Why Bitcoin so popular in Discussions about government taking over the economy?

[Rarity]

The account that bought the car isn't "mine" it's nobody's, a vacant shell account. An address, nothing more.

Then it won't be whitelisted in the first place.

I have no need to explain what someone else does after they buy my cars.

You have to explain what happened when there is no record you sold it and a criminal now has it, yes.

So, what happens when I mine transaction fees from blacklisted addresses along with transaction fees from whitelisted addresses?

We are only dealing with a subset of the Bitcoin economy here and whitelisted coins and wallets.  Mining is entirely meaningless to this scenario.  There is no reason for you to do it.

Insert Quote
In Ireland what they have is the Criminal Assets Bureau, where if they start chasing you, require you to prove you got the funds legitimatelythat was used to buy your property (i.e. your house car etc.).

If you can't provide legit means of income that could cover those assets then they take them off you.

I believe it's something along the same lines in the U.S. so it becomes a case of prove that you're good or you lose everything (although its the IRS in the states).

Yeah, it's not like proposing money laundering and other white collar crime should be illegal is some new crazy idea I came up with.  The only change here is that using Bitcoin as the currency with proper regulation makes enforcing such laws vastly easier.  

Once bought a car from a mate for $7000 and when it came to register it that figure magically changed to $500 so the transfer tax was only paid on the smaller amount  Cheesy

...and under our regulated Bitcoin market the true price would be there for the world to see and you would not be able to get away with it.  

[myrkul]

The account that bought the car isn't "mine" it's nobody's, a vacant shell account. An address, nothing more.

Then it won't be whitelisted in the first place.

...And?

You do realize that the bitcoin protocol makes new addresses at every transaction, right? And change spent from those transactions, in a later transaction, comes from those new addresses, right? If every non-whitelisted address were suspect, everyone would be guilty.

[Rarity]

The account that bought the car isn't "mine" it's nobody's, a vacant shell account. An address, nothing more.

Then it won't be whitelisted in the first place.

...And?

And you can't buy cars with non whitelisted addresses.  You have very little understanding of financial crime and the Bitcoin protocol and it is becoming extremely tiring discussing them with you. 

[myrkul]

The account that bought the car isn't "mine" it's nobody's, a vacant shell account. An address, nothing more.

Then it won't be whitelisted in the first place.

...And?

And you can't buy cars with non whitelisted addresses.

Read the rest of the response.

[Rarity]

So, what happens when I mine transaction fees from blacklisted addresses along with transaction fees from whitelisted addresses?

We are only dealing with a subset of the Bitcoin economy here and whitelisted coins and wallets.  Mining is entirely meaningless to this scenario.  There is no reason for you to do it.

I'm not sure how mining can be meaningless, mining is Bitcoin.

While you are only dealing with a subset of the economy, I'm processing transactions for the entire network. The reason I do it is the block reward. I'm not going to limit my block reward to whitelisted address transaction fees only.

So, either the government controls mining, or it doesn't. If it doesn't, in the process of seeking a block reward I will be processing transactions for whitelisted addresses and blacklisted addresses, and will be adding those fees to my block reward.

So stop mining if you don't like that you aren't rewarded for it.  The government itself can pick up the slack for missing private miners without anyone needing to "control" the process.  This is most likely the endgame Satoshi envisioned for Bitcoin in the first place.  The rewards of mining will be used by the government in case they need to add new whitelisted coins to the economy, for instance to distribute new wealth to the less fortunate.

[Rarity]

If you just answer correctly next time, we could save a lot of wasted time.

Please re-read my comment.  The government is not taking control of anything.  You can keep mining if you want, you just don't get rewarded for it with anything you can spend in your local economy.  Mining will still be done outside of that economy as well in other countries with their own Bitcoin economies, this is not about controlling the network.  

[Rarity]

I don't see what is at all difficult to understand here.  Only the government can add whitelisted Bitcoins to the economy.  None of your mining proceeds would be whitelisted regardless of their source.

[myrkul]

Only the government can add whitelisted Bitcoins to the economy.

wut

Are you frigging kidding me?

[Bitcoin Oz]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LO2eh6f5Go0

[Rarity]

wut

Is it that you guys don't understand what a whitelist is?  I'm at a loss for how you are having difficulty keeping up here.  These concepts are not very advanced.

A list or collection of people or entities that are known, trusted or explicitly permitted.

[myrkul]

wut

Is it that you guys don't understand what a whitelist is?  I'm at a loss for how you are having difficulty keeping up here.  These concepts are not very advanced.

A list or collection of people or entities that are known, trusted or explicitly permitted.

"Whitelisted addresses" does not equate to "only government-mined coins are good"

Sorry, you cannot bend Bitcoin to your socialist dream. If you want something like that, go make SocialistCoin.

[Rarity]

wut

Is it that you guys don't understand what a whitelist is?  I'm at a loss for how you are having difficulty keeping up here.  These concepts are not very advanced.

A list or collection of people or entities that are known, trusted or explicitly permitted.

"Whitelisted addresses" does not equate to "only government-mined coins are good"

Sorry, you cannot bend Bitcoin to your socialist dream. If you want something like that, go make SocialistCoin.

Please stop replying until you have managed to keep up with the discussion and understand what I am saying.  There is no effect here on the actual network itself, the government can blacklist any coin they want from any source they want for use as legal tender and you can still send it wherever you want.  It's just that you'll have about as much chance at using them to buy something legally as you would if you made your own blank nickels.  The metal itself is not important, the fact that is has been minted and stamped by the government is.  

[Cranky4u]

wut

Is it that you guys don't understand what a whitelist is?  I'm at a loss for how you are having difficulty keeping up here.  These concepts are not very advanced.

