Bitcoin Forum

I wanted to post this before... but I forgot my password, and password reset wasn't working lol... maybe because of forum hack... but anyway.. now it's working again and I am glad I can post again...

Cause I did want to share my thought with you on this... perhaps this theory/hypothesis has already been discussed exactly like this or perhaps not but here goes:

So I think I know who Satoshi might be, all I have to do is think "What would I do if I were him ?" since I am a developer too, so I can think a little bit like him, the story probably goes as follows:

1. Satoshi lost his keys during development... while bitcoin was still worthless.

2. Satoshi got depressed, because bitcoin not worth anything to him anymore... he couldn't mine anymore because of the difficulty increase.

So the next logical thing for him to do is:

3. Start a new coin... and mine it early to get rich once again ! LOL.

PROBLEM SOLVED ! LOL.

And indeed... Satoshi did seem to leave bitcoin....

So the question is which new/alternate coin is he now in ?

Maybe litecoin... or maybe a coin in the future ! ;) =D

Bye,
  Skytoshi ! =D

If he is as smart as people claim to be:
1) Wouldn't ever happen (he claimed himself that people should never delete wallets)
2) Gets countered by point 1)
3) That's not a logical thing at all.

If he really is as smart as people think, he would never touch an altcoin.

I don't beleive in this theory.. Maybe he got involved in some altcoin somehow under a different synonym, but I don't think he would start one to get rich..

Also I don't think he would lose the keys to ALL of his wallets now would he?

If that was true, the other developers would have picked up on it already. They studied his style of coding and even labeled it as being "messy" For this reason, about 80% {not sure of this %} of his original coding in the protocol was replaced/re-coded.

If he started a new coin, it would have been up there with the best of them, and it would be very unique not a copy cat version of the Bitcoin protocol.

I just think he got sick of the internal politics and scared when Gavin approached the 3 letter Agencies. He made a good dicision, because a central figure head, would have been chopped off quickly, if the governments and the banks knew his identity.  >:(

Too many LOLs in your post, but anyway....


1. Satoshi was smart and intelligent enough to invent Bitcoin. Surely he can handle wallet backups and secure his private keys? This is a no-brainer.
2. Point doesn't stand because point 1 doesn't stand.
3. Bytecoin? :D  Remember the bug that created 184 Billion Bitcoins? Now Bytecoin has 184 Billion total coin supply. Probably Satoshi wanted to give a subtle sign that he was working on Bytecoin now? /JOKE

I had a hunch about this once...

In 2010, Satoshi said he was "venturing into more complex ideas" (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=913508.msg10030979#msg10030979)

So if bitcoin not worth anything to him anymore, why he will bother with mining.

Anyway, you have got enough ammo for awesome weekend, go and write the latest "Satoshi - My experiments with alt coins and Bitcointalk ALT section" It would be instant hit for sure.

Thanks for luls :)

Regards

Some people were thinking he might be the Spreadcoin dev. The funny thing is, the Spreadcoin dev, (Mr. Spread) actually lost his private keys to 80k of Spreadcoin. Then he got donations and kept developing. Then he suddenly left. Just like Satoshi! (sort of)

Litecoin or namecoin are the first 2 other alts right, litecoin would make him Charles Lee wouldnt it?

You could ask all the miners who started in 2010-2011 , bitcoin was worth next to nothing back then, most were just fasinatation with the technolpgy and .

i guess he started Litecoin after Bitcoin  :P  ...then Satoshi would be.... Cha... :o

Wonder how many will look into this hint of bytecoin (you never know about them jokes, sometimes they have meaning to them), not many people can see past all the 1000's of alternative's over the years (most of the originals have a set purpose though, scrypt & many other algorithms)? Depending on how much time one spends on learning this new world of crypto (knowledge is key), seeing the world is not just Windows & Mac/Apple anymore. We now have 100's of Operating Systems, several web browsers, millions of applications & many more things that I could go into detail on... I'm just an uneducated nobody though (Autodidacticism), took over a year (16+ hours a day, 7 days a week of just doing research) in crypto to actually see that it will change the world (look past all the bad news, you'll see more good things it can change)...

