Was U.S. Army Sgt. Bowe Bergdahl a Traitor?

[zolace]

Our government has fucked us over again. How much longer do we want this shitshow to continue?

[bryant.coleman]

I wish him a safe return to the United States. I have spent a lot of time thinking about him over the course of several years. I worry about him and hope he gets rescued soon.

Hmm.. I thought that he was already back home. Seems like I was wrong. But I don't know whether he will be safe anywhere in the United States. A lot of threats were made against him and his family.

[5flags]

I think he should have been fired for deserting his role, but I don't think there should be any more serious a penalty than if I walked out of my job. The army is a profession, an employer, where people are trained, paid and follow orders. I don't see the legitimacy of any parallel legal structure to be subjected to.

So he felt more compassion for the Afghan victims of US terror. Great, that makes him human. Maybe he's a conscientious objector, maybe he's an idiot. I don't really care. The fact that he was able to view victims of US terror with compassion sets him apart from his accomplices in Afghanistan.

[Wilikon]

I think he should have been fired for deserting his role, but I don't think there should be any more serious a penalty than if I walked out of my job. The army is a profession, an employer, where people are trained, paid and follow orders. I don't see the legitimacy of any parallel legal structure to be subjected to.

So he felt more compassion for the Afghan victims of US terror. Great, that makes him human. Maybe he's a conscientious objector, maybe he's an idiot. I don't really care. The fact that he was able to view victims of US terror with compassion sets him apart from his accomplices in Afghanistan.

How about the Taliban's victims?

[bryant.coleman]

So he felt more compassion for the Afghan victims of US terror. Great, that makes him human. Maybe he's a conscientious objector, maybe he's an idiot. I don't really care. The fact that he was able to view victims of US terror with compassion sets him apart from his accomplices in Afghanistan.

If he felt compassion for the victims of US terror, then there were a large number of legal options for him to quit his job. Instead, he is suspected of going AWOL, and thereby causing the death of multiple soldiers.

[5flags]

How about the Taliban's victims?

He was part of the US war machine, it's only natural he was more acutely aware of its victims.

The Taliban aren't nice people. But let's not pretend that the US military are any better.

[5flags]

If he felt compassion for the victims of US terror, then there were a large number of legal options for him to quit his job. Instead, he is suspected of going AWOL, and thereby causing the death of multiple soldiers.

Legal options? Legal options laid down by the regime perpetrating the terror in question? There's a certain amount of irony there.

[Ron~Popeil]

So he felt more compassion for the Afghan victims of US terror. Great, that makes him human. Maybe he's a conscientious objector, maybe he's an idiot. I don't really care. The fact that he was able to view victims of US terror with compassion sets him apart from his accomplices in Afghanistan.

If he felt compassion for the victims of US terror, then there were a large number of legal options for him to quit his job. Instead, he is suspected of going AWOL, and thereby causing the death of multiple soldiers.

The fact that he got others killed is a real problem for him. There will be a clamor for involuntary manslaughter charges as his negligence did in fact cause the death of others. If it can be proven that he was in any way involved with the killings he will face the death penalty. I hope this was just a case of a disillusioned soldier that made a bad choice. Either way this is all a hell of a propaganda coupe for the Taliban.

[Ron~Popeil]

How about the Taliban's victims?

He was part of the US war machine, it's only natural he was more acutely aware of its victims.

The Taliban aren't nice people. But let's not pretend that the US military are any better.

We use our military far to often but to draw some sort of moral equivalency between the Taliban and the US army is a bit disgusting. Welcome to my ignore list. 

[5flags]

The fact that he got others killed is a real problem for him.

But why are other Americans who slaughter innocents in Afghanistan not held to account?

You post smells of subservience to power. A common smell on this forum, which is odd, considering what this forum is.

[5flags]

We use our military far to often but to draw some sort of moral equivalency between the Taliban and the US army is a bit disgusting. Welcome to my ignore list.  

It's perhaps a little unfair to make that comparison. The US military after all is far better at slaughtering innocent people than the Taliban will ever be.

[bryant.coleman]

Legal options? Legal options laid down by the regime perpetrating the terror in question? There's a certain amount of irony there.

He was a paid employee of the United States Armed Forces, and he joined as per his wish. No one forced him to join the USAF. But once you join the USAF, you have to abide by the laws and regulations, which are outlined by it. If he was against the war in Afghanistan, then he had a better option of staying at home, doing some other job.

[5flags]

He was a paid employee of the United States Armed Forces, and he joined as per his wish.

And he left as per his wish.

No one forced him to join the USAF. But once you join the USAF, you have to abide by the laws and regulations, which are outlined by it.

And what if he only realised the extent of the crimes committed by the US after arriving in Afghanistan? What if this was the driving factor? I don't know that this is what happened, but hypothetically?

Perhaps he also learned that there is no nobility or honour in serving power.

[bryant.coleman]

And he left as per his wish.

Where I live, if an employee want to terminate his employment, then he has to remain in the job for a certain a notice period (depends upon the T&C). It can be a few days, or it can be a few months. The employer can get a replacement for him in the meantime. In case the employer waives his notice period, he can leave the company immediately.

[5flags]

Where I live, if an employee want to terminate his employment, then he has to remain in the job for a certain a notice period (depends upon the T&C). It can be a few days, or it can be a few months.

Where I live, that is convention, but it would be very strange if walking out of your job meant you were kidnapped at gunpoint and put in a cage. That sounds a little less like employment and more like something else...

