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Author Topic: Why the darkcoin/dash/dashpay instamine matters  (Read 36347 times)
qwizzie
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March 24, 2015, 06:19:57 PM
 #61

Dark coins been out for months now. Why is everyone upset about an instamine now?

They are not upset about the instamine, they are upset about the price rise of DRK over these last few months.
They fear it directly undermines their own coin.

Dash Masternodes Info : http://qwizzie.1apps.com/Dash/
Dash Merchants Info : http://qwizzie.1apps.com/Dash-Merchants/
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March 24, 2015, 06:22:15 PM
 #62

Dark coins been out for months now. Why is everyone upset about an instamine now?

DARK is trying to steal the name of Dash, a Cryptonote coin with real privacy.

The reason is the Darkcoin Foundation wants to escape their poker/gambling/darkmarket past and take start marketing their HYIP to normal people.

Pushing Ponzis on Bitcoin Rich crypto-nerds for lulz and profit is one thing.  Tempting with ridiculous ROI decent folks who work hard for their money is another matter.

"It's the Next BitcoinTM and the Next VisaTM all in one; get in on the Ground FloorTM" they say.   Roll Eyes

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Warning Dash is a planned instamine, it wasn't an accident


The difference between bad and well-developed digital cash will determine whether we have a dictatorship or a real democracy.  David Chaum 1996
Fungibility provides privacy as a side effect.  Adam Back 2014
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Blocksize is an intentionally limited resource, like the 21e6 BTC limit.  Changing it degrades the surrounding economics, creating negative incentives.  Jeff Garzik 2013


"I believed @Dashpay instamine was a bug & not a feature but then read: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=421615.msg13017231#msg13017231
I'm not against people making money, but can't support questionable origins."
https://twitter.com/Tone_LLT/status/717822927908024320


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It is an Engineering Requirement that Bitcoin be “Above the Law”  Paul Sztorc 2015
Resiliency, not efficiency, is the paramount goal of decentralized, non-state sanctioned currency -Jon Matonis 2015

Bitcoin is intentionally designed to be ungovernable and governance-free.  luke-jr 2016

Technology tends to move in the direction of making surveillance easier, and the ability of computers to track us doubles every eighteen months. - Phil Zimmerman 2013

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BlockaFett
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March 24, 2015, 06:28:33 PM
 #63


moohnero blah blah




(dear Mods, before you delete me, this is not off topic because this pic represents how Smooth doesn't really care about drk public launch emission, instead he cares because he is the layabout Monero core dev who submitted 3 lines of code in the last 12 months and is butthurt because a real coin is owning his thinly valed investor scam)

anonymousxx1503
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March 24, 2015, 06:29:43 PM
 #64

Please stop with these FUD threads  Sad the price is rising way too fast because of you


Thanks retard.

I'd like to thank eduffield and the other developers for this critically important evolution in virtual currency. DarkCoin is what bitcoin should have been. Some might call it "Bitcoin 2.0" but would do better by saying: "DarkCoin is digital cash." - Child Harold - February 28, 2014
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=421615.msg5424980#msg5424980
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March 24, 2015, 06:30:06 PM
 #65

Darkturd shill blah blah blah
qwizzie
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March 24, 2015, 06:30:56 PM
 #66

Conclusion to OP's topic ''why the darkcoin/dash instamine matters'' :

it doesnt matter, all that matters is the amount of work put into development of Darkcoin and its ability to actually achieve what it set
out to achieve only a year ago. The market regnonices and confirms the progress in price correction.

Dash Masternodes Info : http://qwizzie.1apps.com/Dash/
Dash Merchants Info : http://qwizzie.1apps.com/Dash-Merchants/
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March 24, 2015, 06:35:18 PM
 #67

Dark coins been out for months now. Why is everyone upset about an instamine now?

They are not upset about the instamine, they are upset about the price rise of DRK over these last few months.
They fear it directly undermines their own coin.

Of course it's about the price . There are many dozens of premined/instamined/scam coins but there is no point in worrying about them because they amount to nothing. Having a "suspect" coin growing so big is of concern and worth investigating.

"We are just fools. We insanely believe that we can replace one politician with another and something will really change. The ONLY possible way to achieve change is to change the very system of how government functions. Until we are prepared to do that, suck it up for your future belongs to the madness and corruption of politicians."
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March 24, 2015, 07:21:17 PM
 #68

Let's ignore DarkCoin.
 
LOL

So why 2 of your devs pass hour and hour in our thread, and bashing us on reddit??

