[2014-09-06] For KnCMiner, Time to Forget Selling Bitcoin Machines To At-Home ‘M

[ganabb]

http://blogs.wsj.com/venturecapital/2014/09/05/for-kncminer-time-to-forget-selling-bitcoin-machines-to-at-home-miners/

Back in June 2013, eons ago in the fast-changing sector of bitcoin, KnCMiner launched with an offer to sell semiconductor equipment that would allow buyers to generate bitcoin.

“We took in $6 million on the first four days that we were open last year,” said Sam Cole, KnCMiner’s chief executive and co-founder, of the pre-orders people placed.

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[CoinMode]

"There, [KnCMiner] generates bitcoin for itself, as revenue, and also has started leasing power to customers. Customers can come to its website and pay a fee to get a certain amount of compute power for a duration of time." - WSJ.com

All of the decentralization that KnC was promising our community by sending out units to thousands of international clients is going to dissappear entirely. They were originally a massive help to the principles of cryptocurrency. Now they are going to become a massive hinderance, just like GHASH.io mining pool. Both will dissappear into the shadows.

This is just depressing that so many of the largest players in the crypto world keep betraying their customer base, but it does leave a lot of space for newcomers to steal their lunch.

[IYFTech]

Or just to steal........

[notthematrix]

"There, [KnCMiner] generates bitcoin for itself, as revenue, and also has started leasing power to customers. Customers can come to its website and pay a fee to get a certain amount of compute power for a duration of time." - WSJ.com

All of the decentralization that KnC was promising our community by sending out units to thousands of international clients is going to dissappear entirely. They were originally a massive help to the principles of cryptocurrency. Now they are going to become a massive hinderance, just like GHASH.io mining pool. Both will dissappear into the shadows.

This is just depressing that so many of the largest players in the crypto world keep betraying their customer base, but it does leave a lot of space for newcomers to steal their lunch.

What do you expect them to do?
Ignorance is a bliss isnt it?

Knowing some poeple running miners from them , they had some problems in the beginning.
but the failing parts were replaced by them for free over UPS!
1 Miner runs over 2000 watts on 230 volts EU power.
that's over 16 amperes in the US!
most home's simply don't have such power on the main fuse!
So the only way to get your miner running in the US is by adding 220V (hi power) to your home grid.
This is not standard.
but to get your 3.5 Terrahash this is needed.
Bitcoin is more decentral then banks ever were and yes there will be big miners , and yes it will be more centralized , but instead of wining you could in fact invest in a miner and get your wireing done to run one and support the network!
If you want to run 10 you need a greenhouse grade connection to your power supplier!
you need a 120 amp fuse instead of the standard 25 amp you get in europe!
So its very good they focus on company's  instead of home users.
Complaining about that is useless and bullshit.

[fryarminer]

KnCMiner has built a vast data center, which consumes 30 megawatts of power, in northern Sweden, in the Arctic Circle.

So global warming was a true prophecy!!!

[fryarminer]

I just did the math on their cloud mining. There's no way you would make your money back in the 6 month time that they sell the contract for.

[CoinMode]

"There, [KnCMiner] generates bitcoin for itself, as revenue, and also has started leasing power to customers. Customers can come to its website and pay a fee to get a certain amount of compute power for a duration of time." - WSJ.com

All of the decentralization that KnC was promising our community by sending out units to thousands of international clients is going to dissappear entirely. They were originally a massive help to the principles of cryptocurrency. Now they are going to become a massive hinderance, just like GHASH.io mining pool. Both will dissappear into the shadows.

This is just depressing that so many of the largest players in the crypto world keep betraying their customer base, but it does leave a lot of space for newcomers to steal their lunch.

What do you expect them to do?

This has absolutely nothing to do with people not having enough electricity to run a miner. Nowhere in the article, or anywhere in the universe, did KnCMiner say that household power issues were one of their main reasons for discontinuing hardware sales.

Customers were upset because of delayed shipments and broken promises on shipping times. Also, some of the miners had already been used for an extended period of time before being shipped. You obviously did not read the article and then attacked me with that electric straw man. I'd take the time to point out how the average household in the USA can easily power a 2TH miner, but your weak straw man isn't worth beating.

