Bitcoin Forum

https://www.raspberrypi.org/blog/raspberry-pi-zero/

Would sure make for cheaper Controller replacement costs?

Not only could Bitmain use these, maybe, in their miners but it just made running USB miners even cheaper. Hopefully it has enough processing power to run the OS and cgminer ~

It does change the miner controller-scape only as far as the manufacturers are willing to embrace it. Bitmain walked away from the ar9331 modules (which would have cost them about the same) to the BB which, with their volumes, costs them about the same.

The Pi ZERO, though, is quite limited in terms of connectivity, aka ethernet and / or wifi, without further spending on enabling it, thus the $5 would end up being more like $15+ in medium volumes, even $30+ in small volumes. I can not see it below $10 with the connectivity added (to say the conrol board).

That said, the Pi ZERO will only change the controller-scape if an independent developer can fashion a drop in replacement controller board that it can host but most importantly, can run bitmain boards.

Some miners like Avalon have a chance as it's close to B/B+ number's.   They use RPI as controller, so I would disagree with just independent devloper can use RPI's.

I do agree bitmain will not work due to using custom controllers.  I still hope one day they switch over to RPI's.  But it seems unlikely at this point they will ever do that.

This version of RasPI has no ethernet connectivity; just an USB data port and GPIO.

In terms of changing the controller-scape, Avalon can only be mentioned as a detail to Bitmaintech, for all the good things Avalon that may be. I can not see the appeal of a Pi ZERO over Bitmaintech's chosen BB derivative, not even price (and not to mention connectivity, or the lack of it - USB to ethernet considered).

Could you not use a USB ethernet adapter or wifi?  I missed the part if you truly can have no Ethernet that would be a big issue if so.


How many Bitmain miners have you had?   Wait till one day you have trouble with one or brick it.... sadly it can happen. With RPI you can go to local store and buy one quick and if you have backup flash it and be up in no time.  But with custom bitmain controllers you have to wait for it to be shipped to you through RMA process, unless they are nice and let you buy it without sending back.

RPI has lots of advantages.

if your good at doing custom oases on any pi, give it time you will be able to use any type Pi, you want with Avalon's,with bitmain you can but can' t, you take a very big risk of messing up that new 1.7 k  US miner, not just the controller, if you try some kind of modded controller in place of there BB, you all most can't mess up any miner with a stand alone controller that uses one, so the benefits of a stand alone out weigh a built-in one any day.

I have  brick  a few bitmain controllers the miners still worked but it was disabled/useless till i could get a replacement controller,  it made me want my own off unit controller.

 with Avalon's it's just a mater of setting up there openwrt server on another PI type. it's very possible and safe to do.

I mentioned it as possibly viable substitute to save on controller costs, because just like how the BBB is being used, it run a daughter board anyways. I'm not a hardware expert, but i don't see why it could not have a Ethernet ported added there, leaving the base cost of the mini computer to 5$ instead of 30$+

I reckon without a Ethernet port, the cost would have to be over 5$, but really, how much more expensive could it be to make a batch of thousands RasPi0+ for a manufacturer or for the Bitcoin mining community?

i agree but give time some one will be selling a plug in Ethernet port for USB Hub's for this. in fact you can buy one now plug in port, if it works on this, no idea.

You can add ethernet to the Pi ZERO by simply plugging in a mini USB to ethernet dongle which costs about $10. But the cost difference between a BB and a Pi ZERO is not even that (reportedly the BB costs bitmain $7) and both will require a daughter-board (even for Avalon).

That is the reason I said the Pi ZERO will not be of interest to Bitmaintech, however, for an independent developer, there definitely is some scope. Technically on a simplistic level, it is merely a matter of serial interfacing with the hash boards which can be achieved with the Pi ZERO as much as it is with the BB.

With regard to bricking, for the S1 and S3 that was an issue in the ealy days, but unless there is damage to components, recovery from bricking is a breeze and aside from time, costs a meagre $3 for a USB to TTL dongle. Ofcourse with the BB, you can always pop down your favourite webstore for a replacement so bricking and time to RMA is moot.

I understand that, but if the RasPi is 5$ to the end user, a big batch could be 3$ or less. Not that i would know. But maybe saving thousands of dollars on many thousands of Miner produced could be of interest to Bitmain, SP, Avalon too, maybe, who knows.

I've seen reports of the new Pi ZERO being sold by authorised resellers for EURO 12+ plus shipping ...
But yes, volume purchases normally result in lower pricing, but notwithstanding the Pi ZERO using the "older" processor, I am not sure how far below the listed price the price can go. Are they getting the processor for free? The footprint of the PCB would itself cost about $2 at a dirt cheap PCB fabricator (OK given that would not be for volumes)!

