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Title: Putin: Turkey, who is aiding terrorists, has stabbed us in the back Post by: Nemo1024 on November 26, 2015, 06:08:55 PM Explosive Consequences of Turkey Downing Russian Su-24 Jet in Syria – Complete Analysis and Predictions!
https://futuristrendcast.wordpress.com/2015/11/24/consequences-of-turkey-shooting-down-russian-plane-in-syria/ Quote MAP: Russian Su-24 crash scheme by Russian defense ministry: Russian Defense Ministry demonstrates map of the Su-24M flight which ended in downing by Turkish F-16 jet. Russian MoD insists the jet didn’t violate Turkish airspace, while Ankara says the plane crossed into its territory for 17 seconds, leaked document indicates. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Cs8jdJKSGo During the moment of Turkey shooting down the Russian Su-24, it flew at the 6km altitude, one kilometer away from Turkish border on the Syrian side. The plane was shot down by AMERICAN missiles from American-made F-16 employed by TURKISH army, in retaliation for Russia successfully bombing Syrian terrorists, whom they call ‘Turkmen,’ and who are financed, trained and openly supported by Turkey. In the area in which the plane was shot down there is no peaceful population. It is the territory fully controlled by various armed thugs, fed by Turkey to create havoc on Syrian territory. It has been known that Turkey actively recruits terrorists in the former Soviet republics of Azerbaijan, Turkmenistan, Kyrgyzstan and Uzbekistan, as well as in the Russian Chechnya and Dagestan, through a wide network of mosques and extremist Islamist schools they openly organize and finance. The exception are Chechnya and Dagestan on the Russian side, where recruitment is done more subtly. As was seen on many videos, the plane crashed very quickly. Both pilots ejected. It was also visible on videos how Turkey-supported terrorists were shelling the pilots as they tried to land. The info about the pilots is conflicting. There was a speculation that they may have been taken hostage. However, the latest sad news I’ve heard is that either one or both pilots are unfortunately dead. One of them may still be alive, being a hostage in the hands of the militants. ... Below I will talk about USA and its unseemly role in the downing of the Russian Su-24 jet in Syria. You know I usually don’t talk about Obama, but this is one exception. Obama’s despicable role in this matter deserves a special mention. ... It has to be mentioned that Kurds play a very significant and convoluted role in Turkey. On one hand, they have legitimate grievances and it is their right to want independence and being re-united with other Kurds from three other Middle Eastern countries. To remind, Kurds were artificially divided between four countries, with borders drawn by the British Empire during colonial era. Same happened to Armenians, who also became divided between several countries by the British Empire. Read all about it in SYRIA GAME CHANGER. On another hand, it is known that in many situations Kurds are financed and controlled by the US. Exploiting their natural grievances, desire for equal rights and re-unification, USA systematically uses Kurds as a very clandestine and non-obvious weapon for US geopolitical gains in the Middle East. Therefore, Kurdish protests and riots in Turkey, manipulated since 2014 to get Erdogan back into the US/NATO fold, were helped from across the ocean. In view of the Russian jet’s downing and the killing of the two Russia pilots, I can predict that Erdogan will be in a more precarious situation than ever. Big changes in Russia’s attitude towards Turkey are coming. Russian Duma has been discussing since the Egypt crash certain security measures regarding Turkey. It has been proposed to stop air traffic to Turkey, in addition to Egypt. It was also proposed to revoke visa-free regime. This proposal didn’t pass the Duma, as most rejected such restrictions at the time. It’s almost inevitable that it will be passed now. Egypt tourism indistry is already dead after Russians withdrew all tourism. Russian tourists constituted 70%, in some case up to 90%, of Egypt’s tourism revenues. Turkey’s tourism industry is about to suffer the same fate. For both of these countries tourism is extremeley important. Meanwhile, Russian resorts in Sochi and Crimea are getting a boost. In this regard, note the ‘co-incidence’ of Ukraine’s terrorist act, as discussed in: Urgent! Ukraine Blows Up Power Lines, Leaving Crimea and 2.5 Million People Without Electricity. This terrorist act left the peninsula without power, sabotaging the growing Crimean tourism. Russia is also developing winter tourism in Siberia and the Far East. ... As I said, Russia tried at all cost to keep Turkey stable, overlooking some of Erdogan’s actions. Destabilization of Turkey is beneficial only to the US – this is why by default Russia had to do the opposite. Now the situation may change. But I will predict preliminarily that Putin will still act very carefully, so not to destabilize the region further. The political outlook for Turkey will change gradually; when Putin is ready to act – no one will see it coming. This is still the situation when Russia will have to chose between bad and very bad so not to destabilize the region even more. ... And now let’s see what Obama has said immediately after the shooting down by Turkey of the Russian Su-24 jet: ‘Turkey has the right to defend itself.’ Meanwhile the US command in Iraq says they can confirm that for 5 minutes Turkish army was warning the Russian jet to withdraw from the area, and only then they fired. Let me get it straight: Turkish army was warning Russian jet to withdraw from the area across the border, in SYRIA, where Turkey has no right to be present or give commands, and where Russian pilots are present at the direct request and invitation of the Syrian government. It is clear that this is an openly cynical and blatant collusion between USA and Turkey. I would not be surprised if it turns out that the ones pushing the trigger that killed Russian pilots and downed Su-24 were actually Americans, under the guise of the Turkish army. Let’s recall that USA and NATO have a lot of military bases in Turkey and this territory has always been their prised stronghold against Russia. ... I quoted only some highlights of the report. The full article is well-worth reading to understand what is going on, and where this is leading the world. Also, this hypocrisy from the Land of the Terrorism: US-back states have rights to self defence, not others- State Dept. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G48rD7-ltLw PS: Downing of Russian Su-24 looks like a planned provocation - Lavrov https://www.rt.com/news/323404-lavrov-syria-s24-turkey/ Quote The downing of a Russian warplane in Syria by Turkey appears to be a pre-planned provocation, the Russian Foreign Minister said. Ankara failed to communicate with Russia over the incident, he added. “We have serious doubts that this act was unintentional. It looks very much like a preplanned provocation,” Lavrov said, citing Turkey’s failure to maintain proper communication with Russia, the abundance of footage of the incident and other evidence. Lavrov added that many Russian partners called the incident “an obvious ambush.” Title: Re: Putin: Turkey, who is aiding terrorists, has stabbed us in the back Post by: Nemo1024 on November 26, 2015, 08:06:54 PM http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-11-24/russia-escalates-suspends-military-cooperation-turkey-moves-warship-coast-destroy-an
Quote ... Russia claims otherwise: HMEIMIM AIRBASE'S RADAR SYSTEM RECORDS VIOLATION OF SYRIAN AIRSPACE BY ATTACKING TURKISH WARPLANE - RUSSIAN DEFENSE MINISTRY And is escalating: RUSSIAN 'MOSKVA" CRUISER TO GO TO AREA IN COASTAL LATAKIA TO STRENGTHEN AIR DEFENSE IN SYRIA - RUSSIAN DEFENSE MINISTRY RUSSIAN ARMED FORCES GENERAL STAFF: NONE OF OUR PARTNERS, COUNTRIES FIGHTING ISIL HAVE EVER TOLD US THAT SO-CALLED MODERATE OPPOSITION UNITS WERE IN AREA WHERE SU-24 DOWNED NO ATTEMPTS REGISTERED ON PART OF TURKISH PLANE TO GET IN TOUCH OR ESTABLISH VISUAL CONTACT WITH OUR CREW VIA OBJECTVE CONTROL DEVICES - RUSSIAN DEFENSE MINSTRY WARSHIP TO DESTROY ANY THREATS SEEN TO RUSSIAN PLANES: IFX Specifically, as RT reports (https://www.rt.com/news/323329-russia-suspend-military-turkey/), the steps announced by Russian top brass as the following:Three steps as announced by top brass: Each and every strike groups’ operation is to be carried out under the guise of fighter jets Air defense to be boosted with the deployment of Moskva guided missile cruiser off Latakia coast with an aim to destroy any target that may pose danger Military contacts with Turkey to be suspended Just like the downing of flight MH17 over Ukraine, it has quickly become a case of "he said, she said": Rudskoy said the Russian warplane did not violate Turkish airspace. Additionally, according to the Hmeymim airfield radar, it was the Turkish fighter jet that actually entered Syrian airspace as it attacked the Russian bomber. The Turkish fighter jet made no attempts to contact Russian pilots before attacking the bomber, Rudskoy added. “We assume the strike was carried out with a close range missile with an infra-red seeker,” Rudskoy said. “The Turkish jet made no attempts to communicate or establish visual contact with our crew that our equipment would have registered. The Su-24 was hit by a missile over Syria’s territory." Sergey Rudskoy, a top official with the Russian General Staff, condemned the attack on the Russian bomber in Syrian airspace by a Turkish fighter jet as “a severe violation of international law”. He stressed that the Su-24 was downed over the Syrian territory. The crash site was four kilometers away from the Turkish border, he said ... Russian guided missile cruiser Moskva, equipped with the ‘Fort’ air defense system, similar to the S-300, will be deployed off Latakia province's coast. "We warn that every target posing a potential threat