As another poster said, KnCMiner has been blocking their customers from making money on bitcoin mining. They have done this by delaying the shipments to customers in order to use the mining equipment in their own cloud. No profit can be made from buying their cloud hashing time either. Theft is happening on both ends of the business for KnCMiner, and unless they correct their modis operandi sometime very soon, they will not exist for very much longer.

[notthematrix]

This has absolutely nothing to do with people not having enough electricity to run a miner. Nowhere in the article, or anywhere in the universe, did KnCMiner say that household power issues were one of their main reasons for discontinuing hardware sales.

Customers were upset because of delayed shipments and broken promises on shipping times. Also, some of the miners had already been used for an extended period of time before being shipped. You obviously did not read the article and then attacked me with that electric straw man. I'd take the time to point out how the average household in the USA can easily power a 2TH miner, but your weak straw man isn't worth beating.

As another poster said, KnCMiner has been blocking their customers from making money on bitcoin mining. They have done this by delaying the shipments to customers in order to use the mining equipment in their own cloud. No profit can be made from buying their cloud hashing time either. Theft is happening on both ends of the business for KnCMiner, and unless they correct their modis operandi sometime very soon, they will not exist for very much longer.

Did you ever talked to them directly? , or are you just reading the media?
here they offer miners https://www.kncminer.com/categories/miners


    Minimum 3000GH/s of hashing speed, that's 3TH/s - over 5 times the speed of our first Jupiter release.
    Delivering 30% reduction in watts per GH.
    Most full stock Neptunes deliver around 3.3-3.5 TH/s on average over a 48 hour period, while consuming around 1950 watts at the wall (we guarantee 3+TH/s).
    Users of Neptune are reporting an average of 0.57 watts per GH/s with stock PSU:s. With specialized setups that number can be lowered ever further, some customers report figures around 0.4 watts per GH/s.
    Delivered as a modular design. Each Neptune consists of 5 chip boxes + 1 controller card box.
    Includes LCD-display on controller card, displaying current hashing speed and IP adress.
    Bitcoin's first ever 20nm miner brought to you from the company who shipped the first 28nm bitcoin miner.
    Payment for this product is bitcoins and bank transfer only.
    This purchase is non-refundable  $ 5,995.00

so what do you realy know about KNC?
or did you just got some articles , and no own experiance at all?
My experience is yes the bring things out later , but deliver!
any clue how hard it is to develop a device from scratch?
My guess this article does not say any thing accept that KNC expects that miner hardware will be to hard to configure etc for normal households.... they dont say anything about nit wanting to sell hardware.

[CoinMode]

This has absolutely nothing to do with people not having enough electricity to run a miner. Nowhere in the article, or anywhere in the universe, did KnCMiner say that household power issues were one of their main reasons for discontinuing hardware sales.

Customers were upset because of delayed shipments and broken promises on shipping times. Also, some of the miners had already been used for an extended period of time before being shipped. You obviously did not read the article and then attacked me with that electric straw man. I'd take the time to point out how the average household in the USA can easily power a 2TH miner, but your weak straw man isn't worth beating.

As another poster said, KnCMiner has been blocking their customers from making money on bitcoin mining. They have done this by delaying the shipments to customers in order to use the mining equipment in their own cloud. No profit can be made from buying their cloud hashing time either. Theft is happening on both ends of the business for KnCMiner, and unless they correct their modis operandi sometime very soon, they will not exist for very much longer.

Did you ever talked to them directly? , or are you just reading the media?
here they offer miners https://www.kncminer.com/categories/miners


    Minimum 3000GH/s of hashing speed, that's 3TH/s - over 5 times the speed of our first Jupiter release.
    Delivering 30% reduction in watts per GH.
    Most full stock Neptunes deliver around 3.3-3.5 TH/s on average over a 48 hour period, while consuming around 1950 watts at the wall (we guarantee 3+TH/s).
    Users of Neptune are reporting an average of 0.57 watts per GH/s with stock PSU:s. With specialized setups that number can be lowered ever further, some customers report figures around 0.4 watts per GH/s.
    Delivered as a modular design. Each Neptune consists of 5 chip boxes + 1 controller card box.
    Includes LCD-display on controller card, displaying current hashing speed and IP adress.
    Bitcoin's first ever 20nm miner brought to you from the company who shipped the first 28nm bitcoin miner.
    Payment for this product is bitcoins and bank transfer only.
    This purchase is non-refundable  $ 5,995.00

so what do you realy know about KNC?
or did you just got some articles , and no own experiance at all?
My experience is yes the bring things out later , but deliver!
any clue how hard it is to develop a device from scratch?
My guess this article does not say any thing accept that KNC expects that miner hardware will be to hard to configure etc for normal households.... they dont say anything about nit wanting to sell hardware.

