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Author Topic: How much is a mBTC equal to?  (Read 107868 times)
GeorgeFeb
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July 02, 2014, 01:54:25 PM
 #21

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So 1 mBTC = 0.00100000 BTC?

I love to see a full digits length!

How much will be 0.01985 mBTC then?

0.00001985 BTC  Grin

Damn, I thought so, cheers! Smiley
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July 02, 2014, 01:57:19 PM
 #22

OP is right -- too confusing. Smiley Screw this whole SI unit thing. BTC is a unit already, and it's widely accepted. This unit changing idea is so obviously pegged to USD value, that it means we'll go from mBTC, onto uBTC, satoshis, etc. etc. Or "bits" -- what the hell is that? Just some made up crap.

BTC is a unit.....

It is true that "btc" is a unit, but it is very reasonable and logical to use different units like "mbtc", "μbtc" and "sat", for different kinds of purpose.

For example meter "m" is a unit, but we also have and use nm, mm, cm, km as well for measurements of different kinds of stuff.
Another example would be B, KB, MB, GB, TB, etc. Smiley

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July 02, 2014, 06:25:00 PM
 #23

OP is right -- too confusing. Smiley Screw this whole SI unit thing. BTC is a unit already, and it's widely accepted. This unit changing idea is so obviously pegged to USD value, that it means we'll go from mBTC, onto uBTC, satoshis, etc. etc. Or "bits" -- what the hell is that? Just some made up crap.

BTC is a unit.....

I agree that fractional units of BTC is confusing right now, but I also think that as the BTC value increases in economies around the world, the practicality of fractional units and their corresponding names will be appealing. Your comment about the units being 'pegged to the USD value' are partially true. If you peg BTC value to any fiat though it would be the same, and that pegging is just a current approximation of value in that economy.

For example, I recently paid .004658 BTC for a sandwich here in Seattle. It would have been much easier to quickly wrap my head around price if I didn't have to count trailing digits correctly - just basic human cognition. In small purchase cases, a fractional unit would have been helpful, e.g. 4.65 mBTC in this case.

By the way, 1 meter is a unit..... and centimeters, millimeters and so on have proven useful and therefore been widely adopted.


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July 02, 2014, 08:24:43 PM
 #24

So 1 mBTC = 0.00100000 BTC?

I love to see a full digits length!

How much will be 0.01985 mBTC then?

1 BTC = 1000 mBTC

1 mBTC = 0.001 BTC
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July 03, 2014, 02:32:35 AM
 #25

and, is it anything like uBTC?

It's based on the metric system (google it if you don't know it)

You probably already know centi, from percent, centimeter, and cents. It means 1/100th of something

m (lower case) stands for milli, which means 1/1000th of something (in this case bitcoin, so 0.001 bitcoin or 1/10th of a cent)


uBTC is a different way of spelling μ (Greek lowercase 'mu' where m is derived from, because m was already taken for milli, and M for Mega)  and it means micro (1/1000000) or 1 millionth of something.

After micro comes nano, but that is even smaller than a satoshi, which is not currently supported (maybe in the future). You may have heard of nano before. Computer chips are so small they are measured in nanometers.

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July 03, 2014, 02:37:08 AM
 #26

OP is right -- too confusing. Smiley Screw this whole SI unit thing. BTC is a unit already, and it's widely accepted. This unit changing idea is so obviously pegged to USD value, that it means we'll go from mBTC, onto uBTC, satoshis, etc. etc. Or "bits" -- what the hell is that? Just some made up crap.

BTC is a unit.....

If you screw the metric system have fun without measuring in kilometers, kilograms, centimeters, Celsius, ampere, volts, ohms, watts, joule, newton, pascal, kelvin, gigahertz, terabytes, and what not.

Have fun with your feet, bananas, inches, spider legs and whatever tools you have laying around there caveman.

