Bitcoin Forum

What types of damage could the machine takes if they are placed outside in the scandinavian winter.

whit roof . no walls ?

any overclock pocibilities?


Let's say s5 machines sp20s ?

this is the idea.

The Blow will be outside and the intake will be pulled from downside.


PLacing the Miners on the balconi the intake should not bring any moisture from the downside.

Weather is pretty dry were i live.

The little box will be weather prooff so no water or snow will be getting inside.


https://i.imgur.com/a4QqQiB.jpg

No walls? What about rain/snow? :P Condensation might be a problem I guess?

you need to override fan settings for miners outside.
I used my garage last year.
 (Michigan) I saw alot of failures due to hotspots, keep the fans blowing all the time, it can be set to lower sped, but circulation is important or you're going to end up with potentially damaged equipment.
or just a fwe large fans blowing across the whole farm is another option if you have the room.
but at least tarp to walls to keep moisture out

Thermal stress will reduce your equipment's lifespan and blowing snow will get through your HVAC and destroy the machines.

As long as the miner stays on so it generates heat, does not get wet, has air circulation and stays clean I would think it will do fine.

I might be concerned about the wiring getting to brittle if it gets really cold.

yeah i am building a box to put them inside, whit the exhaust out of the windows .

It kinda will have two sides and intake will facing inside the buildingn whit the extra roof.

You've got it backwards, you want intake to be from the windows outside so you intake cool air.  You want exhaust pointed inside so you heat the inside of your building during the winter "for free".

I would be pretty scared of this box outside.  You have to make it where air can escape depending on box this could allow snow/water/ice/etc from -20 not sure what you will get with hot miners beside it.

But I would look at way's to put miners inside and exhaust outside.   Water damage could be very bad.

Your equipment will damaged because of the snow and fog. Water is killing for technical equipment. You better get it with walls with a good ventilation system from outside. It will reduce cooling costs a lot.

As long as you don't get wet on your machines it sounds like a good idea. -20 would be too much, dunno if any electronic devicewould work at that temperature.

I think the hardest part is letting air in and out.  This is needed to run miners an intake and exhaust of air.  OP is talking about a roof and 2 sides I believe this leaves 2 sides open to the elements.

The miners chances are will heat up.  And when they do you will be running with water/ice inside i think.   You cannot make air tight so it leaves it to elements of outdoors.

I still highly suggest moving inside with miners and send exhaust outside.  Water can do a lot of damage.

There won't be any kind of elements getting inside, discard this, as there will be a roof over the "box" whit roof.

The Air is dry so to carry mositure it wont be that easy.

Not only wiring becomes breakable at this temperature. Any of the plastic details inside your miners may splinter too.
They are not joking when they say that Operating Conditions for S5 are: 0 °C to 35 °C. So be careful.

Why would you want it outside? -20 Celsius is insane, you HAVE to keep it warm *always* at that temperature, at least 5 Celsius. (or the miner's silicon plastic bitties will snap) If the intake air is -20 Celcius, you simply can't mine with it outside. It will freeze the tech inside of the miner and effectively destroy it. If your outside temperature is -20 C, you must have a hell of a time heating up your house, turn that heater right off and buy a few more S7s and make yourself a foot heater.

Your idea is kinda a small version of my setup: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mfmfdEjRkWU

Pulling in cold air thru window, straight thru the miners, and out (some inside the house for heating).
It can get as low as -20 to -25 during the really bad winter days, hopefully it will work out!

I'd say go for it, just make sure the box is "sealed". You should consider trying it with an older ASIC first, to make sure you don't ruin it..

Is it snow or ice by miner?   I'm guessing ice with temp but snow still could fall I'm guessing.

I just think if air is able to get in possibly some bad elements could to.  If snow or ice is pushing against intake when it snows and it melts seems possible for it to come inside of the box.  I just have not seen anyone done this at these temps before.

And I could be wrong, just don't see to many miners outside, and specifically at this temp.

True notlist3d! Maybe a watercooled solution is the way to go? With external radiator(s). Then you could probably seal the box off?

Yeah but it wont come anything from the underside it will be sealed aswell, hot air goes up, and cold air will go down..

Intake will always be fresh air.


If cpus can hold nitrogen why would -20 c affect the chips ?

It will freeze the inside of the miner when it isn't generating heat/the parts of it that don't generate heat. -20 C is really pretty insane, just run it inside if your outside temp is that cold.

I hope I am wrong as I would love to see this insane box of mining.  I just think decent chance intake could take a little water/ice if wind blows it up.

I don't think we have seen anyone run a miner at this low -20.  So again would be interesting if you do it.

Yeah i will try anyways.


