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Author Topic: ASICMINER: Entering the Future of ASIC Mining by Inventing It  (Read 3916266 times)
ensurance982
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September 02, 2014, 02:08:03 PM
 #22601

I think the strategy of AM is effectively to offer a much cheaper price for the hardware they sell in order to make it impossible for the competition to sell their miners. That way the competition loses their income streams! I believe AM doesn't rely on the profits they make from selling the hardware. I think they're quietly deploying respectable amounts of self- and franchised-hash rate and for now use the revenue to deploy even more. One day FC will come around the corner and say "well, look at our 15% of the hash rate" - is that soo improbable?

I will donate 0.5 BTC to Sean's Outpost when AM will reach 15% of the hashrate!

Ha, quoting you right there! I don't necessarily think they'll achieve 15%, but why not at least 5%? I don't think that's totally unrealistic, maybe even 10%. I'm just saying, who knows what AM is doing, they may very well be putting massive amounts of hash rate online as we speak!

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September 02, 2014, 02:09:58 PM
 #22602

Your criticism is flawed.  You're obviously not from an engineering background.  If costs scaled perfectly for R&D, AM et al would all be on KnC's level of technology right now.  I compare the 40nm costs to those of smaller architectures using a roadmap analysis.  This is imperative because (1) as the difficulty continues to increase, the only way to match the required exponential increases in network hashing power to energy costs as the BTC price stagnates is to use more powerful (density-wise) chips, and (2) the efficiency engineering comes after you've completed a prototype at a smaller architecture - the "fine-tuning" of your draft chip design, followed by the hardware design process and the efficiencies that can be gained therein.

Your critique neglects to acknowledge that mining is an arms race and will be for the foreseeable future.  If you're fighting a war, sure you can bring a million musketmen to the battlefield, but they'll be a pittance compared to your enemy's cruise missiles.

Quoted for future reference. Coming from an engineering background person you made me LOL with this post. Cruise missiles...LOL! You reminded me about ROFLCOPER!

Ha, quoting you right there! I don't necessarily think they'll achieve 15%, but why not at least 5%? I don't think that's totally unrealistic, maybe even 10%. I'm just saying, who knows what AM is doing, they may very well be putting massive amounts of hash rate online as we speak!

Down 10% already? That's a big swing!

If I were a shareholder I would be sad to not know my companies future plans. Almost 2 months of self mining and nobody knows the hashrate...

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September 02, 2014, 02:11:39 PM
 #22603

... One day FC will come around the corner and say "well, look at our 15% of the hash rate" - is that soo improbable?

The wolf also shall dwell with the lamb, and the leopard shall lie down with the kid;
and the calf and the young lion and the fatling together;
and a little child shall lead them.

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September 02, 2014, 02:15:31 PM
 #22604

I think the strategy of AM is effectively to offer a much cheaper price for the hardware they sell in order to make it impossible for the competition to sell their miners. That way the competition loses their income streams! I believe AM doesn't rely on the profits they make from selling the hardware. I think they're quietly deploying respectable amounts of self- and franchised-hash rate and for now use the revenue to deploy even more. One day FC will come around the corner and say "well, look at our 15% of the hash rate" - is that soo improbable?

I will donate 0.5 BTC to Sean's Outpost when AM will reach 15% of the hashrate!

Ha, quoting you right there! I don't necessarily think they'll achieve 15%, but why not at least 5%? I don't think that's totally unrealistic, maybe even 10%. I'm just saying, who knows what AM is doing, they may very well be putting massive amounts of hash rate online as we speak!


I certainly hope that is the case, along with all the other shareholders. To flip the script for a moment, I have a question for you. At what point in 2014 would you start to lose faith in AM's ability to produce a profit out of Gen3 chips? Hypothetically speaking, if we were to enter October with nothing tangible, does this change your view on the company's ability to compete in the mining industry with force, going forward? It is worth noting that while FC has been more active in the forums of late, the "dividends in August" hope resulted from another shareholders claim of a conversation with FC, not from the Cat himself speaking to his shareholders here on the forum.

