Bitcoin Forum

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I agree with your most of your stated points, but I have a few things to bring up.
2) Public opinion. "Lack of a PR team to improve bitcoin's public relations" This aforementioned point is rightly impossible, bitcoin is not limited to a singular group of people or a single business, things that require a PR team. Bitcoin, as advertised pretty much everywhere is a decentralized currency. Though I am interested, I'd rather say that the community itself has to debunk the rumors put forth by the media that are outright lies or not entirely truthful.
6) Global econonmy. Well, okay. Bitcoin does need a network in which to effectively use it in selling and purchasing items, possibly an amazon that accepts bitcoin along with normal currencies. That would be infitinitely benificial to the whole bitcoin system. Alas, this is too far away, as you said, we need a means of education for everyone.
8) Leadership. LEADERSHIP? The whole point of bitcoins is to have no leader. Idols endorsing bitcoin possibly will help in the whole advertising sector that is required for integration into mainstream society.
9) Capital expansion. The current system is stable enough, of course there are defaults and scams, but members lending have a vigiliant eye for that kind of stuff and defaulting will always happen, in every lending sector it does.
10) Gender relations. I agree with little you say in this, but along with a medium to purchase these things it will be easier for women to get cosmetics and the like. In whole it is the women mentioned choice and responsiblility to exercise bitcoin to their heart's content.

When I was first getting started with Bitcoin, I didn't find the bitcoin.org website particularly helpful either.  Once I was up to speed, I tried cobbling together my own version (http://www.wearedecentralised.co.uk/bitcoinforbeginners/index.html), but it's probably a little too long-winded because there's so much to cover.  I'm always trying to think of ways to improve it, but it seems like there's no easy one-size-fits-all solution.  Everyone absorbs information in different ways, so some might find one site easier to comprehend than another.  The other issue is that many established people in the community have vastly differing views on what exactly Bitcoin is, so getting everyone to agree on exactly what we should be teaching to the new starters could be difficult.  As an example, I deliberately left out web-wallet services because I think we should be teaching users the importance of looking after their own wallets and not relying on websites that may become compromised.

I agree with most of your ideas, but the biggest roadblock to implementing them is organization. Bitcoin is basically a grass roots currency, and as such, lacks organization and leadership. If organization and leadership were implemented, Bitcoin would lose much of its appeal. Kind of a catch-22.

I basically agree with most of what you saying, but point number 10 in my opinion, might be a bit strong. You have put a lot of time and effort into your post and we do appreciate

that, but the gender thing, is a bit over the top. I have posted many arguments and proof that women are using Bitcoin in other threads about that topic on the forum.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1163902.60

Point number 3   - INCOME: Lack of earning bitcoin methods & bitcoin jobs carry my biggest support, and should shift to the number 1 position. We need more income sources for

people to earn Bitcoin online. Every second newbie on this forum, ask that question, when they join... "Where can I earn Bitcoin?"

Well done... Good post.  ;D

Yes I`m aware of that, but many small make one big right?

Sure not 1 group can assume representative role over bitcoin, nor it can assume responsibility over it.

However multiple teams could do that. There can be competition between them, etc..

But the common goal is to shed positive light on bitcoin.

Now there are already bitcoin companies that do charity, but we need specific non-profit organizations to do only that for example.

So a PR specialist organizations /teams is needed.

I will correct that and put plural form, so that people should not misunderstand my post, we dont want bitcoin rulers, but we want bitcoin organizers.



I was referring there to a trigger event. For example a mass bail-in could make citizens upset about banks and turn to bitcoin for haven.


But leadership not in the ruler sense, but in the social organizer sense. A philosopher can be a leader too and it doesnt have to use the sword.

Leaders are ok, violence  and coercion is not.


Not all lenders have vigilancy, if a random guys just wants to earn an interest like if it were a bank account, he should be able to do it more easier than looking out for every scammer.

Its hard for borrowers too, because scammers make legit borrowers look untrustworthy. So there needs to be some filter/mechanism to protect both.


Might want to get some women magazines, or cosmetics company to accept bitcoin, that could send bitcoin demand to the roof.