The article says that KnCMiner is planning to stop selling products. I think you have trouble understanding the article. I have summed it up perfectly multiple times and will no longer be entertaining your ignorance on this issue. Here are the first three lines of the article that you clearly did not read.

"Money came easily to startup KnCMiner, which says it made $70 million in revenue in its first year of operations from selling bitcoin mining equipment.

But not everything was rosy in its business, as many customers were dissatisfied with the long waits for its equipment and are demanding refunds. Now, with $14 million in venture capital backing, the company is getting out of selling bitcoin mining machines entirely." - WSJ online

I cannot fathom how you misunderstood the first three lines of the article.

[notthematrix]

This has absolutely nothing to do with people not having enough electricity to run a miner. Nowhere in the article, or anywhere in the universe, did KnCMiner say that household power issues were one of their main reasons for discontinuing hardware sales.

Customers were upset because of delayed shipments and broken promises on shipping times. Also, some of the miners had already been used for an extended period of time before being shipped. You obviously did not read the article and then attacked me with that electric straw man. I'd take the time to point out how the average household in the USA can easily power a 2TH miner, but your weak straw man isn't worth beating.

As another poster said, KnCMiner has been blocking their customers from making money on bitcoin mining. They have done this by delaying the shipments to customers in order to use the mining equipment in their own cloud. No profit can be made from buying their cloud hashing time either. Theft is happening on both ends of the business for KnCMiner, and unless they correct their modis operandi sometime very soon, they will not exist for very much longer.

Did you ever talked to them directly? , or are you just reading the media?
here they offer miners https://www.kncminer.com/categories/miners


    Minimum 3000GH/s of hashing speed, that's 3TH/s - over 5 times the speed of our first Jupiter release.
    Delivering 30% reduction in watts per GH.
    Most full stock Neptunes deliver around 3.3-3.5 TH/s on average over a 48 hour period, while consuming around 1950 watts at the wall (we guarantee 3+TH/s).
    Users of Neptune are reporting an average of 0.57 watts per GH/s with stock PSU:s. With specialized setups that number can be lowered ever further, some customers report figures around 0.4 watts per GH/s.
    Delivered as a modular design. Each Neptune consists of 5 chip boxes + 1 controller card box.
    Includes LCD-display on controller card, displaying current hashing speed and IP adress.
    Bitcoin's first ever 20nm miner brought to you from the company who shipped the first 28nm bitcoin miner.
    Payment for this product is bitcoins and bank transfer only.
    This purchase is non-refundable  $ 5,995.00

so what do you realy know about KNC?
or did you just got some articles , and no own experiance at all?
My experience is yes the bring things out later , but deliver!
any clue how hard it is to develop a device from scratch?
My guess this article does not say any thing accept that KNC expects that miner hardware will be to hard to configure etc for normal households.... they dont say anything about nit wanting to sell hardware.

The article says that KnCMiner is planning to stop selling products. I think you have trouble understanding the article. I have summed it up perfectly multiple times and will no longer be entertaining your ignorance on this issue. Here are the first three lines of the article that you clearly did not read.

"Money came easily to startup KnCMiner, which says it made $70 million in revenue in its first year of operations from selling bitcoin mining equipment.

But not everything was rosy in its business, as many customers were dissatisfied with the long waits for its equipment and are demanding refunds. Now, with $14 million in venture capital backing, the company is getting out of selling bitcoin mining machines entirely." - WSJ online

I cannot fathom how you misunderstood the first three lines of the article.

The more people mine bitcoin, the harder it is to generate. That means that people need ever faster and more powerful machines. The machines that would be reasonable to sell to customers now would require more power than one can generate in a U.S. home, Mr. Cole said.

“You cannot keep it in a house. You have to keep it in an industrial facility,” Mr. Cole said.