I am hoping to overclock my sp20 and want to see the possibiliets if i can get 3thz from it running in cold weather.

if they can run cpu at -225°C

what would mine be in danger at -20 ?




we could easy have 20thz machines at home ?  ::)


http://www.snotr.com/video/8911/8429GHz_overclocked

There were some pretty good anwsers already.  Asic miners just were not tested in these conditions.   

I don't think anyone can give you a good anwser as no one has done it. I personally would not choose outside and in -20.  But you seem determined so go for it document it and show it to everyone.   

Were just speculating.  You are only one who can test it if you feel it truly can make it.

If it isn't tested OP should just do it. Take some pics for us and show us how its going.

That is what it's going to come down to.  Were all speculating what will happen.  I personally think it's going to lead to problems down the road.

But I have been wrong before.  And I do hope op does document the process.

Yeha ill be prepareing. ,my electric bill is 0.05 cents kwh so might overclocking my machines if it goes well else ioll be having them inside the house.

The climate is still warm . at -5 at nights and rainy on days. might have to wait a month untill it gets colder.


The climate is dry so it wouldnt conduct much moisture, more than normal, even less.


The main obstacle will be to have the protection totally sealed.

Just ordered some new Thermal GReese, AS5 just dries to quick on the sp20, will repaste all the machines and get the chips on alot of compound to protect from the winter chills.


Also ordered a fan controller will have the fans run 100% whit no machine control.


As what i understand from Overclocking under freezing temperatures the cores need to warm up a little bit before running full pontetiall.


Also checking some absorbemt materials to cover under the intake just incase to abosorbe moisture.


A s3 won't be relevant for overclocking but will might give it a try aswell to see maybe can squish 700ghz out of it.

Why not just have a mining box with a small extra fan blowing -20 in and another blowing inside ambient box air out?

If possible have their speed controlled  so that the box temperature is at a more suitable temperature.

So just stick your miner/s into the box and regulate the temperature of the box by controlling the amount of air coming in and out of that box.

Of course be careful that your box temperature does not fluctuate up and down much. Fast temperature changes to electrical devices is death.

The idea is something like this.

But the fans of the machines are to strong to keep it sealed.

So exhaust will be completly open and intake aswell whit a fan pulling cold air inside from the bottom.

Fans form machines will be pushing out.

My IT techer even told me that why not put the machines inside Oil cooling and cool down the oil whit the winter cold.

Might even be a clever solution, oil will protect from outside and will be more seleaded swell.

None of these machines you have mentioned were meant for immersion cooling. Be careful as it sounds like your teacher is giving advice he is not familiar with.

You might have to find special fans to handle this.  I don't think most of the fan's will last.  I think get brittle and break.  But that is a guess no one has tried what your doing that I know of.

Yeah my teacher do not know anything about asics. tought it's cpus .

The idea of this is to not have fans but normal water cooling system like aquarium.




I don't think i will try out this tought it's just to much work to be done.












I've placed the machine outside, tought it still warm.

18 °C / 79,69 °C temps are a  bit high.


2 chips are running at 120c and rest aboud 100c.



Still waiting for the new thermal paste to get home, hopefully it will bring down the temps.



Outside temps are about 10c still nights around -3c.

I don't know if this is a good idea but I am facing a long cold winter and plan to use my miners as heaters.  I live in a small apartment and can get away with spending a lot less on heat while my miners run.  I don't know why someone hasn't designed space heaters that are bitcoin miners.  What would the cost/benefit be?

Well i was going to use them as heaters aswell, but apartments share liquid heating system, so i can not gain any benefit  as i can not shut down the heaters to save money it is just not a possible option.

I could  get the house warmer than usual whit hot fresh air..


I am still checking how SP20 is doing, but im astuck at 1650ghz as highest whit normal temps and fans at 100%.

Waiting for colder temps and the new thermal compund.


I will defeninitly have s5's inside the house heating the house but if i benefit from colt to overclock i will overlock them outside in the balcony..

ill be updating more soon

Condensation can still happen, even if you weather proof it. People have tried these sort of experiments with gaming computers and it never turns out so good.

Well condensation only happens when you have a high humidity ambient.

Wich skandinavian is not a humidity friendly place. air is cold and dry.

what i know is that KNC have open data centers and there is were i  got my idea of as i guess they run this in winter aswell.

They close the electric gates if needed but they are never 100% close, always making  some airflow whit half open gates atleast.

Do you mean $0.05 kwh? I can't imagine such a low price as 0.05 cents kwh. Even $0.05 kwh is pretty low too.

Yeah still quite high for running few mahcines :D.

Global market has statet that Electricity will keep falling down as the usage keeps raising they need to compete whit the global prices.

This is for 2016 the prices would be falling 0.01- 0.02 usd and some more .