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Yup i also think bitcoin.org needs a better design and more information on it. The theme and layout is familiar to all crypto people, but for a person who never knew crypto before it will be very alien.

My first motivation to join BTC was to earn money, and I could not find any useful info there. If it wasnt for my strong motivation, i would have quit bitcoin after 1 month. (And I think many people do this).

To preserve people and keep the interested, we need more education and usefulness added to it.


But again, leadership =/= governance.

I know many libertarians dont like that. A poet or philosopher is also a leader, and doesnt have to use the sword to impose its will on others.

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Truth is always harsh. But really i dont buy into the gender equality crap, we know that men and women have totally different interests, and they both have different biological roles. Males are resource gatherers, and women are family organizers and children raisers. This is their biological role.

So if we want women in bitcoin, we need to impress them by making bitcoin available in things that interest them


2) I`m talking about bitcoin-only charity. Something that can emphasize to the world that bitcoin can be used for charity and not just for crimes.
4) Good points
9) Let's not rush that thought, saying that only centralized systems can work is bad. I`m sure the free market will come up with solutions to preserve decentralization & safety too.

The main problem is the public ignorance of bitcoin. There is no unified approach to advertise the bitcoin so the general public will know about bitcoin. The bitcoin foundation does not much in this area.

Advertising Bitcoin right now is not a good idea. The software is still in the very early stages, look at the number version we are at... we also aren't ready to adopt massive amounts of people. It's best to stay under the radar for now.

Of course it is? What are we waiting for  for developers to settle? They never will.

There are many bitcoin storages available, only tech people use bitcoin core.

I think now is the time to advertise more than ever!

i don't think you need to advertise it like it is a brand of clothes or something, bitcoin is money it will advertise it self, if people want to use it

for when they need it, it will grow alone, people are already aware about bitcoin the problem is that they have choosen deliberately to not use it for whatever reason, security, customers protection etc...

Agree with OP points, especially with point 8. anyway like Amph said it's not cloth brand which the advertise is need to worldwide, look at recent news, some country even try to use blockchain technology from bitcoin to use for their country, but sadly they not used bitcoin, because they not need it, but they know it.

Maybe people still scare for use bitcoin because the price is like roller coasters.

You make some very good points here sir. I only have a problem with one of them; The social aspect. Isn't Bitcoin talk a united community? Other than that, all your points are very valid. You seem like a very intellectual person that can help out the Bitcoin community.

I`m not saying we should manipulate them.

I`m saying we should only increase awareness. Most people havent even took the time to check out bitcoin.org

Advertising is a GOOD IDEA especially that we are in the earliest stages of the coin. Scrutinizing and perfecting the system via user-reported bugs is a great start if we want a coin that is free from attacks. Just my opinion btw.

May be time has not come yet? Social networks, mobile phones have become popular due to heavy advertising and due to its relevance. On the contrary the goal of modern marketing is the promotion and sale of unnecessary things to the ordinary consumer.

But it's effective nontheless.

Why not use this tool then?   The old analogy with campfire vs oven.

I think you bring up a lot of good reasons.  My biggest thing is there are tons of people out there no matter what you do you are not going to convince them to ever use Bitcoin.  They might not have a computer, or the tech savvy to actually use Bitcoin.  That is something that will be fixed with time which is sort of crude to say but true.

Yes that is true, however those people are not really useful innovators anyway so they dont really matter in the economy as much.

The ones we need to convince to use it are usually:  teenagers, young adults, 30-40 year olds who are good consumers or come from middle class, 40+ who are middle class, consumers who shop alot , maybe later workers who want to be paid in bitcoin, artists, inventors, investors, wealthy, and probably the elite too.

There are many groups that are more interesting than just average Joe that minds his own life and doesnt care about anything that goes around him.

Didn't you read the rules of this thread? You're being very counter productive.

OT: Most if not all issues pointed out in this thread are being worked on. Bitcoin has a huge community and the complexity of this whole system is pretty enormous by now. We just need to debunk all the shit that is thrown at us. Paris terrorist attacks for example, which is most likely banks agenda to eliminate bitcoin.

