Decentralized Lending Protocol / Network

[jdbtracker]

Definitely needs metrics for people to consider this situation.

People are smart, we simply have to be able to give them the information they need to react appropriately.
With out a doubt we are going to have negative interest rates according to the terms of payment, people should be able to choose their level of risk; That is what the settings would be there for. If the system detects parameters of the Bitcoin economy are shifting it can begin alerting the user of the change as it happens, with key information that supports the Geopolitical, Supply Chain Management, Technological and Market forces at work... if it's speculators, we can ride out the storm with the long term forecasts.

Best part, we can upgrade the system later, Add components and metrics that we were simply not aware of before we started the project, driving better Investor and Borrower outcomes.

For example if the short term metrics are pointing to a dip in Bitcoin, then short term contracts are adjusted and suggestions are given to the Lender and Borrower to maintain the same forecasted level of Interest for the term. Long term forecasts would get better and better, filtering out speculative Information, sticking to facts and helping long term loans achieve a favorable outcome.

There are going to be a lot of things we are going to be learning... If people can make their own connections in the system choosing their level of risk, many new business models will be coming out, well have to adapt to those. Adding new information, plugging security holes, better metrics, and refined interfaces will be a constant.

Timed Terms may not be the best solution for this system, market conditions will be unfavorable at any moment, increasing risk at random times. Automated Payment Conditions may be required.

[GingerAle]

Definitely needs metrics for people to consider this situation.

People are smart, we simply have to be able to give them the information they need to react appropriately.
With out a doubt we are going to have negative interest rates according to the terms of payment, people should be able to choose their level of risk; That is what the settings would be there for. If the system detects parameters of the Bitcoin economy are shifting it can begin alerting the user of the change as it happens, with key information that supports the Geopolitical, Supply Chain Management, Technological and Market forces at work... if it's speculators, we can ride out the storm with the long term forecasts.

That would be interesting. The protocol alerts its users to changes in the market...

Best part, we can upgrade the system later, Add components and metrics that we were simply not aware of before we started the project, driving better Investor and Borrower outcomes.

Indeed. I was actually thinking that multiple DAFNe's may pop up that have different Key Numbers - i.e., one insures at 1000 participation, while another insures at 5e12, etc

For example if the short term metrics are pointing to a dip in Bitcoin, then short term contracts are adjusted and suggestions are given to the Lender and Borrower to maintain the same forecasted level of Interest for the term. Long term forecasts would get better and better, filtering out speculative Information, sticking to facts and helping long term loans achieve a favorable outcome.

Hrm, yes - but this requires pegging Bitcoin (or any crypto) to something else, right?. Currently that is the dollar, but in a potential future without another currency... then what? The DAFNe is somehow fed information about the price of actual commodities?

Also, "suggestions are given to the Lender and Borrower to maintain the same forecasted level of Interest for the term".... but there are potentially thousands of lenders per borrower. We can't expect all of them to be actively managing their investments at this level.

There are going to be a lot of things we are going to be learning... If people can make their own connections in the system choosing their level of risk, many new business models will be coming out, well have to adapt to those. Adding new information, plugging security holes, better metrics, and refined interfaces will be a constant.

Timed Terms may not be the best solution for this system, market conditions will be unfavorable at any moment, increasing risk at random times. Automated Payment Conditions may be required.

Ultimately, I think the answer is to just build the system with the option to work in either pure crypto or fiat-crypto modes. In fiat-crypto mode, the ledgers are all kept in fiat, and the front end does the conversion based on the current BTC valuation.

[Vessko]

I don't think interest is much of a problem. The extra 1 BTC you are talking about in that scenario could be acheieved by working and saving for it over the years or creating profit from whatever you did with the loan.

You are confusing money with wealth. Extra wealth worth 1 BTC can be created as you describe, no problem. The problem is that, within the society as a whole, the additional 1 BTC (as money) cannot be created because the money supply is fixed.

Again, there are two points you must not forget. 1) The problem is the needed extra amount of money, not the needed extra amount of wealth and 2) the problem occurs with the society as a whole, not in a particular person-to-person transaction.

Between two people in the society, the second one will most likely find a way to get the extra money by selling the products of his labor. But the totality of loans (with interest) in the society requires increased money supply (for the interest) - and with a fixed-supply currency this is not possible.

