Email from Dwolla Regarding Reversals

[triplehelix]

so you have to wait 30 days from first depositing money into dwolla before you can send it to mtgox now?

[Stephen Gornick]

so you have to wait 30 days from first depositing money into dwolla before you can send it to mtgox now?

That's what it sounds like.

[moocow1452]

Ironically, this will make Bitcoin world MORE anonymous, as more US people will now use the anonymous cash deposits at banks via BitInstant instead of Dwolla (it was already much faster... now it's more far more private as well).

That's not ironic. Dwolla is covering it's own ass and doesn't give a rip about how Bitcoin will run with or without it. I would give them my life story if it meant that I could get stuff from here to there faster, but the 30 day thing kills it for me.

[notme]

Now selling Dwolla to mtgox service for 0.50 cents.  Just send funds to https://www.dwolla.com/hub/812-665-7282 with the MTGOX comment that MtGox uses to identify your account.  I will keep a quarter and send it on to MtGox with the comment intact.  I'll probably get my account marked for these requirements before long, and I'll be doing it manually so there will be a delay while I sleep and when I'm AFK, but I can process them within 12 hours from now until Friday, April 20th (I'll be travelling Saturday) or until I get marked.  Of course, there's a chance I'm already marked for having transacted with MtGox, so I would appreciate it if someone who's account doesn't meet the requirements could check and let me know.

Edit: Don't send funds, Dwolla suspended my account.

[coinuser4000]

Facebook thing and 30 day wait won't really prevent fraud. Afterall most crimebots record every keystroke and login so the potential fraudster would already have all Dwolla/FB/everything and can just buy the SSN# from a lookup service.

Bitinstant should crowdsource trusted people to do cash in hand trades in every city and pay an affiliate fee or something No more banks or dwolla middlemen. Sort of a giant hawalla network

I would happily participate in such a thing. I wonder how you'd go about vetting so many people though...

[Stephen Gornick]

Now selling Dwolla to mtgox service for 0.50 cents.

Heh, you beat me to my post by a few seconds.

Just like there are trusted parties on #bitcoin-otc trading PPUSD for MTGUSD amongst each other without any hassle from PayPal there can be those who aren't marked by Dwolla as being under this restriction who would trade Dwolla USD for MTGUSD -- often at 1:1 or near to it (as your offer was).
 - http://webchat.freenode.net/?channels=#bitcoin-otc-foyer
 - http://bitcoin-otc.com/trust.php

[notme]

Now selling Dwolla to mtgox service for 0.50 cents.

Heh, you beat me to my post by a few seconds.

Just like there are trusted parties on #bitcoin-otc trading PPUSD for MTGUSD amongst each other without any hassle from PayPal there can be those who aren't marked by Dwolla as being under this restriction who would trade Dwolla USD for MTGUSD -- often at 1:1 or near to it (as your offer was).
 - http://webchat.freenode.net/?channels=#bitcoin-otc-foyer
 - http://bitcoin-otc.com/trust.php

I really need to get back on there.  I lost my private key for my nick a while back, so I'll have to start over.

[coinuser4000]

Got this in my inbox.

I think this is a good idea, thoughts?

Hello,
As a merchant in the Dwolla community, we appreciate your shared interest in maintaining a safe and responsible payment network.
We'd like to let you know about a few changes we are rolling out shortly to merchants effected by bank level reversals, caused by identity theft and fraud.

Starting today, users sending money to your account will need to meet and/or maintain:

1) Connect a social network
2) Have a bank deposit 30 days old
3) Enable a DWOLLA hub page
4) Have a verified account
(i.e. Social Security and/or Photo Verified)

We are working hard to make sure this policy does not affect your most frequent, loyal, and responsible customers.

Thanks for being a part of Dwolla. We hope our new changes will protect customers and merchants alike. Please let us know if you have any questions.

All the best,
Dwolla

Someone please explain to me how having a Facebook account makes a person less likely to be committing fraud?

Also, am I the only one who thinks it's creepy to require someone to participate a third party social networking site before they can access a banking service? Why do they need to see pictures of your kids to validate your account? Banks don't even ask for this.

I've said it before and I'll say it again, making more rules doesn't prevent fraud, it just infringes on the rights and privacy of ordinary people. Criminals always find a way around no matter what hoops you make people jump through...

[Yankee (BitInstant)]

Facebook thing and 30 day wait won't really prevent fraud. Afterall most crimebots record every keystroke and login so the potential fraudster would already have all Dwolla/FB/everything and can just buy the SSN# from a lookup service.

Bitinstant should crowdsource trusted people to do cash in hand trades in every city and pay an affiliate fee or something No more banks or dwolla middlemen. Sort of a giant hawalla network

I would happily participate in such a thing. I wonder how you'd go about vetting so many people though...

Thats a good idea actually.....

[deepceleron]

Funny now, considering how the thread I created here where I posted links to a Dwolla employee's Facebook and the information gleaned from there got deleted by mods (the same employee that called me on my home phone telling my my funds were locked and wanted photo ID in color). Maybe if they had some more pushback after holding people's money for ransom  (with no policy detailing what they were going to do with personal data) we wouldn't be here now...

We basically have another layer removed that further reveals these are inept midwest college students who started this "service" without the slightest idea about how banking works.

[Etlase2]

Now selling Dwolla to mtgox service for 0.50 cents.  Just send funds to https://www.dwolla.com/hub/812-665-7282 with the MTGOX comment that MtGox uses to identify your account.  I will keep a quarter and send it on to MtGox with the comment intact.  I'll probably get my account marked for these requirements before long, and I'll be doing it manually so there will be a delay while I sleep and when I'm AFK, but I can process them within 12 hours from now until Friday, April 20th (I'll be travelling Saturday) or until I get marked.  Of course, there's a chance I'm already marked for having transacted with MtGox, so I would appreciate it if someone who's account doesn't meet the requirements could check and let me know.

