TOO MANY BITCOINERS

[jonald_fyookball]

I think you are taking what both Gavin and Andreas said out of context.

Gavin said there are "too many miners", meaning, mining market
is saturated, but that will balance itself out as any competitive
market does.  Most Bitcoiners are NOT miners, so there's no
conclusion to be made about bitcoiners in general.

Andreas said "everyone will make their own coin"
but that is a very abstract concept about the far future,
without a clear context or implementation, and doesn't
imply we wont need strong currencies with wide adoption like Bitcoin.

I see none of this implying we should start using alt coins necessarily.

[Bitcoin-hotep]

yes, we really need more people wanting bitcoin, otherwise we might see a bitcoin collapse if the next halving makes bitcoin mining unprofitable.

Problem is that no one I know would be willing to give bitcoin a try, and would confuse me with some Herbalife pyramid scammer type

or pays you to post on a forum

Like the signature campaign do?

People may think you are a scammer, but they are just missing out, move on to the next person.

What is "Signature Campaign"?

[Bitcoin-hotep]

I think you are taking what both Gavin and Andreas said out of context.

Nope, Gavin literally said we have "Too many people mining Bitcoin" word for word and "Year of the multi sig wallet".

And Andreas wants altcoins to start getting made more, and I am pretty sure he used the phrase "Year of the multi sig wallet".

I used what they said COMPLETELY in context, then added my own analysis of what we can do about it.

[jonald_fyookball]

I think you are taking what both Gavin and Andreas said out of context.

Nope, Gavin literally said we have "Too many people mining Bitcoin" word for word and "Year of the multi sig wallet".

And Andreas wants altcoins to start getting made more, and I am pretty sure he used the phrase "Year of the multi sig wallet".

I used what they said COMPLETELY in context, then added my own analysis of what we can do about it.

"too many people mining Bitcoin" implies what consequence/problem?

How does multisig have anything to do with altcoins?

[franky1]

Mining is a free market. It will regulate itself. I do agree that the era of profitable mining is coming to a close but if people want to spend their time and money on it that's okay too.

^ this quote can be found randomly throughout the last 5 years. mainly at times of:
block reward halving
weeks before CPU->GPU transition
weeks before GPU->FPGA transition
weeks before FPGA->ASIC first gen transition
weeks before ASIC 1st Gen->ASIC 2nd Gen transition
weeks before ASIC 2nd Gen->ASIC 3rd Gen transition

new technology will keep mining going,
price increases where miners hoard coins and avoid selling at loss will keep mining going
block halving wont stop it, as everyone thought the last halving would kill off miners... yet the miner hoarding scheme proved block-halving wont stop it

mining will continue until 2025 before its truly not profitable for single entities to buy hardware... so we are only 33% there.. so it is still too early to be truly shouting "its over". then after 2025 when fee's start taking over reward you will start to see the 10 main pools dilute down to 3 main pools.

now. back to the OP.. what a laugh.. bitcoin dosnt need to move to get miners to different coins.. its to move miners away from mining and into running proper businesses.. just like the wild west SOME people dropped their pickaxe and bought dynamite, and then their descendants bought excavators.. yet the large population started to drop their pickaxes and open saloons, blacksmiths, barbers, horse stables, carpenter workshops, etc and found it easier and cheaper to get bitcoin with less stress and costs by running businesses..

this is what you SHOULD see over the next 10 years, more merchants starting up as a method for people to get bitcoins.. leaving only a few companies mining the remaining bitcoins with their large expensive equipment.

telling people to mine a pump 'n' dump shitcoin is not good advice... EVER

[EcuaMobi]

It's arguable there's enough people mining.

But of course we're not "done getting new people" regarding people using, spending and receiving payments in Bitcoin.

Regarding mining, an even less centralized system (such as p2pools) would be ideal.

Ok... So we now only accept people with money to buy our coins... We aren't an elitist community at all.

Maybe we are, unfortunately. I learned about Bitcoin and joined the community when it was at about $1k, and I bought some at tha price.

The only way for Bitcoin to be mainstream is for people to use it. And the easier and most common way for people to use it is to buy it.

[Bitcoin-hotep]

I think you are taking what both Gavin and Andreas said out of context.

Nope, Gavin literally said we have "Too many people mining Bitcoin" word for word and "Year of the multi sig wallet".

And Andreas wants altcoins to start getting made more, and I am pretty sure he used the phrase "Year of the multi sig wallet".

I used what they said COMPLETELY in context, then added my own analysis of what we can do about it.

"too many people mining Bitcoin" implies what consequence/problem?

How does multisig have anything to do with altcoins?