I still don't have a good answer to the person who asked why lend at all. Of course, every individual member of the society will make his own (different) economic calculation. Some will offer loans at a small interest, others will offer loans at no interest (hoping that the money appreciation will reward them sufficiently), yet others might even offer loans at a negative interest, hoping that the currency will appreciate more than the nominal loss of principal. Some of them will be right and prosper, others will be wrong and go bankrupt; that's normal. But for the society, as a whole, interest with a deflationary currency is not possible and there is a strong motivation not to lend.

[GingerAle]

Hrm, could also use the DAFNe in some type of crowd-buying effort, similar to groupon's core model, or related to stock purchases...

say you wanted to buy something at 1 BTC, but the price is currently 1.2 BTC.

You put a buy ticket out on the DAFNe, and people can opt into the buy ticket. The transaction builds until enough people have gotten into the transaction, and the seller triggers the transaction at 1 BTC.

Or crowd selling effort.

Or you put a sell ticket into the DAFne, with a trigger of 1000 buyers. The transaction builds until the condition is met and then BAM, money moves.

In this instance, yes, there would just be a flat fee, because there's no money going the other way.

Probably useful in stock markets or something.

I'm thinking about refining this whole rambling mess to submit to https://www.boost.vc/ jan deadline. Yay i'll get to make a youtube.

[jdbtracker]

Oh wow, you are thinking very ambitiously... sure, let's give it a go, See what we can do.

I'll start up a list of available programs we can use to collaborate better, and we need people who are willing to invest their time, for possibly no immediate reward.

I was thinking of channeling the Bitcoin's to the multiple Blockchains and just through the DAFNe, but how do we setup the incentives to protect the system?

so far we have incentives for the Miners to protect the system through fees, but still have to think of the Volunteers/Developers, Investors, and the nodes running full Clients. I am sure they would like to be supported by the system that they are helping.

[GingerAle]

Oh wow, you are thinking very ambitiously... sure, let's give it a go, See what we can do.

yeah, we'll see if we can get it in.... I actually have a NIMH grant due in february (that I should be working on nonstop until then) but whattaya gonna do. Gotta take a break somewhere.

I'll start up a list of available programs we can use to collaborate better, and we need people who are willing to invest their time, for possibly no immediate reward.

Cool. I think slack (www.slack.com) is a good one. Github actually has some stuff built in.

I was thinking of channeling the Bitcoin's to the multiple Blockchains and just through the DAFNe, but how do we setup the incentives to protect the system?

so far we have incentives for the Miners to protect the system through fees, but still have to think of the Volunteers/Developers, Investors, and the nodes running full Clients. I am sure they would like to be supported by the system that they are helping.

Nodes running full clients - I think they will be incentivised because they are participating in the lending (for that version of it) - they are invested in a secure network because their $$$ is on the line. Also, a full node can also technically be a miner, so they'll get block rewards. Also (in the lending use of the protocol), they'll get dividends and interest.

Volunteers / developers / investors - I was thinking about this too - because this side chain / alt chain theory, with no immediate asset of its own, doesn't provide much incentive to develop. Thus, we could incorporate some time-limited percentage for developers. Say, 5% of the interest is distributed to developers until 500 BTC is reached or something.

"need people who are willing to invest their time, for possibly no immediate reward"
Or, in a manic daydream, we present this to that VC, they see it for what it is, then we can just put bounties out on the code, or just hire people out in silicon valley. Because ultimately, as you pointed out, the core of the DAFNe is this "virtual bitcoin playground" that has a trigger point... and this could be used in a lot of different ways.

Or we could just suck it up and make another damn coin, but treat it as a "share" of the company. This would definitively transform the DAFNe into a DAC, which is fine. But it would be cool to incorporate a way where the block reward is directly proportional to the amount of activity in each block, such that shares of the company aren't produced just because its mineable - instead, this would couple share production to actual business activity. I think it would also be good to change the block reward mechanism such that all miners are rewarded when a block is found, similar to the way that mining pools operate now. This would encourage mining, would encourage solo mining, and would truly represent the amount of "work" you put into the "company", as opposed to the current currency model of block reward which is meant to distribute currency in a random fashion to promote... well I don't know exactly.