The information could be 100% valid, however I see so little coverage of that event and the lack of interviews and other information creates an environment where unless I hear it from the Cat himself, I am not getting my hopes up. The summer is about over, expect things to heat up soon if nothing tangible can be produced over the fall season.
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September 02, 2014, 02:34:38 PM
 #22605

I certainly hope that is the case, along with all the other shareholders. To flip the script for a moment, I have a question for you. At what point in 2014 would you start to lose faith in AM's ability to produce a profit out of Gen3 chips? Hypothetically speaking, if we were to enter October with nothing tangible, does this change your view on the company's ability to compete in the mining industry with force, going forward? It is worth noting that while FC has been more active in the forums of late, the "dividends in August" hope resulted from another shareholders claim of a conversation with FC, not from the Cat himself speaking to his shareholders here on the forum.

The information could be 100% valid, however I see so little coverage of that event and the lack of interviews and other information creates an environment where unless I hear it from the Cat himself, I am not getting my hopes up. The summer is about over, expect things to heat up soon if nothing tangible can be produced over the fall season.

You are right, the information about the dividends was't directly form FC, but it was from a translation of what he said at the salon meeting! So I guess the general consensus actually is that FC did state that, no one has said something contrary!
Well if they indeed have gained access to very cheap electricity, they may be able to mine for quite some time at a profit. I don't think their mining will become unprofitable this year. And FC said himself he intends to achieve the previous average hash rate with the current generation. And at the salon he said something along the lines of 25% with BE200 and BE300...
I definitely believe he still highly intends to pay at least some sort of dividends to shareholders.

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September 02, 2014, 03:05:40 PM
 #22606

Yes, BE200 chips missed their design target. But it was hardly as though AM intended this to happen.

How much power does a single BE200 chip consume anyway? If it's ~0.7 W/GH and nominally 10GH like I read, that's approximately 7W. I guess it should still be possible to run them on high power USB ports. Feel free to buy a batch of chips and turn them into consumer-friendly USB miners, if  you're convinced about the potential.

On the other hand, even if the BE200 hadn't missed its power design target, it would not have squeezed within the 2.5W power envelope that standard USB ports would provide. I trust that FC and team had good reasons to aim for the large scale and high density market.

Which manufacturer didnt missed their target recently hm?! ant? nope. spondo? nope nope nope..

It is obvious that USBminers are finished now considering the difficulty and global hashrate. not even worth selling some to noobs, i mean, how much would cost a 10Gh usbminer? 10$? ridiculous, it would hardly cover the manufacturing costs. Plus, hobbyists should be better off with a regular tube or some S3, instead of piling USB dongles anyway.

9TH for 7,9BTC is the best offer that have ever been made so far in the bitcoin mining industry. I still cant make up my mind as to how fast it has evolved since barely a year.


I think that the USB miners from Rockminer are the new "noob" miners...they are what $40 and easy to use?  I think the issue with AM sales is how they have handled it so far...lack of quality control, lack of a good website, and no real support.  It almost feels like they really do not care if they sell the tubes or not? 
VolanicEruptor
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September 02, 2014, 03:09:45 PM
 #22607

i'm starting to believe AM is complete garbage now, and not because of some shithead named lambchops, but rather FC's complete loss of grip on the market

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September 02, 2014, 03:37:03 PM
 #22608

i'm starting to believe AM is complete garbage now, and not because of some shithead named lambchops, but rather FC's complete loss of grip on the market

and could you tell me on what figures or data have you reach such conclusion?
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September 02, 2014, 03:56:58 PM
 #22609

i'm starting to believe AM is complete garbage now, and not because of some shithead named lambchops, but rather FC's complete loss of grip on the market

and could you tell me on what figures or data have you reach such conclusion?

... not that there is much data for the opposite conclusion either.  


Where is the divident? Where is the hopefull simulation data of another generation?
Where are the numbers of the last quarter? Where are the salesfigures?
Has there been any explanation for the last numbers, yet? For example the huge
expense listed as "exchange fee?" or something like that.  
Once a full moon there is info on how many chips there will/have been ordered.
Not that we hear, that they are delivered, or that they have been sold...

