You work your butt off, and a rich dude does nothing and gets rich - how?

[Ozziecoin]

But your idea of poor and mine are totally different.

Yes, clearly we are at odds.  Any person can see that the money supply has inflated asset prices to kingdom come. It is not difficult to realise this has ADVANTAGED asset holders aka the wealthy.  

I want the poor to have access to money supply.

The money supply you allude to is not money, it is debt, which must be repaid.  You are not helping the poor - you are hurting them.  Why? Because the financialisation of the economy is ADVANTAGING the wealthy, who own assets, to the detriment of the poor, who do not own assets.

Your own charts show the widening wealth gap over the last twenty, nay thirty, years.



The last time we witnessed such WEALTH DISPARITY was just before the Great Depression.  Your position is completely unsupportable.

And for those that have not read it: My explanation is here: My explain

Please provide yours.

[Kprawn]

Go read this :

Robert Kiyosaki -
Unfair Advantage
The Power of Financial Education

Author: Robert Kiyosaki

Why do the rich get richer even in a financial crisis? In his new book the bestselling author of "Rich Dad Poor Dad" confirms his message and challenges readers to change their context and act in a new way. In this timely new book, Robert Kiyosaki takes a new and hard-hitting look at the factors that impact people from all walks of life as they struggle to cope with change and challenges that impact their financial world. In "An Unfair Advantage: The Power of Financial Education", Robert underscores his messages and challenges readers to change their context and act in a new way. Readers are advised to stop blindly accepting that they are "disadvantaged" people with limited options and challenge the preconception that they will struggle financially all of their lives. Robert's fresh approach to his time-tested messages includes clear, actionable steps that any individual or family can take, starting with education. Education becomes applied knowledge, a powerful tactic with measurable results. In true "Rich Dad" style, readers will be challenged to understand two points of view, and experience how financial knowledge is their unfair advantage.

Available here in eBook --> http://www.richdad.com/ebooks.aspx

I enjoy his books, and he explains a lot, in lame men's terms.

There was also a Book titled : Why We want you to be Rich {Exellent reading}

Enjoy

[Lethn]

lol OP, you're pretty late in realising what's going on Technically the rich aren't getting richer, all that's increasing is the amount of paper they hold unless they happen to be buying up lots of investments and goods that will hold their value, but even then, it's not really becoming 'worth' more, it's just getting more expensive.

Bitcoin is a classic example, I don't believe it's actually worth anything more than it was a couple of years ago, I just think that our currencies have been devalued so much it's made it much easier/cheaper to buy stuff with Bitcoin rather than paper money, this is also part of the real reason that Bitcoin has received so much hate, it's because it's making the bankers look really bad.

[Cred]

I kind of agree with the OP but see it differently.

Modern economic policy seems to be based on two irrational biases of people, the wealth effect and inflation apathy. When home owners see the price of their house go up, they spend more even though they still just own the same house. Meanwhile workers don't complain about their wages being worth less each year but if you asked them to take a 2% cut nominal terms they'd go on strike.

Politicians and bankers have known this since last century which is why they target 2% inflation to keep people working just in order to keep up and create full employment and avoid revolt.

The FRB now comes in because in order to keep doing this there has to be an increase in debt to pay the debts of those earlier in the ponzi scheme. Easy solution, pump house prices every time there's a recession so late comers have to borrow more to buy the same house. To do this you lower interest rates and the discount rate and assets go up. Those voters who bought houses before the dot com crash are sorted while anyone who didn't is screwed.

Even this is unsustainable and the GFC should have been the end but they kept it going a bit longer with QE, taking more money from the property poor and giving it to the asset rich. What happens next time people can't make their payments even at 2%? They can't lower rates any more so then we could get the depression that we think we've avoided?

[NotLambchop]

The UK (physically) is largely owned by the same people today as it was in the 19th century.

  Its called being born at the right time and in the right place. Or luck  .

You're right. I call this aristocracy, not meritocracy.

Aristocracy = inheriting the merits of your ancestors.  Inheriting class is no different from inheriting money.  Ur just jelly.

[Jcw188]

Once you have a lot of money you just get more and more through interest. Plus getting inheritance. It's a big problem the rich get richer... And the poor have no capital to get going.

