Mt Gox thinks it's the Fed. Freezes acc based on "tainted" coins. (unlocked now)

[556j]

Most recent update, they unlocked the account. Thanks for the support.

Hello,

We have had the AML requirement lifted from your account as Bitcoinica no longer wishes to pursue this case. Our apologies for the inconvenience caused.

Thanks,

MtGox.com Team

Original post follows.




Yesterday I got my mt gox acc locked. I thought it was strange since I barely use the service and put a few hundred a month through it. I wasn't passing any limits or moving any amount of money that matters. Well today I got a reply to my support ticket, here it is.

Hello Name,

Thank you for your inquiry. Due to the incident of stolen coins from Bitcoinica a couple of weeks ago, the accounts that are suspected to have been receiving the tainted coins were flagged for AML. If you believe that this was done in error, please submit your official ID and proof of residence so that the AML team may verify your account. Our apologies for the inconvenience caused and thank you for your kind cooperation in this matter.

Thanks,

MtGox.com Team

This is the first time BTC has entered my acc since the linode hacks. It was less than $150 and it was payments from customers all over the world. So of course there might be some tainted coins in there but I suspect the percent of them would be very low. I also bet any of you that have accepted payments in the last few weeks will have the same small percent of taint. Of course Mt gox sees this is a great opportunity to shit on the community when it's down, and steal from us. It's obvious they are using this as an excuse to lock accounts based on the chance they won't verify, then profit. Nice business practices there.

Are they even allowed to do this? I'm sure their EULA says they can, right after they sacrifice your firstborn and empty your bank account because of a typo, but legally? They think they can say what coins are good or bad? How could merchants accept payments if this is the case? It's the same as a charge back just through different means.

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[DeathAndTaxes]

They may or may not be able to do that legally however it will take a lawsuit to find out.  So far any seizures they have done haven't been worth the effort for anyone to contest them.  The fact that they are in Japan and most of their customers are not in Japan hasn't helped.

Eventually I would suspect they will be sued and if found in violation hopefully get slammed with some massive punitive damages on top of actual damages. 

I can't see how even the most forced reading of KYC or AML laws requires them to track tainted coins and if they did what is "tainted"?  Did Bitcoinica file a police report?  If not then based on what due process are they even considering the coins stolen?  Because an anonymous person (no offense Zou) on an anonymous message board said their anonymous funds were stolen.

Mt Gox.  I had 783901237129037289312701389 coins stolen 9 seconds ago.  I will send you some addresses please comply with "the law" and block all the tainted coinz and stuff.

Complying with the law is one thing, being the Bitcoin Police is another.  Someday I expect a lawsuit but it likely won't happen until they fuck over the wrong person (someone with both the means and opportunity to strike back).

[rjk]

I'm pretty sure they are looking to get everyone verified at any cost, thus the constant stream of AML docs required for petty things like this. Although I find it useful that they are bothering to even look into where the coins came from, it could be as simple as locking the account and asking the user that deposited them and then unlocking it again, no AML bs needed.

[MPOE-PR]

This is ridiculous. MtGox is turning into Microsoft.

[kakobrekla]

This is ridiculous. MtGox is turning into Microsoft.

MS stole your tainted money?

[muyuu]

I'm only dealing with Intersango now, though I'd like to know of their stance about this to be honest.

MtGox can go fuck themselves.

[MPOE-PR]

MS stole your tainted money?

I don't have either tainted money or MS, but if you'd stop beating your wife for five minutes you'd notice MS also uses their customer's resources to promote their boneheaded take on politics.

[Polvos]

This is turning insane. MtGox is shooting his foot because everybody who has accepted some payment in March can have tainted coins in a low percent. So the more topics starting with "MTGox has frozen my account", the less people will use that changer.


Dear MtGox workers:

- How many "tainted" coins make my address open to freeze? Is it a percentage or more than a number of coins?

- Are you going to increase the crimes that involve Bitcoins in order to taint them? Please, take a look at the next transaction:

http://blockexplorer.com/tx/9d170708462dbeac1d4fedc849c1fa91f0da52e6f2d2dae1baf2d797cc9a12d6#i4791420

I think this transaction proves that "Lupus" payed some coins for a sexual service from a user called "TrAnnY", so please taint them too.

[556j]

By the way, they were fine with me selling off my "tainted" BTC on their market, so they get their commission. My account only got frozen after I exchanged the coins for USD and tried to withdrawal so good luck to whoever bought my coins!

Mt Gox sells tainted coins then locks your account for having them.

If I don't verify the acc how much do you think bitcoinica will get of those funds? I mean that's why they're doing this right? Like my jokes? I'll be here all night.

