BTCD is no more

[jl777]

I didnt realize volumes at cryptsy was so high!
Also, we broke .001 price briefly there:

DRK/BTC    DarkCoin            68.6 BTC   0.01078000   0.01147000 BTC   0.01076488 BTC
BTCD/BTC    BitcoinDark    59.1 BTC   0.00095000   0.00105000 BTC   0.00036200 BTC

Almost same volumes as DRK!
And cryptsy is one of the top DRK volume places

I guess I should stop goofing off and get to work

James

[1714047878]

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[salsacz]

james: sorry https://twitter.com/search?f=realtime&q=bitcoindark%20pow%20pos&src=typd (for pump)   I wanted exclusivity, not a pumpidity

I would like to thank to the 3 donators, of 260 BTCD sent coins. It is 0.02% of the currency. If stakeholders won't start donating like 1% of their stakes to the dev/marketing stunts, I see serious flaws with funding this whole project

[mikesbmw]

This rise in price is no normal growth, it's doomed to be dumped again.

Missed out on the low prices huh?
Or maybe you were the one that dumped into my buy order

Good luck in trying to talk the price down. Your reason it will go down is because "rise in price is no normal growth". Super strong analytical skills, not!

Sure that makes sense, if there were 100,000 new BTCD mined everyday, but lets see the actual number is a bit smaller, something like 200 per day? Probably less, maybe someone can figure that out?

So we have basically no new supply. Less than 1.2 million, not sure we will even get past that by year end.
We have multipools that are buying and I would say they buy a bit more than 200 BTCD
So if you are familiar with supply/demand economics, this creates an upward pressure to the prices.

Of course, if long term there is no future to the coin, then eventually everyone will sell to get onto a better coin.

You say "doomed"
I say early days, just getting started, still tiny marketcap, oh, and there does seem to be a bright future for BitcoinDark!

James

Perhaps I've grown accustomed to trading in larger numbers, but don't these tiny numbers (in BTC and BTCD) seem a little artificial?
I'm absolutely not trying to talk things down, because we all know where this coin is heading (and it ain't down) 

[crackfoo]

This rise in price is no normal growth, it's doomed to be dumped again.

So we have basically no new supply. Less than 1.2 million, not sure we will even get past that by year end.
We have multipools that are buying and I would say they buy a bit more than 200 BTCD
So if you are familiar with supply/demand economics, this creates an upward pressure to the prices.

http://btcd.xpool.ca has been buying 300-400 a day and I expect that to continue to grow.

Cheers!

[jl777]

This rise in price is no normal growth, it's doomed to be dumped again.

Missed out on the low prices huh?
Or maybe you were the one that dumped into my buy order

Good luck in trying to talk the price down. Your reason it will go down is because "rise in price is no normal growth". Super strong analytical skills, not!

Sure that makes sense, if there were 100,000 new BTCD mined everyday, but lets see the actual number is a bit smaller, something like 200 per day? Probably less, maybe someone can figure that out?

So we have basically no new supply. Less than 1.2 million, not sure we will even get past that by year end.
We have multipools that are buying and I would say they buy a bit more than 200 BTCD
So if you are familiar with supply/demand economics, this creates an upward pressure to the prices.

Of course, if long term there is no future to the coin, then eventually everyone will sell to get onto a better coin.

You say "doomed"
I say early days, just getting started, still tiny marketcap, oh, and there does seem to be a bright future for BitcoinDark!

James

Perhaps I've grown accustomed to trading in larger numbers, but don't these tiny numbers (in BTC and BTCD) seem a little artificial?
I'm absolutely not trying to talk things down, because we all know where this coin is heading (and it ain't down) 

150 BTC per day is close to NXT trading volumes, so not sure what you mean...

It might seem artificial to you, but thats all there is of BTCD and at 5% per year on <1.2 million coins its not like it grows on trees.
The other promising coins like XMR are being mined like crazy and that creates daily tens of thousands of coins that need to be sold to pay the mining fees.

Take away the selling pressure and any small continual demand will create a stable floor. Any news stories like salsa is getting keeps pushing things up. I am disappointed people are not donating more to him. Please fund salsa to get more PR, unless you dont like the higher prices and liquidity.

James

[damiano]

beautiful

sold at 92-95k

bought back at 73-77k

[mikesbmw]

This rise in price is no normal growth, it's doomed to be dumped again.

Missed out on the low prices huh?
Or maybe you were the one that dumped into my buy order

Good luck in trying to talk the price down. Your reason it will go down is because "rise in price is no normal growth". Super strong analytical skills, not!

Sure that makes sense, if there were 100,000 new BTCD mined everyday, but lets see the actual number is a bit smaller, something like 200 per day? Probably less, maybe someone can figure that out?

