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For most coins, nodes being hosted on a corporate server isn't a big deal, but when their advertised anonymity depends on those nodes, it's a massive security breach waiting to happen.

Here's a list of active Dash masternodes, the hosting company (or privately held node), and their address:

Accelerated IT servers: Frankfurt Germany: 95
Amazon USA: 44
Asmunda Frankfurt Germany: 150
Bhost ltd: England/Amsterdam: 3
Choopa, NJ, USA: 162
City Network Hosting Stockholm Sweden: 4
CJSR Russia: 1
ColoCrossing NY USA: 14
Comcast PA USA: 3
Crisis Solutions LLC USA: 7
Deutsche Telekom Germany: 1
Digital Ocean NY  USA: 75
DNA Oy  Finland: 4
Earthnet CO USA: 1
Evanzo ECom Germany: 1
Fevvo Inc CT USA: 11
Hetzner Online Germany: 2
Hostinger Intl. Cyprus: 1
HostUs USA: 1
IDC*China or MA USA: 10
Internet Assigned Numbers: 3
Microsoft USA: 3
MyLoc Managed Dusseldorf Germany: 104
Neterra Bulgaria: 1
NodeServ LLC FL USA: 32
Online SAS France: 213
PP KOM i TEX Ukraine: 1
Private Layer Inc Zurich Switzerland: 110
QHoster Ltd  Bulgaria: 96
QuadraNet CA USA: 4
QuickPacket Llc GA USA: 4
RackSpace Hosting TX USA: 2
Rogers Cable Com Canada: 3
Serverius Netherlands: 1
TDC A/S Denmark: 1
Telecom3Sverige AB Sweden: 1
Time Warner USA: 1
UAB Technoloigu Lithuania: 4
VideoTron Telecom Lte Canada: 1

--Of the 1175 active nodes I only found 4 that could be considered run on privately held nodes (3 Internet Assigned Numbers and 1 PP KOM i TEX). The other 1171 were listed under hosting companies.

By country:

Germany: 352 (29.95%)

Accelerated IT servers: Frankfurt Germany: 95
Asmunda Frankfurt Germany: 150
Deutsche Telekom Germany: 1
Hetzner Online Germany: 2
MyLoc Managed Dusseldorf Germany: 104

USA: 364 (30.97%)

Amazon USA: 44
Choopa, NJ, USA: 162
ColoCrossing NY USA: 14
Comcast PA USA: 3
Crisis Solutions LLC USA: 7
Digital Ocean NY  USA: 75
Earthnet CO USA: 1
Fevvo Inc CT USA: 11
HostUs USA: 1
Microsoft USA: 3
NodeServ LLC FL USA: 32
QuadraNet CA USA: 4
QuickPacket Llc GA USA: 4
RackSpace Hosting TX USA: 2
Time Warner USA: 1

France: 213 (18.12%)

Online SAS France: 213

Switzerland: 110 (9.36%)

Private Layer Inc Zurich Switzerland: 110

Bulgaria: 97 (8.25%)

Neterra Bulgaria: 1
QHoster Ltd  Bulgaria: 96

Other: 38 (3.23%)

Bhost ltd: Englad/Amsterdam: 3
City Network Hosting Stockholm Sweden: 4
CJSR Russia: 1
DNA Oy  Finland: 4
Hostinger Intl. Cyprus: 1
IDC*China: 10
Internet Assigned Numbers: 3
PP KOM i TEX Ukraine: 1
Rogers Cable Com Canada: 3
Serverius Netherlands: 1
TDC A/S Denmark: 1
Telecom3Sverige AB Sweden: 1
UAB Technoloigu Lithuania: 4
VideoTron Telecom Lte Canada: 1

--Over 95% of the masternodes are on servers owned by companies located in 5 countries. If this coin ever reached the market cap levels of Bitcoin or threatened global monetary supply, it would certainly gain the inquisitiveness of LEA worldwide who would likely share data in order to prosecute criminals or those that threatened their monopoly of wealth. This shouldn't be made this easy. This is further proof that cryptosystems that rely on users to follow best practices are relying on failure.

*IDC China telecommunications (subsidiary of US company or a Chinese company) listed and counted as China/Other.

Figures gathered 6/1/15 https://www.dashnodes.com/index/masternodes/?sorts%5Bisp%5D=1&perPage=100

Trollero™ strikes again  :o

Get ready for 100 pages of "Dash is a scam" Trollero pumping from:

Smooth - Epic-troll / slightly unhinged Monero core "dev" with 1000s of attack-Dash posts to his name.  Was ranked the 4th biggest troll on the Dash thread by post count.  Recently took over Monero competitor AEON.

Fluffyponzay - Monero lead "dev".  Joined Monero after trying to scam USD 200,000 from Vertcoin investors (aka 20% of their market cap) to "develop" his Vertpay.com website.  Took control of Monero and setup MyMonero.com, centralized Monero web wallet.  Likes to go offline and gives Monero core team / their ISP / NSA acccess to majority of Monero's "anonymous" transactions / users from one handy spot.  And because Monero official wallet doesn't work, it's MyMonero all the way.  Oh also trying to make his 3rd centralized payment site PayBee.com...Lots more but can't be bothered.

