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Author Topic: Hello! New Bitcoin Exchange in town  (Read 5857 times)
Yankee (BitInstant)
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Charlie 'Van Bitcoin' Shrem


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April 30, 2012, 04:51:43 PM
 #21

I'm not really sure what I'm doing wrong here besides trying to offer a service to help new people purchase their first bitcoin. The reason I changed the post is because I didn't want to reveal too much about security as it could possibly open up a potential avenue for exploitation if someone DID manage to compromise the website.

No customer information or bitcoins are stored on the server. All customer information is encrypted with my public key and sent to order@quickbitcoins.net. I do appreciate all the suggestions about the domain name and SSL, which is why I have moved it to a .net and am implementing SSL as we speak. But it seems other than that you all are just trolling. I figured proponents of Bitcoin would like as many competitive services as possible. I'm taking a risk to help people and hopefully make a little money. What's the problem there?

If you guys dislike the site or anything about it please feel free to not use my service. Other than that can we keep feedback to constructive criticism?

Thanks.

I have a few questions:

1. Who are you guys?

2. Where are you located

3. History of the company and any predecessor companies.

4. Why are you in this business?

5. Certificate of incorporation and amendments thereto

6. Bylaws and amendments thereto

7. List of jurisdictions in which qualified to do business or otherwise operating within

Thanks

Charlie

Bitcoin pioneer. An apostle of Satoshi Nakamoto. A crusader for a new, better, tech-driven society. A dreamer.

More about me: http://CharlieShrem.com
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Phinnaeus Gage
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April 30, 2012, 04:55:53 PM
 #22

I'm not really sure what I'm doing wrong here besides trying to offer a service to help new people purchase their first bitcoin. The reason I changed the post is because I didn't want to reveal too much about security as it could possibly open up a potential avenue for exploitation if someone DID manage to compromise the website.

No customer information or bitcoins are stored on the server. All customer information is encrypted with my public key and sent to order@quickbitcoins.net. I do appreciate all the suggestions about the domain name and SSL, which is why I have moved it to a .net and am implementing SSL as we speak. But it seems other than that you all are just trolling. I figured proponents of Bitcoin would like as many competitive services as possible. I'm taking a risk to help people and hopefully make a little money. What's the problem there?

If you guys dislike the site or anything about it please feel free to not use my service. Other than that can we keep feedback to constructive criticism?

Thanks.

I have a few questions:

1. Who are you guys?

2. Where are you located

3. History of the company and any predecessor companies.

4. Why are you in this business?

5. Certificate of incorporation and amendments thereto

6. Bylaws and amendments thereto

7. List of jurisdictions in which qualified to do business or otherwise operating within

Thanks

Charlie

Can we dismiss#6, Yankee, for I'm pretty busy this time of year and need to limit my reading?
Yankee (BitInstant)
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Charlie 'Van Bitcoin' Shrem


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April 30, 2012, 05:12:35 PM
 #23

I'm not really sure what I'm doing wrong here besides trying to offer a service to help new people purchase their first bitcoin. I understand your hesitance as PayPal has a bad rep with the Bitcoin community and usually no one is willing to take the risk of offering them as a payment method. I'm starting to get the feeling that a lack of transparency, even for security reasons, is frowned upon here.


You're absolutely right.


+1

Bitcoin pioneer. An apostle of Satoshi Nakamoto. A crusader for a new, better, tech-driven society. A dreamer.

More about me: http://CharlieShrem.com
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April 30, 2012, 05:12:48 PM
 #24

1) We're Ryan and Stormy Schreiber. A husband and wife Couple. For more information about us you can see our CV's at http://www.workstopia.tk

2) We're located in Albuquerque, New Mexico

3) Our company is a spinoff of Workstopia LLC. It's a sole proprietorship that I am currently in the process of registering in Delaware (My registered agent is taking forever to respond, unfortunately. It's just a matter of waiting a few days at this point). In the mean time I am running this as an individual person and not behind an LLC.

4) The inspiration and motivation to create this service stemmed from our own experience in frustration at having to jump through all kinds of elaborate hoops just to buy and sell bitcoins. We have developed an interest in the e-currency phenomenon.  Originally, this was just a personal, intellectual interest, but seeing an area that has been neglected (using credit cards to purchase e-currencies), we decided to make an effort to fill that gap. I did a huge amount of research on why no one is accepting PayPal or CreditCards and felt like I could mitigate the risk through a combination of manual verification, paranoia-level order denial, and a stiff charge back policy for legitimate users who submit fraudulent charge backs or disputes.