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July 03, 2014, 02:41:48 AM
 #27

OP is right -- too confusing. Smiley Screw this whole SI unit thing. BTC is a unit already, and it's widely accepted. This unit changing idea is so obviously pegged to USD value, that it means we'll go from mBTC, onto uBTC, satoshis, etc. etc. Or "bits" -- what the hell is that? Just some made up crap.

BTC is a unit.....

If you screw the metric system have fun without measuring in kilometers, kilograms, centimeters, Celsius, ampere, volts, ohms, watts, joule, newton, pascal, kelvin, gigahertz, terabytes, and what not.

Have fun with your feet, bananas, inches, spider legs and whatever tools you have laying around there caveman.

You're missing the point. Apparently it went way over your head. I have no problem with the metric system. Roll Eyes

BTC is already a unit. What legitimate reason is there to peg it to fiat value -- seemingly the only justification for perpetually changing its unit? Every few years, we gonna change the unit? How many different wallet standards will there be, and how many people are going to send irreversible payments in the wrong order of magnitude?

The dollar is perpetually being devalued -- the inverse of BTC. Do we constantly change the dollar's accepted unit, as it loses value? No; it is a standard that people are used to and understand. Same goes for BTC.

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July 03, 2014, 03:09:24 AM
 #28

OP is right -- too confusing. Smiley Screw this whole SI unit thing. BTC is a unit already, and it's widely accepted. This unit changing idea is so obviously pegged to USD value, that it means we'll go from mBTC, onto uBTC, satoshis, etc. etc. Or "bits" -- what the hell is that? Just some made up crap.

BTC is a unit.....

If you screw the metric system have fun without measuring in kilometers, kilograms, centimeters, Celsius, ampere, volts, ohms, watts, joule, newton, pascal, kelvin, gigahertz, terabytes, and what not.

Have fun with your feet, bananas, inches, spider legs and whatever tools you have laying around there caveman.

You're missing the point. Apparently it went way over your head. I have no problem with the metric system. Roll Eyes

BTC is already a unit. What legitimate reason is there to peg it to fiat value -- seemingly the only justification for perpetually changing its unit? Every few years, we gonna change the unit? How many different wallet standards will there be, and how many people are going to send irreversible payments in the wrong order of magnitude?

The dollar is perpetually being devalued -- the inverse of BTC. Do we constantly change the dollar's accepted unit, as it loses value? No; it is a standard that people are used to and understand. Same goes for BTC.

We're not really making up new terms though. We are simply affixing already established metric prefixes to the units that we already know in order to distinguish their denomination. Here is a link to a few common metric prefixes. As you can see, calling an amount a centibitcoin is no different from calling a hundredth of a dollar a cent. We can also call it a megasatoshi.

As far as wallet standards go, using different standard units is indeed an annoyance. However, as long as people understand how much a unit is as opposed to a satoshi, then there really shouldn't be a problem. It's not like a satoshi will be worth 0.01 USD anytime soon, so we won't be needing a new unit beyond it.

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July 03, 2014, 03:37:56 AM
 #29

OP is right -- too confusing. Smiley Screw this whole SI unit thing. BTC is a unit already, and it's widely accepted. This unit changing idea is so obviously pegged to USD value, that it means we'll go from mBTC, onto uBTC, satoshis, etc. etc. Or "bits" -- what the hell is that? Just some made up crap.

BTC is a unit.....

If you screw the metric system have fun without measuring in kilometers, kilograms, centimeters, Celsius, ampere, volts, ohms, watts, joule, newton, pascal, kelvin, gigahertz, terabytes, and what not.

Have fun with your feet, bananas, inches, spider legs and whatever tools you have laying around there caveman.

You're missing the point. Apparently it went way over your head. I have no problem with the metric system. Roll Eyes

BTC is already a unit. What legitimate reason is there to peg it to fiat value -- seemingly the only justification for perpetually changing its unit? Every few years, we gonna change the unit? How many different wallet standards will there be, and how many people are going to send irreversible payments in the wrong order of magnitude?

