KanoPool since 2014 🐈 - PPLNS and Solo 0.5% fee - Worldwide - 2435 blocks

[kano]

Meanwhile, I'm going to restart ckpool in ~25 minutes at ~12:00 UTC
One change I'll do will be to increase the starting diff to 2052 (from 1042)

All miners should just reconnect immediately.
If not you'll failover and reconnect within 5 minutes.

It needs a restart every so often, and has been showing those signs today.

I'll post again once it's done.

All good, no problems.
Hash rate is back were it was, before the restart, on all the nodes, and the main pool will catch back up shortly.

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[tournamentdan]

I know this is off topic, but Kano always talks up Avalon.  Just got another A721 man these things are awesome...just steady hashing machines!  Blows Bitmains quality out of the water, so far.

I have two. I prefer them over the s9

And the best is that they are much more durable than the S9.

I now have 19 s9 and still have had no problems. I must be the the luckiest guy in the world. If only I believed in luck. I think the people that have never owned an s9 really should not be making silly comments.  This thread is really becoming the conspiracy theories thread.

[ZACHM]

I'm pretty sure by A6+ kano meant A6 and newer.   

[ComputerGenie]

I'm pretty sure by A6+ kano meant A6 and newer.   

Yes, but since A6 < A7 and the convo was S9 vs A7 (not backwards generations), then "A6 and newer" would have to compare "S7 and newer"...

[ZACHM]

The problem is what is reported to the pool.

kano knows if it is an S9, because the miner tells the pool what it is, same with the A6+

He can only compare the numbers that he has access to, he can't (I think) separate out the A6 from the A721. Most likely because they are running the same software. Also the S7 (and older) does not announce itself like the S9s do.

[scyth3]

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying that S9s aren't a steaming pile of bovine dung; I'm saying that, dung or not, they pay the bills better than the current alternatives.

Not if they're not finding blocks...

Are you saying the bad luck this pool is having is not really bad luck, just S9 not finding blocks on this pool?

[ComputerGenie]

The problem is what is reported to the pool.

kano knows if it is an S9, because the miner tells the pool what it is, same with the A6+

He can only compare the numbers that he has access to, he can't (I think) separate out the A6 from the A721. Most likely because they are running the same software. Also the S7 (and older) does not announce itself like the S9s do.

No, the problem is that you have to do bullshit "tricks" with the numbers to in any way decide that an A7 is measurably better than an S9.
You can fanboy fudge the numbers all day and I can knock them back to reality all day...
S9s are a steaming pile of bullshit, but the cost less to run (in the long run [100+ blocks]) than A7s, and therefore have a better ROI... It's that simple!

[ComputerGenie]

Are you saying the bad luck this pool is having is not really bad luck, just S9 not finding blocks on this pool?

That's been the goto cry since the bad luck started.

[yxt]

I now have 19 s9 and still have had no problems. I must be the the luckiest guy in the world. ....

What batch? post again in 6-12 months.
As I have A6, S7, A721 and S9 I can comment very well on durability and customer service

S9s are a steaming pile of bullshit, but the cost less to run (in the long run [100+ blocks]) than A7s, and therefore have a better ROI... It's that simple!

You ignore that the S9 seems to have a higher failure rate

But yes...back on topic: kano.is pool

[ComputerGenie]

You ignore that the S9 seems to have a higher failure rate...

And you ignore that with that higher failure rate (which, by the way, is why I call them a steaming pile of bullshit), the difference is nominal and the costs are lower. 

[ZACHM]

No, the problem is that you have to do bullshit "tricks" with the numbers to in any way decide that an A7 is measurably better than an S9.
You can fanboy fudge the numbers all day and I can knock them back to reality all day...
S9s are a steaming pile of bullshit, but the cost less to run (in the long run [100+ blocks]) than A7s, and therefore have a better ROI... It's that simple!

I'm not saying either one is better or worse, nor do I really care since I own neither.

I was just saying he can't compare just the A7 to just the S9 since the numbers are not there to do that.

I agree with what you are saying, based on $/TH and W/TH the S9 should be a better investment.
This is the same as cars, it is more cost effective to buy a used car every year for $1000 than to buy a new one for $300+/month. Or Honda vs Cadillac. Or people that buy Apple products. The list goes on and on, some people are willing to pay more even though there is no financial reason to do so.

[ComputerGenie]

...I was just saying he can't compare just the A7 to just the S9 since the numbers are not there to do that.
...

They are there, and he's posted them, and I've even quoted his posting of them....

[yxt]

You ignore that the S9 seems to have a higher failure rate...

