***WARNING TO PEOPLE WHO USE MONEYPAK/WALMART MONEY CARD***

[TizzyTazzy]

This is continued from this thread - https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=88968.0
This is my service thread, My BTC for your MoneyPak - https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=84924.0

I just got off the phone from a rep and they concluded that even though I have done dozens upon dozens of transfers without complaints, that because of ONE SINGLE person disputing a $100 reload that apparently I'm the fraudster and need to provide every single receipt for all MoneyPak reload transactions in the past month and if I cannot, the remaining balance will remain locked without any appeal.

What?!!?!?

They basically just said "yeah your money is ours now sucker".

What kind of bullshit is this? I'm so raged right now.  

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[Bitcoin Oz]

Time to lawyer up or contact a consumer rights service.

[fatigue]

Time to lawyer up or contact a consumer rights service.

Agreed. If you brought it to a court they would probably just decide to give you the benefit of the doubt. It's not like its one of their larger accounts that they should worry about.

[TizzyTazzy]

Time to lawyer up or contact a consumer rights service.

Agreed. If you brought it to a court they would probably just decide to give you the benefit of the doubt. It's not like its one of their larger accounts that they should worry about.

How would I go about doing this? Would I actually need a lawyer? I have around $1000 stuck on the card so wouldn't it be pointless with the money I'd have to spend?

I've never been in a situation where I needed to take anyone to court and I always figured it would never be worth it.. But man I really want to do it for the principal of that matter too.. This is just bullshit.

[bitcoinBull]

Create the receipts and back-date them. Then you can provide them as requested. It will be much cheaper than a lawyer. $1k is too much to let go.

[TizzyTazzy]

Create the receipts and back-date them. Then you can provide them as requested. It will be much cheaper than a lawyer. $1k is too much to let go.

I'm not sure what your saying here? They want EVERY receipt and even if I was able to get a hold of every single person I've traded with, I highly doubt any of them decided to keep the receipt, and I would need ALL of them to have the receipt.

[fatigue]

Create the receipts and back-date them. Then you can provide them as requested. It will be much cheaper than a lawyer. $1k is too much to let go.

I'm not sure what your saying here? They want EVERY receipt and even if I was able to get a hold of every single person I've traded with, I highly doubt any of them decided to keep the receipt, and I would need ALL of them to have the receipt.

He's saying forge them.

[pekv2]

My jaw dropped when I read the op and omg came out.

Definitely make a lawsuit, even though if you lose out by paying for a lawyer, like you said it would be worth for the principle.

I think small claims court will do. Get the yellow book out if you can afford it and even check for pro bono lawyers, they are rare and hard to find but you just might luck into one.

[Gladamas]

If you win the court case you might be able to recover lawyer fees.

[bitcoinBull]

Create the receipts and back-date them. Then you can provide them as requested. It will be much cheaper than a lawyer. $1k is too much to let go.

I'm not sure what your saying here? They want EVERY receipt and even if I was able to get a hold of every single person I've traded with, I highly doubt any of them decided to keep the receipt, and I would need ALL of them to have the receipt.

He's saying forge them.

Its not forgery, they were actual transactions. You're providing records of them after-the-fact. Use some invoice forms, create invoices for each transaction over the past 30 days with the corresponding dates. Stores keep their own merchant copies of receipts, they don't ask customers for their copies when its tax time. They only want your copies of the receipts/invoices.

[fatigue]

Create the receipts and back-date them. Then you can provide them as requested. It will be much cheaper than a lawyer. $1k is too much to let go.

I'm not sure what your saying here? They want EVERY receipt and even if I was able to get a hold of every single person I've traded with, I highly doubt any of them decided to keep the receipt, and I would need ALL of them to have the receipt.

He's saying forge them.

Its not forgery, they were actual transactions. You're providing records of them after-the-fact. Use some invoice forms, create invoices for each transaction over the past 30 days with the corresponding dates. Stores keep their own merchant copies of receipts, they don't ask customers for their copies when its tax time. They only want your copies of the receipts/invoices.

Sorry, I thought you were insinuating that he forge receipts as proof.

[Coinoisseur]

Let them know you will take them to small claims court. Check to see if your area provides small claims actions via telephone, if they do, this basically negates them trying to pull it into another venue you would have a hard time getting to.

With your record of good transactions I'm thinking you'll either get a full favor verdict or just lose out on the $100.

*Gather together whatever you can in terms of records of your Moneypak transactions. Get some emails from people and tie them to specific Moneypaks, etc.

[DeathAndTaxes]

Now I guess people realize why we require sellers to write "Tangible Cryptography LLC" on their MoneyPak receipts and email a scan/photo to us before we complete the sale.  No it wasn't us being parnaoid.  We lost some potential sales by requiring this but it isn't a requirement we intend to drop.

There pretty much is only one dispute possible when it comes to MoneyPaks and that is to claim "I never used this code and when I tried it said the funds had been used".  MP code is only 14 numeric digits so it is possible to brute force.  Generally funds only remain on the "pak" for a short time so the window is small and the risk of a true brute force is small but it can be claimed by a scammer.