0.05$/kwh is very cheap tbh! Prices are gonna go up imo.. ^^

He's picking on your grammar btw, 0.05 cent = 0.00005$, you obviously don't have 0.00005$/kwh prices :D

is not a cent after 0. ? :P haha ;),

But prices will keep falling, i've made some research.

Global comsumption is getting higher.

It don't mean it will go down to almost free from nowehre, it will take some time , specially were it is costly it might even take longer.

Companies always try to get you into contracts because the prices get lowered so if you bind yourself you will be paying 2 - 4 times more than what it should cost at current market price.

Excatly. So 0.05 CENT are how many dollars?  :-*

Well sure, electricity cost might go down. But grid-fee or whatever you call it, will go up! At least here in Norway!

Dunno, here in sweden the grid fee and tax is in debate as many complained that it is to high.


Electricity cost like 0.0001c and the grid is around 0.02 and taxes about 0.027c .

Personally I don't think if the Global comsumption is getting higher the prices will become lower. On the contrary, the higher the demand the higher the price. But I know it's not so unnatural to expect some tricks from the economics, so good luck.)

My assumption is that standard PC/server is in the principle the same machine. The manufacturer are limiting Operating environment. If I remember well typical figures are:
Temperature operating: 5C - 35C (41F - 95F)
Relative humidity: 8% - 80%

Running in temperature below 0C will for sure increase a chance of damadge.   

Part of what makes it tricky is that he want's to run it outside.  I think preventing moisture is going to be hard.  Just if air can flow through I think it's possible for a little moisture to get through.  And even a little would be bad on miiner.

We really will not know for sure until OP does it.   I do suggest he start out with a cheap miner to test what will happen.

For about 6 weeks I ran a large rack of miners in what used to be an attached garage. On the East wall there are large windows I left open and on the west wall is where I had the rack and the miners pointed at the open door. The temperatures were not -20 but we were certainly below freezing many days and nights off and on for weeks. I did not have a need to run the furnace because I had strategically placed miners around the home but this was the largest concentration in the attached garage. Even when it was below freezing it would be so hot in the attached garage that I couldn't sleep in there and I can fall asleep anywhere. Once I placed an exhaust fan by the west door sucking-blowing out. To me it was perfect and I could fall asleep if I was working out there.
(It is not uncommon for me to stay awake too much and only get a couple of hours sleep for a few days and then crash anywhere I land at home.)
The miners did need a good cleaning and I broke them all down as far as possible and with a vacuum and low pressure, dry, clean, compressed air they were spotless. There was not any damage. I've seen pictures in the SP20 thread of weather damage. If you want to see some thermal damage roll through that thread. People who had the miner sitting outside their window with just the exhaust sticking inside for the heat.

I live in a humid area. It isn't extremely humid, but it certainly isn't as dry as some places. I live kind of in the same part of the world as sidehack and novac so maybe they could chime in on the humidity %, and it is a bit dryer in the winter here, but I'm certainly not going to claim it is very dry, probably average for most of the Midwest USA.

I know there were some obscene temperature changes because right beside this door where the exhaust went is an open door to the rest of the house and heat poured in from the other miners. It was so hot you could break a sweat if I didn't open the windows sometimes.

There is a difference between -20 c and - 10 c and most nights in the winter are probably average between 4 c to -6 c
Even though it was technically inside a home there was always a great breeze of cross air in the room. Some nights working out there I regulated the temperature by opening or closing a window.  I certainly had temperature swings from day to night. We have huge swings here where you can see 20 to 0 c between day and night.

I wasn't lucky. I cleaned the miners and I continue to do so.
Take one down, pass it around, wash, and repeat. Be meticulous with any buildup.

The exact same miners are running today in a different part of the home and have a filter setup. They are running great and I have added more miners, but the filters did a fantastic job and I clean about half as often. For your outdoor project I would use a fine thin layer mesh and a true filter. Don't restrict the flow much. I would also use double fans. By this I mean I would use the ones on the miner and have another at the exhaust to your structure which is strong enough to continue pulling air across the hashing boards just in case something happened to the other fan(s). I would never let them run fanless due to hotspots. This is the mistake many people make when performing sub zero and N2 experiments. Hit up overclockers.net for some subzero tips if you want, but it is pretty straightforward at this temperature.

AS long as you keep the air flowing and do not allow water to reach the miner I think you will be fine. This is around February and early march of this year and if I were you I would go for it.

As someone advised, run yourself a little test with one miner for a week and check her out. Do a deep checking and completely pull her down. Take a magnifying glass and patiently look at all components paying close attention to the area around the inlet and outlet. If it is even close to as dry as you describe I do not see why you will have issues. People in Michigan, New Hampshire, North Dakota, etc see temps of -20 c easy every year so I do not understand why -20 is exciting so many folks. After all, it is the humidity that is the killer.