Harrison Ford aka Generalize this - he made this thread already.  (I like that he actually did some research, even though I think it's obviously an idiotic conclusion to say wallets hosted around the world in different countries running as masternodes are centralized, but kudos to Generalize for once :))

G2M - Chronic Monero troll

Icebreaker - Extremely unhinged head Monero troll aka Eduardo de Castro the Hashfast scammer.  Everyone knows him so no introduction needed.

GTO911 - known cat fiddler.  Do not let this person near your family or the family pet.

I will tick off the list as they appear.

If you are just starting this thread, make your life easier and just buy Monero..  They will probably go away if you just give them your BTC.  Wait for them to dump on the dumber Monero users who don't get it's a clone of something else that has been stalling for 14 months already, then BCT can be a more pleasant experience for all of us seeking innovation / decentralized crypto..

Things to watch out for:

1. Trollero users repeating the same thing over and over again, regardless of what arguments, reason or logic are put in front of them.

2. All replies to Trollero users must have any text offensive to Monero removed from them.  Sorry, you're text was just Trolleroed™

3. All Trollero replies to non-believers must start with "are you stupid?" and maintain the fact that everyone is stupid who doesn't "get" Monero (not any other Cryptonote clone though, even the ones with active developers and GUIs - Monero is special and the next bitcoin - FACT.

4. Lots of talk of 10,000 XMR pizzas - like we never heard it before..

5. Anything competing with Monero but not Monero itself is a centralized scam, including any exchange or website that even mentions them, period.

Can't think of anymore right now...oh yeh Poloniex is 100% trustworthy.  The fact that 95% of Trollero volume goes there whilst people on any other exchange like Bittrex or BTC38 won't touch a Trollero with a 10 foot poll means nothing.  And Dash price is fake even though volume is spread across all major exchanges.

Anyway...have fun :D

cheers

Wauw, so desperate, not one single argument to refute GeneralizeThis evidence of centralisation...

well, go ahead, add me to your insulting list with ad-hominems...

best regards

Dude you are no where near getting on this list.   These guys have 1000s of posts behind their names over months attacking Dash.  You need to step up first, what is this your first day?

BTW you didn't read my point about why Dash isn't centralized - "I think it's obviously an idiotic conclusion to say wallets hosted around the world in different countries running as masternodes are centralized" - Centralized means centralized, with a central point, e.g. MyMonero.com...not user's wallets running in different countries, I thought this was obvious...but I wasn't here to argue that, just point out what this thread is about so maybe Trollero doesn't waste another 10,000 hours of crypto people's time in their quest to "replace" Bitcoin with a dysfunctional Cryptonote clone with zero development and constant flow of trolling.

From the MyMonero.com website....
Or if you want to read for yourself https://mymonero.com/#/terms (https://mymonero.com/#/terms) Chapter 4

So what?  Fluffypony can still *see* all the transactions, know what is moving around, know when a pump or dump is coming, take the site offline to stop people withdrawing, it gives Monero core team / his ISP / the NSA full *acccess* to Monero for all intents and purposes.  And he keeps any information on MyMonero usage, or even the MyMonero source code, to himself.  And he has *tried this before* on Vertcoin, and is *trying it again* with Paybee.com

MyMonero.com is 100% centralized and undermines all Monero's claims of being anonymous / untraceable - it's a fucking centralized payment website for a coin they are marketing as 'untraceable' lol.  And you defend that and say Dash is centralized because it works with users on the official wallet in different countries, like Bitcoin

just more alternate reality Monero bullshit....keep going Trollero.

These ad hominem attacks are getting ridiculous, you're not even taking the time to respond to the original post. Nowhere is stated that you, as a Monero user, are obligated to use MyMonero, it's basically the same as blockchain.info. Does blockchain.info make Bitcoin centralized?

Oh and PS, the official CLI wallet does work, but I guess you can't be bothered to try.

Both of my posts stated why I disagree with the OP.  For the third time:

"I think it's obviously an idiotic conclusion to say wallets hosted around the world in different countries running as masternodes are centralized"

and.....

"Centralized means centralized, with a central point, e.g. MyMonero.com...not user's wallets running in different countries, I thought this was obvious"

But I see you side-step my point......

Anyone who reads the XMR thread knows that most users can't get the wallet to work and get recommended to use MyMonero and it is safe to assume most people use it.

Something is extremely wrong with a coin that is over 1 year old that still has an essentially "crippled" official wallet where most people have to use a centralized payment website instead .. a site that gives just the owner visiblility on distribution / transfers that no one else can see - on a coin that the marketing claims is "untraceable". An *extremely* strange choice of vehicle for such a coin, no?