5) Please see #3

7) The LLC is registration is in Delaware, though it's an e-commerce site which services anyone with an internet connection.
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All paid signature campaigns should be banned.


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April 30, 2012, 06:42:28 PM
 #25

I did a huge amount of research on why no one is accepting PayPal or CreditCards and felt like I could mitigate the risk through a combination of manual verification, paranoia-level order denial, and a stiff charge back policy for legitimate users who submit fraudulent charge backs or disputes.

OK, after reading your CV and so on I have decided that you are not a scammer.  But, my question to you is this:  during your huge amount of research you must surely have discovered that the Bitcoin roadway is littered with the rotting carcasses of many, many honest companies that have tried to do EXACTLY the same thing - and I mean exactly.    Are you sure you want to have all of your PayPal assets frozen for months on end?  When this happens, and I do mean when, are you ready to make all your customers whole out of your own pocket?  I am concerned more for you now than for your customers - since I am currently assuming you are not here to scam.

Our family was terrorized by Homeland Security.  Read all about it here:  http://www.jmwagner.com/ and http://www.burtw.com/  Any donations to help us recover from the $300,000 in legal fees and forced donations to the Federal Asset Forfeiture slush fund are greatly appreciated!
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April 30, 2012, 07:35:35 PM
 #26

The moment any money hits PayPal I withdraw it. Usually within the hour. I have also spoken to my bank and removed PayPal's ability to debit my account. They can only make deposits.
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May 01, 2012, 02:17:07 AM
 #27

Be careful with anything you have to run manually.  BTC trades 24/7.
Phinnaeus Gage
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May 01, 2012, 02:45:30 AM
 #28

Quote
The moment any money hits PayPal I withdraw it. Usually within the hour.

I'll echo Bart's sentiments and will no longer infer you as a scammer, albeit the questions may get tougher from me, and surely by others. May I offer up one piece of advice? Always respond to each comment/question with the utmost professionalism, for the moment you start barking, it's all over. That said, I'll state here that you've handled yourself quite well considering what you've contended with thus far.

That said (honestly, I dislike that phrase), in re. what I've quoted above: Exactly how do you and your wife plan on accomplishing that feat? Will you be sleeping in shifts? See what I mean about questions getting tougher (and weirder)?

~Bruno~
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May 01, 2012, 02:57:10 AM
 #29

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The moment any money hits PayPal I withdraw it. Usually within the hour.

I'll echo Bart's sentiments and will no longer infer you as a scammer, albeit the questions may get tougher from me, and surely by others. May I offer up one piece of advice? Always respond to each comment/question with the utmost professionalism, for the moment you start barking, it's all over. That said, I'll state here that you've handled yourself quite well considering what you've contended with thus far.

That said (honestly, I dislike that phrase), in re. what I've quoted above: Exactly how do you and your wife plan on accomplishing that feat? Will you be sleeping in shifts? See what I mean about questions getting tougher (and weirder)?

~Bruno~


For the moment, the higher rate serves a twofold purpose.  One, obviously, is to help us bootstrap our business.  The other, however, is to help keep order volume low enough that we can simultaneously do business while creating and implementing a more automated system which can handle a higher order volume and thus be easier for the two of us to handle.

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May 01, 2012, 03:08:08 AM
 #30

Quote
The moment any money hits PayPal I withdraw it. Usually within the hour.

I'll echo Bart's sentiments and will no longer infer you as a scammer, albeit the questions may get tougher from me, and surely by others. May I offer up one piece of advice? Always respond to each comment/question with the utmost professionalism, for the moment you start barking, it's all over. That said, I'll state here that you've handled yourself quite well considering what you've contended with thus far.

That said (honestly, I dislike that phrase), in re. what I've quoted above: Exactly how do you and your wife plan on accomplishing that feat? Will you be sleeping in shifts? See what I mean about questions getting tougher (and weirder)?

~Bruno~


For the moment, the higher rate serves a twofold purpose.  One, obviously, is to help us bootstrap our business.  The other, however, is to help keep order volume low enough that we can simultaneously do business while creating and implementing a more automated system which can handle a higher order volume and thus be easier for the two of us to handle.


