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Author Topic: [Payout Updates] Bitcoinica site is taken offline for security investigation  (Read 145884 times)
bremer-btc-user
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June 24, 2012, 01:52:58 PM
 #1001


50% of my 700 BTC if found not to be true would be "devastating"?

We need this to pay back the bond holders of TyGrr-Bot. Please at least give us the 50%. The amount of evidence I have sent in is massive and it is shocking that nothing has been done.

maybe theese 700 btc are invested in TyGrr.bot and are waiting for dividend-payment before they can refund them...  Grin

„Würden die Menschen das Geldsystem verstehen, hätten wir eine Revolution noch vor morgen früh.“

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cryptoanarchist
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June 24, 2012, 01:54:08 PM
 #1002

Cut them some slack guys. It is Sunday in UK.

Nobody works then ... they are not robots.

I work everyday.

About the payouts: working on it. Not much to add except going slowly through accounts to verify the low hanging fruit. There are some accounts marked accurate but they aren't immediately paid because the balance is so large.It could be a devastating blow if a large amount is paid erroneously, so those accounts require more checking.


50% of my 700 BTC if found not to be true would be "devastating"?

We need this to pay back the bond holders of TyGrr-Bot. Please at least give us the 50%. The amount of evidence I have sent in is massive and it is shocking that nothing has been done.

Not so shocking once you realize what kind of people they are.
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June 24, 2012, 02:41:20 PM
 #1003

There are some accounts marked accurate but they aren't immediately paid because the balance is so large.

Ah, so verified accounts with large balances need to be verified verified?

I have sent in all my wire transfer IDs, MtGox claimcode IDs, BTC transfer IDs, Bitcointalk ID, Emails, AML documentation, Screenshots, etc. I had no positions. Anything else you need?

It could be a devastating blow if a large amount is paid erroneously, so those accounts require more checking.

Fine, but it basically sounds like you are sending your largest customers to the back of the line. Even in the face of overwhelming proof from their side.

If you can guarantee that Bitcoinica is able to meet *all* valid claim requests in full (no matter the size) I can deal with that. I'm not asking for the interest I've been missing out on for the last 6 weeks, just my balance back as it was on May 11. At least provide customers with an approximate date on which you expect payments to be made.

Note: I'm not angry at genjix in particular (I think he is doing a great job) but at Bitcoinica in general and the way they have been handling this situation.
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June 24, 2012, 02:48:58 PM
 #1004

ninjarobot, thanks.

I think some of the biggest payments are being made soon (possibly today). It's just we wanted to be extra careful that there was no trivial oversights. For instance we could afford to mistakenly pay out $20 but not $30,000.

Evidence that people send does help, but it is not definitive. We use the evidence you send to try to find matches for you in our records. But if we don't have a record of it, then digital evidence is easily faked and does not mean much.
Maria
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June 24, 2012, 03:04:42 PM
 #1005

ninjarobot, thanks.

I think some of the biggest payments are being made soon (possibly today). It's just we wanted to be extra careful that there was no trivial oversights. For instance we could afford to mistakenly pay out $20 but not $30,000.

Evidence that people send does help, but it is not definitive. We use the evidence you send to try to find matches for you in our records. But if we don't have a record of it, then digital evidence is easily faked and does not mean much.

Hi Genjix,

Any updates on my public claim? I want to make some donations but because my funds are locked up in this mess, I am not able to. If you at least refund 50% then I can at least donate %50.

Maria.
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June 24, 2012, 03:07:44 PM
 #1006

ninjarobot, thanks.

I think some of the biggest payments are being made soon (possibly today). It's just we wanted to be extra careful that there was no trivial oversights. For instance we could afford to mistakenly pay out $20 but not $30,000.

Evidence that people send does help, but it is not definitive. We use the evidence you send to try to find matches for you in our records. But if we don't have a record of it, then digital evidence is easily faked and does not mean much.

The trouble I'm having is that for lack of any specific communication over the course of weeks, despite several emails sent, I'm unable to assess whether I need to offer any more evidence of any kind.  I don't know if information I've offered is verified, not verified, if I'm untrusted for some reason, or not.  I just don't know what my status is.  That's what I, and I'm sure others, would like to know.
bremer-btc-user
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June 24, 2012, 03:22:12 PM
 #1007

ninjarobot, thanks.

I think some of the biggest payments are being made soon (possibly today). It's just we wanted to be extra careful that there was no trivial oversights. For instance we could afford to mistakenly pay out $20 but not $30,000.

Evidence that people send does help, but it is not definitive. We use the evidence you send to try to find matches for you in our records. But if we don't have a record of it, then digital evidence is easily faked and does not mean much.

I agree with ninjarobot in stating that you (genjix) try your very best, but to say that digital evicdences are worth nothing  because they are easy to fake means nothing less that all of our claims are suspected as fraudulent until they are verified according to some few records you may have recoverd from something that was told to us it's lost?