Hi, friend. I'm just passing by to let you know that your ideas are already receiving some approval by prominent participants in the bitcoin space.

https://www.reddit.com/r/Buttcoin/comments/3tfog1/a_bitcoin_intellectual_has_some_ideas_on_how_to/

Approval? That thread looks like a demonization or some kind of making fun of my arguments.

It's really sad, reddit is full of idiots. In fact that whole subreddit is some kind of joke, I`m not sure.

Just ignore it, we have important discussions to talk about there.

Actually, those kinds of posts are beneficial, even if they are meant to make fun of me.


I`ve changed the wording of my OP so that people should not have wrong impressions about the message being told here. I especially changed POINT 10, people thought there that my point was too extreme, but look it's the truth.

Women need to find interesting things in bitcoin and to meet with men, these are facts, so you only make fun of yourselves by stating otherwise.

I changed the wording, so that now it focuses more on the message and less about the form.


Damnit too many criticizers, but atleast they point out the weaknesses in my arguments, which I`m glad for. For this to be a good message we need to make it useable by anybody.

Anybody?  Even the human females?  I don't think they will understand anything. 

Yes even women , do you have a problem with that?

Or you dont wish women to join bitcoin?

You don't "join" bitcoin.
It doesn't need P.R. teams;
it needs to be more stable in price and simple to use/secure.

Someday, someway, somehow...a brilliant software writer will create a program that makes bitcoin easy for everyday people to use.

Until then, it doesn't need to be "mainstream" or advertised or anything other than what it is.


"The problem is that there is no reason for women to join bitcoin, women are biologically not resource gatherers, so they are not interested in the financial aspect of bitcoin.

If we want women to join bitcoin, we need to find a niche to attract them: Wealthy guys (very attractive), Fashion , Beauty cosmetics, Chit-chat gossip, Parenting (for mothers), and Online Meetup places other than forums."


?


You are calling yourself an "intellectual" and those who have opposing opinions "idiots".

You use the term "truth" as if you know the difference between truth and your own opinion? You don't seem to know the difference.

An intellectual is capable of open discussion.
Are you capable of that?

I am for open discussion here, what aspect of my post do you want to discuss.

So far we discussed all questions here in a civilized way except a few trolls that come by here and start insulting people.

A true and accurate characterization of the human female woman - by a renowned Bitcoin intellectual:


Notice the peculiar omission of: 'cryptography nerd with too many zits'. 

#7
http://www.seansoutpost.com/

Feel free to donate to them generously (they've been around for awhile)

Never mind #10 ?
It is practically it's own answer.

So you deny that women are attracted to: Wealthy guys, Fashion , Beauty, Chit-chat gossip, Parenting,...?

Yes that is nice, this website needs more attention.

We need charities that work only on bitcoin, because we can then emphasize to the world that bitcoin can be used for good too, despite the many evil things happening around it.


I still dont understand what the problem is with 10?

Was my wording too harsh? I dont want to offend any groups here, I`m just speaking the truth.

"I still dont understand what the problem is with 10?

Was my wording too harsh? I dont want to offend any groups here, I`m just speaking the truth."


Okay, you have softened me. Any hard edge you may have detected in my former comments is gone :-)
If it hadn't been for reading so many of these comments on this forum before, it would be hard to believe that you have made this statement in earnest but it appears that you have.

It isn't harsh nor offensive nor is it "the truth". It may be your opinion/experience.
Anthropologists typically categorize us females as "the gatherers" but beyond that,

understand that this statement speaks more to your character than a characterization of all womankind
and when you figure out why...
your life will probably be much more pleasant.

I don't want to break this down anymore, my advice to you is to stick around and learn more about bitcoin because as to #4
Information is plentiful...

Here, books, Youtube, articles, Satoshi's paper can be downloaded and yes: Google it.

So you are saying you wouldn't fuck him?  Aren't you attracted to him?  He definitely knows what attracts a human female woman.  After all, he is an intellectual.  

Oh right, I get it: you like dumb guys.  Too many human females are this way.  I sympathize with the lad.

Well then you misunderstood my point.

Historically, women were the ones raising the babies and males were the ones working and sustaining the families.
Of course that has changed, women now work too, and that is good if they choose so.

So even though women are more financially free in the past 100 years than they ever been, genetics hardly change in that short amount of time.