A list or collection of people or entities that are known, trusted or explicitly permitted.

"Whitelisted addresses" does not equate to "only government-mined coins are good"

Sorry, you cannot bend Bitcoin to your socialist dream. If you want something like that, go make SocialistCoin.

+1000

[myrkul]

wut

Is it that you guys don't understand what a whitelist is?  I'm at a loss for how you are having difficulty keeping up here.  These concepts are not very advanced.

A list or collection of people or entities that are known, trusted or explicitly permitted.

"Whitelisted addresses" does not equate to "only government-mined coins are good"

Sorry, you cannot bend Bitcoin to your socialist dream. If you want something like that, go make SocialistCoin.

Please stop replying until you have managed to keep up with the discussion and understand what I am saying.  There is no effect here on the actual network itself, the government can blacklist any coin they want from any source they want for use as legal tender and you can still send it wherever you want. 

So, your plan is to gradually outsource all industry and employment, as the change from legitimate transactions gets blacklisted by not being attached to the whitelisted addresses anymore, and can therefor no longer be used in legitimate transactions within the country, but is still perfectly acceptable in other areas?

Sounds good.

[Bitcoin Oz]

wut

Is it that you guys don't understand what a whitelist is?  I'm at a loss for how you are having difficulty keeping up here.  These concepts are not very advanced.

A list or collection of people or entities that are known, trusted or explicitly permitted.

"Whitelisted addresses" does not equate to "only government-mined coins are good"

Sorry, you cannot bend Bitcoin to your socialist dream. If you want something like that, go make SocialistCoin.

Please stop replying until you have managed to keep up with the discussion and understand what I am saying.  There is no effect here on the actual network itself, the government can blacklist any coin they want from any source they want for use as legal tender and you can still send it wherever you want.  It's just that you'll have about as much chance at using them to buy something legally as you would if you made your own blank nickels.  The metal itself is not important, the fact that is has been minted and stamped by the government is.  

Bitcoin doesnt use just one address when you end coins.

[FreeMoney]

We should just wait 5 pages and then decide what to title a thread.

[myrkul]

We should just wait 5 pages and then decide what to title a thread.

How's this one?

[Rarity]

wut

Is it that you guys don't understand what a whitelist is?  I'm at a loss for how you are having difficulty keeping up here.  These concepts are not very advanced.

A list or collection of people or entities that are known, trusted or explicitly permitted.

"Whitelisted addresses" does not equate to "only government-mined coins are good"

Sorry, you cannot bend Bitcoin to your socialist dream. If you want something like that, go make SocialistCoin.

Please stop replying until you have managed to keep up with the discussion and understand what I am saying.  There is no effect here on the actual network itself, the government can blacklist any coin they want from any source they want for use as legal tender and you can still send it wherever you want. 

So, your plan is to gradually outsource all industry and employment, as the change from legitimate transactions gets blacklisted by not being attached to the whitelisted addresses anymore, and can therefor no longer be used in legitimate transactions within the country, but is still perfectly acceptable in other areas?

Sounds good.

Coins can be newly whitelisted by the government at any time.  There is no danger of this becoming an issue.  Once again I have to tell you it is becoming very tiresome trying to instruct you in these very basic concepts.  I think it is very likely I am being trolled right now, and it's a shame folks here would ruin what could be such an interesting conversation by doing that.

[myrkul]

Coins can be newly whitelisted by the government at any time.  There is no danger of this becoming an issue.  Once again I have to tell you it is becoming very tiresome trying to instruct you in these very basic concepts.  I think it is very likely I am being trolled right now, and it's a shame folks here would ruin what could be such an interesting conversation by doing that.

OK, so, I make a transaction, and some part of my wallet gets sent to an address I can't see in the client, and is transparently (from my point of view) linked to my main balance. I then have to contact the government, fill out a form, and request that portion of my funds be returned to me?

Why? so the government can decide what transactions are "legitimate" and which are not? What's the point, when I can simply run my entire life on the black market, as many people did in Soviet Russia?

I suppose you're going to have bitcoin police, too, tracking the blockchain, watching for "illegal" transactions? How are you going to differentiate transactions in another country from black market transactions in yours?

[Rarity]

Coins can be newly whitelisted by the government at any time.  There is no danger of this becoming an issue.  Once again I have to tell you it is becoming very tiresome trying to instruct you in these very basic concepts.  I think it is very likely I am being trolled right now, and it's a shame folks here would ruin what could be such an interesting conversation by doing that.

OK, so, I make a transaction, and some part of my wallet gets sent to an address I can't see in the client, and is transparently (from my point of view) linked to my main balance. I then have to contact the government, fill out a form, and request that portion of my funds be returned to me?

Why? so the government can decide what transactions are "legitimate" and which are not? What's the point, when I can simply run my entire life on the black market, as many people did in Soviet Russia?

You are clearly trolling here.  Unless you are sending funds to a non-whitelisted account you have nothing to worry about, I have already explained that.  Unless you want to live without a home and transportation and any government services...basically entirely off the grid, you aren't going black market only. 

I suppose you're going to have bitcoin police, too, tracking the blockchain, watching for "illegal" transactions? How are you going to differentiate transactions in another country from black market transactions in yours?

You have again forgotten the main focus here is a white list. There is no need to track random black market transactions.

Are you intoxicated?  I'm not sure how else to explain your inability to learn about this subject.  If you are under the influence of drugs or alcohol, please consider stopping before we continue this conversation and if you are having difficulty stopping please seek help.  I can recommend this as a really effective program that helps a lot of people.