// 8 bits = 1 byte ~ pixels

https://web.stanford.edu/class/cs101/bits-bytes.html

First PC ever build piece by piece (over 10 years ago), bought the spare parts from Bits&Bytes 8)

I meant to say that, mining difficulty should not come into picture as he said bitcoin was not worth anything.

Regards

1) maybe it was an accident, we are all human after all, satoshi wasn't a god, it can happen
2) this will only reinforces the first point
3) i don't think he is talking about an altcoin, most likely completely different than bitcoin, not based on blockchain or something, otherwise it would be stupid for him to build a pure clone...

Absolutely unbelievable scenario.. Even is Satoshi lost some private keys, even without them, he would have been one of the first and the richest in bitcoin because of jumping in so early. Why would he betray his own creation for some shitty alt?
And remember there was no PayCon alternative those days, so not even that was an option :P

1
1) No. Satoshi has so many addresses which most likely extend over several wallets. Losing 1 or two is acceptable, losing all of them isn't.
Besides, who does not have a backup of their encrypted wallet somewhere?
2)
3) Satoshi claimed that he is moving onto different projects when he contacted Gavin the last time. This is only natural.
However, I doubt that he is sticking around and wasting his time on some altcoin.

I think Satoshi is behind Namecoin.

Hints:
- Namecoin's founder (Vincent Durham) is also an unknown person/pseudonym. Similar 'strategy' as for Bitcoin.
- Namecoin is the first fork of the Bitcoin software, (one of the) first alt coin
- Satoshi Nakamoto was in a discussion about a hypothetical system called BitDNS here on this forum in 2010
- Namecoin includes ideas/features that seem to be relevant for Satoshi according to his posts

I also wouldn't be surprised if Satoshi is also involved in Qora (will post another time why I think so).

Yes he started NakamotoDark.

1) Yes I agree (It was pulled for a reason)
2)  ???
3) Do you think these other projects would have anything to do with Crypto currencies? Did Gavin post proof of this or was that just something he said? I have read most of his postings on this forum, and I did not get a negative vibe from it.
Something about this, make the hair at the back of my head go all prickly. hmf  

1) losing does not mean only distractedly, but also because of some thief, no amount of backup will save you at that time

and not only cybernetic thief but also real life thief, many thing could happen that could steal your treasure

To understand point two you have to look at the original point that OP made:
It is directly tied to the first point. As we've disproved his first assumption, point 2 becomes invalid.
As for point 3, we can't really know what he is working with. He never said anything related to that as far as I know. Also if I'm correct, Gavin posted the last email from Satoshi in which he stated that he was moving on. It might have to do something with Gavin visiting the CIA back then. However, we should not be stuck in the past. We should be rather looking towards the future.

There are two problems with your desire to win arguments in this one:
1) Stealing an encrypted wallet does nothing, hence it being pointless (if the password is long enough)
2) You're the one that was preaching that you're 'un-hackable' in some thread; so why wouldn't satoshi be as well?  ::)

There is no way that someone was able to trick a man who did so much to extensively and successfully hide his identity from everyone in the world. I hardly doubt that someone so proficient and intelligent would download some malware or key logger. As for the everyday theft, how do you steal Bitcoins from a person if you don't know that he/she owns them?

I highly doubt he wanted to have any involvement in cryptocurrency development after the boom of Bitcoin... But this is just speculation, just as the first post :)

He is probably a simple person, an engineer, he doesn't live of "glamour and fashion", neither from popularity. He lives from ideas and ideals (and this one is certain: otherwise he wouldn't have bothered in designing and writing Bitcoin).