Thus some characteristics of this genetical behaviour still applies.


The same way men were the ones hunting down the animals and bringing food to their tribes. Men dont really need to go hunting anymore, at least not in the wilderness.


So even though society drastically changed in the past 1000 years, there are still behaviours that are intrinsic to both genders that still persist.

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So because of these differences, every gender, or in fact every group of people really, wants something else out of bitcoin.

X person from Y group wants bitcoin for Z reason, and those 3 variables change for each individual.


For bitcoin to be really successful it has to appeal to all groups, genders, religions, etc...

Sorry pal ,I really have to censor you now, you are getting really on my nerves. You have disrupted the conversation far too long, and only showed your childish nature.

Go troll elsewhere please.

Real Bitcoin.
here is the order in which things should happen if you want longterm success.


if anyone believes the order is incorrect and that an increase of users should come before usefulness/understanding.. then i guess your end goal is just a price speculated spike and not a bitcoin economic and infrastructural growth.

points (2) and (1) should not be community funded. but bitcoin business funded.

Yes I agree with you, bitcoin talk is a united community. I really believe bitcoin brings users together in a community environment.

Nice way to put it, but I think Marketing and PO are the most important, because that is how you introduce people to BTC.

If there is a non-bitcoin person out there and you introduce him to BTC, but he heard about all crazy crap going on around bitcoin, he will be scared to join.

So, a positive PR is definitely needed. Some positive events that could show the world that bitcoin is GOOD (or atleast neutral, judge the wielder not the sword)

Just give it time I say. All things mature with age. Bitcoin is like fine french wine. Sour at first but eventually will get better as time goes on.

I just found Lighthouse:

https://www.vinumeris.com/lighthouse


Pretty good and useful bitcoin app, especially for charities, but for other crowdfunding too. I just installed it, and will be using it frequently to donate to things I see helpful.

Way to go, bitcoin is really breaking the path here on the crowdfunding front.

skipping to mass marketing/PR and shouting that bitcoin is a new utopian world, but not having any means for people to get onboard, is a futile effort.
so before even telling the world to get on board. we need to build the training facilities. we need to build the easy access ships.

that involves compiling all the learning material first. linking businesses who can offer people jobs. linking businesses who offer products and services to spend.

then... and only then would it be ready for mass adoption..

after all there is no point spending $30million on tv/youtube advertising.. if when people say yea bitcoin is great.. they then get lost, not finding the right information. not knowing if they should trust which exchange. not even finding an exchange to get their currency.. or not even finding a job that pays in bitcoins or not finding somewhere locally to buy toilet paper with it.

to be honest. racing to drag noobs into bitcoin right now sounds more like a pump&dump social experiment.. bitcoin needs to evolve a little more in regards to noob usefulness and noob training. before we invite said noobs.

thats all im saying

very good

Has anyone got any extra inspiration from my wisdoms?

Just my 2 cents. But, for bitcoin to go mainstream quickly (I think that in the long-term we will get there anyway), something has to appear (service/product) that you can only do with bitcoin, that is so awesome that it is potentially addictive.

Think of things such as facebook. Can't do that shit without a digital network, and appears to be pretty addictive for a lot of people.

If you have that, politics, PR, difficulty of obtaining bitcoin, none of that matters. People will find a way to satisfy their needs.

Fucked if I know what it could be, and I don't think it matters anyway. Long-term bitcoin will get there.

your wisdom's just seem to be about getting noobs to buy in, and then find that they cant really spend it..
your wisdom's seem predominantly centered around pump and dump methodology rather than growing bitcoin infrastructure/economy.

until your wisdoms expand beyond your mindset of pump and dumping coin prices. there will always be backlash that will tarnish any positive PR.

so as i tried to point out before.. start on the bitcoin business, so people can sell products like toilet roll baked beans, coffee sandwiches and staff can earn a bitcoin wage. which will then get people to actually find that they dont need to convert to fiat to buy toilet paper..
then noobs will see bitcoin as something useful..

then your PR attempts wont be as hard.

doing it the other way (your OP way).. is an endless cycle of people buying in, getting confused/lost and then running out.. over and over again..