Ultimately, the share could be used for voting purposes (with those heavily invested having more of a vote), and voting would be performed by sending to an unpayable (but trackable) wallet address. In this system, shares would always be rewarded (no decrease in block rewards over time - shares always produce in proportion to activity in block)

[GingerAle]

welp, one thing to legitimize the effort would be a web page. I saw some folks in the above threads that wanted to contribute but can't code - getting a website going would be great.

I'm currently working on the white paper. At the least, I'll host the whitepaper and that can serve as a web page why not.

so I've successfully registered dafne.bit on the namecoin network, so in 12 blocks it'll be verified or whatever.

Now how exactly I develop a .bit is beyond me. Nameserver what? Anyone know?

well that seems crazy complicated. I also just got dafnep.com ....

[GingerAle]

hrm, trying to figure out if ethereum and/or mastercoin can do what we wanna do..........

[theblacksquid]

Ethereum might do it, but its not even released yet. We can build something now, and integrate with Eth or any other 2.0 tech later

[jdbtracker]

Trust me this is buildable now...

It's like setting up a website, you got your interface, your distributed platform and a Database.

and besides they are trying to do it by creating a new coin; we can do it without one bypassing any legislation anywhere in the world. We are not touching any of the coins merely encrypting the private key into our Blockchain and moving it around internally without ever moving the Bitcoins.

We know what we have to do, the technology is already setup... now the hard part; The parameters need to be ironed out, good settings will make the difference whether we succeed or fail for the deadline.

[GingerAle]

Does anyone have any skill in creating web animations for the required youtube video?

When I get back to home PC, I will create a slack channel.

lookin through adam drapers thingy, came across this

http://www.pylonloans.com/

no idea how their system works though. "on the blockchain" would indicate to me THE blockchain.

[theblacksquid]

@jdbtracker: Do you think we could build the DAFNE using python with c/c++ libraries that has python wrappers?

[jdbtracker]

All libraries are good, We'll want to throw everything we have at it at this point; Once we have something working we will be able to fine tune it and plug any security holes we may have later.

Just so everyone knows, I am only a beginner at Programming but have been checking out the code for a lot of the Cryptocurrency projects for almost two years now.

so, I can read C/C++, Python, PHP, Javascript, Java, HTML5, CSS3, XML, Ajax, ATS... If it looks like  C I can tease it out. but we will need people who actually can code rather than just build the layout.

[GingerAle]

So, slack requires the use of email to login. If you want to make a phony/new email address and then PM me, I can send you the invite.

I think i finally distilled this thing into its essential components. here is a draft of a digestable whitepaper.


Decentralized Autonomous Lending
made possible by the

Decentralized Autonomous Financial Networking (DAFNe) Protocol
A peer-to-peer transaction distribution system
+
LendWallet
Wallet software controlled by the DAFNe
+
Decentralized Autonomous Reserve (DAR)
A distributed reserve for cryptocurrency





Abstract. Economic instability has plagued societies throughout history. We present the supposition that this instability is an unintended emergent property of lending within a fractional reserve system. To recreate the benefits of conventional banking without fractional reserve, we present an alternative type of banking called the Decentralized Autonomous Financial Networking protocol. This protocol exploits heretofore underutilized aspects of cryptocurrency: extreme currency partitioning and a worldwide network of currency holders. This solution requires the addition of a sister blockchain network (the DAFNe) that interacts with a cryptocurrency's primary blockchain. In this network, transactions are built in partitions, wherein a party creates a contract and additional parties fill this contract until there are no more partitions, at which point the contract is complete and the constructed transaction is submitted to the primary blockchain by the DAFNe. Proper function of the DAFNe requires a unique wallet software controlled by the DAFNe. To provide risk mitigation and incentivize lending in the network, a decentralized autonomous reserve is created to provide an insurance pool for defaulted loans. Ultimately, a lending network is created where only those partaking in lending and maintaining the network receive revenue.

1. Introduction
Lending is an important function of money that allows a society to literally invest in the future. Investment mechanisms combined with fractional reserve banking, however, have repeatedly been shown to introduce instability into world economies. Here, we present a software suite that allows lending and investing to maintain the simplistic function of one party transferring money to a second party under contract to return the money with interest. Using cryptocurrencies (either as a payment system or a currency) in combination with the DAFNe, LendWallet, and DAR, we can create a worldwide banking platform that mimics conventional banking without the need for fractional reserve and maintains economic stability through algorithmic management of the financial network.