I looked into ordering one it appears what a lot are doing is bundling it with cheap items.  This allows them to sell the 5 dollar item for much greater profit.  They include cheap accessories... and double the price if not more it seems.

So could be a bit till truly can get just the pi zero for 5 bucks.  It's kinda scummy of so many to add accessories to get greater profit... but guess that is buisness.

I think this will have zero impact on the choice of SBC (Single Board Computer) that is used for any mining gear by Bitmain, or anybody else. The cost of the SBC is such a small part of it, that this just wouldn't register.

As I read it, it roughly a Raspberry B-, with a different form factor and reduced ports. The CPU and memory infrastructure look to be straight out of the Raspberry Pi "B series". Even the existing Raspberry Pi B+ costs $20 at MicroCenter to the retail customer. That's got plenty of ports and Ethernet, and would make way more sense.

Yes I think the Pi Zero is a cute and interesting device, but it's impact on the Bitcoin universe will be negligible at best.

The only thing I can think of that would work is the BTCGarden miners. They utilized the RPi GPIO pins which could easily be soldered onto the PiZero, but to connect to the internet you would need a router with USB to internet built in. Of course there may be a couple other miners that work with GPIO but can't think of them right now. Mind you, I'm only talking about limiting the PiZero to operate in a strictly controller function without adding other shields or adapters to reach a pool.

No Ethernet = no effect as nobody building Bitcoin miners is likely to bother even looking at it.

Why couldn't you use a cheap adapter like this: http://amzn.com/B00AKXE59E  for ethernet? If purchased in bulk for hardware application, surely you could get pricing <$1.

I wonder if there is a mini HDMI-to-USB adapter (if that is even possible). HDMI port is useless for mining, otherwise.
AS far as micro usb to Ethernet-it does not make much sense to me because there are only two micro USB ports there with one dedicated to Power as far as I understand (maybe it cannot do data?), which leaves just one micro USB available for data. I assume you would want to connect micro USB (m) to USB (f) adapter there, then hook up a usb hub, THEN connect a usb to ethernet adapter to that hub. I am not sure that this concoction would work, but it might, however all these adapters would reduce the appeal (since raspberry pi B+ could be had for $19.99 with all connectors already present). However, that tiny thing looks appealing just for trying it out.

From the spec sheet.  Does anyone know if you can set data transmission to run through through the GPIO headers on previous models? Obviously that would be the cheapest solution if used with a dedicated controller board on a miner.

The header can be used to add a Wi-Fi shield. That bumps the cost up to model B prices, hence why use it?

I think the reason would be for fun, or space.   Buying a RPI B/B+ would be easier and they are not expensive.

I do think there are multiple things such as usb to Ethernet you could get cheap and add on to RPI zero.  But one thing to keep in mind is it seems most places with a RPI zero turned it into a kit with cheap accessories.... so you might even be spending more then a RPI B currently.

For most users who just want a turnkey, sure. For people who want to tinker a bit, i think this is great. I'm mostly thinking that it would not be hard for them to make a batch that has a Ethernet port on it. If a company request to buy a batch of 1000+ that come with a Ethernet port then it would not really drive up the price. Then they could be resold at 5-7$ at profit still.

this will have ZERO impact , or almost ZERO with mining, only controllers will be maybe with 10$ cheaper  ;)

It will have a bigger impact on some maker/project communities.   A 5 dollar RPI to control someones project is pretty nice and hard to beat.

You are right that it will have likely no impact on miners as far as capability.  It will be more for those that enjoy tinkering testing it as a controller.

Great little device for tinkering, learning and honestly for $5.00 this is brilliant, it is cheap enough to bring into low funded schools for students to experiment with.

They're available for free with the December issue of MagPi magazine which if you're in the US
you can find at Barnes&Noble.  Unfortunately my store only had October issue in.  The magazine retails for $15.99. :o

That is possibly one of the most genius ideas of selling a magazine in today's wold.  I read most of my magazines on a e-reader.  Just cheap and love when new months auto-download to it.

That is not that bad of a price either.  Most places in stock are doing bundles with other gear... so raises their profit.  Cant wait till I truly can get a 5 dollar RPI.

Magpi not in B&N nearby, but there is a whole shelf of gun mags  :-\...Tejas...