So we have basically no new supply. Less than 1.2 million, not sure we will even get past that by year end.
We have multipools that are buying and I would say they buy a bit more than 200 BTCD
So if you are familiar with supply/demand economics, this creates an upward pressure to the prices.

Of course, if long term there is no future to the coin, then eventually everyone will sell to get onto a better coin.

You say "doomed"
I say early days, just getting started, still tiny marketcap, oh, and there does seem to be a bright future for BitcoinDark!

James

Perhaps I've grown accustomed to trading in larger numbers, but don't these tiny numbers (in BTC and BTCD) seem a little artificial?
I'm absolutely not trying to talk things down, because we all know where this coin is heading (and it ain't down) 

150 BTC per day is close to NXT trading volumes, so not sure what you mean...

It might seem artificial to you, but thats all there is of BTCD and at 5% per year on <1.2 million coins its not like it grows on trees.
The other promising coins like XMR are being mined like crazy and that creates daily tens of thousands of coins that need to be sold to pay the mining fees.

Take away the selling pressure and any small continual demand will create a stable floor. Any news stories like salsa is getting keeps pushing things up. I am disappointed people are not donating more to him. Please fund salsa to get more PR, unless you dont like the higher prices and liquidity.

James

I'm not talking about the total volume, I'm talking about the single trades. It's mostly single or low double digits BTCD per trade. On average very small trades.
Perhaps it's normal and I'm seeing things that aren't there...

[jl777]

This rise in price is no normal growth, it's doomed to be dumped again.

Missed out on the low prices huh?
Or maybe you were the one that dumped into my buy order

Good luck in trying to talk the price down. Your reason it will go down is because "rise in price is no normal growth". Super strong analytical skills, not!

Sure that makes sense, if there were 100,000 new BTCD mined everyday, but lets see the actual number is a bit smaller, something like 200 per day? Probably less, maybe someone can figure that out?

So we have basically no new supply. Less than 1.2 million, not sure we will even get past that by year end.
We have multipools that are buying and I would say they buy a bit more than 200 BTCD
So if you are familiar with supply/demand economics, this creates an upward pressure to the prices.

Of course, if long term there is no future to the coin, then eventually everyone will sell to get onto a better coin.

You say "doomed"
I say early days, just getting started, still tiny marketcap, oh, and there does seem to be a bright future for BitcoinDark!

James

Perhaps I've grown accustomed to trading in larger numbers, but don't these tiny numbers (in BTC and BTCD) seem a little artificial?
I'm absolutely not trying to talk things down, because we all know where this coin is heading (and it ain't down) 

150 BTC per day is close to NXT trading volumes, so not sure what you mean...

It might seem artificial to you, but thats all there is of BTCD and at 5% per year on <1.2 million coins its not like it grows on trees.
The other promising coins like XMR are being mined like crazy and that creates daily tens of thousands of coins that need to be sold to pay the mining fees.

Take away the selling pressure and any small continual demand will create a stable floor. Any news stories like salsa is getting keeps pushing things up. I am disappointed people are not donating more to him. Please fund salsa to get more PR, unless you dont like the higher prices and liquidity.

James

I'm not talking about the total volume, I'm talking about the single trades. It's mostly single or low double digits BTCD per trade. On average very small trades.
Perhaps it's normal and I'm seeing things that aren't there...

Not sure what you are seeing, here is the top of bittrex:


SUM (BTC)   TOTAL (BTC)   SIZE (BTCD)   BID (BTC)
0.3028   0.3028   
400.00000000
0.00075700
0.4916   0.1888   
250.00000000
0.00075502
0.5108   0.0192   
25.60848229
0.00075155
0.8748   0.3640   
485.36087952
0.00075005
1.6248   0.7500   
1000.00000000
0.00075000
1.7248   0.1000   
136.05257071
0.00073501
1.9086   0.1837   
250.00000000
0.00073500
1.9107   0.0021   
2.87251898
0.00073001
2.6407   0.7300   
1000.00000000
0.00073000
2.8214   0.1807   
250.00000000
0.00072300

yikes, formatting is horrible, but all I see are 3 and 4 digit volumes

James

[mikesbmw]

beautiful

sold at 92-95k

bought back at 73-77k

Wow, what was up with that?!  
Someone either made a mistaken, wanted to get rid of coins NOW or trying to push things down a bit (which didn't work).

Unfortunately I had my buys around 83000... Could have gone lower. Oh well, at least I didn't loose anything.

