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Author Topic: MtGox please help us find out if the robbed coins reached your service...  (Read 1725 times)
paraipan
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March 02, 2012, 11:37:42 AM
 #1

Mod Note: Thread split from here
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=66979.0


The only thing that would solve any doubts, and back your previous statement, is if you guys publish the public bitcoin addresses, under your control, that received funds in the last 24h, without any kind of other info at all. Can you help us with that ?

People who think the dumps at Mt. Gox is the stolen money, are absolutely clueless about everything. Gox takes money laundering more seriously than any other Bitcoin exchange. The thief would be out of his mind to try selling the coins via Gox, not now or ever.

There are better ways to do it. What we're seeing now at Gox is speculators selling because there has been serious bad news in the Bitcoin world. That's about it.

but there is a small possibility that could happen and you have to be really dumb to dismiss it completely  Undecided


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Matthew N. Wright
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March 02, 2012, 11:50:15 AM
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People who think the dumps at Mt. Gox is the stolen money, are absolutely clueless about everything. Gox takes money laundering more seriously than any other Bitcoin exchange. The thief would be out of his mind to try selling the coins via Gox, not now or ever.

There are better ways to do it. What we're seeing now at Gox is speculators selling because there has been serious bad news in the Bitcoin world. That's about it.

but there is a small possibility that could happen and you have to be really dumb to dismiss it completely  Undecided

Christ. Would someone take the time to explain to paraipan how to use BlockExplorer.com please before he files a police report that MtGox is laundering illegally obtained money in a country out of jurisdiction?

paraipan
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March 02, 2012, 12:02:43 PM
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People who think the dumps at Mt. Gox is the stolen money, are absolutely clueless about everything. Gox takes money laundering more seriously than any other Bitcoin exchange. The thief would be out of his mind to try selling the coins via Gox, not now or ever.

There are better ways to do it. What we're seeing now at Gox is speculators selling because there has been serious bad news in the Bitcoin world. That's about it.

but there is a small possibility that could happen and you have to be really dumb to dismiss it completely  Undecided

Christ. Would someone take the time to explain to paraipan how to use BlockExplorer.com please before he files a police report that MtGox is laundering illegally obtained money in a country out of jurisdiction?

meh, no need for that. disclosing already public info from mtgox would solve any kind of doubt on it, like their receiving addresses in the last 24 hours without any other client info.

Btw I don't get why you're being vocal like that bashing all my statements and personally attacking me, i'm a civilized person and respectful with others and expect the same.

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Matthew N. Wright
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March 02, 2012, 12:05:15 PM
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meh, no need for that. disclosing already public info from mtgox would solve any kind of doubt on it.

How do you 'disclose' already public information?

What information are you looking to get?

Use blockexplorer, follow the money like everyone else is doing.

Case in point: It hasn't gone to MtGox. Ta-da!

Btw I don't get why you're being vocal like that bashing all my statements and personally attacking me,

You must be new here. Hi. My name is Matthew. I'm vocal and bash people's statements when they are idiotic and FUD.

i'm a civilized person and respectful with others and expect the same.
Civilized people file police reports because they didn't get their way for a few days?

MtGox has already commented, you totally ignored it. You are not respectful. You are a trouble maker and should be avoided until you learn how to work in social situations under stress. Everyone on this forum seems responsible, civilized and respectful until you push them.

paraipan
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March 02, 2012, 12:22:44 PM
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@Matthew N. Wright heh, you bet i know you dude, you're one of the most resourceful and intelligent person in this community when you're not trolling off course

Having a list of their receiving addresses in the last 24h would help us a great deal investigating and their legal binding with the clients will not be affected, i'm a client of MtGox too if that matters.

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Matthew N. Wright
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March 02, 2012, 12:26:28 PM
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@Matthew N. Wright heh, you bet i know you dude, you're one of the most resourceful and intelligent person in this community when you're not trolling off course

Having a list of their receiving addresses in the last 24h would help us a great deal investigating and their legal binding with the clients will not be affected, i'm a client of MtGox too if that matters.

