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Author Topic: Idea: Snap & Send Picture of Cheque; Recieve Bitcoins After Cheque Confirms  (Read 2904 times)
Jon
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March 14, 2012, 07:16:18 AM
 #1

Assumptions:

Bank cheques are not reversible;

A picture of a cheque can be validated within an hour of being sent;

Cheque fraud can be easily mitigated in high-risk situations;

If the above assumptions are met, would it not be viable to have a smartphone/web application take pictures of client's bank cheques, validate and deposit the respective money into an account, then in turn send Bitcoins to the paying client?

The Communists say, equal labour entitles man to equal enjoyment. No, equal labour does not entitle you to it, but equal enjoyment alone entitles you to equal enjoyment. Enjoy, then you are entitled to enjoyment. But, if you have laboured and let the enjoyment be taken from you, then – ‘it serves you right.’ If you take the enjoyment, it is your right.
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March 14, 2012, 07:30:14 AM
 #2

Unfortunately I think pretty much any transaction that a bank does is reversible.

In regards to cheques are you referring to personal/company or "bank cheques" (as certainly in Australia they are treated very differently)?


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Ian.


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Jon
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March 14, 2012, 07:33:15 AM
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Unfortunately I think pretty much any transaction that a bank does is reversible.

In regards to cheques are you referring to personal/company or "bank cheques" (as certainly in Australia they are treated very differently)?


Cheers,

Ian.




The Communists say, equal labour entitles man to equal enjoyment. No, equal labour does not entitle you to it, but equal enjoyment alone entitles you to equal enjoyment. Enjoy, then you are entitled to enjoyment. But, if you have laboured and let the enjoyment be taken from you, then – ‘it serves you right.’ If you take the enjoyment, it is your right.
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March 14, 2012, 07:34:48 AM
 #4

Unfortunately I think pretty much any transaction that a bank does is reversible.

In regards to cheques are you referring to personal/company or "bank cheques" (as certainly in Australia they are treated very differently)?


Cheers,

Ian.



He's talking about personal checks backed by private account funds and disputable, not the ones that are backed by bank funds that are the same as money orders.

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March 14, 2012, 07:39:40 AM
 #5

Not actually clear about what type of cheques now (was assuming the OP's quote of my post unchanged meant my question was wrong therefore he was talking about "bank cheques").

Personal/company cheques take days to clear so obviously they are of no use.

Even with bank cheques I'm pretty sure that (at least in Australia) it would require physical inspection (not a scanned picture).

With CIYAM anyone can create 100% generated C++ web applications in literally minutes.

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Jon
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March 14, 2012, 07:40:44 AM
 #6

Interesting article:

http://www.bankrate.com/finance/checking/bank-not-responsible-in-check-dispute.aspx

It seems cheques aren't disputable without proper law enforcement.

The Communists say, equal labour entitles man to equal enjoyment. No, equal labour does not entitle you to it, but equal enjoyment alone entitles you to equal enjoyment. Enjoy, then you are entitled to enjoyment. But, if you have laboured and let the enjoyment be taken from you, then – ‘it serves you right.’ If you take the enjoyment, it is your right.
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March 14, 2012, 07:44:07 AM
 #7

Not actually clear about what type of cheques now (was assuming the OP's quote of my post unchanged meant my question was wrong therefore he was talking about "bank cheques").

Personal/company cheques take days to clear so obviously they are of no use.

Even with bank cheques I'm pretty sure that (at least in Australia) it would require physical inspection (not a scanned picture).


Walmart can clear checks instantly, along with some banks. The technology exists -- at least in the US.

The Communists say, equal labour entitles man to equal enjoyment. No, equal labour does not entitle you to it, but equal enjoyment alone entitles you to equal enjoyment. Enjoy, then you are entitled to enjoyment. But, if you have laboured and let the enjoyment be taken from you, then – ‘it serves you right.’ If you take the enjoyment, it is your right.
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March 14, 2012, 07:47:28 AM
 #8

Walmart can clear checks instantly, along with some banks. The technology exists -- at least in the US.

Interesting (pretty sure that don't happen down under) - I was reading an Australian article discussing about cash being used less and less and that cheques are most likely to become scrapped in a matter of years.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2012-03-13/australians-shunning-cash-for-cards/3885930

tl;dr "We know for instance that cheques are on a decline, there's about eight years left in the cheque system... and then we probably won't use cheques, we'll have to find other forms of payment," he said.