Coupled with 2 facts: Fluffypony has a *history* of doing this, and secondly from investigating Ryan Kennedy I know that people who make a big effort to get 'in the middle' of a coin like he did with Doge, and Fluffy tried with Vertcoin and now succeeded with Monero, are often scamming (and often intelligent / good with people / controlling perceptions at the same time).

Did you stop to consider, how involved is Fluffy in the actual XMR market?  If he is a large investor / trader, he has positioned himself quite nicely to be ahead of the market and also be the voice of Monero to guide things how he wants.

Then add in some other facts like how Monero volume is just through Poloniex with no effort to get onto other exchanges, and they have setup XMR with it's own market and made it the landing page.  And Polo is the only entity apart from MyMonero.com that has info on XMR distribution / movements that they keep to themselves too.....nice single point to control at too.

I am not saying this is certainly the case. I am just looking at it myself and saying hmm....structurally, if Fluffy / his buddies were scammers, they are positioned nicely to take advantage....

Above is off topic, and not saying with a Dash investor hat on...this is stuff you should think about (assuming you aren't a Monero dev which I am guessing a lot of these acccounts are)

As long as people host their masternodes properly with encrypted wallets with backups, I can't see anything that could cause any issues. If a hosting company were to refuse hosting masternodes for whatever magical reason, nobody would lose anything and there are plenty of them around so I wouldn't call it centralized. I mean there are much fewer pools than masternode hosting services so for the time being I think we're fine.

Hey that's a good point.

Someone should test it out though.

It should be easy enough and I'm gonna draw on my past dash dumping experiences on cryptsy.

See, I noticed a funny thing. If I saw a meaty buy order for 500ish dash that I wanted to drop a stack into, I started by transferring a load to craptsy.

Only magically, the buy order disappeared or moved way down in the ten minutesor so it takes to show up.

Every time. Were talking about over ten times bc I got bored and wanted to do it for luls.  Of because I have a tendency toward the number ten for the convenience of this post.

Obviously I could just move it in small amounts as I later found out, but it still begs the question: is cryptsy manipulating the market, or is someone not trading based on blockchain tracking data?

I found the second situation more likely, which is another screwy story all together.

Anyways point here is - when I move largish amts of monero to polo, this doesn't happen like it did at cryptsy. Free to dump at market value if you wanted.

So why isn't that the case? Is it a conspiracy to get me to write this post, or should you put up some actual money and run it through mymonero and then send it to polo to see if the buy orders move in line with when you move large amounts to the exchange?

Interesting, OP. Thanks for the factual information, and not resorting to biased, opinionated bullshit that comes out of the posts of trolls like BlockaFett.

1. My point is that hosting companies are privacy breaches waiting to happen for masternodes, and most people don't follow best practices in this regard, so why would they in other ways? Are you in the "they got this wrong, but they'll get that right--because it validates my opinion" business?

2. My stated concern (listed at the beginning an end of the post) is not that peoples funds are at risk, but their privacy and security.

BlockaFett guy is like, please dont do it, please let me get rich with this scam

https://i.imgur.com/kEW9ptG.png

Can't wait that to happen, as that would currently mean each masternode earning $6,500/month in rewards (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1070914.msg11507036#msg11507036). People might then afford moving their masternodes away from Amazon.

That was one of the best posts i read for some time. It has drama, truth, humor and intelligence all nicely packed together.
Thank you sir for posting it

cheers 

Yeah, great job, bravo.

http://33.media.tumblr.com/a974fa86d4b5fcd7604ea8fc644d4806/tumblr_mu9iajiDFU1qhs6zgo1_500.gif

A bit desperate this one is it not ?

Blockchain daemons can be run by anyone, anywhere, anytime. For that matter, half of them can be run in the foyer at Langley HQ for all the difference it makes to the network's behavioural logic. Thats the whole point of a decentralised network.

Don't worry, if TPTB truly feel the need to de-anonymise one of your addresses, they'll have easier ways of doing it than waiting for one of your transactions to be handled by some random masternode, attempting to find out where in the world it and its participating partners for that transaction are, commandeering those virtual servers only to discover that they can't detect your transaction originating address anyway. They'll probably just knock on your door instead.

(On the other hand, since they "own" cryptonote tech and all known jiggery pokery, scam logic, corrupt transactional behaviour and heists are totally hidden from public view and therefore void of public accountability, I'm sure they won’t mistake which one has the “low hanging fruit”).

P.S. Masternodes are secured by a collateral populated coin address, not hosted servers.

P.P.S. Mind your definitions.  ;)

Centralised:


Decentralised:

So you believe LEAs won't subpoena, coerce, or just ask hosting companies to provide billing information? How many instamine recipients own the nodes in Germany, or France, or the USA? If you had only those three countries supplying node intel, you'd have over 80% of all masternode traffic. They wouldn't even need to ask ;) for the operator's permission; they just need to hack nicely. but I'm sure people who spend so much time covering their tracks by using hosting companies follow best practices with their personal computers also.

Dashers learn to make private nodes and how to obfuscate your IPs--too hard? Then give up the anonymity game--you already lost.