The dollar is perpetually being devalued -- the inverse of BTC. Do we constantly change the dollar's accepted unit, as it loses value? No; it is a standard that people are used to and understand. Same goes for BTC.

We're not really making up new terms though. We are simply affixing already established metric prefixes to the units that we already know in order to distinguish their denomination. Here is a link to a few common metric prefixes. As you can see, calling an amount a centibitcoin is no different from calling a hundredth of a dollar a cent. We can also call it a megasatoshi.

As far as wallet standards go, using different standard units is indeed an annoyance. However, as long as people understand how much a unit is as opposed to a satoshi, then there really shouldn't be a problem. It's not like a satoshi will be worth 0.01 USD anytime soon, so we won't be needing a new unit beyond it.

Nobody said anything about "making up" terms. I am aware of the metric system, LOL. This is not about what the metric system is -- it is about whether it is useful or applicable here. I argue that it is not. Again, I see no reason to peg BTC value to USD value, and as your last point suggests, that's what this is really all about.

Would someone explain to me why that is necessary?

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July 03, 2014, 11:25:38 AM
 #30

well 1 mbtc = 0.001

when i was a newbie on bitcoin first i see the site coinad.. and they pay in mbtc.. then i go to bitcoinstore.com and see that the thing about 0.15 like .. or more ..

then i thought i get too much from coinad .. after with i see thats one mbtc worth only 0.001 Cheesy of btc..

So if anyone ask you to give mbtc ask him i will take only btc or atleast 100 mbtc Cheesy

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July 03, 2014, 11:57:54 AM
 #31

OP is right -- too confusing. Smiley Screw this whole SI unit thing. BTC is a unit already, and it's widely accepted. This unit changing idea is so obviously pegged to USD value, that it means we'll go from mBTC, onto uBTC, satoshis, etc. etc. Or "bits" -- what the hell is that? Just some made up crap.

BTC is a unit.....

If you screw the metric system have fun without measuring in kilometers, kilograms, centimeters, Celsius, ampere, volts, ohms, watts, joule, newton, pascal, kelvin, gigahertz, terabytes, and what not.

Have fun with your feet, bananas, inches, spider legs and whatever tools you have laying around there caveman.

You're missing the point. Apparently it went way over your head. I have no problem with the metric system. Roll Eyes

BTC is already a unit. What legitimate reason is there to peg it to fiat value -- seemingly the only justification for perpetually changing its unit? Every few years, we gonna change the unit? How many different wallet standards will there be, and how many people are going to send irreversible payments in the wrong order of magnitude?

The dollar is perpetually being devalued -- the inverse of BTC. Do we constantly change the dollar's accepted unit, as it loses value? No; it is a standard that people are used to and understand. Same goes for BTC.

A kilogram is a not a different unit from a gram just like a gigabyte is no different from a megabyte,

There's a unit (gram, bytes, meters, whatever) and a prefix to show the correct order of magnitude so you will at most need 2 decimal places (which we are used to) so if you use the metric system, no matter how small or how large, you can always use the same single unit without needing many decimals. For example, need to measure a distance traveled by car? Use the prefix kilo (which means multiply by 1000) on the unit of distance (meters) and you'll measure distance in kilometers so you don't need to add 3 zeroes and the distance traveled is probably less than 1000 kilometers (otherwise you should TECHNICALLY use megameters Altough noone really uses that)

However meters or kilometers would be quite useless if you are measuring your windows in order to place new frames. You'll need more precision so you divide by 1000 to get millimeters. (Or centimeters, but millimeters is usualy prefered in this case)

Is that not exactly what we want? Using one unit (bitcoin) without using more than 2 decimals? Welcome to the metric system.