2. Contracts
We define a contract as a ledger entry containing the receiving addresses and the sending addresses. For the lending network, the receiving address is fixed, and the sending addresses are not fixed. A contract is initiated by one party (the borrower), wherein they submit the contract to the network and the contract contains a set point – in the lending case, a loan amount. Participating nodes in the network recognize the ledger entry and report to end users that the contract is unfilled. Lenders stake a claim in this contract through a digital signature – similar to making a transaction in a cryptocurrency network – a lender is sending a stake to the loan. The ledger records the amount of stake and the required cryptocurrency address in this secondary blockchain, and the network nodes communicate the change in the contract. This continues until the contract reaches the set point, at which point the network submits the constructed transaction to the cryptocurrency network.

3. LendWallet software
In order for the DAFNe blockchain to function with the primary cryptocurrency blockchain, the DAFNe must be able to lock funds in place once they have been committed to a contract. This is achieved using specialized wallet (lendwallet) software that monitors the DAFNe blockchain and identifies when the lendwallet's address has staked a claim in a contract. This information locks that amount in the lendwallet by preventing the user from withdrawing funds below that amount.

The lendwallet also functions to autonomously submit the transaction to the bitcoin network when the set point is reached. The lendwallet “mines” the sister blockchain, and rewards are derived from interest and fees associated with the contracts in the sister blockchain.

4. Decentralized Autonomous Reserve
In order to provide an insurance mechanism for loan default and to incentivize lenders, a reserve system is created that provides dividends. The reserve insures loans based on the number of investors in a given loan. Collusion to defraud the system decreases as the number of investors grow, thus the percent of the loan that is insured increases as the number of investors increases. The reserve remains decentralized using the locking mechanism of the lendwallet, wherein the coins are stored locally in the nodes wallet, but under the control of the DAFNe.

5. End Result
The suite of software described above creates a banking system in which money velocity is encouraged by exploiting the extreme partitioning capacity of cryptocurrencies and the ability to include infinite parties in a single transaction. In this network, hundreds of thousands of individuals can claim stake in an individual loan. By staking these micro amounts of money, the “cost” of the loan felt by an individual is insignificant, but the net effect of the network is the transfer of a significant investment.

6. Other applications of the the DAFNe protocol
The primary technological advancement of the DAFNe protocol is the ability to build and secure a virtual financial transaction to be submitted to a cryptocurrency network. The fundamental contract can be utilized for other purposes – such as buy and sell orders, where a particular set price or number of participants is what ultimately submits the transaction to the primary blockchain. The DAFNe can also be utilized as internal business infrastructure, where branches of an organization place requisitions to a central actor. The lending protocol, as described above, can also be utilized as a crowdfunding (granting) platform. The DAFNe protocol also provides an immediate means to create and monitor credit history.

7. Conclusion
Here we provide the means to recreate the benefits of conventional banking without the need for a fractional reserve system by exploiting the extreme partitioning of cryptographic currencies. This achieved using a sister blockchain alongside the primary currency blockchain and wallet software that is controlled by the DAFNe protocol. Finally, a dentralized autonomous reserve is introduced to provide insurance and incentive for participating in the network.

[theblacksquid]

@GingerAle: Slack is a very good way to coordinate better, you can send me an invite at theblacksquid2012(at)gmail.com.

@jdbtracker: I mostly have experience in Python and JavaScript, and I'm reading up on C++. I highly reccomend using Python as a base language, as there's a bigger open source community that could help write the could and get us off the ground.

As for the application stack, this is what this is what I think its going to look like, based on what I understand from the project. What do you guys think?

Node Consensus-generated blockchain (eg. Ripple) --> Internal API --> Smart Contracts --> DAR --> Lendwallet (Ripple? POS Coin fork? Build from Scratch?!) --> External API

[GingerAle]

I've heard about python as well. I've heard complaints that its slow, but ultimately the first iteration can be python, and then others can translate it to a faster language.

[jdbtracker]

I'm figuring out how to modify a Blockchain at the moment, I really think that for legal reasons we should stick to a coinless Blockchain. A Blockchain that just takes the Coins keys without generating it's own, takes it's fees from the incoming supply of coins for the DAR and R&D, then secures them using the Bitcoin networks Hashing power.