Who knows? He might be around the forums ;) Or not.

uhm i said real life thief also, which has nothing to do with cybernetic thief, it could be that someone knew about his treasure when bitcoin became big, and thus he forced satoshi to reveal his password or whatever, you are basically telling me that there is no chance that this could have happened, which is blatant wrong

my un-hackable fortress has nothing to do with this...seeing how we are talking about different type of thieves

Stop diverting the argument. You often tend to divert for the sake of winning, which seems to me like a red herring situation? Although, don't bother with this.

You've mentioned cyber theft, now you're saying it has nothing to do with this?
You're telling me that someone found out, managed to steal it and force him to reveal the password in addition to not touching the funds for years? Statistically highly improbable.
I never said that there 'is no chance', stop twisting my words.

Don't make me laugh.  ::)


Update: Yes you are, and here we go again. I'm going to ignore your posts in this thread.

1. A man who created bitcoin and who always advised others to keep their private keys is very improbable to lost his own private keys, but it still is possible however.
2. Going back to #1, chances are slim of him losing the private keys. He couldn't mine, yes, but given his talents and skills as a coder, leaving bitcoin is okay because he can still use his wits to get by or get rich.
3. Probable, but I don't think he would ever, ever, start a new coin given that bitcoin reached several milestones already. A man of pure integrity and belief in his own work wouldn't create a new one to counter his previous obra maestra. Instead, he will keep on honing and developing his masterpiece until there are some things left to be developed.

Just my 2 cents.

i said BOTH cyber thief and real life thief(i'm not diverting anything, you apaprently forget about how to read correctly a post), read my post again

yes there is a chance, (which is not that slim as you think, remember that Sirius was the other guy that did built this forum, so he wasn't alone and he certainly did not invented bitcoin in some remote place like in a jungle above a mountain at 4k + meters from the ground)

that someone knew about his enormous amount of money and forced it to reveal his passphrase, very far from being un unlikely scenario

do you honestly think that a programmer like satoshi who came up with the idea of bitcoin and made it happen, could lose his private keys because bitcoin was worthless back then!!!
i don't know how much longer you guys are going to compare bitcoin with a pump and dump altcoin.

Satoshi believes in spending outputs and as long as there is not a competing technology in security, which is not to this date, he would not create a different platform

Here is a question for you disbelievers, which is pretty good:

How much bitcoin has Satoshi actually spent ?

The not spending of his coins actually supports point 1.

Another funny thing is that sometimes people giving the advice, ignore their own advice and fok up :)

Also Satoshi is not god or anything, there are other possibilities too, like his systems overheated and melted down.

Or old equipment was used and failed even faster than average day electronics or perhaps opposite, more reliable...

Another possibility which came to mind and question about it:

Did Satoshi use an automated versioning system from the start ? Did it fok up because of bugs?

Did he use a manual versioning system ?

Some claimed his code was messy, thus his mind could be messy, like a nutty professor...

Sometimes professor can be nutty and forget things or make really funny fok ups.

So the messy code could also be taken and seen as a messy/stressed mind capable of fok ups :)

(Maybe even a frustrated mind that in the start his system wasn't really being used that much).

Which could also support point 1... though I do find this a bit of stretch... but not even that far of a stretch ;)

(Also the encrypted wallet argument might not be valid, I think Satoshi left before that feature was implemented)

Also his systems may have been struck by virusses/trojans... (I find that counter argument somewhat weak...that he might be immunine to that... bad luck with hardware/drivers/bugs/holes/hacks can strike anyone.. though I also find this scenerio somewhat less likely.)

But I have a question about it: What was his development system ? Windows ? Linux ? Something else ? Maybe Unix ? ;) Maybe even OS X ? (small little lol there... probably not  OS X ;))

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/04/17/health/psychology/17brody.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0


FugueCoin: Mine 'em till you're rich, then forget you ever mined them. If your FugueCoins are ever stolen, you'll simply forget that the incident ever took place and move on. The beauty of FugueCoins is that even hackers will forget what they've stolen, ergo also useless to them.