For your information thanks to them I'll never ever invest a $ in this shitcoin and speak about this to all my friends:

Quote from:  link=topic=421615.msg10863910#msg10863910 date=1427141519
Quote from:  link=topic=421615.msg10859967#msg10859967 date=1427117950
Smooth, as someone who holds some Monero (less and less over time, admittedly), you make me very nervous with the amount of time you spend in the Dash thread slandering other developers instead of working on your own technology.  You and Fluffypony need to figure out that if you put more of your time into development, and show that your technology a positive future, the community will see this promise and will defend the tech for you- as has happened with Dash.  Their developers don't get involved in circular arguments that waste everyone's time on anonymous message boards ("You prove this", "No, you prove this", etc).  They focus on improving their product and they get things done.  Positivity will trump negativity every time.

I understand that you have "concern" that people are choosing the "wrong" technology, and that you're "concerned" for late-comers about the amount of coins released early on.  I came in "late" and I researched all of the facts and I still invested in Dash.  You come off as very greedy and obviously aren't concerned for anyone other than yourself.  As an investor in your product, I ask you to please worry about your own project and don't come here making up reasons to bash someone else's.  



Well, I think I'm gonna like having you around


Hey, thanks.  I'll be around for a while.  I have them all ignored now, but I just couldn't resist letting the Monero developer know what I thought about the way he chooses to use his time as someone who once thought Monero possibly had a future.  I had been slowly getting out of Monero for some time and after seeing how the devs have acted the past few days (Fluffypony bashing Dash on Reddit non-stop, and Smooth spending literally 10+ hours in this thread today alone) I'm fully out and done with them. I don't know how anyone can possibly think Monero has a any sort of long term future with those two jealous greedy children being the main developers.

I hope that more and more people will see that Monero Devs have no clue, only option attack the success coin.

Edit : loosers !  Tongue
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March 24, 2015, 07:23:52 PM
 #69

Maybe you forgot InstantX..

A real beauty...

Edit : double loosers  Tongue Tongue
nachoig
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March 24, 2015, 07:54:05 PM
 #70


I already considered several times to buy darkcoin, but all the controversy are keeping me away from it... i didnt realise that alrady exist one coin with the name Dashcoin, its not ethical at all, and tell alot about the dev.. all the links you have on your signature are the reason because i am still away from it, even knowing that i could have 20x the value of the investment that i think in made back then i think i will just keep away... i believe that the main reason for the price beeing so high is the greed for masternodes alone, but everything else just dont fit in my personality

I also don't think people understand the attractiveness of having a perpetuity of cash flow from a masternode... you always hear of people wanting a money tree, well, this seems to be the closest thing to it (coupled with the fact that at any time, you can spend those generated coins as well as the original if you no longer want to run a mn). Life is all about taking risks. You get in the car to go to work, there's always a chance you get into an accident and die. Don't be the shortsighted people thinking that arguing over a few dimes in the price per BTC back in 2011-2012 was about getting a better entry point when in the grand scheme of things, it meant you might have missed out on one of the greatest rallies ever. If you're a believer in crypto, then there's a massive amount of upside from here, especially if you start looking at the global economies and abused monetary policies.

I hope that more and more people will see what Darkcoin/Dash is about.

Well, from what I know, there are about 2300 masternodes. As each masternode needs 1000 DRK to operate, so there are 2,300,000 DRK "frozen" (these coins can be moved only if you want to shutdown the masternode), or 44% of the currently supply (about 5,200,000).
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March 24, 2015, 07:58:58 PM
 #71

Around 15% of the total monero coin supply was instamined by several groups including the original dev who was removed from the project for scamming. Smooth has admitted only 5% being instamined with a optimized miner from one group that went public, the other teams are still on the loose waiting to dump coins on newcomers. They had everyone mining on a "crippled miner" while elite insiders had optimized miners. smooth is one of the original bad holder and possible the ousted original anon dev.
The nsa involvement is bad enough but the inflationary distribution model will kill this coin before the massive bloat does.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CryptoNote#NSA_involvement

Blowing the lid off the CryptoNote/Bytecoin scam (with the exception of Monero)
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=740112.0

Zerocash is a monero killer! RIP
Dump it now, thank me later.