[the joint]

I think people need to leave Gox.  A while ago they shut down my account without any warning and stole the 25 cents I had in there (at least I assume that's what happened as no combination of email/password worked, and attempts to recover my password were hopelessly in vain).  I never even found out this had happened until I tried logging back in one day.  

Now, I don't care about the 25 cents (although, this was USD not BTC).  I've never done heavy trading on Gox and never will -- the 25 cents was a test.  But seriously, Gox easily trumps almost every other exchange in terms of horrible customer service and shadiness based upon the dozens of threads I've seen flaming them.  And, I believe they stole from me -- a quarter.  A fucking quarter.  Seriously?  Are their profit margins so slim that they 1) can't hire extra customer support staff and 2) need to steal quarters from the other side of the globe?

To me, their business appears as ugly as Karpeles's face.  And goddamn is it ugly.

[Matthew N. Wright]

I'm only dealing with Intersango now, though I'd like to know of their stance about this to be honest.

MtGox can go fuck themselves.

Lol. You don't even know what their stance on it is but you're so sure to associate yourself with them?

[Sergey (imcex.com)]

Mt Gox sells tainted coins then locks your account for having them.

No that I'm protecting MtGox but are you sure it was all about tainted coins and not something else?

[Matthew N. Wright]

Mt Gox sells tainted coins then locks your account for having them.

No that I'm protecting MtGox but are you sure it was all about tainted coins and not something else?

+1

They don't block tainted coins. They block suspicious people.

[muyuu]

I'm only dealing with Intersango now, though I'd like to know of their stance about this to be honest.

MtGox can go fuck themselves.

Lol. You don't even know what their stance on it is but you're so sure to associate yourself with them?

So far no records of this kind of policy.

Wish they came forward and explicitly say that they won't do any MtGoxing.

[556j]

Mt Gox sells tainted coins then locks your account for having them.

No that I'm protecting MtGox but are you sure it was all about tainted coins and not something else?

+1

They don't block tainted coins. They block suspicious people.

This is the attitude they love and thrive on.

Did you read the quote from them in my first post. I mean even if you were right isn't they reply they gave me pretty shady considering as you say, they don't block tainted coins? (hint: they do)

How suspicious is a US based account moving three digits a month from same ip (Time Warner)

No matter what I say people with your mentality will think I was the problem. It's ok I thought exactly the same way until it happened to me.

[Matthew N. Wright]

No matter what I say people with your mentality will think I was the problem. It's ok I thought exactly the same way until it happened to me.

Au contrare. I have been the greatest publicly vocal Mt Gox detractor. In a situation where coins were stolen from Linode and they want to find out who did it though, I support them.

[556j]

It sounds noble sure.

From where I'm sitting I can see how ridiculous the claim is that I have anything to do with linode stuff. Too bad I don't really have a way to prove that to the community here. Though I probably wouldn't be here posting all this from my home IP (same one I use at mt gox, theymos can see it's a Time Warner IP from the states) You can read my posts here and gather I'm probably not smart enough to pull it off. I accepted payment (from many different people) so it's possible I have some percent of stolen coins but I can't control that. The whole point of BTC was this couldn't happen. My customers paying in stolen funds then screwing me over, that is.

Watch out, big baller trying to Launder $150 here... I mean if I was trying to cash out some bigger number with a high percent of taint maybe I could understand, but not this.

[Matthew N. Wright]

It sounds noble sure.

From where I'm sitting I can see how ridiculous the claim is that I have anything to do with linode stuff. Too bad I don't really have a way to prove that to the community here. Though I probably wouldn't be here posting all this from my home IP (same one I use at mt gox, theymos can see it's a Time Warner IP from the states) You can read my posts here and gather I'm probably not smart enough to pull it off. I accepted payment (from many different people) so it's possible I have some percent of stolen coins but I can't control that. The whole point of BTC was this couldn't happen. My customers paying in stolen funds then screwing me over, that is.

Watch out, big baller trying to Launder $150 here... I mean if I was trying to cash out some bigger number with a high percent of taint maybe I could understand, but not this.

Let's not argue the MtGox issues since they are ripe with shadiness. Let's argue the Linode hack. Do you support finding out who hacked it?

[DeathAndTaxes]

Not this way.

The people give the authority to investigate crimes to the Police.  They still must abide by due process.  An entity simply making themselves final arbiter without due process is tyranny. 

[rjk]

Not this way.

The people give the authority to investigate crimes to the Police.  They still must abide by due process.  An entity simply making themselves final arbiter without due process is tyranny.  

It isn't illegal. While I do agree that they are going about it in a somewhat heavy handed manner (requiring verification/AML) and generally botching the process, I support the effort to trace back where the coins came from.

It is obvious that the perp is doing a very good job of disposing of his  the stolen coins effectively, but all criminals slip up somewhere, and maybe the gox will be the one to point out who it is.