Who here can give any fair estimate of what is going on with frainchising, or has gone on....?
I ask you honestly ... with full respect to buisness secrets for competitive advantage for the
future: What gives, that there is no release of what happend even 1 year ago?
________________________________________________________________________
Trollmode: on

Shure, I am sitting with money in the exchanges waiting for bloodbaths to cash in on firesales
on the secret info that friedcat has been held captive by the chinese goverment for months
and everyone is hush about it and the tech stuff just runs the company like any other
shenzen alibaba operation.... NO INFO IS A CLEAR SIGN OF NO INTEREST IN INVESTORS.

My friend, I know a good investment, shure thing. Just looks a bit like as if it is
100% not accountable to you. But it did behave ethical in the past.
Another great advantage are the secret shareholder meetings.
Its so great i just bought 10 grand of more shares.
Trollmode off
________________________________________________________________________
Disclaimer: Still hold substantial amounts since IPO and know how to run a firm hand live.
Request: No investment advise, please.

Edit for spelling and Emphesis


don't let me make you question your assumptions
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September 02, 2014, 04:12:43 PM
 #22610

Why do you or AM shareholder in general think that I have a lot of hate towards AM?

Because you keep making up shit about AM and try to pass it off as facts.

What's the speed of AM self mining? Nobody knows. What's the speed of Bitfury's self mining? Nobody knows, but it's the highest % of the network. These are the big boys. AM is just playing in the sand at this moment.

So, you admit you have no idea how much hashing power AM are mining with then proceed to call them little kids playing in the sand. The only thing you do know is that they had 60 Ph/s worth of BE200 ASICs back in June. That's almost 1/3 of the network hash rate today.

Clearly small potatoes.  Roll Eyes

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September 02, 2014, 04:21:19 PM
 #22611

I would suggest Friedcat to hire some Executive Coaching.
I think that he might be a splendid engineer, but lack managerial skills/business acumen to take the company to the next level.
Either that or hire a CEO. Many technical founders become CTOs, and that's nothing wrong with it.
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September 02, 2014, 04:27:09 PM
 #22612

I would suggest Friedcat to hire some Executive Coaching.
I think that he might be a splendid engineer, but lack managerial skills/business acumen to take the company to the next level.
Either that or hire a CEO. Many technical founders become CTOs, and that's nothing wrong with it.

that is basically the most practical thing that can be done.

don't let me make you question your assumptions
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September 02, 2014, 04:33:48 PM
 #22613

I would suggest Friedcat to hire some Executive Coaching.
I think that he might be a splendid engineer, but lack managerial skills/business acumen to take the company to the next level.
Either that or hire a CEO. Many technical founders become CTOs, and that's nothing wrong with it.


I will be honest when I say some of your other comments have come off with a pushy and aggressive tone. However, this piece of advice must be quoted for significance and logic. ASICMINER is at a crossroads right now and I hope FC realizes that the environment from early 2013 has changed at lightning speed.
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September 02, 2014, 04:56:38 PM
 #22614

I would suggest Friedcat to hire some Executive Coaching.
I think that he might be a splendid engineer, but lack managerial skills/business acumen to take the company to the next level.
Either that or hire a CEO. Many technical founders become CTOs, and that's nothing wrong with it.

Brilliant engineer, yes.  Needs MBA and with his one-in-a-billion resume could get into the very best programs in the world.
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September 02, 2014, 05:16:06 PM
 #22615

hope this is MBA and executive recommendation sees more action then the public relations agent.

don't let me make you question your assumptions
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September 02, 2014, 05:28:35 PM
 #22616

I would suggest Friedcat to hire some Executive Coaching.
I think that he might be a splendid engineer, but lack managerial skills/business acumen to take the company to the next level.
Either that or hire a CEO. Many technical founders become CTOs, and that's nothing wrong with it.

Brilliant engineer, yes.  Needs MBA and with his one-in-a-billion resume could get into the very best programs in the world.