I have to admit that that's an excellent answer, albeit I'm not sure what question it's in reference to. You clearly stately that any money that hits your PayPal account will be withdrawn within a hour. I asked how the heck you and your wife are planning on doing that. One reason I asked is that I tried to come up with a solution in my head as to how I would accomplish such a task and an answer thus far has eluded me, hence hoping to read a reply from you as to how exactly you plan on doing it.

~Bruno~
Yankee (BitInstant)
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Charlie 'Van Bitcoin' Shrem


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May 01, 2012, 03:14:43 AM
 #31

The moment any money hits PayPal I withdraw it. Usually within the hour. I have also spoken to my bank and removed PayPal's ability to debit my account. They can only make deposits.

That won't make much a difference.

If you have a 0 balance in your Paypal account and someone charges back, Paypal will debit your account for the amount.

You said you told the bank to not allow this kind of debit. If thats true (I find it difficult to believe) Paypal will then invoice you and stop at nothing to collect the payment.

Whatever you think you can do to stop it, someone else as thought of it already.

Paypal will get their money.

Bitcoin pioneer. An apostle of Satoshi Nakamoto. A crusader for a new, better, tech-driven society. A dreamer.

More about me: http://CharlieShrem.com
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May 01, 2012, 03:18:59 AM
 #32




I have to admit that that's an excellent answer, albeit I'm not sure what question it's in reference to. You clearly stately that any money that hits your PayPal account will be withdrawn within a hour. I asked how the heck you and your wife are planning on doing that. One reason I asked is that I tried to come up with a solution in my head as to how I would accomplish such a task and an answer thus far has eluded me, hence hoping to read a reply from you as to how exactly you plan on doing it.

~Bruno~



Sorry!  I misunderstood the question you were asking to be how we were running things in general, rather than specifically about removing the funds from PayPal.  Whenever we receive an email alert notifying us of a payment from PayPal, a very loud audible alarm is set to go off.  There is always at least one of us at home, and the alarm ensures that we can transfer the funds immediately. ;-)
Phinnaeus Gage
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May 01, 2012, 03:26:07 AM
 #33

The moment any money hits PayPal I withdraw it. Usually within the hour. I have also spoken to my bank and removed PayPal's ability to debit my account. They can only make deposits.

That won't make much a difference.

If you have a 0 balance in your Paypal account and someone charges back, Paypal will debit your account for the amount.

You said you told the bank to not allow this kind of debit. If thats true (I find it difficult to believe) Paypal will then invoice you and stop at nothing to collect the payment.

Whatever you think you can do to stop it, someone else as thought of it already.

Paypal will get their money.

Exactly! And one way they could do it is the following: At noon, you have $0 in your PayPal account. At 12:05, PayPal needs to debit your account $X, but your account currently has $0. At 12:43, a client of yours deposit $(X + Y). At 12:43:01, PayPal deducts the $X they feel is rightfully theirs, thus leaving you with only $Y. That's the good news. The bad news? Wait for it! At 12:43:02, PayPal locks your account.

Here's a new question for you. Are you going to take the time to find and read the over two dozen threads consisted of other businesses using this business model, thus proving it won't work, or do you want us users to use are valuable time and hunt them down for you?

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May 01, 2012, 03:28:34 AM
 #34




I have to admit that that's an excellent answer, albeit I'm not sure what question it's in reference to. You clearly stately that any money that hits your PayPal account will be withdrawn within a hour. I asked how the heck you and your wife are planning on doing that. One reason I asked is that I tried to come up with a solution in my head as to how I would accomplish such a task and an answer thus far has eluded me, hence hoping to read a reply from you as to how exactly you plan on doing it.

~Bruno~



Sorry!  I misunderstood the question you were asking to be how we were running things in general, rather than specifically about removing the funds from PayPal.  Whenever we receive an email alert notifying us of a payment from PayPal, a very loud audible alarm is set to go off.  There is always at least one of us at home, and the alarm ensures that we can transfer the funds immediately. ;-)

BULLSHIT!
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Charlie 'Van Bitcoin' Shrem


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May 01, 2012, 03:29:30 AM
 #35

Coming from someone who has tried working with Paypal with their specific written permission of being allowed to do so, and then having them close your account and freezing your funds for 180 days, its not worth it.

