Purpose of Bitlicense Regulations

[chopstick]

So, Mr. Douche aka Ben Lawsky has come out with proposed NY regulations.

http://www.dfs.ny.gov/about/press2014/pr1407171.html

After reviewing these proposed regulations, it is clear what the objectives are.

1. Restrict and greatly Monitor all Bitcoin users, get rid of all privacy

2. Maintain the status quo by making it so businesses cannot take profit in BTC. So we have to keep relying on Banks.

3. Stifle innovation and force companies out of USA


I do not find the attempt surprising, it was going to happen eventually. However, they will fail. Bitcoin has proven itself resilient, and it will overcome these trivial hostilities.


Here is a good article on the matter.

http://www.fentonreport.com/news/bitcoin-why-engage-with-ben-lawsky

No bitcoin company is going to want to do business with NY customers..  they can only hurt themselves.


You can't kill the bitcoin, remember?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WMQg546agpU

[Yakamoto]

Your statement is exactly what I was thinking about when I heard the announcement. but forcing businesses out will be less and less fruitful in the long run. It'll become obvious soon enough.

Monitoring won't succeed, but I think it's noteworthy to say that the licenses apply only to businesses and exchanges, from what I understand.

And yeah they're aiming to maintain the status quo, it'll be entertaining when it all fails.

[Inotanewbie]

The regulations are actually only affecting the exchanges that are based in New York, and will not directly affect users of bitcoin except that they need to go through KYC process when dealing with exchanges (however this is nothing new)

[LostDutchman]

The regulations are actually only affecting the exchanges that are based in New York, and will not directly affect users of bitcoin except that they need to go through KYC process when dealing with exchanges (however this is nothing new)

Wrongo, Boyo!

The regs apply to ANY exchange which does any kind of business in New York even if the exchange is located outside of the USA.

[chufchuf]

The purpose is to make sure banks are the only ones that can handle bitcoin, and the other purpose is to keep the state tax revenue enough to pay Lawsky wages.

[gmx95]

So, Mr. Douche aka Ben Lawsky has come out with proposed NY regulations.

http://www.dfs.ny.gov/about/press2014/pr1407171.html

After reviewing these proposed regulations, it is clear what the objectives are.

1. Restrict and greatly Monitor all Bitcoin users, get rid of all privacy

2. Maintain the status quo by making it so businesses cannot take profit in BTC. So we have to keep relying on Banks.

3. Stifle innovation and force companies out of USA


I do not find the attempt surprising, it was going to happen eventually. However, they will fail. Bitcoin has proven itself resilient, and it will overcome these trivial hostilities.


Here is a good article on the matter.

http://www.fentonreport.com/news/bitcoin-why-engage-with-ben-lawsky

No bitcoin company is going to want to do business with NY customers..  they can only hurt themselves.


You can't kill the bitcoin, remember?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WMQg546agpU

What did you expect from the goverment? Of course they want to control and regulate everything. Bitcoin is an alternative to fiat. Of course it is in their interest to restrict it.

[santaClause]

The purpose is to make sure banks are the only ones that can handle bitcoin, and the other purpose is to keep the state tax revenue enough to pay Lawsky wages.

this is the opposite of what the regulations do. It would be unprofitable for banks to hold bitcoin because the regulations do not allow fractional reserves

[Ibitcoinloan]

Any above ground trade currency that might be used by terrorists or narco trade will face regulation eventually.

Any point in the btc trade network converting btc into a cash curreny will be monitored and regulated.

Bitcoin itself wont be regulated but the flow into cash will be since govs assume cash equals narco or terrorism.

That's the price to pay to live within a some safe envoronment post 911.

Business can take it in trade. Businesses can sweep into their accounts, but if you expect btc to be sold via wire services or such you mistaken. Try to receive money now via WU, any significant amount you produce ID.

So to secure people counties will regulate.

Try to get on a plane today with no ID.

Try to drive a car no ID.

As long as you keep btc in btc wallets you need not worry.

But if you dont have a site or business taking it, then how do you expect to acquire it?

More Mt Gox scams?

I see no problem with it being regulated at the exit points into cash since all wires are regulated now.

