Provisions of the NDAA found unconstitutional by US Federal Court

[Bitware]

http://www.procon.org/headline.php?headlineID=005090

let the games begin.

[1713527903]

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[check_status]

Their attack is repetition, until we become weary and sleepingly allow criminally traitorous legislation to become enacted. The internet/copyright legislation is but one example of this attack method being used to take away freedoms which are already guaranteed by previous pre-existing laws. Rights which are already protected are being assaulted so that monopolistic forces can impose a more restrictive dissemination, indirectly controlling what you are allowed to think by limiting our access to resources.
There has been a constant assault on the Constitution for a very long time by those who hate it's creation. You could say it is an English resentment that has persisted in it's anger toward a document and a government that was so destructive to an English rule. Just imagine what might happen if other nations had instituted and fought for the ideals as those within America have done. They called it anarchy then, while today we are being told by "our" government that a Constitutionalist is an anarchist and most probably a terrorist. It appears to be the same forces still churning and opposing freedoms as those in the 1700's, so much so that it is just surreal.

[Hawker]

Their attack is repetition, until we become weary and sleepingly allow criminally traitorous legislation to become enacted. The internet/copyright legislation is but one example of this attack method being used to take away freedoms which are already guaranteed by previous pre-existing laws. Rights which are already protected are being assaulted so that monopolistic forces can impose a more restrictive dissemination, indirectly controlling what you are allowed to think by limiting our access to resources.
There has been a constant assault on the Constitution for a very long time by those who hate it's creation. You could say it is an English resentment that has persisted in it's anger toward a document and a government that was so destructive to an English rule. Just imagine what might happen if other nations had instituted and fought for the ideals as those within America have done. They called it anarchy then, while today we are being told by "our" government that a Constitutionalist is an anarchist and most probably a terrorist. It appears to be the same forces still churning and opposing freedoms as those in the 1700's, so much so that it is just surreal.

While I have no love for the English, blaming them for American laws being enacted in 2012 is ridiculous.

[Bitware]

World domination and population enslavement has probably been in the hearts and minds of the worlds elite for thousands of years. I think it is less important who is behind it, and more important to put to task those who allow it to affect our systems put in place to protect again such unconstitutional tyranny and oppression. Also, I think its not important why they let it happen.

It is treason.

Of course I am talking about our legislators.

They should be arrested, charged, prosecuted then executed upon a determination of guilt for their treason to show the world this is what we do with those we entrust the administration and management of our nations with to the detriment of our people, who then sacrifice it all, the will of the people and their constitutional and creator endowed rights by birth, for ANY reason.

Ideally, the elites behind it should pay as well for their attempts to overthrow our systems but that is less important, and would be more difficult as they are carried on the winds of fear to the far ends of the earth to cower in their bunkers as they hasily attmept to change international law to protect themselves.

This would probably cause civil unrest, maybe even civil war over ideology, and most definately world war, unless everyone is onboard and awake and aware of the treason.

No matter how it goes down, things will get much worse before they get better. I honestly believe that people must lose all their rights, property, become homeless and start dying from starvation and disease before any meaningful change can occur.

[Hawker]

...snip... I honestly believe that people must lose all their rights, property, become homeless and start dying from starvation and disease before any meaningful change can occur.

We live in an age where housing and food are abundant to the point where obesity is a bigger killer than hunger.  Poor people today, including people on welfare in most western countries, have a degree of luxury that would have stunned royalty a century ago.  And its only going to get better.

Are you 100% convinced that this happy set of affairs rules meaningful change out ?

[Bitware]

...snip... I honestly believe that people must lose all their rights, property, become homeless and start dying from starvation and disease before any meaningful change can occur.

We live in an age where housing and food are abundant to the point where obesity is a bigger killer than hunger.  Poor people today, including people on welfare in most western countries, have a degree of luxury that would have stunned royalty a century ago.  And its only going to get better.

Are you 100% convinced that this happy set of affairs rules meaningful change out ?

There are fewer citizen non-business property owners and more renters.

There are more middle class that have transformed into poverty than ever before. This is your marxism at work. Bring up the poor, bring down the middle class, all while solidifying the upper crust and government.

There are more on some form of public assistance than ever before.

The disparity between rich and poor is greater than ever before.

The cost of living is farther away from income than ever before.

The obesity that you speak of is more lack of nutritional food availability than food choices and income. The junk is cheaper than high nutrient foods.

The luxury of the poor is in western civilized society, which is not the norm. We are the exception to the norm. The vast majority of the worlds low class still lives in abject poverty. Although the poor of the world are starting to come up overall.