[mikesbmw]

Not sure what you are seeing, here is the top of bittrex:


SUM (BTC)   TOTAL (BTC)   SIZE (BTCD)   BID (BTC)
0.3028   0.3028   
400.00000000
0.00075700
0.4916   0.1888   
250.00000000
0.00075502
0.5108   0.0192   
25.60848229
0.00075155
0.8748   0.3640   
485.36087952
0.00075005
1.6248   0.7500   
1000.00000000
0.00075000
1.7248   0.1000   
136.05257071
0.00073501
1.9086   0.1837   
250.00000000
0.00073500
1.9107   0.0021   
2.87251898
0.00073001
2.6407   0.7300   
1000.00000000
0.00073000
2.8214   0.1807   
250.00000000
0.00072300

yikes, formatting is horrible, but all I see are 3 and 4 digit volumes

James

At the moment I'm seeing 6 out of 10 asks below 50 BTCD. Perhaps people trade in those small amounts. Don't know.
But gaining 20-25% in one hour and than loosing it again in one hour? This is probably why I don't trade often with new coins... 

I mainly buy and hodl and buy some more.

[damiano]

beautiful

sold at 92-95k

bought back at 73-77k

Wow, what was up with that?!  
Someone either made a mistaken, wanted to get rid of coins NOW or trying to push things down a bit (which didn't work).

Unfortunately I had my buys around 83000... Could have gone lower. Oh well, at least I didn't loose anything.

my first bid was @80k when I saw that dump only to 81K and i figured i should lower it and I got lucky.

got all my coins back plus i have extra btc now laying around

[shrekster]

Pump is coming

[jl777]

Not sure what you are seeing, here is the top of bittrex:


SUM (BTC)   TOTAL (BTC)   SIZE (BTCD)   BID (BTC)
0.3028   0.3028   
400.00000000
0.00075700
0.4916   0.1888   
250.00000000
0.00075502
0.5108   0.0192   
25.60848229
0.00075155
0.8748   0.3640   
485.36087952
0.00075005
1.6248   0.7500   
1000.00000000
0.00075000
1.7248   0.1000   
136.05257071
0.00073501
1.9086   0.1837   
250.00000000
0.00073500
1.9107   0.0021   
2.87251898
0.00073001
2.6407   0.7300   
1000.00000000
0.00073000
2.8214   0.1807   
250.00000000
0.00072300

yikes, formatting is horrible, but all I see are 3 and 4 digit volumes

James

At the moment I'm seeing 6 out of 10 asks below 50 BTCD. Perhaps people trade in those small amounts. Don't know.
But gaining 20-25% in one hour and than loosing it again in one hour? This is probably why I don't trade often with new coins... 

I mainly buy and hodl and buy some more.

Oh, you are talking about the ask side. Well of course, only WH is selling below .001
And with so few coins, I am surprised to see the occasional 1000 BTCD lot for sale, very tempting for me, but I have enough now and I think better for more people to get a taste

James

P.S. I have yet to sell a single BTCD and dont expect to until we go above DOGE marketcap
Then I will sell some, maybe enough to buy a real Shiba doggie

[damiano]

Pump is coming

hmm maybe we will go back up, but i expect some further consolidation to occur around here first.

would be healthier to stay here for the time being then go up.

we are following the same path as darkcoin when they did there climb

[jl777]

For reference, I found a discussion between myself and AnonyMint. For those that know him, I dont need to tell you about AnonyMint. For those that dont, he is brutally honest, very smart and obsessive about anonymity. He worries about stuff like future Quantum Computers cracking all current day encryptions!

So, this thread gives some insight into where I was several months ago:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=470987.msg5581647#msg5581647

Now many of the design details have changed, some thanks to AnonyMint's feedback. As he says the key is being able to trust your privacyServer. Everything revolves around this, so for the truly paranoid, the solution is to setup your own privacyServer. If you cant trust yourself, then who can you trust?

I suggest that people that want to setup privacyServers for the public to use to start preparing now. People will want to know you, to be able to trust you as their privacyServer provider. I will make it so that privacyServer nodes get a percentage of the business that flows through them, eg. InstantDEX commissions. You will also earn nodecoins just for running a node. The privacyServers will eventually need Ddos protection, decent bandwidth, enough RAM. Not sure of the exact specs, but considering the hardware BTCD community put together to get 3 petahashes(!!), I dont see a big problem in getting enough privacyServers setup.

So, it will be a hub and spoke topology and we need to get more hubs than DRK has masternodes. However, just having nodes is not enough, we need to have each hub have at least 10 active users, otherwise attackers can use timing and knapsack analysis to deanonynimize.

I am envisioning the privacyServer providing many services, for example I already have a squid http/https proxy automatic install script. This allows you to get subscribers for http proxy service, which runs about $5 per month. Probably best to charge less to get more customers.