With CIYAM anyone can create 100% generated C++ web applications in literally minutes.

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March 14, 2012, 08:04:21 AM
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Walmart can clear checks instantly, along with some banks. The technology exists -- at least in the US.

Interesting (pretty sure that don't happen down under) - I was reading an Australian article discussing about cash being used less and less and that cheques are most likely to become scrapped in a matter of years.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2012-03-13/australians-shunning-cash-for-cards/3885930

tl;dr "We know for instance that cheques are on a decline, there's about eight years left in the cheque system... and then we probably won't use cheques, we'll have to find other forms of payment," he said.


Chase Bank is on the leading edge of these types of solutions and yes, here in the US you can take a picture and e-mail/text it to Chase bank and they will deposit it.  I believe what is happening (not an expert) is that the transaction is being converted into an EFT (electronic funds transfer) or ACH (automatic clearing house?) so as long as you have an account number and routing number you can request info and send it.

I think this could be a cool service for a bitcoin bank (plug in Flexcoin Wink ) to offer.  The question really becomes how do we get the USD (or other currency) into bitcoins?  Are there fees?  Do we need to go to mtgox.com to convert? 

If Flexcoin offers an exchange service for customers as well, then the fees associated with this could be mitigated. 

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March 14, 2012, 08:09:06 AM
 #10

If it is ACH then as I understand it would most definitely be reversible (that was the whole Dwolla problem wasn't it?).

Certainly in Australia even an EFT can be reversed (although not so simple if between different banks as I found out the hard way with WBX and ANZ).

With CIYAM anyone can create 100% generated C++ web applications in literally minutes.

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Jon
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March 14, 2012, 08:10:52 AM
 #11

At this point, I've had it with the current banking system.

Let's just pay everybody in Bitcoins and get this over with.

The Communists say, equal labour entitles man to equal enjoyment. No, equal labour does not entitle you to it, but equal enjoyment alone entitles you to equal enjoyment. Enjoy, then you are entitled to enjoyment. But, if you have laboured and let the enjoyment be taken from you, then – ‘it serves you right.’ If you take the enjoyment, it is your right.
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March 14, 2012, 08:12:56 AM
 #12

Now that sounds more like it.  Grin

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March 14, 2012, 08:57:08 AM
 #13

You could have your checks reversed up to 2 billing cycles later I believe.
All it takes is for someone to say "my checkbook was stolen" or a few other things.

With cashier's checks and money orders you can still get slammed:
1) someone fakes a cashier's check or money order
2) you take it to your bank, they look at, accept it as legit and deposit the funds in your account
3) you send the BTC
4) a few days later your bank realizes it's fake
5) your bank debits your account equal to the check or money order
6) you eat the loss and curse the current financial system

There are services that accept checks and cash you out after a few days / a week or what.
They charge a fee and if they realize you're getting slammed with fraud will either charge more or cut you off most likely.

At this point, I've had it with the current banking system.

Let's just pay everybody in Bitcoins and get this over with.

Yep and trade cash for Bitcoins in person. That would do it.


-Jered

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March 14, 2012, 02:44:55 PM
 #14

Chase Bank is on the leading edge of these types of solutions and yes, here in the US you can take a picture and e-mail/text it to Chase bank and they will deposit it.

I believe that Chase requires both sides of the check to be scanned, so the payee has to endorse it.  This means the payee would have to have physical possession of the check (through mail or meetup) before Chase can deposit it.

Quote
All items presented for deposit utilizing the Chase Quick
Deposit service should be endorsed, either manually or
using virtual endorsement.  After you are prompted, place
the checks you wish to deposit into the scanner document
feeder. Your scanner will begin scanning checks automatically.

Important: Some small financial institutions may also require
a physical signature of the payee in addition to the virtual
endorsement.

- https://www.chase.com/ccpmweb/shared/document/QuickDepositScannerInstallGuide.pdf
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March 14, 2012, 03:29:27 PM
 #15

At this point, I've had it with the current banking system.

Let's just pay everybody in Bitcoins and get this over with.

Right?!? Who knew it'd take so much work to replace the global financial system Smiley 
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