I will answer you question if you wish to rephrase it in a more neutral fashion. I dont answer loaded bullshit questions.

[TECSHARE]

haha, you tell him

[Hawker]

...snip... I honestly believe that people must lose all their rights, property, become homeless and start dying from starvation and disease before any meaningful change can occur.

We live in an age where housing and food are abundant to the point where obesity is a bigger killer than hunger.  Poor people today, including people on welfare in most western countries, have a degree of luxury that would have stunned royalty a century ago.  And its only going to get better.

Are you 100% convinced that this happy set of affairs rules meaningful change out ?

There are fewer citizen non-business property owners and more renters.

There are more middle class that have transformed into poverty than ever before. This is your marxism at work. Bring up the poor, bring down the middle class, all while solidifying the upper crust and government.

There are more on some form of public assistance than ever before.

The disparity between rich and poor is greater than ever before.

The cost of living is farther away from income than ever before.

The obesity that you speak of is more lack of nutritional food availability than food choices and income. The junk is cheaper than high nutrient foods.

The luxury of the poor is in western civilized society, which is not the norm. We are the exception to the norm. The vast majority of the worlds low class still lives in abject poverty. Although the poor of the world are starting to come up overall.

I will answer you question if you wish to rephrase it in a more neutral fashion. I dont answer loaded bullshit questions.

The US has a truly huge welfare state its true and its unusual in that most welfare goes to people who are well off.  Whatever else you say, to call a system that pays the well off at the expense of the less well off a marxist is simply silly. 

You are correct that there are people in the world who are desperately poor.  Many live on less than $2 per day and have no freedom and food supplies are interfered with by governments that want to keep the poor in their place. Of course they are open to meaningful change.

But the US?  You have a country where people have more food than they can eat.  The food deserts thing is a myth cooked up by your liberal press.  Food cooked outside the home like fried chicken costs much more than fresh home cooked food - you just have lot of people who can easily afford their deep fried treats.

The point I am making to you is that you should not assume you need a crisis to change things.  People are open to new ideas and change already.  Why not offer them your ideas and see if they take off instead of waiting for a crisis that is not coming?

[benjamindees]

But the US?  You have a country where people have more food than they can eat.  The food deserts thing is a myth cooked up by your liberal press.  Food cooked outside the home like fried chicken costs much more than fresh home cooked food - you just have lot of people who can easily afford their deep fried treats.

Hawker, the obesity epidemic coincides with the entrance of women into the workplace.  Fast food is always cheaper when labor is taken into account.  And, in some urban areas, fresh food is indeed relatively expensive and sometimes not so fresh.  I know because I've lived there.

There are other issues as well, including sedentary jobs, lack of exercise, and the loss of cooking knowledge.  But it's mostly just crap food, even in grocery stores.  Any American can read the labels for themselves and see.  Excepting, of course, the genetically modified foods that aren't labeled or the hundreds of deceptive labeling practices that are legally allowed.

[Hawker]

But the US?  You have a country where people have more food than they can eat.  The food deserts thing is a myth cooked up by your liberal press.  Food cooked outside the home like fried chicken costs much more than fresh home cooked food - you just have lot of people who can easily afford their deep fried treats.

Hawker, the obesity epidemic coincides with the entrance of women into the workplace.  Fast food is always cheaper when labor is taken into account.  And, in some urban areas, fresh food is indeed relatively expensive and sometimes not so fresh.  I know because I've lived there.

There are other issues as well, including sedentary jobs, lack of exercise, and the loss of cooking knowledge.  But it's mostly just crap food, even in grocery stores.  Any American can read the labels for themselves and see.  Excepting, of course, the genetically modified foods that aren't labeled or the hundreds of deceptive labeling practices that are legally allowed.

I agree with you. But my point to Bitware remains that change is possible now if you have a good idea.  There is no need to wait for famine or disaster.  Just find a good idea

[Bitware]

The US has a truly huge welfare state its true and its unusual in that most welfare goes to people who are well off.  Whatever else you say, to call a system that pays the well off at the expense of the less well off a marxist is simply silly.

So much for your poor living in luxury. Or did you really mean the well-off are the poor living in luxury ?

I think the poor would take exception to your claims.

But the US?  You have a country where people have more food than they can eat.  The food deserts thing is a myth cooked up by your liberal press.  Food cooked outside the home like fried chicken costs much more than fresh home cooked food - you just have lot of people who can easily afford their deep fried treats.