Doesn't really matter as nobody else than the dash fan group cares about it. Too much shit surrounding it, only being defended by a huge number of insiders.

So what ? They can probably get that just by reading bitcointalk.

It's not the machine that hosts the masternode that matters strategically, it's the anonymous address that hosts its collateral. Blockchain daemons can disappear and pop-up anywhere, hosters can have open access to masternodes for all anyone cares - it's decentralised remember ?

The "Evil NSA" doesn't need to hack into any hosting company's virtualised servers to get access to a masternode daemon, they can just download one from here (https://www.dashpay.io/downloads/) and run it themselves.

P.S. Notice something about that page by the way ? It contains the official Dash client, complete with hash's so you can conclusively verify your download is not(a hacked-to-peices wallet that's showing you a JPEG of a phony balance from a blockchain that has no support for public consensus to endorse its veracity or otherwise)  ;)

Thats because in crypto, to any self respecting developer, the meer idea of "third party wallets" is synonymous with third party "please-help-yourself-to-my-money" tech, so an official, native, clean, verified, GUI client is usually the first order of business, not the last.


Sorry, but in crypto (unlike fiat) preventing people from seeing and verifying the anonymous addresses at each end of a transaction is not anonymity - it's monetary clownery.

Nice subject title though - "The reality of masternode centralisation". That sure took some creativity. Your next assignment: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spin_(public_relations)

Read again. I showed how masternodes could be compromised by using gleaned information from the hosting company, not by compromising the servers themselves.

If you compromise a masternode, you can trace part of the mixing. And the more masternodes you compromise the more you can trace. The rest of your argument is the spin you are accusing me of. Even if LEA owned all of the Monero nodes they wouldn't be able to trace a transaction any better than if they were watching the blockchain--if you don't get why this is better anonymity, I feel sorry for you.

Kind of laughable to talk about Monero 'anonymity' when you have 50% of users typing Monero transactions into your core-devs website on his closed-source server wired up with Google Analytics,  Generalize.  And sorry I didn't read how you think you can compromise Masternodes, i know from experience what your analysis is like and life is too short :)

Where are you getting this absurd 50% from? 

Just stop responding to BlockaFett, the guy uses false #'s and wild speculations in every post he makes, which makes him either a troll or a very dumb man.

Edit: BlockaFett is 100% a troll, his level of stupidity cannot possibly be real

You're right, if you don't care that your coin is or isn't very anonymous, then why should anyone else care? Sorry you can't be bothered with such details.

That is a number I read on the Monero thread at some point and in my opinion is a conservative estimate.  I don't actually know what the number is because Fluffy refuses to share that information with anyone, but I am guessing it is actually the majority of users judging by how many people complain about the client wallet on the XMR thread, how many times I see people get recommended to just use MyMonero.com, and how new users looking to download the wallet get presented with this:

https://i.imgur.com/pOtvWSZ.png

More like I know from experience that you are desperate to find something wrong with Dash.  In the last 3 months you have been jumping round a dozen different threads with "Dash is a scam because XYZ" and now you are trying to say a p2p network topology essentially the same as Bitcoin is centralized so excuse me if I don't pay too much attention.

As I thought, its something you pulled out of your ass.  Just like all your other arguments.

So what is the number then, you tell me?  1%, 5%, 10%, 25%, 50%, 75%?  Can you enlighten us?  If not why not?  And in the abscence of the actual number what is the number you are comfortable with using for argument's sake?  For me it's 50% as a conservative estimate, you don't agree?

Are you retarded BlockaFett? Honestly, stop making up false percentages with no basis in fact. At least troll intelligently.

So the first link you get when you try to download a Monero wallet is MyMonero.com, and the second link starts with "If you have enough bandwidth...disk space...and want to run a full node"...and you think there is no basis to say estimate that 50% of people use the first option, MyMonero.com?  I disagree.

https://i.imgur.com/pOtvWSZ.png

So what % do you think then Celestio?  Because at the end of the day, no one knows apart from your core-dev.  Just like no one can see inside the opaque blockchain, apart from the MyMonero.com owners if they so desire.

Wrong, I'm saying that you shouldn't have to trust a node for privacy in a coin that claims it's anonymous--masternodes have no business being in a "anonymous" cryptosystem.

And i never said dash is a scam--the claim that it wasn't instamined and the claim it is any more anonymous than Bitcoin is BS, and now i guess I'll go research instantx and see if it as claimed. Could never get this much research done without dashers like you egging me on--so thanks.  ;)

lol if it makes you happy Generalize, maybe you can tear-down InstantX just like you just busted the centralized decentralized P2P network....i'm sure the market is literally holding it's breath.....

from the first page of the thread:


predictable...

DASH is a huge instamine-circlejerk-multi-scam.  Stay away but if you choose to get involved make sure you wear a rubber body suit so you dont get covered by seamen from head to toe as a result of the biggest circle-jerk in crypto history.

Ok...