Because NEW PEOPLE ARE STILL COMING TO MINE. So they should know what to mine.

[Bitcoin-hotep]

It's arguable there's enough people mining.

But of course we're not "done getting new people" regarding people using, spending and receiving payments in Bitcoin.

Regarding mining, an even less centralized system (such as p2pools) would be ideal.

Ok... So we now only accept people with money to buy our coins... We aren't an elitist community at all.

Maybe we are, unfortunately. I learned about Bitcoin and joined the community when it was at about $1k, and I bought some at tha price.

The only way for Bitcoin to be mainstream is for people to use it. And the easier and most common way for people to use it is to buy it.

Or, you could think a little harder.

And teach EVERYONE how to make coins, then let those people mine those coins with their shitty laptops, tablets and windows XP computers. Then they can come and trade those coins for Bitcoin or better altcoins.

Even if they had NO MONEY to start with.

[jonald_fyookball]

I think you are taking what both Gavin and Andreas said out of context.

Nope, Gavin literally said we have "Too many people mining Bitcoin" word for word and "Year of the multi sig wallet".

And Andreas wants altcoins to start getting made more, and I am pretty sure he used the phrase "Year of the multi sig wallet".

I used what they said COMPLETELY in context, then added my own analysis of what we can do about it.

"too many people mining Bitcoin" implies what consequence/problem?

How does multisig have anything to do with altcoins?

Because NEW PEOPLE ARE STILL COMING TO MINE. So they should know what to mine.

they can mine altcoins if they want, I still don't see a problem.

[Bitcoin-hotep]

I think you are taking what both Gavin and Andreas said out of context.

Nope, Gavin literally said we have "Too many people mining Bitcoin" word for word and "Year of the multi sig wallet".

And Andreas wants altcoins to start getting made more, and I am pretty sure he used the phrase "Year of the multi sig wallet".

I used what they said COMPLETELY in context, then added my own analysis of what we can do about it.

"too many people mining Bitcoin" implies what consequence/problem?

How does multisig have anything to do with altcoins?

Because NEW PEOPLE ARE STILL COMING TO MINE. So they should know what to mine.

they can mine altcoins if they want, I still don't see a problem.

The problem is that there is not really any altcoins that are doing well. Sure there is Litecoin, but that is getting hard to mine also.

People need to start letting new people know about all these other coins.

[SirChiko]

Some people don't mine to profit, they mine to make the network stronger.

Then why not mine to make an Alt network stronger?

Cuz some altcoins (most of them) are just bloodsuckers of bitcoin.

[EcuaMobi]

It's arguable there's enough people mining.

But of course we're not "done getting new people" regarding people using, spending and receiving payments in Bitcoin.

Regarding mining, an even less centralized system (such as p2pools) would be ideal.

Ok... So we now only accept people with money to buy our coins... We aren't an elitist community at all.

Maybe we are, unfortunately. I learned about Bitcoin and joined the community when it was at about $1k, and I bought some at tha price.

The only way for Bitcoin to be mainstream is for people to use it. And the easier and most common way for people to use it is to buy it.

Or, you could think a little harder.

And teach EVERYONE how to make coins, then let those people mine those coins with their shitty laptops, tablets and windows XP computers. Then they can come and trade those coins for Bitcoin or better altcoins.

Even if they had NO MONEY to start with.

You know that's not the way to make Bitcoin mainstream (or you should).

Honestly, how many people would be willing to learn that and
leave their computer running all day for a few dollars worth?

It's impossible to have billions of people to do that.

[Bitcoin-hotep]

And we need coins that DO something (at least represent a region if not represent some form of change).

Not just NXT and NEM.

We need Brazil Coin, China Coin 2, Singapore Coin, Mexico Coin, etc.

[jonald_fyookball]

I think you are taking what both Gavin and Andreas said out of context.

Nope, Gavin literally said we have "Too many people mining Bitcoin" word for word and "Year of the multi sig wallet".

And Andreas wants altcoins to start getting made more, and I am pretty sure he used the phrase "Year of the multi sig wallet".

I used what they said COMPLETELY in context, then added my own analysis of what we can do about it.

"too many people mining Bitcoin" implies what consequence/problem?

How does multisig have anything to do with altcoins?

Because NEW PEOPLE ARE STILL COMING TO MINE. So they should know what to mine.

they can mine altcoins if they want, I still don't see a problem.

The problem is that there is not really any altcoins that are doing well. Sure there is Litecoin, but that is getting hard to mine also.

People need to start letting new people know about all these other coins.

where did you get the assumption from that we need altcoins to be doing well?

sounds like circular logic and you haven't convinced me you understand the original
messages from Gavin or Andreas.