Look at the previous years average. What does the temp range do when the sun comes up? Does it stay at -20 or does it blast to +10 in 30 minutes? That can be a reason for concern but otherwise you are good.

Document everything! Take pictures! I didn't and I kick myself for it. If it wasn't so much work I would set it up this way just to take pics, but I have a different plan for this winter. I am going to use the existing ductwork in my home being fed by all the miners in one room. The duct will handle it no problem. I will take pictures :)

This is the really hard part I forsee.  OP talks about a box outside in -20.   The miner will heat the inside of the box.  I think getting airflow outside without allowing moisture is going to be a really uphill battle.

I honestly hope OP does it as I have not seen it done outside in -20.  But I sure would start off with a cheap miner nothing nicer then a S3 in that box.  I'm afraid moisture will make it the box of death for a miner.

The box might get a li ttle heat, but the idea is to have the fulls fully blowing to get the hot air pushed outside.


I am running one outside atm, and it's 100% cool inside, but the temps are still warm

Can you take some pictures? Is the one outside in a box like you mentioned?

Also what kind of miner did you put out there?

Yes, please. I'd like to see some pictures too. How's your progress?


You mean the temps outside? So no -20 yet?

+1 but maybe you can help the wires by making sure you connect it only with one cable instead of two (not sure every miner has this option but most miners you can use a stronger PSU and then put only one connection so a lot of power goes thru this one connection and warms itself up...) also if you overclock the hashrate the heat inside should suffice to keep the cables warm...

I will put pictures later tonite.


I have not built a box yet. still considering the materials to be used.



I have sp20 outside, but temps as said before are not so low yet. maybe 0c at night as lowest and around 15c daily.


Fan at 100% still only have the miner on 1650GH/s , asic temps are fine too 2x at 100c and rest 85c.

It is pulling around 1300W from the wall and 2 wires are hot , some plastic melted and burned a week ago, tought was running 2x pcie from 1x wire.

Now each pci-e have it own wire , tought 2x are still running hot but not to a melting point.


Still waiting for colder temps to start something atleast.


I just can't seem to overclock the sp20 it keeps just adjusting automatic even if the temps are low.


Bringing home some S5 miners, will see tonithgt how they perform outside.

I look forward to seeing the pictures! I have been curious what this project will turn into.

On the wires are you saying at 0c they are still hot?  In 0c the wires should not be hot.  What PSU are you using?  Also are you using a extension cord?

Yeal ill be updating.

Just had so much crap outside i need to get everything clean to make some room.


sp20 is currently on a server psu. DPS-2000BB , i self made the wires whit home wiring , they are fat Copper cables and should not be so hot actually.

On the night a bit of the "homeMAde" cable is still warm, the other day when 4x pcie were passing trough 1x copper wire , it got RED HOT, and started to burn stuff and melting plastic haha, no dmg too done i got it in time :).




the s5s will sit on a rm1000 together, i am not comfortable to put all the machines on the Server psu and make it fully load.

The burnage happened at half load.


right now i am configuring and making everything clean , have alot of IT work to do from school so kinda prioritizing but ill keep update as much as i can.

Weather is still warm, it got even warmer, but should drop any soon, it should start to snow in some weeks.

I HIGHLY suggest stopping using them and look into better cables.  The hot cable is not good.   4 PCIE cables going through 1 wire?  Can you take a picture of it.

Please show what your doing on 4 though 1 cable as this sounds like something I have not seen before.   Not to mention dangerous.

^^Absolutely. With 1300W we are talking about at least 100 amps, so you should use 4 AWG or 35mm² for your wiring.

You need to use some real wires and size them appropriately.  Nothing should be so hot that you cannot touch it.  Something red hot is way way way into the danger zone, you'll end up burning down your neighborhood.
http://leaprate.com/wp-content/uploads/15105864373_5aa695e761_k.jpg
https://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/s--vKMCcubG--/c_fill,fl_progressive,g_north,h_358,q_80,w_636/pepxlzrotfmujmjwjp0c.jpg

Are there more pictures of that happening?  I had not seen the first one thank you for posting it.   Different view was interesting.

But yea like I mentioned earlier stop.... honest OP you will thank us.  Heating up and burning stuff is no joke, it's honestly dangerous.

Just browsing google image search, found these as well, there may be more out there:

http://bravenewcoin.com/assets/Uploads/_resampled/ResizedImage600335-proof-of-burn-2.jpg

https://coinreport.net/wp-content/uploads/2014/11/columnofflam.jpg

http://i59.tinypic.com/kdtqhy.jpg

I feel the urge to bring this up again:

https://i.imgur.com/iQ872cQl.jpg (http://imgur.com/iQ872cQ)
This happend to me, use the right gauge! :P

Exactly it is scary what electricity can do if not set up proper.  Using crap wire, or cheaper wire.  Cheaper equipment can cause very bad things. 

