Dirty coins

[Miz4r]

Bad idea, coins should all be treated the same. Once I see Bitcoin develop towards a path where I might run the risk of my coins being less valuable because they're more or less tainted I will sell all my coins and find a better coin that doesn't have this problem. Fungibility is too important.

[1713496547]

1713496547

[OROBTC]

...

Bitcoin = Bitcoin = Bitcoin

For almost everyone.  If somebody does not want "dirty coins", they have the option to not accept them.  It's a free country (smile,,,).

*   *   *

I have read that getting "newly generated coins" from a miner (when they win a block) is desired by some.  Anyone who really wants "clean coins" might be able to buy direct from an Eligius, GHash.IO, BTC Guild, etc.

OP!  Let us know if you take that route!  I would be curious to know how hard/easy it would be to buy "Brand New Coins" * from a miner!




* Also let us know if there would be any "numismatic value" to any mintages...    

[DieJohnny]

...

Bitcoin = Bitcoin = Bitcoin

For almost everyone.  If somebody does not want "dirty coins", they have the option to not accept them.  It's a free country (smile,,,).

*   *   *

I have read that getting "newly generated coins" from a miner (when they win a block) is desired by some.  Anyone who really wants "clean coins" might be able to buy direct from an Eligius, GHash.IO, BTC Guild, etc.

OP!  Let us know if you take that route!  I would be curious to know how hard/easy it would be to buy "Brand New Coins" * from a miner!




* Also let us know if there would be any "numismatic value" to any mintages...    

That sounds like fun. Coins never spent before landing in my wallet look at my shiny virgin coins!

[DieJohnny]

The right to freely trade is a basic right, as is the right to refuse!!!

I'm not sure about the “right to refuse”. If you refuse to give service to someone, for example, because they're black, that's discrimination and a crime in certain jurisdictions (it should be everywhere).

Are you serious??

Can you imagine.....

excuse me sir, are you refusing to take my money/coins??, I will see you in jail sir because holy hell you not buying from me after you met me is down right illegal!!!

[R2D221]

The right to freely trade is a basic right, as is the right to refuse!!!

I'm not sure about the “right to refuse”. If you refuse to give service to someone, for example, because they're black, that's discrimination and a crime in certain jurisdictions (it should be everywhere).

Are you serious??

Can you imagine.....

excuse me sir, are you refusing to take my money/coins??, I will see you in jail sir because holy hell you not buying from me after you met me is down right illegal!!!

Not in jail, but in court.

[grendel25]

I understanding why miners not filtering transactions for any reason is a good idea as it would diminish the overall fungiblity of Bitcoin.

However, why not have an app that will tell you how dirty the coins are for a particular address that is the source of your potential exchange. You can decide if the coins are too dirty for your liking.

Example, You want to sell a car, someone offers bitcoin. You ask for his address to confirm funds. He provides an address that is a couple steps removed from the Bitstamp heist and 80% of the value in the address is directly linked to the Bitstamp heist. You tell him no thanks.

How would this impact the fungible aspects of Bitcoin?? and it is certainly easy to do so why hasn't anyone done this yet!!

It would be just as easy to supplant bitcoin with a better coin.  But that would be really bad for crypto as a whole so I think it's more likely that your suggestion would be implemented as a fork to the many forks already deployed.

[Miz4r]

The right to freely trade is a basic right, as is the right to refuse!!!

I'm not sure about the “right to refuse”. If you refuse to give service to someone, for example, because they're black, that's discrimination and a crime in certain jurisdictions (it should be everywhere).

Are you serious??

Can you imagine.....

excuse me sir, are you refusing to take my money/coins??, I will see you in jail sir because holy hell you not buying from me after you met me is down right illegal!!!

If I go to a shop and I want to buy something, and they refuse to take my money because my skin is black or my cash looks too 'dirty' to them I would definitely make a case of this. This is a crime where I live and in most places I know, for good reason. It's a slippery slope once merchants start to do this and discriminate coins based on the history linked to it. What if my coins are linked to something controversial like wikileaks or piratebay, or other things that governments or the people with big money don't like? Won't Bitcoin become the same then as VISA/Mastercard as they can just block me from using my coins in most places when my coins are linked to any of these things? No thanks. Messing with fungibility is messing with freedom, period.

[oblivi]

Nothing is gonna happen, and if you are paranoid just use a mixer (hint, the one on my sig for example).

[spazzdla]

If you think coins should be coloured you are probably a regulator or have their D in your butt.

[DieJohnny]

If you think coins should be coloured you are probably a regulator or have their D in your butt.

I am not and do not. I am actually not proposing a stamp on coins. I am just proposing a simple app that will tell me how connected an address is to nasty historical addresses like Bitstamp, or maybe even Gox if there is one.

[R2D221]

I am just proposing a simple app

There's nothing simple about this.

[Jakesy]

I am just proposing a simple app

There's nothing simple about this.

Yep.  Fractions of clean coins mixed with fractions of 'dirty' coins = grey area.

[Possum577]

Use a bitcoin mixer and further remove yourself from the transactions.

[Q7]

Brings me back to this topic, now we have even more dirty coins after the bter hack. We just have to accept it. Can't go on marking and identifying coins

[ajareselde]

Brings me back to this topic, now we have even more dirty coins after the bter hack. We just have to accept it. Can't go on marking and identifying coins

Bitcoin wasnt created so that certain coins would be marked and what not, this is a part of bitcoin idea,anonimity, so you either accept it or go away.
It is on regulations to rise security needed for people to own and run exchange, even tho i believe theyre lying about getting hacked, and they claimed coins themselves.
cheers

[Borisz]

Brings me back to this topic, now we have even more dirty coins after the bter hack. We just have to accept it. Can't go on marking and identifying coins

Bitcoin wasnt created so that certain coins would be marked and what not, this is a part of bitcoin idea,anonimity, so you either accept it or go away.

Agreed.

Money is money. Even $ is used to buy drugs, weapons and who knows what else.
The solution should not be to mark these coins, so that the 100th person who received it somehow legitimately can't use them. "Simply" the wrongdoers should be caught and dealt with.

[manselr]

If I was a rich BTC early investor I would hire a sexy maid to know my dirty coins, gnome saying?

[DieJohnny]

Brings me back to this topic, now we have even more dirty coins after the bter hack. We just have to accept it. Can't go on marking and identifying coins

Let me simplify the discussion for you because I think you and other want to jump into the macro way of thinking about this.

Lets say that today someone approaches you and says I have a great deal on 7,000 Bitcoins, I will sell them all to you for $100 right now.

Lets say you have the money to pay him.

Would you want to know if those 7000 coins were coming from the addresses that are part of the BTER heist before you made the purchase or not???

If you say you don't care, then I think you are not being a responsible member of society. You should care and you it is easy to check, so why not do it.

[R2D221]

If you say you don't care, then I think you are not being a responsible member of society. You should care and you it is easy to check, so why not do it.

No, it's not. After the thief uses a coin mixing service, there's no way to tell where those coins come from.

[odolvlobo]

If you say you don't care, then I think you are not being a responsible member of society. You should care and you it is easy to check, so why not do it.

No, it's not. After the thief uses a coin mixing service, there's no way to tell where those coins come from.

It is not easy.

Even without a mixing service, there is no way to prevent somebody from sending you tainted coins.

Furthermore, what level of taint are you willing to accept? All coins other than newly mined ones will eventually have 100% taint as coins are stolen over time.