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Author Topic: What happens when the coins dry up?  (Read 7099 times)
cunicula
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April 28, 2012, 02:24:31 PM
 #41

Scenario when a monopoly forms in a proof-of-stake network:
  • Large mining pools merge or a monster miner emerges.
  • The possibility of potential terrorist organizations take control of Bitcoin
  • Enemies of the monopolist are targetted for reversals.
  • Double-spend attacks are attempted.
  • Stakes have no geographical location and can use rented servers, they cannot be shut down by any authority.
Solution A:Since the government regulators would be managing an unknown group that can be communicating covertly. This would be very difficult and expensive. It would require a central governmental clearinghouse of approved addresses for any business accepting Bitcoin, identification, and transaction approval of all commerce to prevent terrorists from controlling the network. Bitcoin is more likely to be outlawed. Either way Bitcoin fails.
Solution B: Fork the blockchain. Bitcoin fails.

Scenario when a monopoly forms in a proof-of-work network:
  • Large mining pools merge or a monster miner emerges.
  • The possibility of potential terrorist organizations take control of Bitcoin
  • Enemies of the monopolist are targetted for reversals.
  • Double-spend attacks are attempted.
Solution: Find allies to bring reserve mining power online before this attack has 6 confirmations and reject those attacks. Government miner stockpiles are brought online and thwart the attack. These stockpiles cost very little to maintain because they don't require electricity until they go online. These can even be patriot volunteer organizations. The attackers are identified by their IP addresses and shut down. Bitcoin survives.

These are simply two different philosophies about how to operate a cryptocurrency. Trusting in a monopoly is hardly a disrupting enterprise. While monopolies can be efficient, historically they require government regulation to prevent corruption. In a PoS model, the government regulators would be managing an unknown group that can be communicating covertly. This would be very difficult and expensive.

Lol! What?

Can someone translate for me? I don't speak idiot.

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cbeast
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April 28, 2012, 03:03:55 PM
 #42

Scenario when a monopoly forms in a proof-of-stake network:
  • Large mining pools merge or a monster miner emerges.
  • The possibility of potential terrorist organizations take control of Bitcoin
  • Enemies of the monopolist are targetted for reversals.
  • Double-spend attacks are attempted.
  • Stakes have no geographical location and can use rented servers, they cannot be shut down by any authority.
Solution A:Since the government regulators would be managing an unknown group that can be communicating covertly. This would be very difficult and expensive. It would require a central governmental clearinghouse of approved addresses for any business accepting Bitcoin, identification, and transaction approval of all commerce to prevent terrorists from controlling the network. Bitcoin is more likely to be outlawed. Either way Bitcoin fails.
Solution B: Fork the blockchain. Bitcoin fails.

Scenario when a monopoly forms in a proof-of-work network:
  • Large mining pools merge or a monster miner emerges.
  • The possibility of potential terrorist organizations take control of Bitcoin
  • Enemies of the monopolist are targetted for reversals.
  • Double-spend attacks are attempted.
Solution: Find allies to bring reserve mining power online before this attack has 6 confirmations and reject those attacks. Government miner stockpiles are brought online and thwart the attack. These stockpiles cost very little to maintain because they don't require electricity until they go online. These can even be patriot volunteer organizations. The attackers are identified by their IP addresses and shut down. Bitcoin survives.

These are simply two different philosophies about how to operate a cryptocurrency. Trusting in a monopoly is hardly a disrupting enterprise. While monopolies can be efficient, historically they require government regulation to prevent corruption. In a PoS model, the government regulators would be managing an unknown group that can be communicating covertly. This would be very difficult and expensive.

Lol! What?

Can someone translate for me? I don't speak idiot.
Come up with another solution and then watch me tear it to shreds.
IT MEANS YOU GOT NOTHING! LOL WTFSTFU
or maybe you are a terrorist.
or maybe you want Bitcoin to fail.
or maybe English is not your first language.

Any significantly advanced cryptocurrency is indistinguishable from Ponzi Tulips.
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April 28, 2012, 05:37:15 PM
 #43

IT MEANS YOU GOT NOTHING! LOL WTFSTFU
or maybe you are a terrorist.
or maybe you want Bitcoin to fail.
or maybe English is not your first language.
Haven't you figured it out yet? The bolded item is the correct answer.

Mining Rig Extraordinaire - the Trenton BPX6806 18-slot PCIe backplane [PICS] Dead project is dead, all hail the coming of the mighty ASIC!
cbeast
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Let's talk governance, lipstick, and pigs.


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April 28, 2012, 07:42:30 PM
 #44

IT MEANS YOU GOT NOTHING! LOL WTFSTFU
or maybe you are a terrorist.
or maybe you want Bitcoin to fail.
or maybe English is not your first language.
Haven't you figured it out yet? The bolded item is the correct answer.
I just don't understand why he won't admit that the idea of PoS is a PoS. If he really cared about Bitcoin, he would throw out the bad parts, keep the good ones, and offer a better idea. I actually think he is sort of on the right track, but instead of using an acquired stake (which can be stolen), use a proof that you earned those Bitcoin by processing transactions, and that fact weighs even more than hashrate or the stake itself. I just don't know how you would do that.

Any significantly advanced cryptocurrency is indistinguishable from Ponzi Tulips.
Meni Rosenfeld
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April 29, 2012, 04:57:20 AM
 #45

I just don't understand why he won't admit that the idea of PoS is a PoS.
Because it's not. Getting a majority of the bitcoins is much harder than getting a majority of the hashrate, meaning that increasing the reliance on the former improves security.

Also, it looks like the PoS detractors haven't taken the time to study how the proposals for PoS actually work. In particular the proposals aim for combining PoS and PoW.

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