While I understand that starters or backers of altcoin would like to spread this idea..it is completely unbelievable.

He knew that if bitcoin was not to be seen as 'his' personal project and truly become a global currency he would have to back off and also limit his own amount of currency.

If he for example owned 50% of all coins.. people found find it strongly unfair and feel they were working for him. To make the currency successful he would need people to take ownership of the idea.

So there is a very very good reason he backed off.

But I think he is still in btc. Perhaps even fully still.

yep, very likely.

He spent years developing bitcoin and proving it could work, amassed a significant amount of it, when it finally starts to gain recognition he just simply walks away from it?

nah
Very likely just said that to take off the attention. He "switched off" the Satoshi persona and undertook a different pseudonym.

I would guess that Satoshi views the alt sections and sprays a fountain of vomit in disgust all over his/her/their screen.

A full on visionary is not going to dick around with shit coins. If financial considerations were a factor, BTC still outweighs everything else by a country mile.

Living in Japan I feel like he is everywhere ;)

Is is the same person Ted Nelson thinks it is? ;)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=emDJTGTrEm0

I think it is very likely that "Vincent Durham" aka "vinced (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=9552)" was Satoshi. A double spacer like Satoshi, he appeared a few months after Mr. Nakamoto vanished.

See Zooko's Triangle:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zooko's_triangle (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zooko's_triangle)

1. Satoshi is founder of bitcoin. I think he won't lose his private key in development. Except he wrote his private key on paper and that paper was burn.
2. He can buy so many ASICs miner with his premined coin when bitcoin was still in development.
3. I think he won't make a new coin and become rich with premined coin trick.
Satoshi is a mysterious man and i don't know where is he right now :D

did satoshi create a new altcoin?
meh, this is unlikely

did he lose his private keys
lol, how can you lose the most important thing (private key) to something that you create?!!
sorry but this is honestly the stupidest thing i have ever heard.

satoshi created a new coin to mine and get rich
not everybody earns money from pumping altcoins, you can work as a programmer and earn a lot more than that if you are good!

afaik Satoshi went "dark" when government reached out to Gavin for questioning. And since creating any form of money by a citizen is prohibited, it doesn't surprise me he did just that.
Thinking that he went to create some shi*coin is insane, since he is considered to hold big piece of bitcoins, and the fact he is not spending them only shows that he knows what
he is doing. If he was to spend the coins, it would create a flood of bad comments how "the founder is dumping his coins" and what not.


Litecoin creator identity is known, so what are you trying to say, that Satoshi= Charlie Lee ? That's just dumb idea. If he was to bounce to a new coin every year or so, it would
make 0 credibility for him and the bitcoin.
btw. imho litcoin is just another shi*tcoin, created to be asic resistant; and look at it now, whereas bitcoin is still doing what it was created to do, so please don't try to insinuate things to
try to increase people's confusion.

cheers

This is interesting, let's suppose he did not loose his keys, but instead he lost his wallet. The keys are somewhere on a piece of paper ?!

How hard would it be for him to match the keys to the possibly many addresses that were generated ?

Also how many addresses and/or keys would he have needed to write down on paper ?

Why do you insist on the theory that he lost anything?
Is it so hard to believe that he is just using his bitcoins as store of value and being the firt hodl-er ?

cheers

I find this somewhat weird:

1. Creating any form of money by citizen ends the citizen up in jail.

2. Developing said 1 further does not end up citizen in jail ? :)

Too funny.