[Ozziecoin]

Once you have a lot of money you just get more and more through interest. Plus getting inheritance. It's a big problem the rich get richer... And the poor have no capital to get going.

This is right.  My question is this: why should the rich get an extra advantage when they are already wealthy?  This goes against every fibre in my being. I believe in even playing fields, where people who work hard are justly rewarded.  FRB makes this impossible.  The landed wealthy will always stay wealthy, provided they don't gamble it away. 

[7queue]

If you are smart, you should know that the system is rigged and exploit its flaws.

Cryptocurrency is the chance of our life.

I started with nothing in cryptos and my wealth is now going to the moon at the speed of light.
Cryptoworld is a land with no regulation and no rich people or politics to interfere.

You should stop trying to find excuses to the past and act now to change your destiny.

What Is Cognitive Dissonance for 1000 ...

8 )

[Bru]

Once you have a lot of money you just get more and more through interest. Plus getting inheritance. It's a big problem the rich get richer... And the poor have no capital to get going.

This is right.  My question is this: why should the rich get an extra advantage when they are already wealthy?  This goes against every fibre in my being. I believe in even playing fields, where people who work hard are justly rewarded.  FRB makes this impossible.  The landed wealthy will always stay wealthy, provided they don't gamble it away. 

Don't we all (almost) have the opportunity to work hard and get rich ? Don't we all play by the same rules ? I had friends in my elementary school who were dirt poor, one in particular didn't even own a tv, he wasn't even that smart - but he would learn everything the teachers gave him to learn, he wouldn't do anything else, he had very good grades, even tho he was made fun of for being so poor. Well, he continued to learn , to work hard on his studies, and today he is a big-ass wealthy manager and I know, personally other people like that.
I myself have a sub-avg. paying job, and without a loan, couldn't afford a place for myself (ty FRB). And because today's real estate is cheap, it can grow, it can even double,   so i'm enjoying the fruits of a value-increasing asset.
About inheritance, if you worked hard all your life shouldn't you be able to give your off-springs more than your neighbor who was lazy all his life and is therefor - poor ?
 So my answer would be: cause maybe they deserve it. But I do know we live in an unfair world, and a lot of people get rich by chance and not by work and effort.

[BombaUcigasa]

Once you have a lot of money you just get more and more through interest. Plus getting inheritance. It's a big problem the rich get richer... And the poor have no capital to get going.

This is right.  My question is this: why should the rich get an extra advantage when they are already wealthy?  This goes against every fibre in my being. I believe in even playing fields, where people who work hard are justly rewarded.  FRB makes this impossible.  The landed wealthy will always stay wealthy, provided they don't gamble it away. 

So you're a communist?

See how well that worked for some countries?

[Ozziecoin]

Once you have a lot of money you just get more and more through interest. Plus getting inheritance. It's a big problem the rich get richer... And the poor have no capital to get going.

This is right.  My question is this: why should the rich get an extra advantage when they are already wealthy?  This goes against every fibre in my being. I believe in even playing fields, where people who work hard are justly rewarded.  FRB makes this impossible.  The landed wealthy will always stay wealthy, provided they don't gamble it away.  

So you're a communist?

See how well that worked for some countries?

Please answer the question!

Even playing fields are the bedrock of capitalism. You don't have capitalism in America or anywhere in the world, you have Creditism. The entire economy is run on credit money. Only sound currencies based on the blockchain can be trusted.  

We are talking about not advantaging the rich. This has nothing to do with communism, socialism or capitalism. This has everything to do with EVEN PLAYING FIELDS.

[twiifm]

Capitalism is not about fairness or equal playing field.   Never have been.  Capitalism is about competition

We have crony capitalism in USA.  One idea is to increase inheritance tax.  Let people become as rich as their abilities allow.  But limit how much they can leave as inheritance

[Ozziecoin]

Capitalism is not about fairness or equal playing field.   Never have been.  Capitalism is about competition

We have crony capitalism in USA

Unfortunately, this is true.  But you must also see that the financial system in America today is naturally advantaging those that hold assets against those that don't have any assets, and also those that don't have assets on a net basis. Meaning, asset minus liability = zero assets.  

The wealthy holding the assets are getting wealthier by virtue of the fact that they own assets.  This should not be accepted in America which is supposed to represent the land of opportunity where dreams can be realised.

[NotLambchop]

...  This should not be accepted in America which is supposed to represent the land of opportunity where dreams can be realised.

