make more money by playing fair.

Number 2, is EXACTLY what im talking about...  

So what is your issue with me ?

Wake up, people have a lot of capital..  this is happening. now...

And the locking up starfish makes it worse! If you cant understand that, I really have little more to say..
Not my job to teach you.

As long as Zhou is dealing on mtgox, there will be massive bouts of volatility from the big players screwing around with Zhou because there is a clear sign * saying, hey! come over here and abuse me!  Who wins?

Not us.

I have no issue with you... You are the one bringing emotion into this conversation.  In fact, I'm a little taken aback by it.

The * is caused by traders.  Anyone who is holding long on Bitcoinica knows about it.  They are the ones taking the risk, and the ones who may be screwed.  If you are not one of them, why complain?  If you are one of them, why complain when you could close your long?

Should we shut down the pirate bay because it allows you to do things that may get you in trouble?

not me you are not so great at analogies....

massive instability keeps people from jumping on board.  case in point, i told all my friends about bitcoin during the good wives hype and they were ready to try out the waters...after that crash you could forget it. 

[notme]

I respect you decision to stay out of bitcoinica.  I merely take issue with your vague statements that confuse the issues.  That has been clarified, so hopefully we can get back on topic now.

[notme]

not me you are not so great at analogies....

massive instability keeps people from jumping on board.  case in point, i told all my friends about bitcoin during the good wives hype and they were ready to try out the waters...after that crash you could forget it. 

Yes... Let's hide how tiny and unstable our little market is.  That will solve our problems.  But who will bury the last guy's head in the sand?  If your friends can't stomach a temporary dropout, BTC won't be ready for them for a few more years.

[teflone]

not me you are not so great at analogies....

massive instability keeps people from jumping on board.  case in point, i told all my friends about bitcoin during the good wives hype and they were ready to try out the waters...after that crash you could forget it. 

Yes... Let's hide how tiny and unstable our little market is.  That will solve our problems.  But who will bury the last guy's head in the sand?  If your friends can't stomach a temporary dropout, BTC won't be ready for them for a few more years.

No, lets use mtgox through bitcoinica and increase volatility while Advertising it!


Sometimes I crack myself up.

[notme]

I didn't get liquidated.  In fact, I helped the price rebound by increasing my long.  I have already closed that position when it got too high.  How am I adding volatility?

[teflone]

I didn't get liquidated.  In fact, I helped the price rebound by increasing my long.  I have already closed that position when it got too high.  How am I adding volatility?