Doesn't need MBAs, just executive coaching... but that is only if he really wants to delve deeper into the boring executive role.
I know that most creative guys prefer to be on more creative roles, such as strategic product design, or any area that is orbiting their main skills and areas of interest.
Very simple rule of thumb: Keep core competence, delegate incompetence.
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September 02, 2014, 05:53:19 PM
 #22617

I would suggest Friedcat to hire some Executive Coaching.
I think that he might be a splendid engineer, but lack managerial skills/business acumen to take the company to the next level.
Either that or hire a CEO. Many technical founders become CTOs, and that's nothing wrong with it.

Brilliant engineer, yes.  Needs MBA and with his one-in-a-billion resume could get into the very best programs in the world.

Doesn't need MBAs, just executive coaching... but that is only if he really wants to delve deeper into the boring executive role.
I know that most creative guys prefer to be on more creative roles, such as strategic product design, or any area that is orbiting their main skills and areas of interest.
Very simple rule of thumb: Keep core competence, delegate incompetence.

Nah - from everything I've seen, its 'mentor core competence', 'source incompetence closely so as to learn'.  This will be especially effective in the coming years if AM is to survive.  If friedcat wants to continue growth in the cryptosphere, yes, he's going to need to delegate, but the team ("C-suite", for all intents and operational purposes) which he would assemble has to be able to maximize the economies of skill across their respective backgrounds to learn the business as a cohesive unit rather than a commodity-skills-modeled assembly of disinterested individuals.
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September 02, 2014, 06:38:34 PM
 #22618

Coindesk Today:

Huobi’s Fixed-Return Financial Product Sells Out in One Hour

link: http://www.coindesk.com/huobis-fixed-return-financial-product-sells-one-hour/


ASICMINER related quote:

Digcoin has arrangements with Chinese mining equipment manufacturers Avalon and AsicMiner, among others. It is part of the Discus Fish mining pool and sends funds to a publicly released address. At current strength it mines about 28 BTC per day.


So here is that...

Anyone cares to estimate the size of the sellout of Huobi's DIGCOIN/DIG-VC that happened today ? And also how much revenue that could have generated for Asicminer ?


Instead of pasting text from the article, here the article link again: http://www.coindesk.com/huobis-fixed-return-financial-product-sells-one-hour/

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September 02, 2014, 06:52:27 PM
 #22619

Coindesk Today:

Huobi’s Fixed-Return Financial Product Sells Out in One Hour

link: http://www.coindesk.com/huobis-fixed-return-financial-product-sells-one-hour/


ASICMINER related quote:

Digcoin has arrangements with Chinese mining equipment manufacturers Avalon and AsicMiner, among others. It is part of the Discus Fish mining pool and sends funds to a publicly released address. At current strength it mines about 28 BTC per day.


So here is that...

Anyone cares to estimate the size of the sellout of Huobi's DIGCOIN/DIG-VC that happened today ? And also how much revenue that could have generated for Asicminer ?


Instead of pasting text from the article, here the article link again: http://www.coindesk.com/huobis-fixed-return-financial-product-sells-one-hour/


"Digcoin is raising investment to significantly increase its overall hashing power. It currently stands at 1.3 PH/s (petahashes per second), or 2.5% of the bitcoin network’s global hash rate. It is seeking to raise that power to 4 PH/s."

2.5%?even 4PH isnt 2.5% right now
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September 02, 2014, 07:34:42 PM
 #22620

Quote
2.5%?even 4PH isnt 2.5% right now

correct.

The sale from today was 2000 shares 1 btc each which makes 2000 btc of contracts.
For a ballpark estimate, at first, I was tempted to get those 2000 btc and divide by 7.9 btc (price of one AM tube set) which gives ~ 253 sets. Then if one set is ~ 700-800 GH/s we have ~ 200 TH

BUT

These contracts are just some kind of rental agreement / capital raise for 60 days... The contract purchaser does not own the equipment...

But we can at least hope that the capital raised via this sale, these 2000 btc has been heading towards the 7.9 btc AM Tubes... And maybe this is only the beginning ?! AM supporters I am sure hope so.

200 TH can easily become 1 PH seeing the stellar success of today's Dig-VC SALE :
50% of the 2000 BTC was sold in the first 2 minutes!
The rest 50%=1000 BTC changed hands in 1 hour from the start.

Most of it was bought by Chinese/Asians the article says...




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