Please answer one Question: Do you think you will be able to verify every honest claim by screening your records and compare them with the informiations that are given to you in the claims and addidional informations? If so, I'll be patient and looking forward to get back my 64.01 BTC some day (hopefulle earlier than later)...

If your answer has to be a "NO" what will you do then?Huh

„Würden die Menschen das Geldsystem verstehen, hätten wir eine Revolution noch vor morgen früh.“

Henry Ford
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June 24, 2012, 03:32:09 PM
 #1008

I agree with ninjarobot in stating that you (genjix) try your very best, but to say that digital evicdences are worth nothing  because they are easy to fake means nothing less that all of our claims are suspected as fraudulent until they are verified according to some few records you may have recoverd from something that was told to us it's lost?

Yes, you're correct.

Quote
Please answer one Question: Do you think you will be able to verify every honest claim by screening your records and compare them with the informiations that are given to you in the claims and addidional informations? If so, I'll be patient and looking forward to get back my 64.01 BTC some day (hopefulle earlier than later)...

If your answer has to be a "NO" what will you do then?Huh

Personally I think the majority of people will be refunded. However there will be honest people who are mistakenly classified as fake and not repaid back. Or others who get paid back less. I really want everyone to get paid back fully, but I'm not going to lie and say that we're going to recreate a perfect database from imperfect records. The process will be fair albeit slow. There's not any other better way around this (I don't think).
bremer-btc-user
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June 24, 2012, 04:13:13 PM
 #1009

maybe it will be more useful to identify "fake-claims" than to try to verify the honest ones?

„Würden die Menschen das Geldsystem verstehen, hätten wir eine Revolution noch vor morgen früh.“

Henry Ford
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June 24, 2012, 06:16:05 PM
 #1010

I agree with ninjarobot in stating that you (genjix) try your very best, but to say that digital evicdences are worth nothing  because they are easy to fake means nothing less that all of our claims are suspected as fraudulent until they are verified according to some few records you may have recoverd from something that was told to us it's lost?

Yes, you're correct.

Quote
Please answer one Question: Do you think you will be able to verify every honest claim by screening your records and compare them with the informiations that are given to you in the claims and addidional informations? If so, I'll be patient and looking forward to get back my 64.01 BTC some day (hopefulle earlier than later)...

If your answer has to be a "NO" what will you do then?Huh

Personally I think the majority of people will be refunded. However there will be honest people who are mistakenly classified as fake and not repaid back. Or others who get paid back less. I really want everyone to get paid back fully, but I'm not going to lie and say that we're going to recreate a perfect database from imperfect records. The process will be fair albeit slow. There's not any other better way around this (I don't think).

Genjix, are you confirming through EMail when you are paying back the claims?  For instance, could it be possible for you to mistakenly think you have paid a claim, when in reality you haven't? 

Just wanted to make sure everyone was on the same page.  Also, I am in the same boat, I don't have 50% of my coins yet.  I am cool with this as long as it's coming sometime, but mainly I wanted to know if you are confirming through EMail when giving back 50%.

Thanks
disclaimer201
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June 24, 2012, 07:45:33 PM
 #1011

I agree with ninjarobot in stating that you (genjix) try your very best, but to say that digital evicdences are worth nothing  because they are easy to fake means nothing less that all of our claims are suspected as fraudulent until they are verified according to some few records you may have recoverd from something that was told to us it's lost?

Yes, you're correct.

Quote
Please answer one Question: Do you think you will be able to verify every honest claim by screening your records and compare them with the informiations that are given to you in the claims and addidional informations? If so, I'll be patient and looking forward to get back my 64.01 BTC some day (hopefulle earlier than later)...

If your answer has to be a "NO" what will you do then?Huh

Personally I think the majority of people will be refunded. However there will be honest people who are mistakenly classified as fake and not repaid back. Or others who get paid back less. I really want everyone to get paid back fully, but I'm not going to lie and say that we're going to recreate a perfect database from imperfect records. The process will be fair albeit slow. There's not any other better way around this (I don't think).

Genjix, are you confirming through EMail when you are paying back the claims?  For instance, could it be possible for you to mistakenly think you have paid a claim, when in reality you haven't? 

Just wanted to make sure everyone was on the same page.  Also, I am in the same boat, I don't have 50% of my coins yet.  I am cool with this as long as it's coming sometime, but mainly I wanted to know if you are confirming through EMail when giving back 50%.

Thanks

I was surprised not to have gotten an email before receiving my 50%.

dancingnancy
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June 24, 2012, 07:52:49 PM
 #1012

Yes, I would think that they would be doing this?
ninjarobot
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June 24, 2012, 08:11:33 PM
 #1013

However there will be honest people who are mistakenly classified as fake and not repaid back. Or others who get paid back less.

I don't think customers that know for a fact that their claim is correct will accept this, nor should they.

Sounds to me that there will have to be an 'Appeals' process in the near future if this will be the case.
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June 24, 2012, 08:15:42 PM
 #1014

I emailed bitcoinica.reimburse@gmail.com several days ago asking for a status update. No response yet. Please let me know what further action you require. You have my passport on file, and you know who I am.