And you ignore that with that higher failure rate (which, by the way, is why I call them a steaming pile of bullshit), the difference is nominal and the costs are lower. 

I talk about broken units. A unit stopped hashing can't be hashing for lower costs...

[ZACHM]

They are there, and he's posted them, and I've even quoted his posting of them....

You are right, sorry about that.  

I guess the reason he was adding in the figures for the A6 is because there have only been a few blocks by them. That is too few blocks to compare. If you add in the S7s then you are comparing vastly different numbers. Additionally, the S7s used completely different software than the S9s, whereas the A6 and A7 use very similar software.

[ComputerGenie]

I talk about broken units. A unit stopped hashing can't be hashing for lower costs...

Now this may be the difference between hobby and income, but I'm not sure why anyone with more than 2 or 3 units wouldn't have spare parts....
Would you own 3 race cars and 0 spare tires at the track on race day?

[tournamentdan]

I now have 19 s9 and still have had no problems. I must be the the luckiest guy in the world. ....

What batch? post again in 6-12 months.
As I have A6, S7, A721 and S9 I can comment very well on durability and customer service

S9s are a steaming pile of bullshit, but the cost less to run (in the long run [100+ blocks]) than A7s, and therefore have a better ROI... It's that simple!

You ignore that the S9 seems to have a higher failure rate

But yes...back on topic: kano.is pool

Batch 5,10,18,22,24.

[yxt]

@tournamentdan
ok, so most of them are not too old. I hope you stay lucky


@ComputerGenie
spare parts are not free and maintance cost time, that isn't free either.

If you are a trucking company would you buy the truck that costs more and need more fuel but drive on the road all the time, making money. And if something is defective you have very good customer service.
Or the one that is cheaper, needs less fuel but you have troubles all the time, you have to argue with the customer service about very cheap spare parts even if you bought hunderts of trucks from them....

But competition is good, everybody should buy what he think fits him best.
I am out from that diskussion. Because I have decided for Avalon

[ComputerGenie]

If you are a trucking company would you buy the truck that costs more and need more fuel but drive on the road all the time, making money. And if something is defective you have very good customer service.
Or the one that is cheaper, needs less fuel but you have troubles all the time, you have to argue with the customer service about very cheap spare parts even if you bought hunderts of trucks from them....
...

As for your analogy....
That's so flawed that I don't even know where to begin....
Since 66 is the LCM...

	Unit Cost	Power Usage	TH/s	Power/TH	(kWh) cost USD	Yearly Power Cost/TH	Yearly Power Cost @ 66TH	Purchase Cost for 66TH
A7	$1,222.29*	1,000.00	6	166.67	$0.10	$146.39	$9,661.87	$13,445.19
S9	$1,232.00	1,185.80	11	107.80	$0.10	$94.67	$6,248.40	$7,392.00

Edit: purchase price alone, you could buy 11 S9s (not counting the 1 that the power cost difference makes), throw 5 in the trash (having never used them) and still save $.

Edit 2: *based on retail price in yxt's singature

[tournamentdan]

If you are a trucking company would you buy the truck that costs more and need more fuel but drive on the road all the time, making money. And if something is defective you have very good customer service.
Or the one that is cheaper, needs less fuel but you have troubles all the time, you have to argue with the customer service about very cheap spare parts even if you bought hunderts of trucks from them....
...

As for your analogy....
That's so flawed that I don't even know where to begin....

Actually it is spot on. Except for his argument of course.
You see I am a owner operator truck driver. I know all to well the maitinance of a trucking company.  Big trucks cost big money. Which is why you have to maximize your profits. You have to maximize your gross income because there will always be costs that drive down your net income. Costs are a fact of life. Or should I say a fact of business. There are going to be failures. I expect there to be failures. But that is just part of business. There are brand new cars that have recalls on them. Brand new toasters that do not work when you buy them.

I have not had any problem with cold solder. Which makes up a good part of the complaints. I have not had problems with over heating because I do not have them in a closet in my house hashing away. I think we can all agree there has been an infux of people that are new to mining. (Including myself ) Those are the people misusing the equipment.  Overclocking, under ventilation, power surges. I am not pointing fingers at anyone on this thread. After all. Equipment failure is part of business. It's just there are bad business people not treating their equipment right that make it seem that there is a high failure rate.

[Biodom]

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying that S9s aren't a steaming pile of bovine dung; I'm saying that, dung or not, they pay the bills better than the current alternatives.

Not if they're not finding blocks...

I am not sure how to interpret this from a practical point of view.
do other pools have the same phenomenon? What about slush's or other non-bitmain associated pools?
If they do-I will subscribe to this argument of "poison" S9 v1
If they don't-?