For OP to seem say "haha" around all those bad things is scary.  I don't think he realizes that it can burn down buildings... scary.  Get a good smoke detector if your messing with stuff like that.

Man, please stop using those "homemade" cables! This is not a joke. That's good that you got there in time before fire started, but don't you think that was a sign for you to stop using those cables.

You better pay some cash for the good cables then take such risks. I'm not alone here who is telling this to you so you are warned.

Hey, it is okey now whit cables.

I had made some miss wiring, was passing 300a trough 1 cabler for 2x pcie. i have 4 rails and was using 3.

Now each connection got 1x rail and cables are actually not hot anymore and passing 150a by each cable.

The cable is HOME wiring , fat Copper Wires so was kinda dissapointed when this happened.'

Now it's working fine i will upload pics of the sp20.

It will be dangerous for the equipment. I strongly recommend not to do so.

Please do upload those pictures once you get a chance.  I have been very curious what it looks like after you described cables.

If you have a chance please take picture of wiring to it.

sp20 wich is outside.



http://imgur.com/a/jHCcZ

Thanks for posting the pics! Now I can see the cables you were talking about. Man, they look horrible, but since you said  everything's normal now maybe that's ok, idk.

So apart from the cables everything's fine? I'm glad if it is so. Good luck on mining!

You aren't running it with damaged cables are you?

It appears anwser is yes on mutiple... with electrical tape.   I wondered what wiring was like dang..... OP you really need to think about shutting down rig.

It just is scary on the wiring.  That is a fire hazard.

I am running it whit those cables.

they are about 2.5mm thick.

I know they look ugly but it is working fine , i have been checking them alot, they are not heating up anymore like before.


Machine has been working fine, it works fine at Low FAN speeds 10-20 is good else it drops alot in ghz if i cool it down to much so might be some signs that it's not convenient to even run at lower temps?.


Ambien temps are 12c and 39c backplate.
Asics are running between 70~c and 90~c




The S5.s wich are inside are running at 1250~ up to 1.3 clocked at 391, whit open windows to let the room cooldown they bump up som ghz.

Migh consider to just run the s5.s outside, will put them outside maybe in the week to see how they perfom.


The s5 are pulling 1.2kw clocked together they do 2.5ghz~.





On the night i am doing 4.2thz~.

At morning i am going from 3900 to 4100, i guess the temps might play some roll, need to do some more research.

The sun still heats alot .

The air Is really cold and getting colder.

Nice experiment man! Don't forget to write down the results you get for yourself and for public knowledge as well  ;)

Specifications usually mention 0 deg C as a minimum, because equipment is not tested below that, but this doesn't mean it won't work. Maybe you can even give feedback to the manufacturer saying that you tested it for X time and worked / did not work.

As for your cables, others said as well, look into them. Burned cables are no good. Also, 4A/mm2 can be taken as the rough measure on how much current you can push through a copper cable. Don't go above it when operating continuously.

Cables are not that expensive they really need replaced with proper cables.  It appears like it burnt  through coating on parts and is covered with electrical tape.  Just almost asking for electrical fire with that.

You will think us one day if you spend the money to get new wires.

Yes, I agree. Even if they are working ok now as OP says it's still better replace them because electrical tape is not a good coating for cables.

It honestly hurts me to read threads like this.  Those wires are not safe.  Add some cold weather and some snow/other water source.  Combined with exposed wire... it's asking for trouble.

I can understand trying to stay low cost but really change out the wires.   After you burn them out electrical tape is not a fix.

if you make your own cable, like combine two with solderingiron, is electrical tape enough?
when no shrinking tube available?

I'm guessing you could wrap it enough times.  But sounds like a horrible idea.   Don't make a cable with electrical tape.

Shrinking tube would be so much nicer. (I'm assuming you mean entire cord not just a tiny spot)

like this:

https://i.imgur.com/7H6z8Yx.jpg

If you say bad idea, i will get more shrinking tube, this wil also be in the outside. In the cabitnet of radiators.
see:

If it's for fans there is no problem whit that electrical tape.

This should be true as it should not have a lot of electricity going through molex to fan.  You can buy a professional one cheap though:

One amazon 9 bucks from one molex to 6 fans: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B007S3T4O0?keywords=molex%20to%20fan&qid=1445303953&ref_=sr_1_5&sr=8-5

I used two of these with C1's at a point they are as solid as it gets and works good.

oh yeah,

pro build is always better .