Interesting logic, so anyone that responds with an insult because of sheer annoyance to your biased, opinionated posts that hold no factual information or have no basis in fact, is what you call a "Trollero"? K, then many celebrities, billionaires, and CEO's are Monero lovers then.

can't deny that's funny. good job :D

not for the poor bastards buying into it now...

the result of your dismissal is that we now can't talk about MyMonero being any kind of a problem because no one (outside the core team) knows the actual number of users and for some reason in the absence of such you won't allow anyone to use an estimate either.  

That's great....

sad face :(

Again, are you retarded? I don't want to read about your opinions and such, what you're doing is pure speculation, and such things are useless. Provide facts, or shut up kiddo. Don't even bother responding if you're just going to state an opinion or "speculation" of yours.

Maybe you can contact everyone on the rick list and see if they care:

https://moneroblocks.eu/richlist

Yeah!

The Rick List!

That's really here:  https://moneroblocks.eu/ricklist (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ)

Make sure you click it and don't copy paste :D

The irony is, your actual rich list is on the DB on MyMonero.com, with access to the privileged few, most likely.  Oh and on Poloniex DB too of course :)

like I said, just a way for you to sweep the whole issue under the carpet...the issue of the "most secure and untraceable coin", operating with the majority of users (as far as we can estimate) typing their transactions into the dev's personal, closed-source server API, wired up to Google Analytics, because the dev's chose not to develop a viable alternative after 1 year since launch.

that's great

For a third time, Are you retarded? I do not care for your biased opinions. Provide factual information or shut up. What you've said is all speculation and has absolutely 0 basis in fact.

Going round in big circle..."provide factual information or shut up" - You dev refuses to provide the information, therefore you want me to 'shut up', so if an exploit is going on, you just covered it up nicely.  It's like saying "you don't know the exact number of BTC Ryan Kennedy stole from Mintpal, so shut up". 

Because your core dev refuses to say the exact number, to be able to discuss the underlying issue, we have to use an estimate.  Mine is 50%, what number are you happy with? (3rd time I tried to explain this to you)

No you didn't, you showed how a hosting account's owner could be identified, not how a masternode could be compromised.

Furthermore, I showed you how having access to a masternode does not "compromise" the network in any way, shape or form because the public already has access to them without needing to hack a single account and they in fact do nothing but support the network. Unlike mining, access to a majority of masternodes doesn't mean jack unless you're prepared to push the price to kingdom come and turn all existing holders into billionaires.

Furthermore I showed you how public blockchain, functionally decentralised, pre-emptive mixing is an electronic monetary model that blows Cryptonote back to the dark ages with its fiat based, impoverished trust architecture that wouldn't have lasted 1 of the five years of public pounding that bitcoin took, even with a decent wallet.


Really ? Maybe you should write a white paper quantifying that theory. If I take a piss in the Atlantic I'm sure I could make a persuasive a case on bitcointalk that I've toxified an Ocean.

If you use the criteria of a cryptographic messaging system to measure monetary fungibility -two things that have jack sh*t to do with each other- then you've obviously created a self fulfilling prophecy and are going to draw conclusions that are practically meaningless as you have done.

This might help your cause https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=82P6IRnueog

A lot of people extremely angry that I point out how MyMonero.com undermines the whole anonymity / untracability claims of Monero and gives the owners potential to be the only ones to see inside the opaque blockchain whilst the shleps are out in the cold...and trying to find out anything more about it is like trying to draw blood from a stone.....v. interesting. ;)

Maan.

You mean I can't rickroll people for luls?

Fine.

Definitely would get a good idea w/ polo db. Still on the edge about mymonero. Would they be anywhere close to blockchain.info, or any other rich list though?

I guess a good question to ask at this point would be: ok, so the view key doesn't let you know what output is spent, yet it seems to be used to keep track of balances on mymonero. How is that information useful only on mymonero, and not anywhere else? If the information isn't beneficial anywhere else, why has this not been better conveyed? Is it because nobody asks, nobody cares, or nobody uses it?

And if you can't win there, then you can drill into the fact that the viewkey is a Monero core component except nobody has implemented it except for one website managed by Flufficus Pontificus et al. Why is this functionality not in the core software yet if there wasn't profit to be had by withholding the information?

Additionally, if there's all this damn profit to be had by creating services that allow you to view information that you can use to game the market - why isn't anyone jumping on the opportunity? I mean this is btctalk ffs. Scam central. These people would scam a nickel out of a five year old. So if getting financial information and using it to trade profitably on the Monero market was possible - where are they all?

So now you're lying. Since you have absolutely no factual information, you're entirely making up percentages here. If you insist you're not lying, then I'd have to classify you as "below average" intelligence, as you consistently make up information on a whim and try to pass it as having any substance. Either those 2, or that you're simply trolling of course.

Put up factual information or shut up. Your biased opinions are worthless.

