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Author Topic: Statement about the suspect of recent Bitcoinica hack  (Read 132431 times)
naima53
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July 30, 2012, 07:22:27 PM
 #581

Perhaps it is not proper thread, but since all are active here .... I have an idea. How to do that would not have to pay the scammers? (fake claim) To reduce the unreasonable claim funds.

 Just ask them to rewrite all those who have already filled in the form of claims. (Fill out the form again.) I know it sounds silly, but believe me, it will have a very strong effect. Up to 70% of fake claims will be rejected as demanding "initial data inconsistency"

it's broken...

https://claims.bitcoinica.com/
That's it! That is why I am writing on it!

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defxor
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July 30, 2012, 07:30:58 PM
 #582

Rackspace?   I thought it was Linode?

~

Linode, March, 40K BTC
Rackspace, May, 18K BTC + loss of database
MtGox, July, 40K BTC + $40K

I'm sure the list is not complete.
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July 30, 2012, 07:33:37 PM
 #583

From the comic book series:
周侗传奇 – "The Legend of Zhou Tong"

An unreleased/unknown volume was recently discovered:
Volume 11 剿杀盜周侗 - "Killing the Thief of Circular Stupidity"


For Bitcoin to be a true global currency the value of BTC needs always to rise.
If BTC became the global currency & money supply = 100 Trillion then ⊅1.00 BTC = $4,761,904.76.
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aq
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July 30, 2012, 07:52:46 PM
 #584

Well, I think you confuse something here. The consultancy kept our funds for a few months, doing basically nothing. Then ZT stepped up and refunded some 5kBTC. Now within days he made more funds available. In my point of view, ZT is the only one that does actually pay back something. If some BitBuster was repaid from this consultancy - fine, however, for all of us still waiting, ZT seems the only one that does not hide behind some delay tactics. Hell, I think, ZT should, if he can, hack the current account of this lame consultancy, so that the funds can be repaid.

I think it is you who are confused.  Ryan Zhou was the one that "hacked" into the site in the first place, stole the coins and destroyed the database.  It is because the database was destroyed that they are having a hard time paying people back.  ZT can't be praised for anything, because he alone willfully caused this mess.


But there is zero evidence, and quite a bit of evidence in the contrary, that Zhou was involved in the Rackspace hack. What makes you believe that?

Apparently there are quite a few guys, like mlawrence, out there, that would love to see the pay back fail. One should really start to wonder why that is...
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July 30, 2012, 07:53:17 PM
 #585

Given the thread, I think this is a good read:

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10823341

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Vod
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July 30, 2012, 07:55:51 PM
 #586

Apparently there are quite a few guys, like mlawrence, out there, that would love to see the pay back fail. One should really start to wonder why that is...

That's nonsense, but wonder away if you wish!

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Phinnaeus Gage
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July 30, 2012, 07:59:06 PM
 #587

Does Patrick A Murck have a twin brother named William who also practices law at the same DC address? That would be so nifty is he does.

~Bruno~
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July 30, 2012, 08:26:07 PM
 #588


Sorry, I still don't get under what authority is Patrick Murck allowed to receive, possess and transfer stolen goods? There must be some sort of judicial process which results in the granting of a warrant to do so? Please Patrick Murck, lets have all the facts and proof.


It's unlikely that there's going to be an issue regarding him receiving or holding the funds in trust.  Where an issue potentially arises is the transferring of the funds to someone else and I'm sure that Patrick's going to do everything possible to protect himself from any potential liability in that respect.

As an interesting side note, if a NZ entity becomes insolvent and a creditor helps secure assets or uncover hidden ones, the creditor's costs associated with securing those assets become a preferential debt.

All I can say is that this is Bitcoin. I don't believe it until I see six confirmations.
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July 30, 2012, 08:27:39 PM
 #589

It's unlikely that there's going to be an issue regarding him receiving or holding the funds in trust.  Where an issue potentially arises is the transferring of the funds to someone else and I'm sure that Patrick's going to do everything possible to protect himself from any potential liability in that respect.

As an interesting side note, if a NZ entity becomes insolvent and a creditor helps secure assets or uncover hidden ones, the creditor's costs associated with securing those assets become a preferential debt.

Patrick is probably getting paid for "helping" us, and each time he comes to the forum to answer questions, he bills for his time.  He'll take his fees out of the balance the users get.

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Phinnaeus Gage
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July 30, 2012, 08:29:56 PM
 #590

It's unlikely that there's going to be an issue regarding him receiving or holding the funds in trust.  Where an issue potentially arises is the transferring of the funds to someone else and I'm sure that Patrick's going to do everything possible to protect himself from any potential liability in that respect.

As an interesting side note, if a NZ entity becomes insolvent and a creditor helps secure assets or uncover hidden ones, the creditor's costs associated with securing those assets become a preferential debt.

Patrick is probably getting paid for "helping" us, and each time he comes to the forum to answer questions, he bills for his time.  He'll take his fees out of the balance the users get.

Can a lawyer do that when located in a state where he doesn't practice law?