Well.

Ive had my sp20 and s5s outside, and let me say that they underperform at cold temps.

So skip putting them outside, will just warm the house for winter .

house only 60m2,
to hot ;D for 5KW
possebly 10KW in future ;)

Remember that heat is also generated when there is any resistance.  If you have a weld and use different metals (aluminum/copper) you will run into other issues.

That's a nice decision! I was always thinking what if not just ventilate out the hot air but to use for heating something like a greenhouse or even the house where you live.

What are this issues?.

My copper wiring was connect "soldered" to aluminium cables at the end.

Put your stuff in a shed, just make sure you monitor humidity and you should be fine.

I love that your brave enough to do this.  It makes it a fun thread to read, and intresting as it's a different setup.

I think issues are shown in picture: http://imgur.com/a/jHCcZ  . That wiring scares the heck out of me personally.

Hahaha. yeah well if you don't try you never know
I am not 100% educated on electricity, i have learned new things here in forum.


Contacts from PSU är made of Bronze, connected to the copper wirings, and then to Aluminium cables. so its kinda a nice mix up haha ;D.



I will sort out the wiring. i am able to do it proffesionaly, it's just the that it takes time, and time is money my friend.


I have sold some machines, keeping 1x s5 antminer right now.

Will try to make fund for a s5++ or wait for next gen, i guess that whit price going up machines will go up aswell.



but yeah, i guess some machines could work outside in the winter , gotta find out wich machines.

look.

you need to unplug this death trap NOW.

aluminum and copper wiring DO NOT PLAY WELL TOGETHER.

I agree. Since the aluminum wiring expands when it is warmed and contracts when cool much more then a copper one I suggest OP to use copper wiring only. I know that the copper wiring is more expensive but it is worth the price IMO.

I think were all in agreement.  But I don't think OP will be doing this from his view on the wiring.   I don't think he truly  understands how scary it is.

I mean you go to sleep... if that thing catches fire in middle of night that would be horrible.  Make sure you have a lot of fire alarms in your house as that wiring truly is unsafe.

Rain, Snow, Direct sunlight...

These things can cause damage to your machine.

Beside these, the natural cooling mechanism is a good idea.

Haha yeah i am not using that PSU anymore,, ill be making copper wiring only then.

I got massive ammount of copper wiring ;) so is no problem.


one thing i wonder is, if i connect 4x 12v together, do they add up as 48v or they mainan at 12v ?

That depends on how you connect them, series or parallel. With parallel you'll have same 12v, but with series you'll have 48 v so be careful. Maybe you should consult with an electrician.

The miners will usually use +12v input. If you connect 4 +12V in parallel to the miner, the +12V should remain at +12V or slightly less because of the strong current.

Without load, the +12V could be +12.08V, with power output, the +12V could be +11.89V. It depends on the quality of the power supply and the current.

This is the one time condensation could be a factor to if your gpu's are working afterwards or not. Haha.

Bitcoins machine for mining are used for good earnings in btc..
But, in cold conditions you can face problems.
Thermal stress will reduce your equipment's lifespan and blowing snow will get through your HVAC and destroy the machines.
So make sure it's not exposed in direct cold. That is snowfall (if it happens in your area) or rainfall (definitely not) as it will cause a damage to the machine. So be careful. It is rightly Said that prevention is better than cure.

I doubt anybody using a miner is worried about the longevity of the miner beyond one year's time so issues like humidity damaging the PCB might not be such as issue.  Snow melting and then getting flung by a 4000 RPM fan and causing a short will put down pretty much any miner in seconds.

When the miner manufacturer sell the machine they will price it in such as way that the ROI is about 6 month with some difficulty rise assumptions. The machine will be unprofitable after 8 month. So the life span of a machine is less than 8 month depending on your electricity price.

Well, if it's a balcony like in the image you drew, you have to be aware of a few factors.

- Ice buildup
- Animals and insects
- Scandinavian cold air might be too cold and damage the hardware

But there are also some pros.

- Natural cooling, no cost
- No need for housing for your money


I have an idea. My friend asked me about this idea. Instead of an in-house heater, you use a miner and route it into your house, and an air filter inside the miner too. You can build it in a slot in your wall, so there's no snow.

The largest issue you would face would be the condensation.  Because of the heat that is thrown off and the drastic temperature difference, you would have an issues with the condensation.  The hot air would rapidly cool/condense causing all the moisture in the air to get heavy and drop.  It would be like putting a warm glass of ice outside during the summer.  Now if you could eliminate the moisture in the sir and find a way to circulate the cold air into the system, then you would be able to do this.

First of all, i love your Paint skills.