Angry? I think it's cute that you made that thread shortly after i made this one, with your pseudo-research and all, and now you're on this thread trying to skim attention away from the masternode problem.  ;)

TBH G2M I don't know what the actual data MyMonero asks for when you use it, I tried signing up but got an error when submitting the private key words...no one bothered to mention it until you did, so the data collected could be totally innocuous for all i know :)

Don't know either whether anyone is using this info or not or even collecting it.  On the site, javascript is sending (some of) the data to the backend API. if that is being retained on the backend then you could theoretically reconstruct parts of the blockchain and use analysis tools which would give an advantage as everyone else is on opaque chain but depends on the data and someone needs to actually exploit it too..  Stuff like balances / large fund movements / where funds were going would be the honey pot. I dont know enough about Monero to say :)

I had no idea.  It's incredible that so many people think DASH is a scam and started threads discussing the various fallacies and shortcomings.

If the NSA compromises monero users' wallets, gives Poloniex the order for the coins in their possession, and steals and buys more monero coins, the more transactions they can trace. And nobody would know the percentage of the outputs the NSA would own.

https://lab.getmonero.org/pubs/MRL-0004.pdf


If the NSA can do what I said, then Dash's anonymity is broken, but Monero's is fine. If the NSA can do what you said, then both coins are broken.

Yup.  Let's pretend like having most Monero transactions typed into the dev's personal MyMonero.com website to move funds between there and Poloniex, that controls 95% of volume, because he refuses to make you a working client wallet where he / google analytics can't see what you are doing, means that Monero's anonymity "is fine".  (serious face)

Blocka, you can't just make things up and assume them into truth. As Senator Moyniham once elegantly pointed out, "Everyone is entitled to his own opinions, but not his own facts."

LOL - i'm making up MyMonero.com?

Since I raise this 2 days ago, i got 30 Monero trolls hopping up and down saying "lies!!!!" and not one person try to say how the MyMonero setup / crippled client wallet / single-exchange situation is legit?

big mistake IMHO.  just from the reaction a huge alarm bell is going off.............................

You are making up the above statement because you don't know it to be true or not.

Opinions are like assholes.  Everyone has one.

I have pointed out that MyMonero.com is essentially a massive gaping whole in your setup and looks likely to be a scam by your dev who has a *history* of trying to setup a web wallets in the middle of coins, like when he tried to scam USD 200,000 from Vertcoin to develop Vertpay.com - a simple HTML site. (and choosing to do this now on a Cryptonote coin means he is the only one with potential to see inside your opaque blockchain...)

Monero's answer "You don't know how many users use MyMonero, so without an exact figure nothing you are saying is true".

Or in other words, you think people are fucking stupid enough to believe a puerile defense like that instead of a reasonable explanation as to why the #1 wallet (i.e. the only one that actually works) for "the most anonymous coin in the world" is a website with a closed source backend ran by your core dev and wired up to google analytics = coin suicide.

I'll just leave this here:

https://i.imgur.com/pOtvWSZ.png

I do like how you cut-off the bottom of the page to prop-up your assertions--subtle, very subtle.  ::)

https://getmonero.org/getting-started/choose

^^here's the live full version for those who don't trust Blocka's research techniques. 

That's right Generalize, because I don't have a 4k screen where I can include the 3rd party wallets like MoneroX which also don't work, everything i'm saying is a lie.

you guys are an utter disgrace to BCT...just sayin.

Then use two screen shots for full disclosure.  ;)

You are wrong to think people are stupid enough to not see through this...when the penny dropped for me and I pointed this out 2 days ago, personally I was 50/50 as to a deliberate scam, but now after seeing the reaction, and how e.g. your last page of posts avoiding my point like everyone else has done, I think i totally nailed it..  

I guarantee certain Monero people are currently sh**ing their pants on this issue..but don't worry, not worth my trouble to fully expose it and you have enough suckers on Trolloniex to keep your scam going for a good few months I suspect...

Dude, what proof of a scam have you uncovered? All i'm reading is assertions built on conjecture. Give me some verifiable evidence. It will only take some legwork on your part (along with finding the right people with right expertise) if it is true. It's not like anyone is preventing you from collecting facts, are they? If you are being threatened, you should alert the authorities....

Maybe deal with what I already said:

"I have pointed out that MyMonero.com is essentially a massive gaping whole in your setup and looks likely to be a scam by your dev who has a *history* of trying to setup a web wallets in the middle of coins, like when he tried to scam USD 200,000 from Vertcoin to develop Vertpay.com - a simple HTML site.

Monero's answer "You don't know how many users use MyMonero, so without an exact figure nothing you are saying is true".

Or in other words, you think people are fucking stupid enough to believe a puerile defense like that instead of a reasonable explanation as to why the #1 wallet (i.e. the only one that actually works) for the most anonymous coin in the world is a website with a closed source backend ran by your core dev and wired up to google analytics = coin suicide.
"

Generalize this one you avoided too ^

I think Fluffy already defeated your vertcoin attack months ago....or did you forget that accusation made and refuted?

