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Author Topic: All The Fees  (Read 6276 times)
hoo
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January 28, 2012, 05:13:57 AM
 #21

To clarify, if I mine say 0.1 BTC in a pool, I get fees.
If I send that to my bitcoin client, I might *not* get a fee, but, I probably will get charged a fee.
Now if I want to send that 0.1BTC out anywhere else, I have to pay another fee.

Eventually I no longer have 0.1 BTC
so once I get that very small amount amount into an exchange, I have lost quite a bit, and now I get charged fees every step of the way there also, I will get about 25 cents from the beginning total of 0.1.

This is what I mean by becoming disillusioned with the fees, everything takes fees even when it doesn't need them, and now after getting a pretty good idea of what p2sh is trying to do. We will be charged even more fees for the safety they already had built. That's what set me off about this, seeing how p2syh works made me look at everything else. It's the exact same kind of tyrannous infection sneaking in.


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January 28, 2012, 05:14:03 AM
 #22

I think the fees are too high. I buy everything with cash, a debit card (fee is around 25 cents in the US I think), or a check.

How do you use cash online?  I would stick it in the CD drive but most computers do not have them now.

I scan it, and then email the image.
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Gerald Davis


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January 28, 2012, 05:15:30 AM
 #23

To clarify, if I mine say 0.1 BTC in a pool, I get fees.
If I send that to my bitcoin client, I might *not* get a fee, but, I probably will get charged a fee.
Now if I want to send that 0.1BTC out anywhere else, I have to pay another fee.

Eventually I no longer have 0.1 BTC
so once I get that very small amount amount into an exchange, I have lost quite a bit, and now I get charged fees every step of the way there also, I will get about 25 cents from the beginning total of 0.1.

This is what I mean by becoming disillusioned with the fees, everything takes fees even when it doesn't need them, and now after getting a pretty good idea of what p2sh is trying to do. We will be charged even more fees for the safety they already had built. That's what set me off about this, seeing how p2syh works made me look at everything else. It's the exact same kind of tyrannous infection sneaking in.

0.1 BTC is ~$0.50.  Show me where you can spend/transfer $0.50 online without a fee.

How about don't transfer 0.1BTC.  Transfer 1 BTC and it will be free.  Alternatively wait a few hours and the 0.1 is free too.
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January 28, 2012, 12:55:40 PM
 #24

25cents is less than 0.05 btc. to lose the other 0.05 on transaction fees you have to make 50 transactions.
btw: who is fuck is going to secure 0.1btc with a multisig?
...0.1btc, seriously...
...maybe you just trade them back for the five wow-gold you bought them for and stick with a currency thats meant as a toy  Wink





ps2: sorry for venting. it just annoys me that of all the thing one could possibly criticize about bitcoin some people really come up with the usually-less-than-one-cent fee.

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January 28, 2012, 01:43:41 PM
 #25

I think the fees are too high. I buy everything with cash, a debit card (fee is around 25 cents in the US I think), or a check.

How do you use cash online?  I would stick it in the CD drive but most computers do not have them now.

Visa. No fees for me. May be for seller tho.

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January 28, 2012, 03:29:42 PM
 #26

High (implicit) txn fees reflect a combination of a marketing gimmick (rapid initial currency generation) and a poor cryptocurrency design choice (aka proof-of-work). A new cryptocurrency would need to be designed from scratch to change this. No one cares.


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cbeast
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Let's talk governance, lipstick, and pigs.


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January 28, 2012, 03:43:37 PM
 #27

High (implicit) txn fees reflect a combination of a marketing gimmick (rapid initial currency generation) and a poor cryptocurrency design choice (aka proof-of-work). A new cryptocurrency would need to be designed from scratch to change this. No one cares.
And no one agrees.

Any significantly advanced cryptocurrency is indistinguishable from Ponzi Tulips.
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January 28, 2012, 03:47:17 PM
 #28

High (implicit) txn fees reflect a combination of a marketing gimmick (rapid initial currency generation) and a poor cryptocurrency design choice (aka proof-of-work). A new cryptocurrency would need to be designed from scratch to change this. No one cares.
And no one agrees.

Your PhD is in?

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January 28, 2012, 03:49:08 PM
 #29

I think the fees are too high. I buy everything with cash, a debit card (fee is around 25 cents in the US I think), or a check.

How do you use cash online?  I would stick it in the CD drive but most computers do not have them now.

Visa. No fees for me. May be for seller tho.