DASH = Digital Cash         FAQ          DASHTALK
othe
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March 24, 2015, 08:08:51 PM
 #72

Around 15% of the total monero coin supply was instamined by several groups including the original dev who was removed from the project for scamming. Smooth has admitted only 5% being instamined with a optimized miner from one group that went public, the other teams are still on the loose waiting to dump coins on newcomers. They had everyone mining on a "crippled miner" while elite insiders had optimized miners. smooth is one of the original bad holder and possible the ousted original anon dev.
The nsa involvement is bad enough but the inflationary distribution model will kill this coin before the massive bloat does.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CryptoNote#NSA_involvement

Blowing the lid off the CryptoNote/Bytecoin scam (with the exception of Monero)
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=740112.0

Zerocash is a monero killer! RIP
Dump it now, thank me later.





Nothing was instamined, the emission curve is totally perfect and sheduled how it was meant to be.
The NSA involvement, well, sounds good - the NSA knows how to make crypto systems way better than Mr. Duffield - thank you.

Blowing the lid off - with the exception of Monero, thank you again; do you know what exception means?


Peters comment is MRL-0001 which got fixed with MRL-0004 -  a totally theoretic attack anyway :-) Unlike the Darkcoiners we aren't as arrogant to not attack our own crypto and make it better :-)
You could paste the other comments from Peter maybe?

Quote
Peter Todd @petertoddbtc  ·  Mar 20

I probably should get around to finally buying some #Monero; @xmr_to is a pretty clever service. https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/2zrdxz/withdrawals_halted_as_stolen_evolution_coins_make/

MRL-0004 is worth reading btw, but i doubt you can understand it  - but maybe give it a try:
MRL-0004: Improving Obfuscation in the CryptoNote Protocol - https://lab.getmonero.org/pubs/MRL-0004.pdf

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March 24, 2015, 08:12:28 PM
 #73

.... then zerocash is also a DRK killer... unless instanx is all it worked up to be.

"leads to a lot of ugly situations that zerocash WILL resolve"

FTFY

(as in its not here yet.)

< Monero Compile Instructions >   < Track your bitcoins! > < Track them again! > < Monero NVIDIA mining instructions > < MONERODO : An operating system for your dedicated decentralized node device > <<< What is fungibility? >>> 46P88uZ4edEgsk7iKQUGu2FUDYcdHm2HtLFiGLp1inG4e4f9PTb4mbHWYWFZGYUeQidJ8hFym2WUmWc p34X8HHmFS2LXJkf <<< Free subdomains at moneroworld.com!! >>> <<< If you don't want to run your own node, point your wallet to node.moneroworld.com, and get connected to a random node! >>> @@@@@ Simple Monero Node Installer and Monitor for Windows @@@@@
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March 24, 2015, 10:18:21 PM
 #74

I do find it interesting that after 4 pages of attacks, not one person has even attempted to (reasonably) address smooth's points in the OP.
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March 24, 2015, 10:26:30 PM
 #75


Nothing was instamined, the emission curve is totally perfect and sheduled how it was meant to be.
The NSA involvement, well, sounds good - the NSA knows how to make crypto systems way better than Mr. Duffield - thank you.

Blowing the lid off - with the exception of Monero, thank you again; do you know what exception means?


Peters comment is MRL-0001 which got fixed with MRL-0004 -  a totally theoretic attack anyway :-) Unlike the Darkcoiners we aren't as arrogant to not attack our own crypto and make it better :-)
You could paste the other comments from Peter maybe?

Quote
Peter Todd @petertoddbtc  ·  Mar 20

I probably should get around to finally buying some #Monero; @xmr_to is a pretty clever service. https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/2zrdxz/withdrawals_halted_as_stolen_evolution_coins_make/

MRL-0004 is worth reading btw, but i doubt you can understand it  - but maybe give it a try:
MRL-0004: Improving Obfuscation in the CryptoNote Protocol - https://lab.getmonero.org/pubs/MRL-0004.pdf


I saw this:

https://download.wpsoftware.net/bitcoin/wizardry/brs-arbitrary-output-sizes.txt - Ring Signature Blinding

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=768499.0


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March 24, 2015, 10:40:47 PM
 #76


I already considered several times to buy darkcoin, but all the controversy are keeping me away from it... i didnt realise that alrady exist one coin with the name Dashcoin, its not ethical at all, and tell alot about the dev.. all the links you have on your signature are the reason because i am still away from it, even knowing that i could have 20x the value of the investment that i think in made back then i think i will just keep away... i believe that the main reason for the price beeing so high is the greed for masternodes alone, but everything else just dont fit in my personality

I also don't think people understand the attractiveness of having a perpetuity of cash flow from a masternode... you always hear of people wanting a money tree, well, this seems to be the closest thing to it (coupled with the fact that at any time, you can spend those generated coins as well as the original if you no longer want to run a mn). Life is all about taking risks. You get in the car to go to work, there's always a chance you get into an accident and die. Don't be the shortsighted people thinking that arguing over a few dimes in the price per BTC back in 2011-2012 was about getting a better entry point when in the grand scheme of things, it meant you might have missed out on one of the greatest rallies ever. If you're a believer in crypto, then there's a massive amount of upside from here, especially if you start looking at the global economies and abused monetary policies.

