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Author Topic: Convince a Micronation to Use Bitcoin  (Read 4701 times)
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May 16, 2011, 01:55:33 PM
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May 16, 2011, 02:44:04 PM
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Tax evasion via Monaco/Canal islands/etc. isnt as easy as it used too. And it seems to be getting worse.

I'm not talking about tax evasion, I'm talking about places with very low taxes.

The idea of seasteading is that people would move to live there. And by the way, it's not meant to be "for rich only". The idea is to create prosperity for all. Obviously that in the beginning poor people will not be able to afford floating houses, but as times goes by and technology advances, the "ocean tax" becomes smaller, while government taxes quite the contrary...
I doubt the economic validity of that. Its horrible expensive to set up and just about the only thing i could think of that could generate enough money is being a tax-haven. Margins in fishing/producing are far too low. And white-collar labor (IT, for example) isnt profitable enough either, by a long shot, i think. First-class-tourism? But (as a tourist) i still prefer real islands with sandy beaches (that dont have to be built first, which saves quite a bit on investment).

Estimates say that a concrete submarine with living space equivalent to a 60m2 apartment could cost something between $60k to $100k to build. It's not that expensive.

The challenge is for sure to come up with a "business plan" that could sustain a village and eventually grow to a city. White-collar labor is for sure a possibility, and there are others. "Medical tourism" is a big possibility if you consider existent medical laws in most countries. Drugs/prostitution/gambling tourism too, a sort of improved Las Vegas. Anyway, there are several possibilities. And the big deal is to start. Once the first steps are taken, more industries and services would be attracted by the economic freedom of the place.

Youll have to pick a good convenience flag, extradition treaties are now quite commonly made with all countries.

These treaties don't concern what happens in the other country. It seems you see the seasteading idea as something to run away from prosecutions in your home land. It is not it. If all you want is to run away, just go to Rio de Janeiro. Cheesy

Besides, I still doubt you will get much people living on a floating island for long periods of time unless they get a sizable benefit (beyond idealistic hope for an idyllic future). I just dont see where that benefit should be coming from and i see plenty downside (mostly cost)).

Well, I see many potential benefits, yes. You should watch the talk I linked you to.

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May 16, 2011, 10:29:04 PM
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May 17, 2011, 03:47:59 AM
 #24

One of my dreams is form a small nation, kinda like a indigenous tribe, plainly because I believe it is a better form of government.

But I see that this is almost impossible to be done without war :/

The most feasible plan so far is buy a large farm, remain part of the country where it is located for a while, build a fortress, a army, and only then claim independence (and the likely result will be a bloody war...)

Not if you have nukes.  A rich bitcoiner could pick them up off the black market for $20 000 000 or so purely as a defensive measure. Self defence ftw.
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May 17, 2011, 04:00:12 AM
 #25

That last post was a joke btw  Smiley

http://freestateproject.org/ or http://www.freetownproject.com/ are possible projects worth following.

The other option is the freemen on the land and others like the Amish people. Theres a few indian tribes that are independent nations withint the US. "Nation" means family not the corrupted word the states use. http://freelakotabank.com/ bills itself as the "world's only non-reserve, non-fractional bank."
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May 17, 2011, 05:38:43 AM
 #26


Cool concept.  Does anyone know if the Free Lakota Bank is for US citizens only?

Cheers,

Klaus Alexander Seistrup
http://about.me/kseistrup
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April 17, 2013, 01:26:00 AM
 #27

Arise Chikun! Sealand may be making bitcoin the official currency! http://www.reddit.com/r/IAmA/comments/1cgo6n/iama_im_prince_michael_of_the_principality_of/c9gavep?context=2
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April 17, 2013, 06:24:41 AM
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I wonder today if that's a good thing.
Of course, kudos to Sealand's prince for even thinking about it.
But, I mean, would it be good for bitcoiners? If Bitcoin becomes the official currency of a country, wouldn't legislation about buying/selling/holding it automatically become harsher in most other countries?
Just as an example, wouldn't Argentina's capital controls automatically apply, making TradeHill plans impossible to start?
I'd like to be wrong on that one, but I'm not sure.

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April 17, 2013, 10:59:27 AM
 #29


I wonder today if that's a good thing.
Of course, kudos to Sealand's prince for even thinking about it.
But, I mean, would it be good for bitcoiners? If Bitcoin becomes the official currency of a country, wouldn't legislation about buying/selling/holding it automatically become harsher in most other countries?
Just as an example, wouldn't Argentina's capital controls automatically apply, making TradeHill plans impossible to start?
I'd like to be wrong on that one, but I'm not sure.

They would have to take Sealand seriously first. I personally like bitcoin because no one is forced to use it.
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April 17, 2013, 03:43:17 PM
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The most feasible plan so far is buy a large farm, remain part of the country where it is located for a while, build a fortress, a army, and only then claim independence (and the likely result will be a bloody war...)

Hahahahaha.

You've read too many fantasy books.
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April 17, 2013, 04:08:58 PM
 #31

We should convince our representatives to bring a motion, to legalize bitcoin as a national alternative currency. Then in time,our great representatives will have their say about bitcoin as global currency at UN,and then


Target achieved one earth,one currency.    Smiley

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April 17, 2013, 04:51:59 PM
 #32

Sealand should totally adopt Bitcoin.

Then become a semi-legal micro-nation with a datacenter based economy.

On a converted repurposed mishmash of once ocean-traveling ships, while the polar ice caps melt at an ever-alarming rate.

Holy crap.... it must be 'the future' because that straight-up sounds like a plot from a '80s cyberpunk novel Smiley 

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April 17, 2013, 07:54:46 PM
 #33

convince a real small nation to use them and we are talking
which of course wouldn't happen due to states desiring absolute control over currency

My attempt at adding to the bitcoin-using marketplace: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=171843.0
Like online video games? Check it out! I'm selling at a big discount
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April 17, 2013, 09:35:03 PM
 #34


Whoa, that's crazy. I e-mailed Sealand and recommended they adopt bitcoin as a currency a few months ago.
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April 17, 2013, 09:50:19 PM
 #35

Sealand should totally adopt Bitcoin.

Then become a semi-legal micro-nation with a datacenter based economy.

On a converted repurposed mishmash of once ocean-traveling ships, while the polar ice caps melt at an ever-alarming rate.

Holy crap.... it must be 'the future' because that straight-up sounds like a plot from a '80s cyberpunk novel Smiley 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Snow_Crash

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April 18, 2013, 03:07:21 AM
 #36



What armies do places like Monaco, Lichtenstein, Singapore and others have?


Spy armies. http://www.forbes.com/forbes/2011/0926/focus-monaco-prince-albert-spy-legal-falkenberg.html
http://www.eringerreport.com/
http://www.eringerreport.com/2012/10/monaco-spymaster-rules-1.html
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