KnCMiner has built a vast data center, which consumes 30 megawatts of power, in northern Sweden, in the Arctic Circle. “We produce a lot of heat. We need cold air,” Mr. Cole said.

they dont say the will stop selling to customers.
they just say its to hard now for non tech people to run a miner!
and thats correct.

[CoinMode]

The more people mine bitcoin, the harder it is to generate. That means that people need ever faster and more powerful machines. The machines that would be reasonable to sell to customers now would require more power than one can generate in a U.S. home, Mr. Cole said.

“You cannot keep it in a house. You have to keep it in an industrial facility,” Mr. Cole said.

KnCMiner has built a vast data center, which consumes 30 megawatts of power, in northern Sweden, in the Arctic Circle. “We produce a lot of heat. We need cold air,” Mr. Cole said.

they dont say the will stop selling to customers.
they just say its to hard now for non tech people to run a miner!
and thats correct.

Please don't bring up the very basics of bitcoin, especially when they are completely irrelevant to your point. The article very clearly says that KnCMiner is in the process of discontinuing sales of all their miners. If the reporter got that part wrong, then that is an error in the WSJ and you should inform them. However, your arguments are so far nothing but straw men and red herring crap that any logical person can easily see through.

I never quoted the representative of KnC. I quoted the author of the article. You have zero argument except "well the WSJ obviously got it wrong" which is pathetic. The WSJ is notable for doing decent investigative journalism. In fact, they are so good that they are one of the top newspapers for billionaires, and they are the most read paper for bankers and brokers, many of whom are millionaires and billionaires. You cannot attack the WSJ by implying that the most likely got the facts wrong. No. They most always get the facts correct, otherwise billionaires wouldn't be reading them.

Combining your logical fallacies with your poor grasp of English reading and writing, and knowing that your grammar and spelling mistakes are common of people from Northern Europe, like Sweden, then the only conclusion possible is you are a shill for KnCMiner. I'm doing you a favor by letting you know that contract will be terminated the moment the VC behind your scam operation realize they won't make a return. I hope you use this advice to better yourself.

[notthematrix]

The more people mine bitcoin, the harder it is to generate. That means that people need ever faster and more powerful machines. The machines that would be reasonable to sell to customers now would require more power than one can generate in a U.S. home, Mr. Cole said.

“You cannot keep it in a house. You have to keep it in an industrial facility,” Mr. Cole said.

KnCMiner has built a vast data center, which consumes 30 megawatts of power, in northern Sweden, in the Arctic Circle. “We produce a lot of heat. We need cold air,” Mr. Cole said.

they dont say the will stop selling to customers.
they just say its to hard now for non tech people to run a miner!
and thats correct.

Please don't bring up the very basics of bitcoin, especially when they are completely irrelevant to your point. The article very clearly says that KnCMiner is in the process of discontinuing sales of all their miners. If the reporter got that part wrong, then that is an error in the WSJ and you should inform them. However, your arguments are so far nothing but straw men and red herring crap that any logical person can easily see through.

I never quoted the representative of KnC. I quoted the author of the article. You have zero argument except "well the WSJ obviously got it wrong" which is pathetic. The WSJ is notable for doing decent investigative journalism. In fact, they are so good that they are one of the top newspapers for billionaires, and they are the most read paper for bankers and brokers, many of whom are millionaires and billionaires. You cannot attack the WSJ by implying that the most likely got the facts wrong. No. They most always get the facts correct, otherwise billionaires wouldn't be reading them.

Combining your logical fallacies with your poor grasp of English reading and writing, and knowing that your grammar and spelling mistakes are common of people from Northern Europe, like Sweden, then the only conclusion possible is you are a shill for KnCMiner. I'm doing you a favor by letting you know that contract will be terminated the moment the VC behind your scam operation realize they won't make a return. I hope you use this advice to better yourself.

My englisch writing can be a problem dyslectia , but that feature of my brain make me a better analytic then most non dyslectics
to keep it simpel yes they have that part wrong , and yes they just used this article again for spreading bullshit about bitcoin , if you want to buy a miner , you can visit them at http://www.kncminer.com and buy one!
The rest of the article is all fuss and its just an other filling to sell.
this article shared on twitter by knc is I think closer to the truth http://www.coindesk.com/kncminer-series-a-funding-round/
they receved a funding round to set up a datacenter.
not selling to customers is not talked about


 

[CoinMode]

The more people mine bitcoin, the harder it is to generate. That means that people need ever faster and more powerful machines. The machines that would be reasonable to sell to customers now would require more power than one can generate in a U.S. home, Mr. Cole said.