James

[damiano]

For reference, I found a discussion between myself and AnonyMint. For those that know him, I dont need to tell you about AnonyMint. For those that dont, he is brutally honest, very smart and obsessive about anonymity. He worries about stuff like future Quantum Computers cracking all current day encryptions!

So, this thread gives some insight into where I was several months ago:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=470987.msg5581647#msg5581647

Now many of the design details have changed, some thanks to AnonyMint's feedback. As he says the key is being able to trust your privacyServer. Everything revolves around this, so for the truly paranoid, the solution is to setup your own privacyServer. If you cant trust yourself, then who can you trust?

I suggest that people that want to setup privacyServers for the public to use to start preparing now. People will want to know you, to be able to trust you as their privacyServer provider. I will make it so that privacyServer nodes get a percentage of the business that flows through them, eg. InstantDEX commissions. You will also earn nodecoins just for running a node. The privacyServers will eventually need Ddos protection, decent bandwidth, enough RAM. Not sure of the exact specs, but considering the hardware BTCD community put together to get 3 petahashes(!!), I dont see a big problem in getting enough privacyServers setup.

So, it will be a hub and spoke topology and we need to get more hubs than DRK has masternodes. However, just having nodes is not enough, we need to have each hub have at least 10 active users, otherwise attackers can use timing and knapsack analysis to deanonynimize.

I am envisioning the privacyServer providing many services, for example I already have a squid http/https proxy automatic install script. This allows you to get subscribers for http proxy service, which runs about $5 per month. Probably best to charge less to get more customers.

James

I know who he is and of his rep
I hope you guys are working together  

I can't easily follow that description. What is a NXT mixer? Is it a mining peer who won the right to process the next transaction block?

You are explaining in terms of coding details. Can you make an algorithmic description instead?

You've impressed me enough that we should work together.

[BTCDDev]

Hi everyone,

For those of you who have been in the irc, I need no introduction. For the rest of you, I am BTCDDev, one of the core devs on this project along with jl777, Azeh, and Torrn. I will be posting here along with them updates, some technical and some not, as we go along. Just though I would introduce myself.

 

[BTCDDev]

For reference, I found a discussion between myself and AnonyMint. For those that know him, I dont need to tell you about AnonyMint. For those that dont, he is brutally honest, very smart and obsessive about anonymity. He worries about stuff like future Quantum Computers cracking all current day encryptions!

So, this thread gives some insight into where I was several months ago:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=470987.msg5581647#msg5581647

Now many of the design details have changed, some thanks to AnonyMint's feedback. As he says the key is being able to trust your privacyServer. Everything revolves around this, so for the truly paranoid, the solution is to setup your own privacyServer. If you cant trust yourself, then who can you trust?

I suggest that people that want to setup privacyServers for the public to use to start preparing now. People will want to know you, to be able to trust you as their privacyServer provider. I will make it so that privacyServer nodes get a percentage of the business that flows through them, eg. InstantDEX commissions. You will also earn nodecoins just for running a node. The privacyServers will eventually need Ddos protection, decent bandwidth, enough RAM. Not sure of the exact specs, but considering the hardware BTCD community put together to get 3 petahashes(!!), I dont see a big problem in getting enough privacyServers setup.

So, it will be a hub and spoke topology and we need to get more hubs than DRK has masternodes. However, just having nodes is not enough, we need to have each hub have at least 10 active users, otherwise attackers can use timing and knapsack analysis to deanonynimize.

I am envisioning the privacyServer providing many services, for example I already have a squid http/https proxy automatic install script. This allows you to get subscribers for http proxy service, which runs about $5 per month. Probably best to charge less to get more customers.

James

James, I will want to test/host a couple of privacyServers on a vps. Just let me know.

[jl777]

Just finished coding a basic onion routing support, the confusing part is that you can make requests locally, to the privacyServer or even via broadcast. I want to minimize redundant code so I funnel everything to a single process_packet function, so client, or server or broadcast or tcp or udp, all get processed in the same place.

Somehow it seems to be way too little code for what it does.

Anyway, time for some lunch and then debugging

Once the encrypted comms are stable in the new setup (I had a hardcoded client/server test working), then all but the initial handshake will be encrypted with a session specific public/private key using Daniel Bernsteins nacl library: http://nacl.cr.yp.to/index.html

I use the NXT token generation to sign every packet and it is even timestamped so even if somehow it gets intercepted and decoded, it can't be used in a replay attack.

Its really not anything very spectacular to just send messages back and forth, but this is the foundation on which all the rest of the code will use. Being able to say "send this message to that account" and having it magically get there and being totally encrypted is a very useful foundation.

Sorry it is taking so long, but this is critical code and any loose end could allow attacker to deanonymize, so I have to go slow and careful.

James

[TamRob]

Thanks for the updates James, keep up the good work bud.