It's the bitcoin that is the unit, and milli, micro that is the prefix. Need to buy a house or a car? Bitcoin will do. Need to buy a bread? Millibitcoin will do (for now)

Is it the year 2018 and is bitcoin worth a million?

Need to buy a yacht? A couple of bitcoin will do
Need to buy a car? Millibitcoin will be enough
Need to buy a bread? Microbitcoin will be the best choice

Never need units larger than 1000 and never need units smaller than 0.01

Want large numbers? Measure in microbitcoins and enjoy feeling rich by owning over a million micros

Have you ever seen someone say: well I went on vacation to Spain and it was only 20 millimeters travel?

Of course not! We automatically use the prefix that fits the situation. If the prefix makes it so that the number is between 999 and 0.01 than you use the right prefix. Well technically if we want to be strict about it you should always use the unit that is between 999 and 1.00 (called engineering notation) but either way works.

By the nature of having very many decimals and very large as well as very small numbers (up from megabitcoin, which will probably never be used down to almost nanobitcoin which might be used in the future) makes bitcoin absolutely one of the prime examples of why the metric prefixes were invented in the first place.

Let me explain again. The sole purpose of Metric prefixes is to avoid having to use very large or very small numbers, while having only 1 standard unit of measurement. To avoid conflicting and confusing units and unit conversions. 

Would you rather have millimeters and centimeters than having inches, yards and miles? Don't let bitcoin fall to the imperial system with all their weird 'bits' or we might as well introduce the banana scale.

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July 03, 2014, 12:18:32 PM
 #32

At the current bitcoin price, it is okay to stick with the unit "btc".
But as zimmah explained, if the bitcoin price goes up dramatically, it is good to use different units for different kinds of trades.

Could you imagine we use "byte" for HDD size and use "meter" for size of transistor in CPU?

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July 04, 2014, 02:54:39 AM
 #33

1 mBTC = 0.001 BTC= 0.64204 USD (Right?)

In Indonesia you can buy 1 pcs of burger or 1 glass of juice, or 1 pcs of fried chicken or 3-4 minutes telephoner or 360 mb internet data charge

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July 04, 2014, 04:50:27 AM
 #34

OP is right -- too confusing. Smiley Screw this whole SI unit thing. BTC is a unit already, and it's widely accepted. This unit changing idea is so obviously pegged to USD value, that it means we'll go from mBTC, onto uBTC, satoshis, etc. etc. Or "bits" -- what the hell is that? Just some made up crap.

BTC is a unit.....

If you screw the metric system have fun without measuring in kilometers, kilograms, centimeters, Celsius, ampere, volts, ohms, watts, joule, newton, pascal, kelvin, gigahertz, terabytes, and what not.

Have fun with your feet, bananas, inches, spider legs and whatever tools you have laying around there caveman.

You're missing the point. Apparently it went way over your head. I have no problem with the metric system. Roll Eyes

BTC is already a unit. What legitimate reason is there to peg it to fiat value -- seemingly the only justification for perpetually changing its unit? Every few years, we gonna change the unit? How many different wallet standards will there be, and how many people are going to send irreversible payments in the wrong order of magnitude?

The dollar is perpetually being devalued -- the inverse of BTC. Do we constantly change the dollar's accepted unit, as it loses value? No; it is a standard that people are used to and understand. Same goes for BTC.

However meters or kilometers would be quite useless if you are measuring your windows in order to place new frames. You'll need more precision so you divide by 1000 to get millimeters. (Or centimeters, but millimeters is usualy prefered in this case)
[...]

Need to buy a yacht? A couple of bitcoin will do
Need to buy a car? Millibitcoin will be enough
Need to buy a bread? Microbitcoin will be the best choice

[...]

Would you rather have millimeters and centimeters than having inches, yards and miles? Don't let bitcoin fall to the imperial system with all their weird 'bits' or we might as well introduce the banana scale.

Believe me, I do not advocate for "bits"....