Ontopic
The idea is good but make sure to protect your miners against any form of liquid (rain, snow, frost etc.).  Cooling won't be your problem and if your energy cost are low to very low,

Why not give it a try

If it is that cold out, I would let the cold air seep in and allow the room not to have any hear access.  By doing this, you will make the room ourside and it will assist in the cold without being in the cold.  You could also place a dehumidifier in the room which will allow you to make the room as dry as possible, however I still feel you will have an issue with condensation on the heat sinks of the units.

In the winter, if you leave your miner at home, it will heat the room and raise the temperature. the higher temperature will make the air less humid. You do  not need a dehumidifier.

Yes, I also thought that condensation on the heat sinks of the units will not happen, because of the high temperature AND constantly working fans.

I guess it could be a very good idea if you put them in your garage. At least inside the garage you will not have to bother with humidity and snow, but you will still be able to have them cooled and with a bigger lifespan.

fit the psu and miner into a suitable perspex box drill holes in the lid for you wires to come out, fit barb fittings into the side wall, at least one in one out (depends on a pump setup) seal the box. install pump hoses and radiator with water proof fans. fill the sealed box with mineral oil.

your hardware wont get wet if it is submerged in oil  ;D

I say, use a cheap mining system and give it a shot.  You can listen to a number of people on what you can do and there are a number of advise comments I would take into consideration, but just try it and see what happens.  You never know until you try, right.

ron7684 is right. You are not only dealing with moisture but also dust. You're saying that condensation won't be a problem, but you're thinking of a working miner under constant load. If the miner disconnects and the temperature goes down it will appear.

I agree. In case of disconnection you'll have moisture covering your miner inside and out. Since some details inside don't meant to be covered with water you might have a problem.

professional expensive electronics is covered in lacque that prevent corrosion and some resistance against moisture.



however these cheap  things don't have that and they are designed for indoor operation
read the manual

Look into bitcoin miners they were meant to be ran indoors.  And for almost everyone that works good.  It would rise costs of all miners who knows how much if they made them moisture proof... and most put it inside.

So putting outside is just a bad idea.  I know someone will say but I made a box!  I just think moisture is hard to keep out, and it kills macines.  So leave machines indoors where they belong.

I have to S7 running on the same setup. running for 2 weeks now with outside temp 10 to -2 with no problems.

witch temp shows your miner, and whats the hashrate, because I figured out today, that if the them is under 36°C then the performance goes down and with an them at 59 I had the best hashrate.

I develop atm an custom firmware for the S7 Miners (all batches), so that we have more options to set and also throwing some stupid messages out of the cgminer, an setting specific values for the fans.

Register at https://www.zwilla.de (https://www.zwilla.de) the first 50 users will get it for free, and all others have to pay 0,05btc  ;D

that is strange, every HW is known to work better with lower temperature, and 36 is still high, chipset should equal to a cpu and cpu give the best at lowest temp for OC for example

it's the same for GPU, threfore it should be the same for asic

I doubt that connecting wires may become brittle in some time.
But for sure you ll get good performance on lower temperatures.

Hey why would you want to put it outside ?  Use it to heat your house, voila, problem solved ?  If noise is a problem, there are ways to deal with that.

I think it is noise for a lot of people.  There are some miners that just run hot and loud.  Running hot is not a bad thing in winter.

But I think it's the noise of some of them that is the issue.  Could also be they have a outlet outside on a different breaker.  Maybe overloading one rooms breaker with miners and other items.

But I agree outside is not a good solution.

If the miners disconnects for some time, there will be condensation. So you have to take it into home to dry and move it out again.

For my small setup, I open the windows and allow the cold are to come into the basement if the miners get 'heated'

For OC'ing this has really helped out this winter

http://i64.tinypic.com/205994.jpg

That is much better then outside solution.  You get the cool air.  But if it's going to raiin/snow or moisture you can close window. 

So I like this much more then the idea of leaving a miner outdoors.  I'm no fan of outside.

You should be aware that by placing the miners outside can damage the hardware, the same is with the laptop putting in fridge, it will damage the screen. Better open the door or the window for few hours if you can afford it.

I like your setup! Firstly, you don't have fire-hazardous things around, like some other home-made setups I've seen. Secondly, your setup is inside so no worries about rain/snow and such. And also I like that the shelf you put your miners on has holes in it, which is better than just plain shelf IMO for cooling.

Thanks! When I saw the 'Miner Pr0n' post I had to clean it up a bit. Didn't look like that before lol.

If the temperature is -20 in your area, why not put the miner in home to get some heating out of the miner?

Yeah! That's a good idea, you can save on electricity bills then. :)

Nice setup you have going there, I'd like to have something similar to this.

I actually do this often. Just be sure to put them in milk crates or somthing

The amount of heat output is not enough to heat an ENTIRE house.

