▁ ▂ ▄ ▅ ▆ Cloudmining 101 (ponzi risk assessment) ▆ ▅ ▄ ▂ ▁

[raskul]

we should have a competition... how many ponzi's can you find in a day


https://www.skycoinlab.com

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[Tigggger]

At the rate these are springing up could be a full time job maintaining this list.

I suggest starting with the basis that any new ones are 1+2+3+4+5+6+7 = Ponzi, and send the site owners a message pointing to this thread and encourage them to provide the proof needed to ensure they don't remain marked that way, let them do the bulk of the work to prove they are legit.

[Puppet]

At the rate these are springing up could be a full time job maintaining this list.

I suggest starting with the basis that any new ones are 1+2+3+4+5+6+7 = Ponzi, and send the site owners a message pointing to this thread and encourage them to provide the proof needed to ensure they don't remain marked that way, let them do the bulk of the work to prove they are legit.

I was pretty much doing that already, but I dont think its fair to label anyone as a ponzi if I havent even checked them out, or given them an opportunity to give or highlight evidence that may be public. So as of now, and with the above linked (scam, bet on it), I just ask the questions I use as criteria and give the operator a chance to reply before defaulting their score to 7/7.

[Puppet]

It takes one click to oversell and instant ponzi

True, but a real company with real people and real assets would then be taking a real risk, financially and potentially even facing jail time. Its possible of course, see MtGox, but its not equally likely to happen as with these anonymous copy/paste scams. I hope Im not implying any of these companies is somehow 100% trustworthy, no company or person ever is. You could one day run away with an escrow,  but that doesnt mean you are as likely to scam someone as, say, Dank,

[Puppet]

I started a signature campaign to promote this thread and push back a tiny little bit against the ponzi's:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=888864

[jokerboy]

What do you think about https://hashprofit.com ? Is it legit ?

[Puppet]

You find them under the list with the others that I havent yet formally rated. Looks suspicious (probably 4 or 5 points), but Id need to investigate further

[jokerboy]

You find them under the list with the others that I havent yet formally rated. Looks suspicious (probably 4 or 5 points), but Id need to investigate further

I saw that but I just think maybe you had a decision so far.  Thanks

[raskul]

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=444495.msg4885241#msg4885241

www.scrypt.cc

looks like another ponzi winding down

[onyxxerl]

kNCloud?
Google even doesnot find it........and this should be legal?

[Puppet]

typo. Its knccloud
https://www.knccloud.com/

Ill fix it.

[cypher21]

Hi puppet.
First thx for your list.

But i have an idea to made your list clearly.  Can you pls made 2 list: one with the services that payout and another list of services which already collapsed. I think we have a better view in the lists. And i probably think that in the future the list of the collapsed services grow...

[johny08]

There is hashfast cloud Mining starting 20 december and i am already in since 10 days.

[raskul]

There is hashfast cloud Mining starting 20 december and i am already in since 10 days.

do you have a link for this?

[Wintermute]

It is like this for about three weeks now (not to talk about X11 which is "available soon" since about three months)

Not sure what you are trying to say.

I was referring to point number (4) of the list:

"4) Open ended IPO
Unless the cloud mining is operated by the asic vendor himself, you can not sell an unlimited amount of hashrate. Hardware takes (usually a long) time to order, arrive and deploy. Any company that doesnt limit sales or make public how much hashrate they sold vs what they have (provably) deployed should be considered extremely suspicious. "

Just wanted to point out that they did not sell scrypt for 3-4 weeks. FWIW. Maybe I did not understand the point (4) though.

Thanks for the list!

[Puppet]

Ok. Yeah I should rephrase that parameter. Basically if I am unable to compare sold hashrate with provably deployed hashrate, or in some other way can have confidence they are not doing "fractional reserve mining"  I count that as a point.
Just stating they are out of hashrate from time to time isnt nearly good enough in that regard.

As illustration, I know bitfury/ cex.io  has an enormous amount of real hashrate, no one doubts that. But they also sold an enormous amount via cex.io and partners. I cant compare them, or even distinguish miners that just use ghash.io pool from their own machines,   so that gave them a point.

OTOH, KNC, we know they have a huge datacenter and its pretty much impossible they sold more than a fraction of that via knccloud. Hence, no points there.

[bitpop]

Knc may have the hash but they'll scam you six ways from Sunday before you get paid

[Puppet]

Knc may have the hash but they'll scam you six ways from Sunday before you get paid

Ive seen no evidence of that, if you are talking about their cloudmining. Got a link for me?

KnC is hated/distrusted and deservedly so for the stunts they pulled off selling hardware. I added a remark reflecting that, but I cant score their cloudmining offering any different than I did based on what I know about it. Doesnt mean I think you should mine there (or anywhere).

[shadowmoon]

All of them are scams. What's so hard about hodling Bitcoin? Any time you give someone your Bitcoin, you just begin begging for it back.

ya this is the truth
numerous of cloud mining websites today
but turning scam within a month

[johny08]

There is hashfast cloud Mining starting 20 december and i am already in since 10 days.

do you have a link for this?

cloud.hashcoins.com

Pools selection and instant payments. So I am in 20 % ghash.io, 40% btcguild, 40% eligius.