Perhaps my perspective is off, being an early adopter. I've watched BTC from < $1 to > $1000. And it will always be BTC to me. I view my wallet balances in coins, not millicoins. Smiley One issue, as I mentioned, is that I see a potential problem with standardization when BTC's value could very well rise significantly over relatively short periods of time (years). If the prefix is constantly changing, I could see a lot of potential confusion -- not to mention I have no idea how consensus would be reached among BTC users and vendors. And I foresee lots of people sending irreversible payments to the wrong order of magnitude. Sure, dollars break down to cents. Do I view $1.50 as 150 cents? $100.50 as 10,050 cents? Hell no. Same goes for BTC. When gold went from < $300 to > $1900, did we consider switching to mXAU? Tongue

But more bothersome to me is that the push to view BTC's price predominantly in mBTC (and later more precise units), is that I feel the people pushing this are doing so purely for financial gain -- the prevalent argument being that late adopters need to psychologically feel like they are getting more for their money, in order for increased adoption and therefore significant price rise to occur. I think that's total bullshit.

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July 04, 2014, 05:45:17 AM
 #35

But more bothersome to me is that the push to view BTC's price predominantly in mBTC (and later more precise units), is that I feel the people pushing this are doing so purely for financial gain -- the prevalent argument being that late adopters need to psychologically feel like they are getting more for their money, in order for increased adoption and therefore significant price rise to occur. I think that's total bullshit.

That is interesting.
I personally don't see that psychological effect, but do other people really feel happier receiving 1 mbtc than 0.001 btc?

Fixed. Smiley

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July 04, 2014, 06:49:12 AM
 #36

But more bothersome to me is that the push to view BTC's price predominantly in mBTC (and later more precise units), is that I feel the people pushing this are doing so purely for financial gain -- the prevalent argument being that late adopters need to psychologically feel like they are getting more for their money, in order for increased adoption and therefore significant price rise to occur. I think that's total bullshit.

That is interesting.
I personally don't see that psychological effect, but do other people really feel happier receiving 1 mbtc than 0.01 btc?

That's the argument I've heard, anyway. Apparently, prospective buyers are like little babies -- break a cookie up into several pieces, and they think it's more than one cookie....

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July 04, 2014, 10:07:32 AM
 #37

OP is right -- too confusing. Smiley Screw this whole SI unit thing. BTC is a unit already, and it's widely accepted. This unit changing idea is so obviously pegged to USD value, that it means we'll go from mBTC, onto uBTC, satoshis, etc. etc. Or "bits" -- what the hell is that? Just some made up crap.

BTC is a unit.....

If you screw the metric system have fun without measuring in kilometers, kilograms, centimeters, Celsius, ampere, volts, ohms, watts, joule, newton, pascal, kelvin, gigahertz, terabytes, and what not.

Have fun with your feet, bananas, inches, spider legs and whatever tools you have laying around there caveman.

You're missing the point. Apparently it went way over your head. I have no problem with the metric system. Roll Eyes

BTC is already a unit. What legitimate reason is there to peg it to fiat value -- seemingly the only justification for perpetually changing its unit? Every few years, we gonna change the unit? How many different wallet standards will there be, and how many people are going to send irreversible payments in the wrong order of magnitude?

The dollar is perpetually being devalued -- the inverse of BTC. Do we constantly change the dollar's accepted unit, as it loses value? No; it is a standard that people are used to and understand. Same goes for BTC.

However meters or kilometers would be quite useless if you are measuring your windows in order to place new frames. You'll need more precision so you divide by 1000 to get millimeters. (Or centimeters, but millimeters is usualy prefered in this case)
[...]

Need to buy a yacht? A couple of bitcoin will do
Need to buy a car? Millibitcoin will be enough
Need to buy a bread? Microbitcoin will be the best choice

[...]

Would you rather have millimeters and centimeters than having inches, yards and miles? Don't let bitcoin fall to the imperial system with all their weird 'bits' or we might as well introduce the banana scale.