How is my method pump and dump when I addressed long term goals specifically.

The enviroment creates the organism, the organism adapts to the enviroment - Reality 101

If bitcoin is promoted well enough for people to get interested in it, then goods & services will quickly adapt to it for it to be useful.



How long did it take for banks to get into bitcoin? 5 years.

How long did it take for banks to use the internet? 15 years.

How long did it take for banks to use electronics? 30 years.

The future is acceleration and adaptation is key for survival and they know it!

We definitely need more jobs to offer to pay or partially pay in bitcoin. I know personally I
would get 10% of my pay in btc if it was offered

you anaology is not how your OP (the PR centric) plan shows..

you say the environment creates an orgasm..
but your plan is not to create any thing.. all you want to do is advertise that the organism should multiply..

thats no way to ensure organisms survival, thats no way to even ensure constant and growing multiplication of organisms..

you are not addressing bitcoin as a functional and useful currency/tool.. you real obsessed purely in grabbing noobs..

so tell me what advantages are you going to spout out what promises are you going to give for these noobs..
you seem soo obsessed about PR yet you have not really told anyone the 'sale pitch' noobs will see that will solve everything.

so again.. its far easier to solve the problems. then the sales pitch would hold more weight and require less of a push

https://www.coinbase.com/careers
https://bitpay.com/about/team
https://ripple.com/company/careers/

i just searched 3 of the main bitcoin related companies. and guess what, their hiring

Very nice post normally I hate long posts but I actually took the
time to read your entire post. I must say I agree on most everything
you mentioned in the OP.  When I first heard about bitcoin is was from
my wife and her brother so it was easier to have people who could
answer all my questions. There needs to be more educational websites
that make it easier to explain what bitcoin is and how it works. This would
also help business owners get more information and could help with adoption.

I would add offline payments made easier as a suggestion.

I`m not obsesses in grabbing new people, but you have to understand that nothing works better than systematic marketing.

How do you think apple or facebook got so many users? By sitting on their butts criticizing eachother? NO.

They worked hard to promote it, spend huge amounts of money, and then the herd effect did the rest.


Bitcoin needs a similar approach, or it doesnt need it, but it is recommended to have it. Therefore we could accelerate it's growth.


In case of bitcoin, end justifies the means in my opinion. And it doesnt matter how bitcoin becomes succesful, once it does.

4﴿ EDUCATION: Lack of a good guide to newbies

This is the main reason for me. When I first learned about bitcoin, I did googled it but  upon reading too many unfamiliar words/terms for me that I gave up understanding those word or raised more questions than actually answers my questions. Understanding the over all concept of bitcoin is not easy to adapt by new users.

I think this initial feeling of being confused as hell is normal at first. After you learn the basics you see this mystery and complexity around Bitcoin is just smoke and it's actually way easier than any other money system ever invented, the thing is, all the technical babble is all over the place with Bitcoin and people get confused when the end customer shouldn't even need to know what a blockchain is.

my opinion
Bitcoin is Not Mainstream Yet because :
1. we need more advertise about bitcoin,not all of debt card user know about ease of bitcoin.
2. not many bitcoin user have pleasure to introduce bitcoin to their friends or family.

Marketing is not really needed at this point, we still don't have a clear way to scale Bitcoin. If marketing was a big success and a ton of people became adopters all of a sudden we would have big problems dealing with the new amount of Bitcoins. I think it's better to stay low key until all thinks are clear scaling wise.

The customer should know what blockchain is. The criteria of a free market is:  "informed customers make rational decisions".

Or do you want some bureocrat deciding where to put your money? I dont think so.


However this doesnt mean that there should not be a simple explanation of bitcoin for newbies.

but apple and facebook had a fully user friendly end-product. that people could understand and use, without worry or headache.
bitcoin is still a prototype. its not perfect..

so if you really want to do PR. start with businesses right now... hold off on the random average joe for now.. and just get bitcoin more user friendly and useful
then later, once you can see an easy path for:
people to easily understand
people to buy bitcoin
people to work for bitcoin
people to use bitcoin to buy real life stuff (meaning toilet paper not specialist / limited list of stuff)
people can use it faster than 10 minutes (meaning its better then a 40 second debit card transaction)

then and only then will it be ready to mass market to common average joe folk.
until then, concentrate on the business, financial and technical industries

Well then a revamping of the bitcoin.org site is needed. I dont really like the design of it, it is pretty sketchy and the labels suck and the menus are very badly designed.