I wonder why?  Ahh... the Lonestar State.  Still too many cowboys around them parts I reckon.  It's pretty much sold out
unless you over pay on Ebay.  I will keep checking my B&N and nearby for the issue.  To me it's worth paying a little more
for it now but not off of Ebay.  Plus I can enjoy the read on the toilet.

How many of these would you need to mine a mbtc of bitcoin?
Since they don't take up too much electricity then I am guessing they wouldn't give off much heat. So right that is a plus for them in my books.
I think this is what started the pi wallet as well. Let know if I am wrong about that.

For those in the US, I read from the rPi site that MagPi will be your end in 2 weeks (actually 3 weeks from printing as sent by ship)!

Now for the tinkerers who'd rather end up with a $30+ PiZERO contraption of a bitcoin mining rig controller, here's some inspiration .... this guy is working on a daughter board that adds wifi .... though for CNC https://openhardwarecoza.wordpress.com/2015/11/27/raspberry-pi-zero-grbl-all-in-one-cnc-controller/

For those that follow each new Pi release you know for the first 2-3 months they are sold way above value.

So waiting three weeks and buying one in a magazine for $16 is well worth it.
Thank you for the heads up of the possible wait on the December issue in the US.

For use as a mining controller it makes sense, just add a cheap wifi adapter
but for Kodi and many other uses it just is too expensive with the additional addons.

Too bad it's not a stripped down Pi2.  But fun none the less.

I guess it is okay if you are willing to tinker with it.

I would prefer to be able to use the newest model 2 as I own one as it is .  So it would be zero cost and is more powerful then this little toy one.

As for bitmaintech  s-7 controllers   are being bricked due to people not understanding the instructions. of starting the gear up.

I have had 3 or 4  people say they turn everything off.  plug in all the hash boards turn the psu's on  thus all the hashboards are running they then take a hot pcie cable and plug it in the controller since instructions state to make sure hash boards are turned on first.


This has fried quite a few controllers as the pcie plug can spark into the controller since it is live.


https://www.bitmaintech.com/productDetail.htm?pid=000201511170341298180m44675v0613


3. Separate power supply to control board: there is one additional 6pin PCI-e connector on the IO board which must be connected to the PSU to get power. If you use different PSU for hash boards and control board, please make sure to power the hash boards first and the control board only after the hash boards have been powered. When using differnt PSU and you want to power off the miner, be sure to disconnect all the PSU from power.


above is why they hot plug the controller's

CPU mining died 4 years ago, even with powerful CPUs

With a tiny slow CPU, maybe 1000 of them would match a 1GHs miner.
(yeah a 1GHs miner is pointless also)

It would take 145GHs to make 0.001 BTC a day (about 35c a day)
So about 145,000 of them might make 35c a day before you subtract electricity.

Lol
https://theofficesportsguy.files.wordpress.com/2015/07/7c687debe61f4b5aca1f1465811bbd05.jpg

I think this is dead-on.

$5 for the RPI-0 (currently sold out)
$5 for a cheap OTG micro USB (m) to USB (f) adapter with at least 2 USB ports
$5 for a cheap USB-ethernet or $10 for a USB-wifi adapter

you are looking at $15-20 total. not too bad, but it brings the cost closer to simply buying far-superior RPI 2 for ~$50

How about 5$ for the RPI-0.
0.25$ for the components to solder an Ethernet port on? (Assuming its possible)
or
2$ for a USB-wifi adapter (ebay, from china)

A USB-hub you have or will need anyways, whether you use one or the other?

I still see a 43$ difference.

I'm not sure why you need a 1->2 ports adapter if you get a Hub anyways?

While I too am curious and will probably buy one, it will strictly be for tinkering. Here in Minnesota, our local Micro Center has the Raspberry Pi B+. Same CPU and memory as the Pi-Zero, but 4 normal USB ports, and the Ethernet jack, all put together for $20 (retail price). While I am sure it would be possible to embellish a Pi-Zero to run an ASIC miner, it would make zero economic sense. I suspect that is true for most folks as well.

You can get  4 port USB hubs and Ethernet to usb much cheaper then 15 dollars.   Once it truly is being sold at 5 it will be a pretty good deal.

But a lot of sites are overpricing accessories and putting them together with a Pi Zero as bundle.   Until there are more zeros on market we can expect to see this.

Cpu and Gpu mining aren't dead, yes you won't be rich in a couple of years.
But.... if you are the type of person that leaves your computer(s) on all the time why not mine with them.
I'm doing that with Ftc just for giggles.  Far better than not doing it.  Accumulate some hold them or trade for Ltc.