Cheap filler fast food is not nutritional food. Its junk. Go try to buy FRESH unprocessed natural fruits, vegitables, meats, dairy and grains. You food bill will rise exponentially.

Now if you raise livestock and grow your own, it breaks the high cost structure.

This statement of yours tells me you have absolutely no experience in the area of buying any food other than the fast food you think is more expensive than healthy food choices.

The point I am making to you is that you should not assume you need a crisis to change things.  People are open to new ideas and change already.  Why not offer them your ideas and see if they take off instead of waiting for a crisis that is not coming?

We are placed inside a box expertly crafted to give us the appearance of choice. It called the left-right lib-con political process/paradigm otherwise known as voting. We must pick a side. No matter what choice is made the end result is identical, save the kitchen table wedge issues spoon fed to us to keep us fighting amongst ourselves instead of coming together as humanity for the betterment of our way of life and our people. The will of the people be damned.

That is what divides us, conquers us, and prevents any meaningful change from ocurring. Good ideas meant to break this cycle are stifled and those presenting them are either marginalized or compromised. I completely agree with your good ideas theory. But thats all it is. Good ideas only make it if someone can make money from them or attach binders to them. Good ideas should not need to be legislated. If we cause no harm and honor our agreements, thats all that matters. But good ideas are often legislated right out of existance at the point of a gun, and the loss of our freedoms and wealth.

Add to all of that peoples indoctrination and manipulation, and their overall apathy and disinterest, you will have no meaningful change until people are dying in the streets, poor, homeless, hungry, and cold... until people see the tyranny and oppression for what it truly is. Even then most will be begging government to help them thereby exacerbating the problems more.

It only took 3% of the population to fight for our nations freedom.

In my opinion it all needs to burn down to the ground so we can start afresh. Thats they only way we will get our freedom and liberty back and end benefits and privilage transformation of rights.

[Hawker]

...snip...

But the US?  You have a country where people have more food than they can eat.  The food deserts thing is a myth cooked up by your liberal press.  Food cooked outside the home like fried chicken costs much more than fresh home cooked food - you just have lot of people who can easily afford their deep fried treats.

Cheap filler fast food is not nutritional food. Its junk. Go try to buy FRESH unprocessed natural fruits, vegitables, meats, dairy and grains. You food bill will rise exponentially.

Now if you raise livestock and grow your own, it breaks the high cost structure.

This statement of yours tells me you have absolutely no experience in the area of buying any food other than the fast food you think is more expensive than healthy food choices.

...snip...

http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/five-myths-about-healthy-eating/2011/10/10/gIQAK9uZkL_story.html

Read the first myth.  Access to fresh healthy food is not a problem in the US.  Its there in abundance and its cheaper than junk food.  

[Hawker]

...snip...
That is what divides us, conquers us, and prevents any meaningful change from ocurring. Good ideas meant to break this cycle are stifled and those presenting them are either marginalized or compromised. I completely agree with your good ideas theory. But thats all it is. Good ideas only make it if someone can make money from them or attach binders to them. Good ideas should not need to be legislated. If we cause no harm and honor our agreements, thats all that matters. But good ideas are often legislated right out of existance at the point of a gun, and the loss of our freedoms and wealth.

...snip...

I see your logic.  Can you point to a good idea that has been stifled? 

[Gabi]

In USA they eat pasta with ketchup and lasagne with ricotta. Well, whatever is that thing they call "pasta" and "lasagne"
No wonder obesity is such a problem there 

[TECSHARE]

In USA they eat pasta with ketchup and lasagne with ricotta. Well, whatever is that thing they call "pasta" and "lasagne"
No wonder obesity is such a problem there 

I love people who have probably never even been here or even personally known someone who lives here give their expert opinions on how Americans live based on what they see on television or in news print, as if that is the reality of how most Americans live. Just like all Americans are supposed to sound like they are from Texas if you ask most of the rest of the world. Ignorance works both ways.

[cbeast]

They should release the Gitmo prisoners on GWBs doorstep.

[Gabi]

In USA they eat pasta with ketchup and lasagne with ricotta. Well, whatever is that thing they call "pasta" and "lasagne"
No wonder obesity is such a problem there 

I love people who have probably never even been here or even personally known someone who lives here give their expert opinions on how Americans live based on what they see on television or in news print, as if that is the reality of how most Americans live. Just like all Americans are supposed to sound like they are from Texas if you ask most of the rest of the world. Ignorance works both ways.

But i know what WE eat. Here pasta is pasta and lasagne are lasagne. Peanut butter? No one here liek it. And fast food and hamburgers here are more an extra than a daily thing