You want a private list of receiving addresses for MtGox customers? Get a warrant. (in Japan, not Spain)

paraipan
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March 02, 2012, 12:30:11 PM
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@Matthew N. Wright heh, you bet i know you dude, you're one of the most resourceful and intelligent person in this community when you're not trolling off course

Having a list of their receiving addresses in the last 24h would help us a great deal investigating and their legal binding with the clients will not be affected, i'm a client of MtGox too if that matters.

You want a private list of receiving addresses for MtGox customers? Get a warrant. (in Japan, not Spain)

as far as i know and you posted it earlier, the public addresses are... public. We only need MtGox to say this or that was mine in the last 24h.

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Matthew N. Wright
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March 02, 2012, 12:41:36 PM
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as far as i know and you posted it earlier, the public addresses are... public. We only need MtGox to say this or that was mine in the last 24h.
Find the post where I said any addresses were public. What I said was that any public information is of course public. I highly doubt the personal deposit addresses given to MtGox users are public unless those users want to make them public (which means they are using mtGox as their e-wallet). This information would most certainly break MtGox's privacy policy for users and it will not happen. Sorry.

paraipan
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March 02, 2012, 12:54:34 PM
 #9

...
Find the post where I said any addresses were public...


....

Christ. Would someone take the time to explain to paraipan how to use BlockExplorer.com please ...



Addresses are public so this would be MtGox showing good faith pinpointing the ones under their control and rule them out of this with some backing.

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Matthew N. Wright
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March 02, 2012, 12:57:53 PM
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Addresses are public so this would be MtGox showing good faith pinpointing the ones under their control and rule them out of this with some backing.

You're confused. When you log in to your MtGox account and get a fresh new deposit address attached to your account only, no, that is not public. It never will be public unless you make it public. MtGox has no duty or right to release that information, as it would tie MtGox customers to addresses. Even if they gave the information out without telling you who owned the address, it would still be releasing customer information, to a forum user who likes calling the cops whenever there is something he doesn't like.

If MtGox is the one who has to make the decision on selling/buying, why not leave it up to them in the first place? What possible good would come to them for giving you a list of private addresses? That is a basic law of security. If someone doesn't need it, don't give it to them.

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March 02, 2012, 01:00:00 PM
 #11

Paraipan must be mad or just stupid. The Bitcoin addresses users have at Mt. Gox are not public information. The fact that all Bitcoin addresses are public doesn't mean that it's public information who owns which address. The privacy of legitimate Bitcoin users should not be sacrificed because shit like this happens. Mt. Gox will handle it on their own end and if coins from the thefts appear on their accounts I'm quite sure their AML department will investigate.

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Matthew N. Wright
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March 02, 2012, 01:06:40 PM
 #12

Paraipan, I know you are just anxious to sink your teeth into lawbreakers and such, so why don't you stop bothering the adults who are working on this in a mature and educated manner and start looking into Mr. CoinExchanger who publicly states that he is running a completely unlicensed exchange and is PROUD of it, calling bitcoin 'worthless, even worth less than monopoly money"?

He's also tied to the scammer account "Maria" (same IP) and here is his latest self promotional thread with a misleading title claiming he has 20,000BTC deposited by someone but absolutely no mention of it in his actual post.

Sick 'em, boy!

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=67044

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March 02, 2012, 01:09:46 PM
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as far as i know and you posted it earlier, the public addresses are... public. We only need MtGox to say this or that was mine in the last 24h.

me: Hello RBS / Barclays / NatWest / Chase Manhattan / Citibank / HSBC ...
      Can you provide me a list of all the names of customers and IBAN codes for all accounts that had deposit activity in the last 24 hours.

them: er.... <phone down>...

I don't think you understand the concepts of Data Protection. MTGOX cannot under any circumstances except those detailed in their privacy policy and terms and conditions release that information. They would be sued into oblivion 3 seconds after they published.

A public address that is is part of the public/private key set that makes up an address is NOT public information - it just means that the address can be given to any random person, and they cannot reverse it to the private address. It doesn't mean that you are entitled to any of that information. Or are you going to put up all your public addresses?