will be destroyed,” lieutenant general Sergey Rudskoy said during the briefing. “All military contacts with Turkey will be suspended,” he added. Furthermore, as the Russian Ministry of Defense explained, going forward, any Turkish plane that enters Syrian airspace will be fair game. Until now, the bomber squadrons flew with only 1 supporting fighter. And the 4 kilometres is interesting. These bombers glide poorly, once shot, the air resistance takes over, and the plane falls practically where it is shot down. And a good comment to the article, presuming the bomber did enter the Turkish airspace: Quote The measured distance of the Su-24's alleged incursion into Turkish airspace is 2.39 miles from entrance to exit. http://www.freemaptools.com/measure-distance.htm At a crusing speed of 300mph, the Su-24 would only be in Turkish territory for about 28 seconds. There is no way the Turkish F-16 could have fired, and struck, the Su-24 while it was still in Turkish territory. Either the pilot fired before the Su-24 entered Turkish airspace, or else the F-16 struck the Russian plane after it had left Turkey. Something clearly does not add up. How can turkey claim that they've been warning the pilots for a whole of 5 minutes? And a good comment to that point: Quote The "Right of hot pursuit" is a murky concept at best, and applies to the most egregious crimes in the international space, Jack. It has never been accepted for something as trivial as a clearly non-aggressive violation of airspace (17 seconds worth or otherwise). There are no specific rules of engagement for violating another country's airspace that anyone agrees on. The generally accepted and almost universal practice is to escort (force) an aircraft out of your airspace after warning it and then bitch about the violation diplomatically and in the press. Nobody is so cowardly as to ambush a transiting aircraft without warning except Israel - and now, Turkey. There is no such thing as an international law that describes precisely when one country is 'allowed' to shoot down another aircraft in it's airspace, just the nebulous suggestion that a country has the right to defend its airspace. Using an excuse of 'hot pursuit' to punish an airspace violation would be laughable if it wasn't so tragic. In extreme cases, you would only dare shoot at an aircraft ignoring you if it remains in your airspace and only while it is in your airspace and some kind of credible threat. By Turkey's own admission, they only believed the Russian aircraft to be transiting their airspace for all of 17 seconds at 19,000 ft. while performing a combat mission clearly focused on Syrian territory. In order to intercept the Russian jet at the right moment to get off an air-to-air missile in that 17-second window, they had to have planned to intercept and fire on it well beforehand. This has absolutely nothing to do with protecting Turkish airspace, but rather protecting the Turkmen al Nusra head-choppers operating in Syrian territory that the Russian jets were bombing. It was no accident - Erdogan had the attack planned from the start. Russia and everyone in NATO knows that, they just can't say so. Erdogan just royally screwed himself. 1) Putin repositioning the Moskva and threatening to protect Russian aircraft from any potential threats means Turkey will lose anything they try to bring within 20 miles of a Russian jet. NATO has pretty much left Turkey twising in the wind on this one - they said Turkey and Russia had to work it out on their own. Meaning when Russia takes out a Turkish F-16 ten miles inside Turkish airspace because it was a potential threat to a Russian aircraft, NATO won't lift a finger. They've already said as much before they sent Turkey packing this morning. 2) The al Nusra Turkmen and their Chechen jihadi pals in the mountains are probably in for a little carpet bombing and cruise missile showers. The Turkmen civilians are already panicing and fleeing Syria for Turkey, so there's even less reason for Russia to hold back. That place is going to get leveled and the Turkmen will never be allowed back. It sucks to poke the bear in your own backyard - you will be relocating as a result, not the bear. The SAA will own those mountains (or what's left of them) again in a few weeks. Title: Re: Putin: Turkey, who is aiding terrorists, has stabbed us in the back Post by: Nemo1024 on November 26, 2015, 08:55:13 PM https://i.imgur.com/bJ4VPKg.jpg
Radar data from the Russian Defence Ministry: Blue: F-15 fighter Red: Su-24 bomber Su-24 was 1 km away from the Turkish border. Right balloon marks the spot of shoot-down 4km away from the Turkish border. Left balloon represents the spot, where the bomber fell. It is also interesting to note the F-16 "just being there" ahead of time to make that backstabbing move. Let's call a spade for a spade here - it was a premeditated murder, not an act of war. Title: Re: Putin: Turkey, who is aiding terrorists, has stabbed us in the back Post by: Nemo1024 on November 26, 2015, 09:47:44 PM Good.