The group saying redefine existing rules is best solution, not the ny state rules

Just rework existing laws about money transmiitters

My opinion

[GrandmaJean]

Any above ground trade currency that might be used by terrorists or narco trade will face regulation eventually.

Any point in the btc trade network converting btc into a cash curreny will be monitored and regulated.

Bitcoin itself wont be regulated but the flow into cash will be since govs assume cash equals narco or terrorism.

That's the price to pay to live within a some safe envoronment post 911.

Business can take it in trade. Businesses can sweep into their accounts, but if you expect btc to be sold via wire services or such you mistaken. Try to receive money now via WU, any significant amount you produce ID.

So to secure people counties will regulate.

Try to get on a plane today with no ID.

Try to drive a car no ID.

As long as you keep btc in btc wallets you need not worry.

But if you dont have a site or business taking it, then how do you expect to acquire it?

More Mt Gox scams?

I see no problem with it being regulated at the exit points into cash since all wires are regulated now.

The group saying redefine existing rules is best solution, not the ny state rules

Just rework existing laws about money transmiitters

My opinion

This is a very good point. You need to identify yourself to do most things today, and this has been this way for over a decade. I don't foresee this changing anytime soon.

[michaelwang33]

So, Mr. Douche aka Ben Lawsky has come out with proposed NY regulations.

http://www.dfs.ny.gov/about/press2014/pr1407171.html

After reviewing these proposed regulations, it is clear what the objectives are.

1. Restrict and greatly Monitor all Bitcoin users, get rid of all privacy

2. Maintain the status quo by making it so businesses cannot take profit in BTC. So we have to keep relying on Banks.

3. Stifle innovation and force companies out of USA


I do not find the attempt surprising, it was going to happen eventually. However, they will fail. Bitcoin has proven itself resilient, and it will overcome these trivial hostilities.


Here is a good article on the matter.

http://www.fentonreport.com/news/bitcoin-why-engage-with-ben-lawsky

No bitcoin company is going to want to do business with NY customers..  they can only hurt themselves.


You can't kill the bitcoin, remember?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WMQg546agpU

What did you expect from the goverment? Of course they want to control and regulate everything. Bitcoin is an alternative to fiat. Of course it is in their interest to restrict it.

When liberals are in office they tend to try to control as much of peoples' lives as possible.

[adoni]

The regulations are actually only affecting the exchanges that are based in New York, and will not directly affect users of bitcoin except that they need to go through KYC process when dealing with exchanges (however this is nothing new)

Wrongo, Boyo!

The regs apply to ANY exchange which does any kind of business in New York even if the exchange is located outside of the USA.

WRONG it's a state level law, it can only be used to enforce trade inside NY State.

So you IP block anyone from that IP range

Oh you're in NY, bye.

Now if a business is outside the USA say in the cayman islands

who cares what NY STATE does, they have no authority over state lines NONE

as the law stands they can't even prosecute the people in NY state that buy it, they can only regulate the exchanges actually with a physical presence inside NY state

now if you are in another state in the USA, then you're shutting down your doors since you know the US Fed Police system aka FBI will harass you.

If you deal with btc as an exchange you do not locate inside the USA period

Switerland
Cayman Islands
Uruguay
A few other nations maybe

USA is not where you would base a modern crypto currency exchange

Now you may soon see money transmitters operating in NY state or FL or TX or CA in the USA, huge population centers, so with only 4 money transmitter licenses a brave new bitcoin western union type service could service most of the USA for bitcoin

People would start lining up at your 'service' and all you do is transmit money, you hang a shingle we sell btc, people come in all day with worthless USD you legally put in your US BANK, then as a money transmitter you LEGALLY WIRE IT refresh your btc supply at whatever exchange outside the USA will sell you btc for your worthless USD

So western union style service points in the 4 top states in the USA could do 80% of the business in the USA

with not one 'exchange' inside the USA

the money transmitter service holds 4 state money transmitter licenses, every operator in its network is an agent of that state license operator

as a MONEY TRANSMITTER business that business can legally conduct business with any exchange in the world, US state licensed money transmitters do not have to deal with US based btc exchanges. So US citizens line up all day to get rare btc so they can save 20% off at internet retailers to try to stretch their worthless paychecks some, that worthless cash goes into a worthless US bank and then an exchange outside the USA takes your worthless USD for btc, money transmitters keep geting btc, btc keeps going up in value and the velocity of the inflation on the USD spirals up.