In the meantime:
http://blockchain.info/tree/2893660
Follow the orange circles note the IP address, look it up, see if it matches the MTGOX IP address for deposits, keep going down the chain. HTH, HAND.

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paraipan
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March 02, 2012, 01:10:39 PM
 #14

...
What possible good would come to them for giving you a list of private addresses?...

A great deal of benefits from calming the spirits with backed statements to increased confidence in their company name. We all know those addresses are public, for all of us to see, and only MtGox has them linked to their clients identities. None of that personal info is required to check if stolen coins have been transferred to the exchange in the last 24h only a brief list of the ones that have received funds in this time frame.

@marked bitcoin is different in this matter, last time i checked the public addresses where stored in the blockchain, not much resemblance with a bank's IBAN.

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March 02, 2012, 01:12:33 PM
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Addresses are public so this would be MtGox showing good faith pinpointing the ones under their control and rule them out of this with some backing.

You're confused. When you log in to your MtGox account and get a fresh new deposit address attached to your account only, no, that is not public. It never will be public unless you make it public. MtGox has no duty or right to release that information, as it would tie MtGox customers to addresses. Even if they gave the information out without telling you who owned the address, it would still be releasing customer information, to a forum user who likes calling the cops whenever there is something he doesn't like.

If MtGox is the one who has to make the decision on selling/buying, why not leave it up to them in the first place? What possible good would come to them for giving you a list of private addresses? That is a basic law of security. If someone doesn't need it, don't give it to them.

Other exchanges work in the same way.

I wonder if they could still tag these addresses as "user addresses" not linking them to any particular user. Given the amount of users they have, the level of anonymity would be more than acceptable.

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Matthew N. Wright
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March 02, 2012, 01:18:26 PM
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A great deal of benefits from calming the spirits with backed statements to increased confidence in their company name.

Oh yes. Inspire confidence in their company name by fullfilling the demands of a lunatic on the forum and breaking their company-wide privacy policy in order to do so. Did you forget a pill this morning?


None of that personal info is required to check if stolen coins have been transferred to the exchange in the last 24h.

Neither is your involvement. None of your involvement is necessary either! MtGox is already doing this on their own I'm sure. Why do they need to break their own Privacy Policy and lose support from their members just so you can be satisfied?

Other exchanges work in the same way.

I wonder if they could still tag these addresses as "user addresses" not linking them to any particular user. Given the amount of users they have, the level of anonymity would be more than acceptable.

Probably not, but none of us need to know the addresses that go through MtGox. Only MtGox needs to know. All we need to know is what MtGox is going to do about it if they find one, and that is up to them to tell us, since we agree to the user agreement when we make our accounts and we support them as a community by giving them our business.

Since MtGox already stated publicly that the coins were not the same ones, it's very clear he's just out to cause trouble.

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March 02, 2012, 02:03:48 PM
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The only thing that would solve any doubts, and back your previous statement, is if you guys publish the public bitcoin addresses, under your control, that received funds in the last 24h, without any kind of other info at all. Can you help us with that ?


And then what happens when there is another sell off in the next 24 hours? Going to ask them 'nicely' again to publish private information? Hell, why not just make a private line to you for all their future deposits too!

Get real. MtGox would need permission from every single user (and the hacker would never give it, would they?) for it to be allowed in any manner that wouldn't breach their very own privacy policy.

Alex, I'm going to say this one last time for your thick skull---- breaching their own Privacy Policy will not win them any friends, especially not to just please -you-, who is the only one on this entire forum stupid enough to think that the coins being sold right now are the same ones as the hacker (for what reason, I don't know).

MtGox are the ones who have to handle it if it happens anyway, so what good is there in telling you?

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March 02, 2012, 02:06:40 PM
 #18

I highly doubt they would go to MtGox after they held allinvains coins, the guys who did this aren't idiots.

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March 02, 2012, 04:47:51 PM
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Wait. Where are all the other posts?

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Matthew N. Wright
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March 02, 2012, 04:49:16 PM
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Wait. Where are all the other posts?

BadBear is trying to preserve the off-topicness. Point out posts you think he missed.

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