Could be a trap for him though:

1. Legalize bitcoin.

2. Wait till he spends coin.

3. Then say it was all a big fat joke/lie to trap him ! =D

There's a big difference between the time bitcoin was created and now, altho even now it's not cristal clear as to what bitcoin should be referred as legally.
Satoshi backed off because the future was unclear, and he didn't want to risk it.
Regarding your trap idea, well, i doubt government would go into such an extent just to make an arrest, there are better ways to do that.

cheers

I don't think you're theory is a thing.  He has invested so much time and "himself" into bitcoin that I think he would rather stick with his creation.  He must be a millionaire.  I can't imagine he would do this for the money and that would be the only reason to start a new alt coin and promote it to succeed.

I know right people love to add more to the plate then what it has, the altcoin industry is down right now, if satoshi hasn't moved any of his wallets why would he create a new coin when he has enough to back up his life with bitcoin.

I'm pretty convince he has.

BurstCoin.

I'm not kidding. This coin has some features that the colored coins will offer, but it still very close to PoW mining. However, PoW and BTC has the problem of power. How much are our natural research are ethical motivated to allocation to mining?

BURST solved that in an amazing way. It stores "plots", created by your GPUs or CPU but only once. When mining those plots are read to see if you a have a solution and my create the next block.

The electricity cost of an HDD is not even comparable to a constantly running ASICs or GPU, an even less so if you are using the computer stays on most of the day.

On the theoretical level, the research done and implemented is stunning. The problem for Burst is funding. They didn't do any crowdfunding or IPO/ICO and all devs and PR efforts have to be paid by donations. But that is not working out. There last major innovation was a true cross-chain transaction, but even if it works perfectly not even a proper PR was writing or circulating.

Very old school. And the way I think Satoshi would do it.

So let Satoshi revolution the world a second-time: help Burst get some VC funding.

And, as I said, I'm not kidding.

why not? notice like he is not here anymore(one could argue that he isn't here because bitcoin is too big and he is holding a fortune, so he want to stay anon 100%, still can't explain why he was missed long before that happened...) there is a chance that he don't care about bitcoin anymore

so dumping for him would be a good thing, also remember that he say in 20 year bitcoin will be nothing or really big, so he has taken into account the fails of bitcoin, and do you think he is that stupid to "baghold" 1M coins if bitcoin will fail?

He mined the coins on his computer when the difficulty was very low, the electricity costs were therefore insignificant. The real "investment" were the years of unpaid work put into developing bitcoin. He never seeked seed capital or asked for any sort of financial help, so it is safe to assume he was doing fine financially and his main intention was not to enrich himself, unlike all these premine and ICO shitcoins out there nowadays. He believed in the idea and wanted to see it make a wide impact. So no, dumping all his btcs is not a good thing for him.

Besides 1M is just a guesstimate as no one knows for sure which wallets belong to Satoshi. I do believe the bulk of the early mined coins will be left untouched as the purpose was to keep the network running, not hog all the coins. But I think he still has a decent (and fair) amount of it. out of all the btcs that were distributed in the beginning, how do you know some of them did not end up at other wallets that Satoshi had and later used to buy stuff or sell for fiat??

"Satoshi" might even be reading this and chuckling at the idea that he lost all his keys or left bitcoin for a altcoin

i think you are partially correct, no one can know for sure that satoshi's intentions were not aiming at enriching himself

what if he created the whole bitcoin thing just to take advantage of the early diff, knowing that he will be the only one in the network(maybe it wasn't his intention at first but it could have been grown later on him when he see the potential in price of his creation), and so mining a shitload of coins

Every coin out there will be claiming Satoshi invented it next and asking for VC funding on the basis of it. Satoshi never tried to get VC funding for Bitcoin and it's done fine without it. If BurstCoin's so good then it will also do fine without any VC funding. A NXTer already tried claiming Satoshi = BCNext and it didn't work. Claiming Satoshi = BurstCoin dev won't work either.

Fun thing is that we will never know. BurstDev is as anonymous as Satoshi was, while he really has no need to be that (if he's not Satochi).

don't think he's spending time and effort on a new digital currency. even if he did, it won't come near to bitcoin as people don't fall for altcoins anymore.