This is probably a terrible idea to do for anyone that you don't trust, and you can't trust people because they have posts on a messageboard. I wouldn't be surprised if you get caught in the middle of this and end up holding the bag for some of this money. Slippery slope, imo.

[stochastic]

Got this in my inbox.

I think this is a good idea, thoughts?

Hello,
As a merchant in the Dwolla community, we appreciate your shared interest in maintaining a safe and responsible payment network.
We'd like to let you know about a few changes we are rolling out shortly to merchants effected by bank level reversals, caused by identity theft and fraud.

Starting today, users sending money to your account will need to meet and/or maintain:

1) Connect a social network
2) Have a bank deposit 30 days old
3) Enable a DWOLLA hub page
4) Have a verified account
(i.e. Social Security and/or Photo Verified)

We are working hard to make sure this policy does not affect your most frequent, loyal, and responsible customers.

Thanks for being a part of Dwolla. We hope our new changes will protect customers and merchants alike. Please let us know if you have any questions.

All the best,
Dwolla

Someone please explain to me how having a Facebook account makes a person less likely to be committing fraud?

Also, am I the only one who thinks it's creepy to require someone to participate a third party social networking site before they can access a banking service? Why do they need to see pictures of your kids to validate your account? Banks don't even ask for this.

I've said it before and I'll say it again, making more rules doesn't prevent fraud, it just infringes on the rights and privacy of ordinary people. Criminals always find a way around no matter what hoops you make people jump through...

The facebook/social network is just a marketing thing.  They want to have access and see who you connect to so to get more customers.  If you link to a fake one they won't know any difference.

[tarrant_01]

Facebook thing and 30 day wait won't really prevent fraud. Afterall most crimebots record every keystroke and login so the potential fraudster would already have all Dwolla/FB/everything and can just buy the SSN# from a lookup service.

Bitinstant should crowdsource trusted people to do cash in hand trades in every city and pay an affiliate fee or something No more banks or dwolla middlemen. Sort of a giant hawalla network

I would happily participate in such a thing. I wonder how you'd go about vetting so many people though...

Thats a good idea actually.....

I would be intersted if a secure method was established for doing exchanges.

[DeathAndTaxes]

The facebook/social network is just a marketing thing.  They want to have access and see who you connect to so to get more customers.  If you link to a fake one they won't know any difference.

Which I have no problem with companies using social media to gain competitve advantage.  What is disgusting is linking that "advertising" requirement to account verification.

Had they launch a separate imitative where liking them on facebook and installing the Dwolla app (which links your Dwolla # to your facebook identity to make it easier for facebook users to send money to each other) got you 10 "free transfers" that would be a smart action by a reputable company.

The integration into "fraud prevention" is just disgusting and shows the kind of culture that exists at Dwolla Inc.

[rjk]

Facebook thing and 30 day wait won't really prevent fraud. Afterall most crimebots record every keystroke and login so the potential fraudster would already have all Dwolla/FB/everything and can just buy the SSN# from a lookup service.

Bitinstant should crowdsource trusted people to do cash in hand trades in every city and pay an affiliate fee or something No more banks or dwolla middlemen. Sort of a giant hawalla network

I would happily participate in such a thing. I wonder how you'd go about vetting so many people though...

Thats a good idea actually.....

Why couldn't something like this be integrated into StartSSL's WoT? If you screw up big time, all your certificates get revoked.

[RodeoX]

Someone please explain to me how having a Facebook account makes a person less likely to be committing fraud?

Who says it does. Maybe they just want your FB info for marketing? I bet if I had your social connections I could identify several hot leads. 

[notme]

Someone please explain to me how having a Facebook account makes a person less likely to be committing fraud?

Who says it does. Maybe they just want your FB info for marketing? I bet if I had your social connections I could identify several hot leads. 

Scam accounts are friends with scam accounts.  When you connect to fb, they pull all your friends in.

[RaggedMonk]

Which I have no problem with companies using social media to gain competitve advantage.  What is disgusting is linking that "advertising" requirement to account verification.

Had they launch a separate imitative where liking them on facebook and installing the Dwolla app (which links your Dwolla # to your facebook identity to make it easier for facebook users to send money to each other) got you 10 "free transfers" that would be a smart action by a reputable company.

The integration into "fraud prevention" is just disgusting and shows the kind of culture that exists at Dwolla Inc.

+1

[phillipsjk]

Someone please explain to me how having a Facebook account makes a person less likely to be committing fraud?

Who says it does. Maybe they just want your FB info for marketing? I bet if I had your social connections I could identify several hot leads. 

The Article linked by Stephen Gornick. Social networks are now being used for credit checks.

[notme]

Now selling Dwolla to mtgox service for 0.50 cents.  Just send funds to https://www.dwolla.com/hub/812-665-7282 with the MTGOX comment that MtGox uses to identify your account.  I will keep a quarter and send it on to MtGox with the comment intact.  I'll probably get my account marked for these requirements before long, and I'll be doing it manually so there will be a delay while I sleep and when I'm AFK, but I can process them within 12 hours from now until Friday, April 20th (I'll be travelling Saturday) or until I get marked.  Of course, there's a chance I'm already marked for having transacted with MtGox, so I would appreciate it if someone who's account doesn't meet the requirements could check and let me know.

Dwolla account ID # 812-665-7282 has been suspended.

Oh well.  At least my account was empty.