“You cannot keep it in a house. You have to keep it in an industrial facility,” Mr. Cole said.

KnCMiner has built a vast data center, which consumes 30 megawatts of power, in northern Sweden, in the Arctic Circle. “We produce a lot of heat. We need cold air,” Mr. Cole said.

they dont say the will stop selling to customers.
they just say its to hard now for non tech people to run a miner!
and thats correct.

Please don't bring up the very basics of bitcoin, especially when they are completely irrelevant to your point. The article very clearly says that KnCMiner is in the process of discontinuing sales of all their miners. If the reporter got that part wrong, then that is an error in the WSJ and you should inform them. However, your arguments are so far nothing but straw men and red herring crap that any logical person can easily see through.

I never quoted the representative of KnC. I quoted the author of the article. You have zero argument except "well the WSJ obviously got it wrong" which is pathetic. The WSJ is notable for doing decent investigative journalism. In fact, they are so good that they are one of the top newspapers for billionaires, and they are the most read paper for bankers and brokers, many of whom are millionaires and billionaires. You cannot attack the WSJ by implying that the most likely got the facts wrong. No. They most always get the facts correct, otherwise billionaires wouldn't be reading them.

Combining your logical fallacies with your poor grasp of English reading and writing, and knowing that your grammar and spelling mistakes are common of people from Northern Europe, like Sweden, then the only conclusion possible is you are a shill for KnCMiner. I'm doing you a favor by letting you know that contract will be terminated the moment the VC behind your scam operation realize they won't make a return. I hope you use this advice to better yourself.

My englisch writing can be a problem dyslectia , but that feature of my brain make me a better analytic then most non dyslectics
to keep it simpel yes they have that part wrong , and yes they just used this article again for spreading bullshit about bitcoin , if you want to buy a miner , you can visit them at http://www.kncminer.com and buy one!
The rest of the article is all fuss and its just an other filling to sell.
this article shared on twitter by knc is I think closer to the truth http://www.coindesk.com/kncminer-series-a-funding-round/
they receved a funding round to set up a datacenter.
not selling to customers is not talked about


 

I know that KnCMiner is currently selling hardware. That is not the point the WSJ was making. What they said was that KnCMiner will stop selling hardware sometime in the near future, and they went on to imply that the data center business will completely replace the old hardware business. Perhaps you are correct and the author simply got the facts wrong.

I personally hope that is the truth. The more individuals data centers we have the better bitcoin will work. Decentralization is always the better way to go, when possible. So, I hope you are right. We shall see.

[BitDreams]

"There, [KnCMiner] generates bitcoin for itself, as revenue, and also has started leasing power to customers. Customers can come to its website and pay a fee to get a certain amount of compute power for a duration of time." - WSJ.com

All of the decentralization that KnC was promising our community by sending out units to thousands of international clients is going to dissappear entirely. They were originally a massive help to the principles of cryptocurrency. Now they are going to become a massive hinderance, just like GHASH.io mining pool. Both will dissappear into the shadows.

This is just depressing that so many of the largest players in the crypto world keep betraying their customer base, but it does leave a lot of space for newcomers to steal their lunch.

They have no stake or interest in holding coins and they don't even want to increase the volume of bitcoin transactions as it makes their hashing more difficult.

[CoinMode]

They have no stake or interest in holding coins and they don't even want to increase the volume of bitcoin transactions as it makes their hashing more difficult.

I don't want them to hold coins, ever. I want them to spread bitcoin out to the world by generating large cash flows and attracting attention to the industry. KnC has been in a lot of big headlines at mainstream outlets, and their headlines are unusual for bitcoin because they are almost always cool or intriguing. By drawing attention to bitcoin and selling hardware, KnC has done a great job at helping us get investors interested to help develop bitcoin businesses. This is what KnC should continue to do. Unfortunately, it seems like that might not be the case much longer.

The number of transactions does not make hashing more difficult.