~Bruno~
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July 30, 2012, 08:31:52 PM
 #591

It's unlikely that there's going to be an issue regarding him receiving or holding the funds in trust.  Where an issue potentially arises is the transferring of the funds to someone else and I'm sure that Patrick's going to do everything possible to protect himself from any potential liability in that respect.

As an interesting side note, if a NZ entity becomes insolvent and a creditor helps secure assets or uncover hidden ones, the creditor's costs associated with securing those assets become a preferential debt.

Patrick is probably getting paid for "helping" us, and each time he comes to the forum to answer questions, he bills for his time.  He'll take his fees out of the balance the users get.

It's a trivial matter to ask those who've retained him in this matter whether they intend to absorb the cost of his fees relating to this issue.

All I can say is that this is Bitcoin. I don't believe it until I see six confirmations.
ninjarobot
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July 30, 2012, 08:42:16 PM
 #592


Thank you for that link. I filed a complaint on Bitcoinica LP's business practices @ FSPR Compliance <compliance@fspr.govt.nz>.
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July 30, 2012, 09:13:06 PM
 #593

Especially the part,

Quote
he found that for about $130 and a small amount of online paperwork, he could set up a shell company in New Zealand without stepping foot in the country or having any financial presence.

For Bitcoin to be a true global currency the value of BTC needs always to rise.
If BTC became the global currency & money supply = 100 Trillion then ⊅1.00 BTC = $4,761,904.76.
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ninjarobot
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July 30, 2012, 09:18:46 PM
 #594

Especially the part,

Quote
he found that for about $130 and a small amount of online paperwork, he could set up a shell company in New Zealand without stepping foot in the country or having any financial presence.

You should listen to the latest NPR planet money podcast:
http://www.npr.org/blogs/money/2012/07/27/157499893/episode-390-we-set-up-an-offshore-company-in-a-tax-haven
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July 30, 2012, 09:19:15 PM
 #595

It's unlikely that there's going to be an issue regarding him receiving or holding the funds in trust.  Where an issue potentially arises is the transferring of the funds to someone else and I'm sure that Patrick's going to do everything possible to protect himself from any potential liability in that respect.

As an interesting side note, if a NZ entity becomes insolvent and a creditor helps secure assets or uncover hidden ones, the creditor's costs associated with securing those assets become a preferential debt.

Patrick is probably getting paid for "helping" us, and each time he comes to the forum to answer questions, he bills for his time.  He'll take his fees out of the balance the users get.

It's a trivial matter to ask those who've retained him in this matter whether they intend to absorb the cost of his fees relating to this issue.

Patrick Murck will not be taking fee's from the balance of the funds recovered. His fee's are paid for.

He will be making a statement soon, but the funds are safe. He has a good team of lawyers in the gamification and virtual currency space and knows the legalities well.

The claims process needs to get done much faster

-Charlie

Bitcoin pioneer. An apostle of Satoshi Nakamoto. A crusader for a new, better, tech-driven society. A dreamer.

More about me: http://CharlieShrem.com
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July 30, 2012, 09:32:15 PM
 #596


The claims process needs to get done much faster

-Charlie


I don't disagree with you regarding this but I don't think the claims processing can be legitimately restarted until all of the promised funds have been returned by Chen.  If Bitcoinica starts paying people pro-rata today based on what's been promised and then those funds are not recovered, they will not be in a position to treat all creditors equally and that will create yet another legal shitstorm. 

They could pay a percentage based on funds on hand right now and then make further payments as additional funds become available, but it's not an efficient way to handle the process and every extra step introduces more possibility of additional fuck ups.

I would feel differently if those who want Bitcoinica to restart the payment process before all of the promised funds have been delivered by Chen were undertaking to pay any short-fall themselves in the event that Chen returns only part of what's been promised.

All I can say is that this is Bitcoin. I don't believe it until I see six confirmations.
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July 30, 2012, 09:35:30 PM
 #597

Can somebody give me a TL;DR situation on this whole Patrick thing?

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July 30, 2012, 09:36:32 PM
 #598

A update needs to be done ASAP, last update was 2012-06-17, in legal terms this is negligence.  

Bitcoinica still has not given me 50% of my claim of 600 BTC
INTERSANGO can go down with bitcoinica for abandoning customers
Alberto Armandi is a SCAMMER
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Charlie 'Van Bitcoin' Shrem


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July 30, 2012, 09:41:05 PM
 #599


The claims process needs to get done much faster

-Charlie


I don't disagree with you regarding this but I don't think the claims processing can be legitimately restarted until all of the promised funds have been returned by Chen.


Your right, but I have no involvement with that. Has anyone gone after this guy?

Zhou or Chen...someone's gotta pay up 

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July 30, 2012, 10:39:57 PM
 #600

The worst case scenario would be if they start making proportional payments to the largest depositors based on assets they believe they currently hold only to discover they no longer hold those assets. For example, imagine if they calculated they could make 85% payouts prior to this last theft and started making those payouts. Then they discover the theft and no longer have enough funds to make 85% payouts. Then what?

On the flip side, the longer they hold the money, the less chance there will be any left to distributed.

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