Believe me, I do not advocate for "bits"....

Perhaps my perspective is off, being an early adopter. I've watched BTC from < $1 to > $1000. And it will always be BTC to me. I view my wallet balances in coins, not millicoins. Smiley One issue, as I mentioned, is that I see a potential problem with standardization when BTC's value could very well rise significantly over relatively short periods of time (years). If the prefix is constantly changing, I could see a lot of potential confusion -- not to mention I have no idea how consensus would be reached among BTC users and vendors. And I foresee lots of people sending irreversible payments to the wrong order of magnitude. Sure, dollars break down to cents. Do I view $1.50 as 150 cents? $100.50 as 10,050 cents? Hell no. Same goes for BTC. When gold went from < $300 to > $1900, did we consider switching to mXAU? Tongue

But more bothersome to me is that the push to view BTC's price predominantly in mBTC (and later more precise units), is that I feel the people pushing this are doing so purely for financial gain -- the prevalent argument being that late adopters need to psychologically feel like they are getting more for their money, in order for increased adoption and therefore significant price rise to occur. I think that's total bullshit.

You don't need to change anything, you just use the prefix that keeps the price between 1 and 1000 regardless of how much a bitcoin is worth.

It's the same with hard disks. They never really sell a hard disk with 5000 GB, but instead they sell hard disks of 5 TB but they don't sell 0.5 TB. It's all about convenient numbers.

Just like you wouldn't pay for a car with pennies, nor would you buy a bread and pay with $100

It's still the same bitcoin, but you just shift the comma a few spaces so you get an easy to understand number.

But more bothersome to me is that the push to view BTC's price predominantly in mBTC (and later more precise units), is that I feel the people pushing this are doing so purely for financial gain -- the prevalent argument being that late adopters need to psychologically feel like they are getting more for their money, in order for increased adoption and therefore significant price rise to occur. I think that's total bullshit.

That is interesting.
I personally don't see that psychological effect, but do other people really feel happier receiving 1 mbtc than 0.01 btc?

I'd prefer 0.01 btc (as it's 10 mBTC)

Also I am fairly sure people prefer owning a 'whole' unit of something. I often hear the argument, "I'd like to buy bitcoin but I can't afford it". Which is totally flawed  logic, but the feel too good to buy a fraction of a bitcoin. Because what use is a small fraction of a bitcoin?

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July 04, 2014, 10:21:42 AM
 #38

But more bothersome to me is that the push to view BTC's price predominantly in mBTC (and later more precise units), is that I feel the people pushing this are doing so purely for financial gain -- the prevalent argument being that late adopters need to psychologically feel like they are getting more for their money, in order for increased adoption and therefore significant price rise to occur. I think that's total bullshit.

That is interesting.
I personally don't see that psychological effect, but do other people really feel happier receiving 1 mbtc than 0.01 btc?

That's the argument I've heard, anyway. Apparently, prospective buyers are like little babies -- break a cookie up into several pieces, and they think it's more than one cookie....

I'd prefer 0.01 btc (as it's 10 mBTC)

Also I am fairly sure people prefer owning a 'whole' unit of something. I often hear the argument, "I'd like to buy bitcoin but I can't afford it". Which is totally flawed  logic, but the feel too good to buy a fraction of a bitcoin. Because what use is a small fraction of a bitcoin?

Ouch, my bad, it should be 0.001 instead. I have fixed it now.
I see, thanks CEG5952 and zimmah for your cookie example and explanations. Cheesy

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July 04, 2014, 01:32:44 PM
 #39

its confusing for me, can't push myself to use mBTC or understand it
thank god its not needed yet Tongue

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July 04, 2014, 03:05:33 PM
 #40

its confusing for me, can't push myself to use mBTC or understand it
thank god its not needed yet Tongue

Yeah it's a way more comfy to use decimals: 0. 0000 0000
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