Kinda hard to say you never used "your" MoneyPak when it has our company name on the receipt and was redeemed by us.

To the OP:
Most likely you won't lose all the funds.  They will just be frozen for some extended time (my guess is 30 to 90 days) and then disbursed to you by company check (similar to a PayPal freeze).  They do this so that if you brute forced all those codes it gives time for the "legit" owners to come forward.

[DeathAndTaxes]

My jaw dropped when I read the op and omg came out.

Definitely make a lawsuit, even though if you lose out by paying for a lawyer, like you said it would be worth for the principle.

I think small claims court will do. Get the yellow book out if you can afford it and even check for pro bono lawyers, they are rare and hard to find but you just might luck into one.

If he files in small claim court no lawyer is needed or possible.

[pekv2]

My jaw dropped when I read the op and omg came out.

Definitely make a lawsuit, even though if you lose out by paying for a lawyer, like you said it would be worth for the principle.

I think small claims court will do. Get the yellow book out if you can afford it and even check for pro bono lawyers, they are rare and hard to find but you just might luck into one.

If he files in small claim court no lawyer is needed or possible.

Then circuit or supreme?

[DeathAndTaxes]

Well given the amount is likely below the limit for small claims court that is the best option as he doesn't have to pay the cost of legal fees.  Small claims court also tends to be more informal, present the fact and judge rules.  That being said the funds likely will be released long before his case gets put on the docket.  It can take 6+ months to get a day in court.

[pekv2]

Well, that's cool. This is more knowledge for TizzyTazzy to take in.

Nice that you're posting your knowledge in here.

[TizzyTazzy]

Now I guess people realize why we require sellers to write "Tangible Cryptography LLC" on their MoneyPak receipts and email a scan/photo to us before we complete the sale.  No it wasn't us being parnaoid.  We lost some potential sales by requiring this but it isn't a requirement we intend to drop.

There pretty much is only one dispute possible when it comes to MoneyPaks and that is to claim "I never used this code and when I tried it said the funds had been used".  MP code is only 14 numeric digits so it is possible to brute force.  Generally funds only remain on the "pak" for a short time so the window is small and the risk of a true brute force is small but it can be claimed by a scammer.

Kinda hard to say you never used "your" MoneyPak when it has our company name on the receipt and was redeemed by us.

To the OP:
Most likely you won't lose all the funds.  They will just be frozen for some extended time (my guess is 30 to 90 days) and then disbursed to you by company check (similar to a PayPal freeze).  They do this so that if you brute forced all those codes it gives time for the "legit" owners to come forward.

They specifically said if I don't provide proof of all MoneyPak reloads, that I'm out of luck.

[Gladamas]

Now I guess people realize why we require sellers to write "Tangible Cryptography LLC" on their MoneyPak receipts and email a scan/photo to us before we complete the sale.  No it wasn't us being parnaoid.  We lost some potential sales by requiring this but it isn't a requirement we intend to drop.

There pretty much is only one dispute possible when it comes to MoneyPaks and that is to claim "I never used this code and when I tried it said the funds had been used".  MP code is only 14 numeric digits so it is possible to brute force.  Generally funds only remain on the "pak" for a short time so the window is small and the risk of a true brute force is small but it can be claimed by a scammer.

Kinda hard to say you never used "your" MoneyPak when it has our company name on the receipt and was redeemed by us.

To the OP:
Most likely you won't lose all the funds.  They will just be frozen for some extended time (my guess is 30 to 90 days) and then disbursed to you by company check (similar to a PayPal freeze).  They do this so that if you brute forced all those codes it gives time for the "legit" owners to come forward.

They specifically said if I don't provide proof of all MoneyPak reloads, that I'm out of luck.

That's why you sue them.

[fatigue]

Now I guess people realize why we require sellers to write "Tangible Cryptography LLC" on their MoneyPak receipts and email a scan/photo to us before we complete the sale.  No it wasn't us being parnaoid.  We lost some potential sales by requiring this but it isn't a requirement we intend to drop.

There pretty much is only one dispute possible when it comes to MoneyPaks and that is to claim "I never used this code and when I tried it said the funds had been used".  MP code is only 14 numeric digits so it is possible to brute force.  Generally funds only remain on the "pak" for a short time so the window is small and the risk of a true brute force is small but it can be claimed by a scammer.

Kinda hard to say you never used "your" MoneyPak when it has our company name on the receipt and was redeemed by us.

To the OP:
Most likely you won't lose all the funds.  They will just be frozen for some extended time (my guess is 30 to 90 days) and then disbursed to you by company check (similar to a PayPal freeze).  They do this so that if you brute forced all those codes it gives time for the "legit" owners to come forward.

^this guy.

They specifically said if I don't provide proof of all MoneyPak reloads, that I'm out of luck.

That's why you sue them.