I hope that more and more people will see what Darkcoin/Dash is about.

The very design of the two-tier approach falls on the back of the masternode network. You're paid to provide a service--at the moment, IX locking and Darksend mixing. If you freelance your time in graphic design, should you not get paid for it? For some, they could give two shits about masternodes but they are the structure of the coin and what offer DASH utility. From a price standpoint, they are an investment and an income stream--no different than mining in that regard. The difference is you're trading hardware depreciation and resale value for currency speculation (good or bad depending on direction). The fact that so many people have opted to setup masternodes tells you a lot about them believing in what the coin has to offer and they are getting a return for doing so. From a price discovery standpoint, S&D factors come into play with where an equilibrium of masternodes to justify the value of the coin, stabilizes. I don't expect you to understand.
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March 24, 2015, 10:46:57 PM
 #77

the masternode network. You're paid to provide a service--at the moment, IX locking and Darksend mixing. If you freelance your time in graphic design, should you not get paid for it?

The block reward portion of the masternode payments is not negotiated and made by the person purchasing that service (by contrast with fees). It is set by the developer in a fairly arbitrary manner, and paid by miners to whom the masternode operator provides no service (in fact InstantX competes with miners). So at best (if it is not an investment scheme), masternode operators are a commercial vendor of the developer, or a confederation of the developer along with miners.

It is certainly not the same model as mining. At best there are some vague similarities.

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March 24, 2015, 10:52:12 PM
 #78

As for the issues Smooth described in the OP:

Numerous existing holders aren't pleased with the beginnings of the coin but its just that, beginnings. A starting point. No one expected Darkcoin to morph into what it is presently and the masternode concept wasn't even a thing back at launch. The reality of the situation is that its an unfortunate reality but one in which miners decided to continue supporting the codebase as well as buyers/sellers continuing to transact in coins. People invest for numerous reasons: utility offered, speculation, etc. The coin as it stands today isn't what it was in the beginning, not even close and it continues to innovate and branch out--part of the reason for the name change. People looking at taking a position have been able to see over the course of the year what the development team has done and certainly on a weekly, ongoing basis, heard nonstop about the instamine. People still continue to support the project because in the face of its history, it continues to offer utility and has differentiating factors that separate it from other coins. People buy into company stock all the time when IPO's float only a portion of ownership while retaining the lionshare. And on that note, there was ample opportunities for anyone if they desired to pick up coins on the cheap over a course of a few months of non-stop stagnation in price and constant dumpings.
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March 24, 2015, 10:55:47 PM
 #79

the masternode network. You're paid to provide a service--at the moment, IX locking and Darksend mixing. If you freelance your time in graphic design, should you not get paid for it?

The block reward portion of the masternode payments is not negotiated and made by the person purchasing that service (by contrast with fees). It is set by the developer in a fairly arbitrary manner, and paid by miners to whom the masternode operator provides no service (in fact InstantX competes with miners). So at best (if it is not an investment scheme), masternode operators are a commercial vendor of the developer, or a confederation of the developer along with miners.

It is certainly not the same model as mining. At best there are some vague similarities.



The block reward of nearly every coin is arbitrary. As for competing with miners, its a double-edged sword. The whole utility aspect of the coin is based entirely on the masternode network, without it, the miners would have "no value". As for IX competing with miners... hardly. There still needs to be a POW confirm for IX to work. Further, if IX fails, it defaults back to conventional POW confirms.
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March 24, 2015, 10:56:13 PM
 #80

As for the issues Smooth described in the OP:

Numerous existing holders aren't pleased with the beginnings of the coin but its just that, beginnings. A starting point.

We're still not even at the starting point of cryptocurrency. To feel locked into something that was launched in a deceptive and misleading manner by the person or people still running it just because a millimeter or two of progress has been made on a million meter journey is silly.

There are plenty of alternatives that don't have that, er, baggage.
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