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Author Topic: Competing Bitcoin Networks  (Read 1132 times)
Imerman2 (OP)
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September 20, 2014, 08:40:11 PM
 #1

I've always thought that Bitcoin had one major flaw, there is no entity that has a profit incentive to improve the Bitcoin protocol itself.  Yes the code is open-source, yes each user has an indirect incentive to find flaws, but there is no entity that receives payment for generating more secure and user-friendly code.  The problem with having an entity that receives profit from securing the code is the problem of centralization, in other words how do you give a single entity control over the code, without granting a monopoly?  The answer seems to me to be competing Bitcoin networks that all have separate protocols, meaning there may be thousands of Bitcoin networks, each with different security, user-friendliness, and protocol for Bitcoin transfers.  This would be akin to the separation between banks and the U.S. dollar, every bank uses the same product, U.S. dollars, but they all have different protocol for doing the same work, transferring and storing money.  In a competing Bitcoin network system, each separate Bitcoin network would have protocol of how to accept Bitcoin's from another protocol, and in some cases they may not accept other Bitcoin network's Bitcoins especially in the case of negligent and fraudulent networks.  In this way you could have different networks specialized for certain tasks, miner networks specialized to the needs of miners, merchant networks specialized to the needs of merchants, etc, etc.  Each network would charge a small fee, and because these networks would not have to record the transfers themselves, but are charging a fee for maintenance of the network itself, they would still be able to do so for less than the traditional banking system.

Bitcoin already has applications, such as coloredcoins, that could be used to tag each coin and the network it belongs to.  I'm not an advanced programmer so I don't know many of the technical details, but it seems something like this could be possible.  This wouldn't centralize Bitcoin because each user would choose a network or they could stick with the original non-competitive network, it wouldn't add large fees because the only fee would be for the upkeep of the network, and without this fee the network would be less stable so (as with any trade) you would get more out than you put in, and finally there would be no governmentally mandated restrictions, because the nature of Bitcoin network would make it impossible to stop competition in the market for Bitcoin networks.

Maybe I'm missing something here, but it seems like competitive networks are the way to go.  If I'm wrong please tell me because I've started to take real steps in putting together how you could structure these networks so as to protect users against fraud without incurring additional fees, and if there is something wrong with this idea that makes it unsuitable to the market, or if some internal part of Bitcoin's structure makes this impossible if you could tell me I would save myself wasted effort.

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September 21, 2014, 12:51:24 AM
 #2

This seems to me like it's basically what will become of the altcoin sea once trust-free cross-chain trading gets built into more clients. The "competing networks" thing is already going on there, with altcoin devs implementing new features that sometimes get back into Bitcoin and sometimes don't. And enough of the altcoins are Scrypt-based that they can share hashpower via merged mining, so the trade-offs are really based on features rather than chain hashpower security.

Of course, the exchange rate between BTC and LTC and BQC and all the rest is floating, so you can't just have coins from network A be automatically the same "value" as coins from network B. And that's as it should be; different "networks" have different properties, so their currency will be valued differently by the market, and any attempt to enforce an exchange rate by developer fiat is just going to push the real exchange rate underground.

If there is something that will make Bitcoin succeed, it is growth of utility - greater quantity and variety of goods and services offered for BTC. If there is something that will make Bitcoin fail, it is the prevalence of users convinced that BTC is a magic box that will turn them into millionaires, and of the con-artists who have followed them here to devour them.
2112
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September 21, 2014, 05:23:57 PM
Last edit: September 21, 2014, 05:38:09 PM by 2112
 #3

I'm not an advanced programmer so I don't know many of the technical details, but it seems something like this could be possible.
It isn't impossible, it's just that it would require very advanced programming expertise and some changes to the Bitcoin protocol to be able to explicitly track sub-variants of Bitcoin again double-networking (currently Bitcoin guards agains double-spends, it would need to safely guard against transferring same bitcoins to more than one sub-network).

If you want you can take a look at my old proposal from my signature:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=54382.0

But I have to warn you that advanced programming knowledge is required to understand it.

Currently there's absolutely no consensus on how to change the Bitcoin's network protocol.

The one thing I don't like is the title of this thread: it should be "Competing and cooperating Bitcoin networks". They are competing in serving of customers but simultaneously cooperating against fraud and counterfeiting.

Edit: Without that last caveat the purely "Competing Bitcoin Newtorks" would be just Alternative Cryptocoin Networks".

Please comment, critique, criticize or ridicule BIP 2112: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=54382.0
Long-term mining prognosis: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=91101.0
johnnyrocket
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September 21, 2014, 10:05:11 PM
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I'm not an advanced programmer so I don't know many of the technical details, but it seems something like this could be possible.
It isn't impossible, it's just that it would require very advanced programming expertise and some changes to the Bitcoin protocol to be able to explicitly track sub-variants of Bitcoin again double-networking (currently Bitcoin guards agains double-spends, it would need to safely guard against transferring same bitcoins to more than one sub-network).

If you want you can take a look at my old proposal from my signature:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=54382.0

But I have to warn you that advanced programming knowledge is required to understand it.

Currently there's absolutely no consensus on how to change the Bitcoin's network protocol.

The one thing I don't like is the title of this thread: it should be "Competing and cooperating Bitcoin networks". They are competing in serving of customers but simultaneously cooperating against fraud and counterfeiting.

Edit: Without that last caveat the purely "Competing Bitcoin Newtorks" would be just Alternative Cryptocoin Networks".

Depending on how you would want "sub-networks" to operate and interact with the main network, I would think that Proof-of-Burn could work as part of the transfer mechanism from the main network to sub-network.
2112
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September 21, 2014, 10:53:34 PM
 #5

Depending on how you would want "sub-networks" to operate and interact with the main network, I would think that Proof-of-Burn could work as part of the transfer mechanism from the main network to sub-network.
AFAIK proof-of-burn is an one-way blockchain hop. I'm more interested in hopping without burning the bridges to return back. Kind of like people talk about side-chains and tree-chains; I'm thinking of DAG-chains or directed-acyclic-graph-chains.

Please comment, critique, criticize or ridicule BIP 2112: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=54382.0
Long-term mining prognosis: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=91101.0
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