Some of the Currency will have to go to us to make sure we can develop it, I guess we will be the first ones to use the system to fund ourselves. lol
It will have to scale properly and we have to come to grips with the fact that it will begin to fund things that are questionable to people in power. They will come after us for developing this venue for re-allocating funds outside their control... of course we can go completely Not For Profit and live off Donations, giving us some sense that we are doing this for Freedom! Just look at what happened to Shrem, got arrested for mentioning/knowing that people are going to use it for nefarious purposes... how many Billions does HSBC Launder? In the Land of the Blind, Ignorance is Bliss and to be Wise is Folly. I certainly like the fact that no-one but the people get to decide what is funded and what is not, but this will have to be done with the utmost caution.
  Liabilities will have to be figured out, a way to put the onus, in software, squarely on the Lender and Borrower.

[GingerAle]

I'm figuring out how to modify a Blockchain at the moment, I really think that for legal reasons we should stick to a coinless Blockchain. A Blockchain that just takes the Coins keys without generating it's own, takes it's fees from the incoming supply of coins for the DAR and R&D, then secures them using the Bitcoin networks Hashing power.

awesome. blacksquid and I were chattin in slack last night, and yeah, modifying the blockchain is probably the first thing to tackle. I agree with the coinless blockchain.

Some of the Currency will have to go to us to make sure we can develop it, I guess we will be the first ones to use the system to fund ourselves. lol

We'll see. Who knows if the draper thing will work out. And there's always kickstarter. Or this

http://jumpstartfund.com

It will have to scale properly and we have to come to grips with the fact that it will begin to fund things that are questionable to people in power. They will come after us for developing this venue for re-allocating funds outside their control... of course we can go completely Not For Profit and live off Donations, giving us some sense that we are doing this for Freedom! Just look at what happened to Shrem, got arrested for mentioning/knowing that people are going to use it for nefarious purposes...

Hrm, interesting legal points. For these reasons I think we should keep any "profit" out of the picture. I never imagined this to create pure profit, but only capable of return if indeed I were to utilize the DAFNe to invest in something.

how many Billions does HSBC Launder? I certainly like the fact that no-one but the people get to decide what is funded and what is not, but this will have to be done with the utmost caution.
  Liabilities will have to be figured out, a way to put the onus, in software, squarely on the Lender and Borrower.

Indeed, good point.

At the end of the day, we're really just making software. Granted, viruses are software. So perhaps, yeah, somewhere in the process, it is clearly stated that the individual making the decision to submit or receive in the DAFNe is their legal responsibility.

I think, generally, that the DAFNe is not a mixing service because the participants need to be trusted actors with DAFNe-derived credit histories and or existing credit histories.

But yeah, I guess it would be technically possible for an individual to create an entire DAFNe alter-ego, where people think they are investing in a car loan but really its something else.

Hrm, I just realized a fundamental weakness of the whole thing is the lack of collateral - i.e., conventional lending works because the bank technically owns the car (or the house)... could an autonomous decentralized network "own" something? Then again, the purpose of collateral is to incentivise repayment of a loan, and as we saw when push really came to shove, people just walked away from their homes anyway. So really, once again, the main incentive an individual would have to be a good actor would be continued participation in the network. 

[jdbtracker]

Excellent we are on the same point on this: Legalities & Functionality.

We do need a way for the regular financial system to interact with our system, making it useful for everyone.

My Philosophy is use all the resources available... Standing on the shoulders of Giants to see further than we have ever before.
I figure that if we make our idea public as we build it, other people will work in tandem with us on their own time, posting as they can snippets of solutions to our overall Vision. We may get some more helpers later on, of course it does bring competition, but in the OpenSource world, I'm okay with that. Have you seen the structure of Horton Works, Map R, Cloudera; Each one is running on a different idea of Complete Openess, Opacity and Proprietary... It may be a good idea to allow the DAFNe to be very flexible in how it operates, maybe even put everything we can think of into it and let the market decide what options they want; Pretty much overwhelming the user but giving excellent choice and possible data to observe to see which are the most popular settings to apply to the top menu's.

Multiple channels for Cryptocurrencies to move through the system and maybe even blend the cryptocurrencies in some channels; Provide secure channels of verified information to flow through and unverified information in other less secure channels: A Broad Scope, Integrated into one solution.

[GingerAle]

I've got it. Instead of some % going to devs, lets put some percentage towards wikipedia. That way we'll never have to go through these pledge drives ever again.