"too many miners" isn't a problem except for someone who want to be a miner,
because it's ultra competitive.

and altcoins have nothing to do with bitcoin multisig.

[Bitcoin-hotep]

Some people don't mine to profit, they mine to make the network stronger.

Then why not mine to make an Alt network stronger?

Cuz some altcoins (most of them) are just bloodsuckers of bitcoin.

That is what people think, but it wouldn't be true if we had coins that were meant to draw NEW people instead of meant for old miners to have an easier time mining.

[Bitcoin-hotep]

It's arguable there's enough people mining.

But of course we're not "done getting new people" regarding people using, spending and receiving payments in Bitcoin.

Regarding mining, an even less centralized system (such as p2pools) would be ideal.

Ok... So we now only accept people with money to buy our coins... We aren't an elitist community at all.

Maybe we are, unfortunately. I learned about Bitcoin and joined the community when it was at about $1k, and I bought some at tha price.

The only way for Bitcoin to be mainstream is for people to use it. And the easier and most common way for people to use it is to buy it.

Or, you could think a little harder.

And teach EVERYONE how to make coins, then let those people mine those coins with their shitty laptops, tablets and windows XP computers. Then they can come and trade those coins for Bitcoin or better altcoins.

Even if they had NO MONEY to start with.

You know that's not the way to make Bitcoin mainstream (or you should).

Honestly, how many people would be willing to learn that and
leave their computer running all day for a few dollars worth?

It's impossible to have billions of people to do that.

That is what everyone said when Bitcoin first started. lol. And there are probably at least a quarter of a billion doing it.

[Bitcoin-hotep]

I think you are taking what both Gavin and Andreas said out of context.

Nope, Gavin literally said we have "Too many people mining Bitcoin" word for word and "Year of the multi sig wallet".

And Andreas wants altcoins to start getting made more, and I am pretty sure he used the phrase "Year of the multi sig wallet".

I used what they said COMPLETELY in context, then added my own analysis of what we can do about it.

"too many people mining Bitcoin" implies what consequence/problem?

How does multisig have anything to do with altcoins?

Because NEW PEOPLE ARE STILL COMING TO MINE. So they should know what to mine.

they can mine altcoins if they want, I still don't see a problem.

The problem is that there is not really any altcoins that are doing well. Sure there is Litecoin, but that is getting hard to mine also.

People need to start letting new people know about all these other coins.

where did you get the assumption from that we need altcoins to be doing well?

sounds like circular logic and you haven't convinced me you understand the original
messages from Gavin or Andreas.

"too many miners" isn't a problem except for someone who want to be a miner,
because it's ultra competitive.

and altcoins have nothing to do with bitcoin multisig.

Altcoins have always been needing to do well.

And I can quote Gavin again here. He said that he would LOVE for some coin to match with Bitcoin, or some Fork to be successful, because then he could sleep at night without wondering if it is all going to crash because of one line of code they missed.

[commandrix]

So maybe we don't need more miners. We just need to actually start getting used to buying and selling with Bitcoin so the guy with the expensive rig starts realizing that he's not the only person who can profit from cryptocurrencies. I was just writing this blog entry about why we need more bloggers.

[EcuaMobi]

It's arguable there's enough people mining.

But of course we're not "done getting new people" regarding people using, spending and receiving payments in Bitcoin.

Regarding mining, an even less centralized system (such as p2pools) would be ideal.

Ok... So we now only accept people with money to buy our coins... We aren't an elitist community at all.

Maybe we are, unfortunately. I learned about Bitcoin and joined the community when it was at about $1k, and I bought some at tha price.

The only way for Bitcoin to be mainstream is for people to use it. And the easier and most common way for people to use it is to buy it.

Or, you could think a little harder.

And teach EVERYONE how to make coins, then let those people mine those coins with their shitty laptops, tablets and windows XP computers. Then they can come and trade those coins for Bitcoin or better altcoins.

Even if they had NO MONEY to start with.

You know that's not the way to make Bitcoin mainstream (or you should).

Honestly, how many people would be willing to learn that and
leave their computer running all day for a few dollars worth?

It's impossible to have billions of people to do that.

That is what everyone said when Bitcoin first started. lol. And there are probably at least a quarter of a billion doing it.

Exactly, thanks. And that's still true. Except of course there's not a quarter of a billion doing it, not even holding coins.

How many people mine Bitcoin?
How many people hold or have ever held Bitcoin?

I don't think those numbers can be even compared.

So only a small percentage of people can get (Bit)coins by mining.

[Bitcoin-hotep]

And I know altcoins are not related to multisig, my point is that "Year of the multisig" is a FAR CRY from last year which was basically "Year of the ASIC".