The exchanges don't care what any currency is worth, it's a number, if you can trade a bitcoin for 500 USD today, that's the number 500, if it's 50 or 50K tomorrow that's the number, the exchange is a service, what crosses the exchange in trade is what people want at that moment in time

It might be btc exchanges soon outlaw all fiat currencies and you must have GOLD ON DEPOSIT to deal with them soon

Fiat is after all worthless and all you need is one money transmitter in say Miami with a line out the door of poor US citizens waiting in line to get btc so they can go to a merchant selling a chinese made TV for a few bucks cheaper than the other retailer.

haha

[LostDutchman]

The regulations are actually only affecting the exchanges that are based in New York, and will not directly affect users of bitcoin except that they need to go through KYC process when dealing with exchanges (however this is nothing new)

Wrongo, Boyo!

The regs apply to ANY exchange which does any kind of business in New York even if the exchange is located outside of the USA.

WRONG it's a state level law, it can only be used to enforce trade inside NY State.

So you IP block anyone from that IP range

Oh you're in NY, bye.

Now if a business is outside the USA say in the cayman islands

who cares what NY STATE does, they have no authority over state lines NONE

as the law stands they can't even prosecute the people in NY state that buy it, they can only regulate the exchanges actually with a physical presence inside NY state

now if you are in another state in the USA, then you're shutting down your doors since you know the US Fed Police system aka FBI will harass you.

If you deal with btc as an exchange you do not locate inside the USA period

Switerland
Cayman Islands
Uruguay
A few other nations maybe

USA is not where you would base a modern crypto currency exchange

Now you may soon see money transmitters operating in NY state or FL or TX or CA in the USA, huge population centers, so with only 4 money transmitter licenses a brave new bitcoin western union type service could service most of the USA for bitcoin

People would start lining up at your 'service' and all you do is transmit money, you hang a shingle we sell btc, people come in all day with worthless USD you legally put in your US BANK, then as a money transmitter you LEGALLY WIRE IT refresh your btc supply at whatever exchange outside the USA will sell you btc for your worthless USD

So western union style service points in the 4 top states in the USA could do 80% of the business in the USA

with not one 'exchange' inside the USA

the money transmitter service holds 4 state money transmitter licenses, every operator in its network is an agent of that state license operator

as a MONEY TRANSMITTER business that business can legally conduct business with any exchange in the world, US state licensed money transmitters do not have to deal with US based btc exchanges. So US citizens line up all day to get rare btc so they can save 20% off at internet retailers to try to stretch their worthless paychecks some, that worthless cash goes into a worthless US bank and then an exchange outside the USA takes your worthless USD for btc, money transmitters keep geting btc, btc keeps going up in value and the velocity of the inflation on the USD spirals up.

The exchanges don't care what any currency is worth, it's a number, if you can trade a bitcoin for 500 USD today, that's the number 500, if it's 50 or 50K tomorrow that's the number, the exchange is a service, what crosses the exchange in trade is what people want at that moment in time

It might be btc exchanges soon outlaw all fiat currencies and you must have GOLD ON DEPOSIT to deal with them soon

Fiat is after all worthless and all you need is one money transmitter in say Miami with a line out the door of poor US citizens waiting in line to get btc so they can go to a merchant selling a chinese made TV for a few bucks cheaper than the other retailer.

haha

You are so wrong on so many of your baseless assumptions that I'm not even going to bother.

[S133p]

The regulations are actually only affecting the exchanges that are based in New York, and will not directly affect users of bitcoin except that they need to go through KYC process when dealing with exchanges (however this is nothing new)

Wrongo, Boyo!

The regs apply to ANY exchange which does any kind of business in New York even if the exchange is located outside of the USA.

I don't think the states have the authority to regulate businesses that have no operations in that state.

[segeln]

This is a very good point. You need to identify yourself to do most things today, and this has been this way for over a decade. I don't foresee this changing anytime soon.

I agree to you ,to Ibitcoinloan as well

[segeln]

When liberals are in office they tend to try to control as much of peoples' lives as possible.

but they want to make us believe everything is in favor for us. very hypocritical