Visa? Yes fees for you! It is indeed for the seller, but how do you think they pay those fees? Correct, they use the money they charge you. So while you aren't directly paying fees, you are indirectly paying fees. If there weren't any fees with Visa, the products would be less expensive.

www.bitbuy.nl - Koop eenvoudig, snel en goedkoop bitcoins bij Bitbuy!
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January 28, 2012, 03:54:32 PM
 #30

High (implicit) txn fees reflect a combination of a marketing gimmick (rapid initial currency generation) and a poor cryptocurrency design choice (aka proof-of-work). A new cryptocurrency would need to be designed from scratch to change this. No one cares.


you seem to care. suggest something useful
and what is your PhD is in? can you link some articles you published?
cunicula
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January 28, 2012, 04:00:35 PM
 #31

High (implicit) txn fees reflect a combination of a marketing gimmick (rapid initial currency generation) and a poor cryptocurrency design choice (aka proof-of-work). A new cryptocurrency would need to be designed from scratch to change this. No one cares.


you seem to care. suggest something useful
and what is your PhD is in? can you link some articles you published?
I have (how else would I know whether anyone else cares?). Economics. Would you associate your public persona with this cesspool?

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Costia
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January 28, 2012, 04:05:41 PM
 #32

link to suggestions?
or better yet put them all in a pdf or something, like satoshi did.
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January 28, 2012, 04:10:11 PM
 #33

link to suggestions?
or better yet put them all in a pdf or something, like satoshi did.

Thanks for your expression of curiosity. I will work on a pdf outlining core ideas.

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Dansker
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January 28, 2012, 04:15:31 PM
 #34

I think the fees are too high. I buy everything with cash, a debit card (fee is around 25 cents in the US I think), or a check.

How do you use cash online?  I would stick it in the CD drive but most computers do not have them now.

Visa. No fees for me. May be for seller tho.

Visa? Yes fees for you! It is indeed for the seller, but how do you think they pay those fees? Correct, they use the money they charge you. So while you aren't directly paying fees, you are indirectly paying fees. If there weren't any fees with Visa, the products would be less expensive.

Indeed they are calculated into the cost of running the business, but I don't see them. I prefer my fees to be paid by the seller too.

This allows me to always see the actual prize I have to pay for a product, which is all I am interested in.

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Let's talk governance, lipstick, and pigs.


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January 28, 2012, 04:18:54 PM
 #35

High (implicit) txn fees reflect a combination of a marketing gimmick (rapid initial currency generation) and a poor cryptocurrency design choice (aka proof-of-work). A new cryptocurrency would need to be designed from scratch to change this. No one cares.
And no one agrees.

Your PhD is in?

I have a Postdoc in ignore.

Any significantly advanced cryptocurrency is indistinguishable from Ponzi Tulips.
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Gerald Davis


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January 28, 2012, 05:27:52 PM
 #36

High (implicit) txn fees reflect a combination of a marketing gimmick (rapid initial currency generation) and a poor cryptocurrency design choice (aka proof-of-work). A new cryptocurrency would need to be designed from scratch to change this. No one cares.
And no one agrees.

Your PhD is in?


I have a Postdoc in ignore.

Lolz
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January 28, 2012, 06:44:30 PM
 #37

Indeed they are calculated into the cost of running the business, but I don't see them. I prefer my fees to be paid by the seller too.

This allows me to always see the actual prize I have to pay for a product, which is all I am interested in.

Mike Hearn has suggested that in the future people may accept 0 fee 0 confirm tx for reasonable amounts and only when they total something significant attach a fee which cannot be claimed until all the dependencies are also confirmed. This kind of lets the receiver pay.

But really we're talking about occasional tiny fees right now, it doesn't seem like a problem.

Play Bitcoin Poker at sealswithclubs.eu. We're active and open to everyone.
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January 28, 2012, 06:46:33 PM
 #38

bansky rulz
0 confirmations is evil
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January 28, 2012, 07:50:50 PM
 #39

To be clear, exchanging any currency to any other currency is not going to be free anyway. Forex has fees, you have to insert and withdraw your money somehow, you have to pay your bank to have your account, it is going to cost something anyway.

Why must it be different with bitcoins?

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January 28, 2012, 08:26:29 PM
 #40

I use a debit card online. 

I've always thought that merchants only had to pay a minor fee (around 25 cents) on these transactions. But maybe I am wrong?  I know I'm not giving them my PIN.  So maybe it is getting treated as a credit card. If so, that is unfortunate.  The banks are evil!


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