Other cryptos will rise as they did when Btc rises.  When no one can mine Btc cryptos will be your best bet.
It's about as lame as the guys a couple years ago that said Btc mining with your cpu is foolish and will never
be worth anything. 

Cpu mining Btc "yes Dead".

Mining on raspberry pi zero (using Gekkoscience ASIC stick):
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1173963.msg13098911#msg13098911

lots of fun setting it up.

This is the BTC part of the forum.
If you wish to discuss alt-coins then do that in the alt-coin part of the forum.

I have to agree, cpu mining is not dead by any objective measure, btc included, though you will never ROI if doing it on a pool. But who knows, with btc you may find a block solo mining and of-course with alt coins you never know where the price is headed.

No, it is dead. 100% dead and that is the right answer here.

The question there was "How many of these (RasPI0) would you need to mine BTC, it should be worth it because they are so cheap." and that is just plain not the case. If you want something small and cheap to mine BTC, its going to be a Sidehack stick. Maybe something like a pod miner.

TLDR: RasPI0, definitively not for mining BTC. Acting as a controller, yes.

If the question was how many $5 rPi ZERO's do you need to mine btc then, surely, the answer is just one NOT cpu mining is dead. Is it worth it? Beauty lies in the eye of the beholder .... usb stick or rPi ZERO ... both have an equal chance of finding a block but the rPi ZERO has the added advantage of being re-useable.
Anyone who says cpu mining is dead is simply being narrow-minded.

And you're wrong. The question was how many RPI0 to be able to mine a mBTC. If you want to go with the lottery route, there is also better ways to go at it, that both cost less for the hardware and less electricity to run.

Its not a narrow minded thing, its just a fact; mining with CPU is a phase that is over.

You can argue that in our times, it is still possible to cross the sea with a galleon by hiring many people and only using arm power over the course of many weeks.

Sure okay its not impossible... but you could just use a ship with an engine or you know, a plane. Thats why its not done anymore.

I am not sure the question is not answered by one, but I'll elaborate just so we are clear. If you can find a block with an rPi ZERO then you'll agree the mBTC is covered by that block, or am I missing something here? Then again, I am not sure one rPi ZERO can not mine an mBTC and still be re-useable, be it for tinkering or as an expensive controller, and that in effect being the proof that cpu mining is not dead.
But you are right, you started this thread and you must be correct.

Me starting the thread does not make me god.
But it doesn't really matter here, i'm just pointing out;

You can't say "To get millions of USD, just go buy a lottery ticket." and its what you're saying here. Every time this would be applied, for nearly everyone, this would be false.

Therefore saying a RasPI0 can be used to mine BTC blocks is wrong as well.

I think the you are correct the RPI will not be used to mine even as lotto.  It needs a secondary miner hooked up to it, you can use U3's, Compac's, etc.  But a RPI alone is not enough CPU/GPU combo to really mine alone.

Although I would love for someone to prove me wrong and do a mining unit with 4 in a stack: http://www.amazon.com/Qunqi-Acrylic-4-layer-Enclosure-Raspberry/dp/B013SSA3HA .  I love that case just never have had a use to get a case for multiple working together.

Thats really cute, but unless you need to use multiple raspi to control different kind of miners, i dont really see a point. Its not like it ever become a cost-effective solution when it comes to obtaining processing powers.

They are just amazing because when you do not need much processing power, the individual cost of your computer become extremely cheap. Now from 5$, to 20-40$ for a deluxe one.

It's not cost effective. I thought kinda the same way that it's a really neat design.  I would love to have a use for a stack... but for most part my RPI's do a lot with just one I don't run multiple unless needed.   And I keep one or more in project pile. 

I have a few RPI projects I just have not gotten to yet.   I have 0 need for a RPI zero... but I still want one to play with. I just can't justify overpaying when I have other projects I could be doing already.

I think there ar those of us that any time we see a new bit of hardware, particularly if it's low cost, start thinking about what we could use it for. I have all sorts of "stuff" that I have bought over the Years, some of which has been put to good use, some of which has had a quick play and some which is still in the Jiffy bag.  :) I particularly like Arduino for simple projects with simple code. A pro mini can be got for < $2 delivered from HK and is great for all sorts of projects

I think this thread was about the Pi Zero reducing the cost of a miner, which it could do, but I would probably stick with a standard Pi with Ethernet. As to mining with it I suspect you can mine with any processor or microcontroller, Pic, Arduino or Pi etc, but other than the academic exercise, which I have a lot of time for, there is no point.

Rich