Bitcoin.org should be a copy paste of litecoin.com (with orange+white color theme).


You need to put the definition of bitcoin first with a video in the middle, then below the features, and on the top of the site the menu with buttons and dropdown menus.


Probably with an index of merchants, as litecoin has. Bitcoin only has only the bitcoin wiki listed merchants, but not on the site, which is bad.

i agree, the bitcoin.org does need a redesign.. but before the redisign of the website we need to sort out the features and usefulness of bitcoins, thus actually have better content to tell people.

thus i bring you back to my point..
1. improving features and ease of use
2. training/resource materials
3. business development
4. acceptability
5. central store of all the information above
.. then mass advertising
we definitely are not at point 5 yet

You got it right it's just little bit of change to over all website and make it more user friendly to attract more users and also easily understandable and one more thing I feels about Bitcoin is lacking in exposure so educate people about BTC.

There aren't really many advertising campaigns for Bitcoin, as usually the owner/creator of a good advertises the good. But since Satoshi is gone, we have to advertise. The problem is, some people don't want to sacrifice their money to help Bitcoin. I cetainly would try if there was a campaign.

Great list though.

Nice research but honestly it all comes down to just being too complicated and hard to understand for common people. Most of Bitcoin userbase is very tech savvy, they work with computers (not just using smartphone, but they are professionals in the field, engineers, web designers, developers, etc). It's a great unique and disruptive idea, similar to when Internet started but don't expect to be massively embraced anytime soon. Its technology is what's so great so maybe in 5-10 years the concept to new generations would be more innate.

The same question could be asked about internet. "Why didn't it become mainstream from the day it got discovered?"

People are just not aware of its potential, they're not informed, they haven't heard of it.
There's lack of interest as well, because of media hyping the "bad" things about it. How people buy drugs, or how they fund terrorist organizations, etc.

I don't think they haven't heard about Bitcoin, it is out there, it's just not needed at all. But maybe sometime it will be needed since we all agree its technology is unique and disruptive like the internet was in 90s.

And all you said well, we can't deny that Silk Road happened and there were many scandals. The black market still moves plenty of BTC per day every day. I know that fiat money does the same but still. With some more years and development under its belt I know it will evolve and become more stable in price (price volatility is still a huge issue in adoption, that's a fact).

It's still funny although, how people think that bitcoin is "evil" man made "currency" and they're being advised to avoid it. While FIAT is moving the entire man-made slavery system, drug markets, weapon markets and all the bad things.

Well, guess people will wake up one day and realize what's going on.

Everyone has a smartphone.

Webwallet+ smartphone. Every person with an IQ over 70 should be able to use that, there is no reason why they cant.

And if they cant, then they should use bitcoin debit card. And those that are entirely technically illiterate like the old people, they should use precious metals then.

Problem solved.

No they shouldn't and they won't, why? Because there is no need for Bitcoin for these people. I don't actually use Bitcoin, it's a complete hassle to buy it alone to then find a store than accept it? It's just not there yet for that purpose. It is of course a new way of thinking about money in this new digital world but that doesn't mean that we should force it down people's throats. Credit cards and paypal do a perfectly good job for most people without all the complications of decimals, converting fiat to bitcoin, wallets, keys and more. Be honest and accept that no average woman would use that anytime soon. I don't say it in a bad way, woman acceptance factor is a deal breaker. But I'm not worried about that because Bitcoin is still developing, I just feel it still can't find its niche or become the standard method of payment for something.

Alrigt then 1st world is not using bitcoin yet (yes they are the most tech savy still).

But what about the countries with crumbling economies (S America, Africa, SE Asia). They have big demand for store of value, and precious metals are not safe in a bad neighborhood or looting governments.


The 1st world will hop in, after many services will be available, we are working on that, but let's speed up the process.

Instead of 30 years, why not wait 3 years only to take off :)