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June 24, 2012, 08:22:13 PM
 #1015

I emailed bitcoinica.reimburse@gmail.com several days ago asking for a status update. No response yet. Please let me know what further action you require. You have my passport on file, and you know who I am.

Good luck.  I've emailed them a bunch of times over the past month(s) at every address they've posted in this thread, including several emails to the email address you just mentioned, and I haven't gotten back a single response.  All I want to know is the status of my claim and whether any additional information is needed from me.  Others have reported getting responses back, and that only worries me more because it makes me wonder if there's some reason I'm being completely ignored.
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June 24, 2012, 08:24:00 PM
 #1016

I agree with ninjarobot in stating that you (genjix) try your very best, but to say that digital evicdences are worth nothing  because they are easy to fake means nothing less that all of our claims are suspected as fraudulent until they are verified according to some few records you may have recoverd from something that was told to us it's lost?

Yes, you're correct.

Quote
Please answer one Question: Do you think you will be able to verify every honest claim by screening your records and compare them with the informiations that are given to you in the claims and addidional informations? If so, I'll be patient and looking forward to get back my 64.01 BTC some day (hopefulle earlier than later)...

If your answer has to be a "NO" what will you do then?Huh

Personally I think the majority of people will be refunded. However there will be honest people who are mistakenly classified as fake and not repaid back. Or others who get paid back less. I really want everyone to get paid back fully, but I'm not going to lie and say that we're going to recreate a perfect database from imperfect records. The process will be fair albeit slow. There's not any other better way around this (I don't think).

Genjix, are you confirming through EMail when you are paying back the claims?  For instance, could it be possible for you to mistakenly think you have paid a claim, when in reality you haven't? 

Just wanted to make sure everyone was on the same page.  Also, I am in the same boat, I don't have 50% of my coins yet.  I am cool with this as long as it's coming sometime, but mainly I wanted to know if you are confirming through EMail when giving back 50%.

Thanks

I was surprised not to have gotten an email before receiving my 50%.

Forgot to ask, but does your personal "claim page" reflect any notation that your 50% has been paid back to you?

Mushoz
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June 24, 2012, 10:31:54 PM
 #1017

Forgot to ask, but does your personal "claim page" reflect any notation that your 50% has been paid back to you?

Nope, it does not. Suddenly I got an incoming 112,50 BTC transaction in my client. Haven't received an email about the 50% payment either.

www.bitbuy.nl - Koop eenvoudig, snel en goedkoop bitcoins bij Bitbuy!
MrTeal
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June 25, 2012, 02:24:20 AM
 #1018

Forgot to ask, but does your personal "claim page" reflect any notation that your 50% has been paid back to you?

Nope, it does not. Suddenly I got an incoming 112,50 BTC transaction in my client. Haven't received an email about the 50% payment either.

I was just about to comment on the size of your 50% payout, until I realize you didn't mean 112kBTC. Wink
guruvan
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June 25, 2012, 02:47:57 AM
 #1019

ugh - now I realize I haven't sent my mails "FROM" the mail account used as the email address on the account. duh. (I did send them gpg signed with my otc registered key, which is posted all over guruvan.net, which I think one can see I clearly own. (they were cc to the bitcionica email addy tho)

of course, just like on this website here, I use inbound only email addresses for most sites.

sigh.

shall I inundate you with a bunch more mail? What can I do to make this easier for you to pay me? I'm happy to do anything that helps.

3 months and almost a $2 move ........

Mine at the Maza Club! with ShastaFarEye Prospectors! Mazacoin PPS & P2pool mining, and more services coming soon!
Maza Means Money! Check yours at the mazacha.in!

Please contact me  on my  OTC registered GPG (A54E87F2) Key's email address or guruvan@shastafareye.net  and encrypt all correspondence.
guruvan
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June 25, 2012, 02:52:02 AM
 #1020

ninjarobot, thanks.

I think some of the biggest payments are being made soon (possibly today). It's just we wanted to be extra careful that there was no trivial oversights. For instance we could afford to mistakenly pay out $20 but not $30,000.

Evidence that people send does help, but it is not definitive. We use the evidence you send to try to find matches for you in our records. But if we don't have a record of it, then digital evidence is easily faked and does not mean much.

The trouble I'm having is that for lack of any specific communication over the course of weeks, despite several emails sent, I'm unable to assess whether I need to offer any more evidence of any kind.  I don't know if information I've offered is verified, not verified, if I'm untrusted for some reason, or not.  I just don't know what my status is.  That's what I, and I'm sure others, would like to know.

This

Mine at the Maza Club! with ShastaFarEye Prospectors! Mazacoin PPS & P2pool mining, and more services coming soon!
Maza Means Money! Check yours at the mazacha.in!

Please contact me  on my  OTC registered GPG (A54E87F2) Key's email address or guruvan@shastafareye.net  and encrypt all correspondence.
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