I repeat, Paypal still has over $15,000 of my funds frozen for another 90 days.

Bitcoin pioneer. An apostle of Satoshi Nakamoto. A crusader for a new, better, tech-driven society. A dreamer.

More about me: http://CharlieShrem.com
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May 01, 2012, 03:33:57 AM
 #36




I have to admit that that's an excellent answer, albeit I'm not sure what question it's in reference to. You clearly stately that any money that hits your PayPal account will be withdrawn within a hour. I asked how the heck you and your wife are planning on doing that. One reason I asked is that I tried to come up with a solution in my head as to how I would accomplish such a task and an answer thus far has eluded me, hence hoping to read a reply from you as to how exactly you plan on doing it.

~Bruno~



Sorry!  I misunderstood the question you were asking to be how we were running things in general, rather than specifically about removing the funds from PayPal.  Whenever we receive an email alert notifying us of a payment from PayPal, a very loud audible alarm is set to go off.  There is always at least one of us at home, and the alarm ensures that we can transfer the funds immediately. ;-)

BULLSHIT!

One of us works days, the other works nights.  It really is just as simple as that.
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May 01, 2012, 03:35:17 AM
 #37

Coming from someone who has tried working with Paypal with their specific written permission of being allowed to do so, and then having them close your account and freezing your funds for 180 days, its not worth it.

I repeat, Paypal still has over $15,000 of my funds frozen for another 90 days.

What did they do when you showed them the written permission they gave you?
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May 01, 2012, 03:41:58 AM
 #38

The key is to prevent having chargebacks in the first place.  This is why we go to such lengths to verify the authenticity of each buyer before we will accept and fill any order.  As stated before, we ARE aware of the fact that PayPal can and possibly will lock down our account.  By withdrawing the money and limiting the size of PayPal transactions, we are ensuring that the total loss will be at most the size of one transaction, which is more than offset by the profit gained by using PayPal in the first place.  Also, as previously stated, PayPal is only a temporary solution during the time in which it takes to get going with another credit card processor.  
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May 01, 2012, 03:42:21 AM
 #39

I'm going to try to help you one more time. Please take the time to read this: http://www.aboutpaypal.org/

If, after reading, you still decide to include PayPal as part of your business plan, then expect to receive 0 customers from this forum. I take that back. Expect to receive X customers from this forum to use your exchange, all of which will issue a charge back.

~Bruno~
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Charlie 'Van Bitcoin' Shrem


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May 01, 2012, 03:47:42 AM
 #40

Coming from someone who has tried working with Paypal with their specific written permission of being allowed to do so, and then having them close your account and freezing your funds for 180 days, its not worth it.

I repeat, Paypal still has over $15,000 of my funds frozen for another 90 days.

What did they do when you showed them the written permission they gave you?

Nothing.

I broke up my 10 year multi-million dollar relationship and closed my 4 other accounts with them the same day. I was processing 100k+ a day on my various retail sites thru Paypal.

The key is to prevent having chargebacks in the first place.  This is why we go to such lengths to verify the authenticity of each buyer before we will accept and fill any order.  As stated before, we ARE aware of the fact that PayPal can and possibly will lock down our account.  By withdrawing the money and limiting the size of PayPal transactions, we are ensuring that the total loss will be at most the size of one transaction, which is more than offset by the profit gained by using PayPal in the first place.  Also, as previously stated, PayPal is only a temporary solution during the time in which it takes to get going with another credit card processor.  

Your not understanding something here, forget chargebacks as you understand it.

Everything your doing is preventing someone from wanting to chargeback if they are not satisfied with the product.

Scammers will use your system to use stolen and hacked cc'd to buy Bitcoin, and then your the one who has to bear the loss.

If you want, I can easily bypass your verification system with a stolen credit card, buy Bitcoin once a day over a few weeks, and then watch as the owners slowly call their banks to claim fraud and your cc processor drops you. I will do this for you to prove a point, no ill intentions but you will lose over $10k at least. Out of your pocket.

Would you rather me do it, or a scammer?

Bitcoin pioneer. An apostle of Satoshi Nakamoto. A crusader for a new, better, tech-driven society. A dreamer.

More about me: http://CharlieShrem.com
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