Bitcoin Forum
December 03, 2016, 01:43:51 PM *
News: Latest stable version of Bitcoin Core: 0.13.1  [Torrent].
 
   Home   Help Search Donate Login Register  
Pages: « 1 [2]  All
  Print  
Author Topic: Who or what is this math being done for?  (Read 3323 times)
rezin777
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Activity: 154


View Profile
May 18, 2011, 09:33:42 PM
 #21

Thank you for your kind replies folks, I understand the maths concept now. Stickies for these things is a fantastic idea btw. One of those READ THIS BEFORE POSTING YOUR STUPID QUESTION threads would be most useful with perhaps the top 10 most often asked questions answered. It wouldn't stop all the dumb questions but it might help.

For what it's worth, I don't think the cranky old guys were too hard on you! You did get called a newbie, but that's about it. I've seen much worse on other forums for not searching (or not searching enough, etc.)!   Smiley
Advertised sites are not endorsed by the Bitcoin Forum. They may be unsafe, untrustworthy, or illegal in your jurisdiction. Advertise here.
1480772631
Hero Member
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 1480772631

View Profile Personal Message (Offline)

Ignore
1480772631
Reply with quote  #2

1480772631
Report to moderator
1480772631
Hero Member
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 1480772631

View Profile Personal Message (Offline)

Ignore
1480772631
Reply with quote  #2

1480772631
Report to moderator
FreeMoney
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1246


Strength in numbers


View Profile WWW
May 18, 2011, 09:46:02 PM
 #22

Why do people move dirt to find gold?  Wink

Where is all the dirt going? Who is it being moved for?

Play Bitcoin Poker at sealswithclubs.eu. We're active and open to everyone.
bitlotto
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 672


BitLotto - best odds + best payouts + cheat-proof


View Profile WWW
May 19, 2011, 03:24:33 AM
 #23

I always explain that just because it's not finding a new science discovery it still can be doing something very useful. Society needs more than medicine and new technology. It also needs a fair way of trading wealth. By doing the "math", Bitcoin is providing a brand new system that has never existed before. It can help society as well. 

*Next Draw Feb 1*  BitLotto: monthly raffle (0.25 BTC per ticket) Completely transparent and impossible to manipulate who wins. TOR
TOR2WEB
Donations to: 1JQdiQsjhV2uJ4Y8HFtdqteJsZhv835a8J are appreciated.
DATA COMMANDER
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Activity: 126


View Profile
May 19, 2011, 06:21:01 AM
 #24

Whenever I read somewhere that bitcoin is a pyramid scheme, I think of threads like this.

Potential "sucker": I don't get bitcoin.
Evil pyramid schemers: RTFM, cockface. Better yet, just fuck off.

Tips are appreciated (very tiny tips are perfectly okay!) 13gDRynPfLH3NNAz3nVyU3k3mYVcfeiQuF
em3rgentOrdr
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 434


youtube.com/ericfontainejazz now accepts bitcoin


View Profile WWW
May 19, 2011, 07:08:02 AM
 #25

All around the world there are thousands or millions of CPUs/GPUs grinding away on math equations in the hopes that they will "solve" one of them and reap the reward of 50 bitcoins. One thing that troubles me (and Ive yet to find the answer); who is this math being done for? I can't imagine all the CPU cycles and kilowatt hours of electricity are being wasted "just because", otherwise that would be an enormous waste of resources. This reminds me of the SETI project where you would install and app on your machine and it would utilize unused CPU cycles when your machine was idle to listed for alien communications. Who or what is the math behind the bitcoin being done for?

The energy is not wasted.  It goes to feed the bitcoin gremlin.  The bitcoin gremlin likes to eat hash cycles.  If you provide the bitcoin gremlin with enough hash cycles, he will reward you with 50 bitcoins.
We need a sticky faq with these simple questions right on the front page of the forum.

Perhaps a mandatory FAQ, with a quiz at the end. Smiley

Excellent idea.  New users can't post until they can pass a fairly easy quiz, but can read whatever they like.

I like that idea...

"We will not find a solution to political problems in cryptography, but we can win a major battle in the arms race and gain a new territory of freedom for several years.

Governments are good at cutting off the heads of a centrally controlled networks, but pure P2P networks are holding their own."
kjj
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1302



View Profile
May 19, 2011, 07:47:57 AM
 #26

The problem is that some people "get it" automatically, and others do not.

If you get it, you'll read these questions and wonder how the hell could someone be so stupid that they can read how it works and not understand how and why the hashing is done the way it is.  If you don't get it, the descriptions that work for the "get it" crowd are meaningless.

I've tried several times to think of better ways to say it, and I've got nothing.

p2pcoin: a USB/CD/PXE p2pool miner - 1N8ZXx2cuMzqBYSK72X4DAy1UdDbZQNPLf - todo
I routinely ignore posters with paid advertising in their sigs.  You should too.
ryepdx
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 714



View Profile WWW
May 19, 2011, 11:39:01 AM
 #27

I've tried several times to think of better ways to say it, and I've got nothing.