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=583449.22660


Also, is this (the OP) you? https://www.reddit.com/r/vertcoin/comments/2590id/hello_members_of_the_cryptocurrency_community/

Anyone can use any of the wallets, so I'm not sure why you A. assume people are using the web wallet or B. that most transactions are being done on mymonero. Until you provide proof of one or both, it's really dumb to discuss the effects that that may possibly have monero's anonymity--i wouldn't transact through a web-based wallet if i wanted anonymity ever, but that's just me. I suspect that many people that have their funds on mymonero are sitting on them until the official GUI is finished. Someone else might assume because of the private nature of monero and the technical know-how of the majority of the people who post on the monero forums that they would want and be able to use one the gui's listed on the monero sites--but these are like your assumptions, based on conjecture and unsustainable as facts until more information is gathered-- kind of like when dashers assumed that everyone was using best practices to set-up nodes....

You are wasting your time.  The only reason he is spewing this nonsense is because there are about a dozen threads by a dozen different people criticizing his precious DASH about the myriad of fallacies and shortcomings inherent in that scam coin.  I believe he is well aware of how factually unfounded his accusations are.

First of all, the whole premise for his monero ""vulnerability"" is he states that most monero transactions go through mymonero which is an outrageous assumption.  Mymonero is simply a web wallet used mostly by noobs who don't want to download the blockchain and run their own wallets.

Even the rest of the DASH DEFENDERS™  are too embarrassed to join him in this ridiculous discussion about unfounded allegations based on absurd assumptions.


https://i.imgur.com/OcYeFcW.png

Blockafett is a dumb fuck why argue with him?

The great thing about decentralized crypto is that anyone who wants to create a web wallet is free to do so, whether he's a core dev or not. If you think MyMonero is shady, you should create a better alternative for people to use for their xmr.

Regarding your other concerns with Monero, anyone who wants to contribute can. The core team members are hardly the only devs... and if any of the many xmr contributors were that concerned about a core gui, for example, they'd implement one and submit a pull request. Nobody has yet, because it's just not that high of a priority.

You're killing them blockafett; you made them talk to you on 9 or 10 dash hate threads...I thought what Evan and he's team did 2 days ago was enough for them since monero developers don't give them much love with any updates for a WHOLE year lol

killing us? I thought he was on a suicide mission.

I might be interested on Fluffy pony ' s now...ill invest some money for him to build me another website like vertpay .com &my monero. Com ...call it crypto.for real developers lol

The problem with Dash is those masternodes can be targeted by a powerful attacker and reveal your position. In general I don't like the anonymising system of Dash and would trust Monero a lot more if my life depended on moving money anonymously.

Thats the point.
Moneros anonymity and untracebility is mathematicaly proven.


This endless discussion XMR vs. DASH makes no sense at all, because from a scientific/technical POI Monero (or cryptonote coins in general) is the clear winner.


P.S. Because of the huge premine it is also very probable that a huge number of masternodes are controlled by a very small group of persons. So someone would just have to compromize this small circle to get the control over the network.

I don't even view it as a competition--more of a difference in opinion about how a cryptocurrency should be built. I researched a few privacy solutions (dash, drk then, was among them) before I came to the realization that monero was the best available.

My main criticism of dash was/is that the masternode system encourages centralization which weakens the prospect of good anonymity and fungibility. I kept reading from dash supporters that people were using best practices when setting-up masternodes and that they were spread over 30 countries--what I found was that 95% were based on the servers of a few companies spread over 5 countries which validated my initial and continuing concern if i were to entertain dash as privacy coin.

Dash supporters can squabble over how this effects the prospects of the coin's anonymity and fungibility (not odd that these two things go hand in hand), but what they can't do now is say that the coin is evenly spread over 30 plus countries or that masternode operators are following best practices.

People are running their masternodes where ever it's cheapest, because the rewards for running one are only ~$40 or w/e per month.

The reason the reward is so small right now, is that we aren't at the point where government agencies would get interested in DASH yet.

If DASH would attain Bitcoin-like adoption (and the interest of TLA's), by then we'd probably have custom hardware without NSA backdoors ("Masternode ASICs" if you will) to run masternodes on. At that point the "best practices" list is going to be quite short and easy to follow.

"Yeah it's weak and centralized at the moment... But when we will have the market cap of Bitcoin, things will get much better!".

How do you get to Bitcoin level if the stuff is half-broken to start with?

"Yeah we don't bother making a GUI so the user experience is weak and centralized to www wallet because we have more important things to do... But when we do, things will get much better!".

There are several GUI available other than www and you know that very well, so don't play dumb.
Who cares if there isn't written "official" on them? We're talking decentralized open-source project, not corporations products.

In Bulgaria there are a lot of DRK (Dash) "fans", but I don't like it. I didn't expected to see that many masternodes though.
Basically, Nettera is quite old bulgarian IT company, but I'm quite sure that they are not doing good lately.

P.S. I don't like Monero either, because almost all discussions are turned into Monero-Dash war.
P.S.2. I didn't read entire thread - just the OP.