That really depends on many things:

1. The size of the house

2. How many miners you have

3. The temperature you want in the house

For example I'm okay with around +15C in my room so even one miner would be enough to make me feel comfortable. Of course I live in a flat surrounded by another flats which are warm.... so maybe tha's why ... Yep, for the entire single house one miner is definitely not enough.

You're seriously comfortable at 15C inside? :P Are you wearing wool? ^^

Oh for sure, they do these kinds of things and they can be done but they are in situations where they're basically using commodity hardware (for them) and have environments where the failure of a machine, rack, row, or even in extreme cases entire data centers doesn't translate to lost service to customers. They can afford to be pioneers and push the envelopes. Most of us simply don't have this type of ability in our houses. They save money on power / cooling equipment and just accept a potentially higher MTBF of server equipment. I worked at a "big company's" data center in Seattle for a while where they had a tent outside that was basically protecting servers from the rain. Intel did similar things. These types of endeavors are what have helped open up the TC 9.9 operating window. It used to be a max of 68F back in 2008 (iirc) but it has since been raised to 80.6F for the cold aisle (inlet) and even in some classes of machines as high as 104F

This is a bit off topic, but yes, of course I'm wearing wool: wool sweater and wool socks. And when I sit behind the computer more than an hour I use a wool blanket to cover my legs. The big advantages of the fresh air I have in the room are: no headaches, no fatigue. You should try it yourself.

i was thinking heating with miners is not healthy, as the electronics are releasing toxic materials into the air.

As long as the temperature of the PCB is less than 300 degree, there is no problem about toxic materials.

There has been a lot of debate about this, even a desktop PC will release *some* voc's during it's lifetime. On the plus side it's been agreed that a 1500M household air filter will negate any potential exposure.

Actually it's how much time you spend in the room with the miners what's matters. Toxic materials go into the air always when heat is applied but not as much as to poison you right away. Don't spend a lot of time where the miners operate and you shouldn't sleep there that's for sure.

Just a noobs question: Will bringing the temperature very low improve the hashing rate? Is lower the better?

I tried putting a small piece of dry ice on my Redfury (about 2 years ago) and it didn't improve the hashing speed at all...

Almost all miners are built to run at room temperature, cooling below 15C is the realm of overclocking and overvolting :)

I leave my laptop by te window wen its cold and it does mine faster

you need to override fan settings for miners outside.
I used my garage last year.
 (Michigan) I saw alot of failures due to hotspots, keep the fans blowing all the time, it can be set to lower sped, but circulation is important or you're going to end up with potentially damaged equipment.
or just a fwe large fans blowing across the whole farm is another option if you have the room.
but at least tarp to walls to keep moisture out

it does not improve the hashing, but it will improve the lifespan of your machine, which is pointless in the asic world, since your machine will be obsolete quickly, unless you have free energy

cold huh https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nJDsTqU3bJA  ;D

in cold seasons if we are placing the machine in outside indicates that we are decreasing their lifespan. the machines productive capacity will decrease by itself. so i think its not the good idea to place outside

If the temperature is low, the electrical circuits will last longer and work more efficiently. My miner works better in winter.

But what about unfavorable conditions for the miners if you expose them to the very low temperature? I agree that electrical circuits might work more efficiently but how do you manage to keep miners without excessive moisture etc ?

It burns their electromotor.and reduces the power

Should work with the mentioned conditions, BUT ...

... if you ever get a service interruption (power goes down) it will get dangerous with temperatures under +12°C for hardware.
And with under 0 and colder --- Your hardware will start to "sweat" in some seconds!
And power comes back after 1-2 minutes it will first slighlty work --- then the thin water-ice-condense will get back to liquid again and .... BUZZZZZZZZ  ::) 8) ;D

Within a datacenter the airflow should not be under 16°C (and not over 23°C - some are even doing it with 26°C - cheap mass hoster!)
Humidity should be max 30% - most prefer lower!
Really hard - you have to drink water and water every minute you feel thursty :)

Without wet-problems it wont be such a problem. But you cannot lower the % of dryness without climate control.


What you should really try is:

1) Cold air from outside
2) Warm air from inside your box (circulation)
==> Mix it (maybe you get a twister)  ::)

On a cold day you will re-use more warm air (more circulation, less cold new air).
On a hot day the air will be to hot from inside, you always will get fresh air.

Well - you need ...
temp measurement
airflow control to regulate which air you need more and less for openening a cold air valve or closing the warm air circulation etc.
(reducing the fan speed or increasing the fan speed could work too for each valve/line)

But in case of power interruption maybe some warm air from inside the house would help. (3th valve)
But it wont work automatic without APC/UPS (power is down) ;)