Oh Jesus, don't tell me it ain't true!  They've been lying to me all along?  MY America?!!
Now I'm almost afraid to ask, but are the streets paved with gold like they say, or is that just a bunch of phooey too?!

Is there anything left to live for, Ozziecoin?!

[Ozziecoin]

Answer the question notlambchop.

[neofelis]

People are poor because there's not enough spending.  No spending, no jobs.


Wow, that is scary statement. I hope you are not referring to government spending.  Reminds me of a few years ago when I heard a Congressman say "We have to spend our way out of this recession."


If the masses spend their money, the economy improves.  When the government spends the peoples money, the economy declines.

[Ozziecoin]

More evidence:

This is from oxfam and covers period from 1980 to 2012.

A new report from Oxfam has been published in time for the World Economic Forum in Davos this week.
It shows the world's ultra-wealthy have not only recovered from the global financial crisis, they have positively blossomed.

The report shows the wealth of the 1 per cent richest people in the world is worth about $US110 trillion, 65 times the total wealth of the bottom half of the world's population.
It also shows the world's richest 85 people control about $US1.7 trillion in wealth, equivalent to the bottom half of the world's population.
And far from hindering the wealthy, the political response to the global financial crisis - including the actions of central banks and the austerity measures introduced by national governments - has made the rich fabulously richer.

In the US, the wealthiest 1 per cent of the population grabbed 95 per cent of post-financial crisis growth between 2009 and 2012, while the bottom 90 per cent became poorer.


Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/business/richest-85-boast-same-wealth-as-half-the-world-20140120-314vk.html#ixzz32mzA4qpL

[twiifm]

Capitalism is not about fairness or equal playing field.   Never have been.  Capitalism is about competition

We have crony capitalism in USA

Unfortunately, this is true.  But you must also see that the financial system in America today is naturally advantaging those that hold assets against those that don't have any assets, and also those that don't have assets on a net basis. Meaning, asset minus liability = zero assets.  

The wealthy holding the assets are getting wealthier by virtue of the fact that they own assets.  This should not be accepted in America which is supposed to represent the land of opportunity where dreams can be realised.

Dude. We all know it takes money to make money.  Life is unfair.  Rich get richer.  Etc.

Its been this since civilization existed.  With or without FRB.  Its like that in rich countries, poor countries, socialist, communist, capitalist, monarchist.  Everywhere it is like that.  

At least in USA there is the possibility for social mobility.  How do you explain Snoop Dogg,  or Mark Zuckerberg.  Or even Satoshi whoever he is.  Or just some immigrant whose kids go to college and become professional

Stop making it sound you are oppressed when you living in AUSTRALIA!  Try living in the shithole 3rd world countries where 90% of people have no choice but to be poor their entire life

Stop ranting about banking when its banking that financed practically every entrepreneurial endeavor we know today

What about bitcoin early adopters who bought at $1 and now have 500X return on investment.  You think that's unfair too?

[Ozziecoin]

Dude. We all know it takes money to make money.  Life is unfair.  Rich get richer.  Etc.

Its been this since civilization existed.  With or without FRB.  Its like that in rich countries, poor countries, socialist, communist, capitalist, monarchist.  Everywhere it is like that.  

What about bitcoin early adopters who bought at $1 and now have 500X return on investment.  You think that's unfair too?

Banking is advantaging asset holders unfairly.  I defend my right to speak about it, whether it is in Australia, America or a developing country.

Let's admit to ourselves what FRB is: A way for rich people to stay rich.  Please, let's not obfuscate the plain truth!

I do not agree with the statement "with or without FRB"  Clearly, it has advantaged asset holders against people with no assets and the young.

As for bitcoin holders who bought at $1, I hold no grudge against people with foresight, determination and who played on an EVEN PLAYING FIELD.  I welcome fair competition, the way capitalism was meant to be.  

Moreover, ozziecoin reserves 50% of coin supply for the residents of Australia. We now possess the means to fix this unfair advantage that rich people have, via ensuring that only money on the Blockchain is considered real money. We can COMPLETELY ELIMINATE FRACTIONAL RESERVE BANKING.

[Ozziecoin]

For those of you who just joined this thread and wonder what is going on, please read the first post: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=621654.msg6885312#msg6885312