I'm not going to download any unofficial wallet that only 5 people are using because I don't trust it. I'm ok with downloading an official wallet or using a Bitcoin wallet such as Multibit or Armory because thousands of people are using them and any malice or fatal bugs would've been found already.

But you trust the masternodes everyone is using best practices to keep private? ::) I get that you want to use the easiest thing available, but don't fool yourself into thinking that the easiest thing available is the best thing available--when Monero releases the official wallet, you will literally have no advantage over Monero, so what's your hurry?

We all know you are perfectly capable of using a command line wallet. Quit trolling.

As for masternode ASICs, you're smoking some good shit. Too bad we're not all in the same place, you could at least share it.

How is ponzi-node blinding coming along?

No, the thing is I don't have to trust everyone to use best practices. That's because DASH mixing was designed to be resilient against sybil attacks.



My shit still isn't as good as americanpegasus' or Risto's shit. :)

It isn't.  Boy genius Duffield didn't realize ponzi-node blinding wrecks DASH's existing infrastructure until it was too late.

Masternode snooping is not a sybil attack.

Let me rephrase then so the intent becomes clear: No, the thing is I don't have to trust everyone to use best practices. DASH mixing was designed to be resilient against sybil attacks (1000 DASH collateral) and spying nodes (multiple rounds using random nodes).

The nodes randomness is useless if an attacker owns (or can see) what a large portion of nodes are doing. Or else the graphs dashers like to post outlining the # of nodes needed break dash's anonymity are pretty stupid to have on hand as evidence of dash's security.  ;)

Did McDuff take it off the DASH roadmap?

Hence the multiple rounds specification. As the number of rounds go up, the odds against go up astronomically.

The number of nodes controlled by an attacker determines privacy, hence why centralization is a big deal. If you are mixing multiple rounds in a system that is 95% (% of mn's held in just 5 countries) clear, your privacy is still pretty weak compared to a coin like Monero irregardless of how many rounds you choose.

*Of course, each round creates a fee, so why wouldn't you want people to have to increase their rounds to achieve the illusion of privacy? ;)

If two things are anonymous to everyone else but the NSA, does it matter which one is "more" anonymous? Aren't they both anonymous enough? Or are you saying Monero is NSA proof?

This is a flawed logic. Monero's privacy is achieved very simply, at the cryptographic level. Dash one is just a technical obfuscation achieved in a fairly complex network of interconnected hardware devices.
We can't affirm with 100% certainty that the NSA can't break through Monero's privacy or Dash's privacy, but IT IS THE ONLY THING they have in common. Otherwise these are two entirely different beasts.
Claiming that because both don't hold 100% certainty, they're equivalent, is really crappy sophism.

This is also a dangerous logic. Following that dangerous logic, we should never try to improve TOR or I2P, research and elaborate tools to keep our privacy and liberty as strong as possible, etc. Since you'd say nothing is NSA proof anyway. So what Sherlock, better give up then? Because *maybe, only maybe* ECDSA is not NSA proof, let's rely on 32-bits RSA instead?

Who made that claim? Not me. Still you're implying I did. Because if I did, then I would claim Bitcoin and DuckNote are equivalent, which I don't.

You implied they are both anonymous enough even if one is superior to the other in regards to anonymity. Who knows what you think about Ducknote and Bitcoin.
 

I didn't imply either being superior to the other.



Doesn't matter what I think, what matters is whether they are equivalent in the context of this conversation i.e. anonymity.

I implied that by this whole thread.  ;)

Given that Monero doesn't have the masternode attack vector, they are not equivalent privacy technologies.

Ugh, you're most definitely a troll.

In the context of them being anonymous to everyone else but the NSA, you implied that they are equally anonymous in the eyes of the NSA(As how can one be more anonymous than another in the eyes of an entity to which neither are anonymous to?). Nothing else in your quote shows otherwise. In fact, to show just how skewed your view is, you're basically also saying that Bitcoin for ex, is as anonymous as Monero or Dash.- Wrong, "If two things",  though those two things aren't specified, but adding Bitcoin is adding a "third thing" and absolutely wrong to do.
 

The reality of the matter(Not even taking in account the levels of anonymity provided by each crypto) is Dash's anonymity is more susceptible to attack than Monero's. Obviously the reason is because the masternodes can simply be taken down by their hosting providers(As the majority are hosted on servers online), while no such thing can happen with Monero. Dash can be "strong armed"(Take down most of it's nodes even if temporarily), Monero cannot.

Edited

If you think I'm saying "Bitcoin for ex, is as anonymous as Monero or Dash", you're also thinking Bitcoin is anonymous to everyone else but the NSA. Are you?

Actually you're right there, your quote says "If two things", so Bitocin can't be included.

Monero has a better chance to be NSA proof at some point, with sufficient operational safeguards and care. That's the nature of a system where the most critical privacy functions are performed without the need for counterparties.

The appropriate present day analogy is PGP, which seems largely if not entirely NSA-proof if used carefully, as opposed to Tor, which seems to be cryptographic swiss cheese.