Here's one:

The energy is not wasted.  It goes to feed the bitcoin gremlin.  The bitcoin gremlin likes to eat hash cycles.  If you provide the bitcoin gremlin with enough hash cycles, he will reward you with 50 bitcoins.

Can we make this the official explanation? Pleeeeease?  Grin

[edited]
TradersEdgeDice
Member
**
Offline Offline

Activity: 84



View Profile WWW
May 19, 2011, 12:37:54 PM
 #28

Its like Ender's Game. We're killing aliens.

hahaha…  We could be.

I like the concept of bitcoin but questions like this are nagging me because my knowledge, not ignorance.

Requiring people to pass a test before posting sounds too much like church of scientology indoctrination to me.

Sure, people should read the fucking wikis and independently verify the information presented.  They should also use the search function.

I just don't see a problem with a question like the OP asked.  That's the kind of question there should be repeatedly asked.  Bitcoin will survive if it can withstand these kind of questions.

Scientific method should rule the day here. I'm not entirely convinced that it does.

Like what I posted?

Buy my Metal FX Currency Dice Set
http://tradersedgedice.com

Buyers using bitcoin get a deep discount.  Free worldwide shipping.

Web of Trust: http://bitcoin-otc.com/viewratingdetail.php?nick=TradersEdgeDice&sign=ANY&type=RECV

GPG Identity: http://bitcoin-otc.com/
Cryptoman
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 728



View Profile
May 19, 2011, 01:03:38 PM
 #29

I just don't see a problem with a question like the OP asked.  That's the kind of question there should be repeatedly asked.  Bitcoin will survive if it can withstand these kind of questions.

I don't see a problem either.  We need to treat newcomers better.  When I saw the title of the thread, I knew it was "one of those threads," and I could have avoided reading it if I chose to do so.  This reminds me of when the general public first started to show up on "our" internet (primarily through AOL).  Most of us had a pretty elitist, RTFM attitude back then too, but it didn't really serve anyone well.  It takes more time to flame than it does to post a link, offer a simple explanation or simply click on to the next thread.

"A small body of determined spirits fired by an unquenchable faith in their mission can alter the course of history." --Gandhi
rezin777
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Activity: 154


View Profile
May 19, 2011, 01:44:03 PM
 #30

I don't see a problem either.  We need to treat newcomers better.

That may be the case, but I don't really see this particular thread as an example of poor treatment of newcomers. The second post answered the question. It was suggested the OP read Satoshi's PDF. Someone mentioned newbies not being able to search. There was a joke or two. Then the OP calls everyone an elitist asshole! If anything the OP is the one overreacting.

I've seen similar threads on other forums where it goes pages before the question is even answered, if at all! This was actually pretty tame.
kjj
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1302



View Profile
May 19, 2011, 01:55:43 PM
 #31

About the best I can think of is that if the hashing function doesn't take 100% effort, cheating is no longer impossible.  When the hashing function is as hard as the global system can stand, it is mathematically certain that the block is legit, just as 2+2=4 is mathematically certain.

If there was some sort of useful work being done as a proxy for the hashing function, we are relying on a different, and unprovable, security scheme.

Right now, increases in hashing power directly translate into increased difficulty.  When we found a way to cheat at hashing (by using GPUs), hashing automatically became harder.  There is no reason to think that this property would hold for a proxy.

p2pcoin: a USB/CD/PXE p2pool miner - 1N8ZXx2cuMzqBYSK72X4DAy1UdDbZQNPLf - todo
I routinely ignore posters with paid advertising in their sigs.  You should too.
BitterTea
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 294



View Profile
May 19, 2011, 02:20:34 PM
 #32

I just don't see a problem with a question like the OP asked.  That's the kind of question there should be repeatedly asked.  Bitcoin will survive if it can withstand these kind of questions.

I don't see a problem either.  We need to treat newcomers better.  When I saw the title of the thread, I knew it was "one of those threads," and I could have avoided reading it if I chose to do so.  This reminds me of when the general public first started to show up on "our" internet (primarily through AOL).  Most of us had a pretty elitist, RTFM attitude back then too, but it didn't really serve anyone well.  It takes more time to flame than it does to post a link, offer a simple explanation or simply click on to the next thread.

The problem is that eventually, people who know the answers to The Questions That Are Repeatedly Asked might get tired of answering them, and not. That leaves an opening for those who don't know the answers or think they do to provide official seeming misinformation, intentionally or no.
Meni Rosenfeld
Donator
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1890



View Profile WWW
May 19, 2011, 03:23:01 PM
 #33

I was going to bitch about the fact that this frequently asked question is not answered in the FAQ. And then it hit me that it would be more proactive to just answer the damn question.

1EofoZNBhWQ3kxfKnvWkhtMns4AivZArhr   |   Who am I?   |   bitcoin-otc WoT
Bitcoil - Exchange bitcoins for ILS (thread)   |   Israel Bitcoin community homepage (thread)
Analysis of Bitcoin Pooled Mining Reward Systems (thread, summary)  |   PureMining - Infinite-term, deterministic mining bond
Pages: « 1 [2]  All
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Sponsored by , a Bitcoin-accepting VPN.
Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.19 | SMF © 2006-2009, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!