[MaxwellsDemon]

We use our military far to often but to draw some sort of moral equivalency between the Taliban and the US army is a bit disgusting. Welcome to my ignore list. 

The US armed forces have killed far, far more innocent civilians than the Taliban. Orders of magnitude more. And not just in Afghanistan, but all over the world.

Now you can add me to your ignore list too. You're already ignoring reality; you might as well ignore those who allude to it.

[5flags]

The US armed forces have killed far, far more innocent civilians than the Taliban. Orders of magnitude more. And not just in Afghanistan, but all over the world.

What he said.

[Wilikon]

Soldier: Bowe Bergdahl lodged false war crime allegations against his unit



An Army veteran who served alongside Sgt. Bowe Bergdahl in Afghanistan said Wednesday that the long-captive soldier was deeply frustrated with the mission and had lodged false allegations that their unit had carried out atrocities.

Bergdahl “didn’t understand why we were doing more humanitarian aid drops, setting up clinics, and helping the populous instead of hunting the Taliban,” former Spec. Cody Full told lawmakers during a hearing on the exchange of Bergdahl for five Taliban detainees at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba. “He wanted to hunt and kill.” [...]

Full, who was honorably discharged and served with Bergdahl in the same fire team, the military’s smallest type of organized unit, railed against Bergdahl’s attitude during his deployment in 2009 and rejected media reports that he was a sensitive young man trying to define himself during a time of war. His handwritten journal, along with essays, stories and e-mails provided to The Washington Post, painted him as a soldier full of worry about his own mental health and the situation in Afghanistan.

“Bergdahl was complaining to his parents that our platoon was committing atrocities instead of helping the local populous,” Full told members of the House Foreign Affairs Committee. “But he was telling our platoon that we needed to stop trying to win hearts and minds and focus more on killing the Taliban.”

Full also dismissed suggestions that Bergdahl’s platoon had discipline issues.

“It’s a ridiculous charge,” Full said. “Security was always in place. These acts of common sense survival did not jeopardize the security or put anyone in danger.”

http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/checkpoint/wp/2014/06/18/soldier-bowe-bergdahl-lodged-false-war-crime-allegations-against-his-unit/

[blumangroup]

We use our military far to often but to draw some sort of moral equivalency between the Taliban and the US army is a bit disgusting. Welcome to my ignore list.  

It's perhaps a little unfair to make that comparison. The US military after all is far better at slaughtering innocent people than the Taliban will ever be.

I would not say that the US military is slaughtering innocent people. Most people killed by the military are somehow involved in a war against the US.

[Wilikon]

Breaking: One of the “TALIBAN FIVE” Swapped for Bergdahl Returns to Terror

Washington (CNN)The U.S. military and intelligence community now suspect that one of the five Taliban detainees released from Guantanamo Bay in return for Sgt. Bowe Bergdahl in May of last year has attempted to return to militant activity from his current location in Qatar, CNN has learned exclusively.

The development has led to an ongoing debate inside the administration about whether there is a new threat from this man, and potentially the other four.

This is the first known suggestion that any of the detainees involved in the exchange may be trying to engage again in militant activity. It comes at a politically sensitive time as the administration has quickened the pace of prisoner release in an effort to encourage the closure of the Guantanamo, and the Army must decide in the coming weeks whether and how to punish Bergdahl for leaving his post.

Several U.S. officials across different agencies and branches of the U.S. government have confirmed key details to CNN. The White House referred CNN to the Pentagon.

The officials would not say which of the five men is suspected. But an ongoing U.S. intelligence program to secretly intercept and monitor all of their communications in Qatar turned up evidence in recent months that one of them has "reached out" to try to encourage militant activity, one official said. The official would offer no further details.

Under current law, this act placed the man in the category of being "suspected" of re-engaging in terrorist or insurgent activities. However, several officials say there is now a debate inside the administration that the intelligence may be stronger than the "suspected" classification. Some elements of the intelligence community believe the information is strong enough to classify the man as "confirmed" for returning to illegal activities. All five men are having their communications even more closely monitored right now, but the belief is there is no current threat, one official told CNN.

Pentagon Press Secretary Rear Admiral John Kirby tells CNN that in addition to its discussions with the Qatari government, the United States is working across its various law enforcement and intelligence agencies to address the issue.

"We have a strong security partnership with Qatar, and are in constant dialogue with Qatari government officials about these five detainees and we are confident that we would be able to mitigate any threat of re-engagement by any of these members," Kirby said in an interview that will air Thursday night on CNN's 'Erin Burnett Out Front.'

Under intelligence laws, the definition of "confirmed" for returning to militant activity is that there is a "preponderance of information which identifies a specific former GITMO detainee as directly involved in terrorist or insurgent activities."

The definition of 'suspected" is that there is "plausible but unverified or single-source reporting indicating a specific former Gitmo detainee is directly involved in terrorist or insurgent activities."

Congress has been notified of the information but it has not been made public.



http://www.cnn.com/2015/01/29/politics/bergdahl-swap-prisoner-militant-activity/index.html?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed:+rss/cnn_allpolitics+(RSS:+Politics)



EDIT: As a reminder:

Hillary Clinton said The Taliban Five Are “Not A Threat To The United States.”

CLINTON: “These five guys are not a threat to the United States. They are a threat to the safety and security of Afghanistan and Pakistan. It’s up to those two countries to make the decision once and for all that these are threats to them. So I think we may be kind of missing the bigger picture here. We want to get an American home, whether they fell off the ship because they were drunk or they were pushed or they jumped, we try to rescue everybody.”

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=98KwPioW9LQ