http://southfront.org/vks-russian-federation-has-annihilated-the-militants-in-the-area-where-the-su-24-was-brought-down-erdogan-has-ordered-that-air-force-planes-of-turkey-be-grounded/ Quote Information has come from Syrian sources that last night (24.11) the Russian Aerospace Defence Forces struck with massive attacks on the positions of militants (including Turkomans) in the region where the Russian Su-24 was brought down. The source reported that most likely nothing remains of the militants who shot down the Russian MI-8 . No detailed information has arrived yet. Meanwhile, there has appeared information that the Turks are not putting their fighters in the air after the majority of them were lit up by Russian radar (the S-300 and, according to early reports, possibly the S-400). After the statement of the Ministry of Defense of Russia, Turkey is afraid that their planes can be destroyed when approaching the border. In this regard the Syrians reported that the Russia air-space forces can begin the full-scale destruction of camps in the border territory, and also annihilate the retreating militants and the fuel trucks which are moving towards Turkey. Erdogan did not receive the hoped-for support from NATO. Erdogan has acknowledged that if the Russian plane even violated the border of Turkey, this was for only for 17 seconds, which means that the Turkish Air Force, on purely physical grounds, could not have reacted to it if the provocation was not prepared in advance. This figure of 17 seconds appears in NATO reports. Members of NATO have been ambiguously treating Erdogan’s action. At present it is difficult to judge how the situation will develop. While it is obvious that Erdogan is attempting to back off, it is already too late, as Vladimir Putin gave to understand at a meeting with the king of Jordan. Most likely Turkey did not expect such a severe reaction from Russia. More: http://southfront.org/western-media-proves-russian-su-24-was-pounding-al-qaeda-allies-when-shot-down/ http://southfront.org/russia-confirms-s-400-air-defense-system-put-on-combat-duty-in-syria/ http://sputniknews.com/military/20151126/1030814269/s-400-combat-duty.html#ixzz3scGistE5 http://southfront.org/syrian-oposition-shocked-the-world-by/ Quote ... The group of Syrian rebels fired on two Russian pilots as they parachuted in Syrian territory. One pilot was saved by the Syrian army, while the other, as proved by Moscow, was injured during the landing, after which he was killed by Jihadists. The pilots flew in a Russian Su-24 bomber near the Syrian-Turkish border, when they were shot down by a Turkish fighter, because they allegedly violated Turkish airspace. In the video that the rebels recorded themselves, you can see a couple of fighters opening fire on the Russian pilots who were at that moment parachuting down to earth. Article 42 of the Additional Protocol to the Geneva Convention, adopted in 1977, prohibited the attack on the people that descend by parachute after jumping from a disabled aircraft. The same Article provides that the person who came down to earth, the territory controlled by the enemy, must be given an opportunity to surrender before becoming the target of attack, unless they take hostile action. ... Title: Re: Putin: Turkey, who is aiding terrorists, has stabbed us in the back Post by: Nemo1024 on November 26, 2015, 10:33:56 PM Great analysis by Pepe Escobar:
http://sputniknews.com/columnists/20151125/1030730838/turkey-erdogan-war-russia.html Quote ... President Putin nailed it; it was "a shot in the back". Because all evidence is pointing towards an ambush: the F-16s might have been actually waiting for the Su-24s. With Turkish TV cameras available for maximum global impact. The Su-24s were actually after Chechens and Uzbeks — plus a few Uyghurs — smuggled in with fake Turkish passports (Chinese intel is also on it), all of these operating in tandem with a nasty bunch of Turkish Islamo-fascists. Most of these goons transit back and forth between the CIA-weaponized Free Syrian Army (FSA) and Jabhat al-Nusra. These were the goons who machine-gunned the Russian pilots as they parachuted down after the hit on the Su-24. Facing Consequences: Russia to Respond in Kind to Downing of Su-24 Bomber The Su-24s posed absolutely no threat to Turkey. Turkish UN Ambassador Halit Cevik's letter to the Security Council is a joke; two Russian jets "warned 10 times in five minutes" to change direction, both flying "more than a mile" into Turkey for an interminable 17 seconds. The whole thing has already been amply debunked. Not to mention that Turkish — and NATO — planes "violate" the Syrian border all the time. Erdogan well knows how US neocons were livid with French President Francois Hollande after his "it's war" cry was followed by a drive to work together with Russia against ISIS/ISIL/Daesh. So the real target was not a Su-24, but the evolving possibility, after the Paris attacks, of a real coalition — the US, Britain and France on one side, the "4+1" (Russia, Syria, Iran, Iraq plus Hezbollah) on the other side — finally converging their interests into a unified fight against ISIS/ISIL/Daesh. ... And also: http://sputniknews.com/military/20151125/1030699146/questioning-turkey-airspace-story.html Quote "Disregarding these warnings, both planes, at an altitude of 19,000 feet, violated Turkish national airspace to a depth of 1.36 miles and 1.15 miles in length for 17 seconds from 9.24.05 local time." But many social media users have begun crunching those numbers and found that they don’t quite add up. — WikiLeaks (@wikileaks) November 24, 2015 When calculating the distance flown and the amount of time allegedly spent in Turkish airspace, some have attempted to determine the aircraft’s flight speed. According to those numbers, the Su-24 would have had to be flying at stall speed. Earlier on Tuesday, the Russian Ministry of Defense also released video proving that the incident did not happen the way the Turkish government claims. Flight path data of the Su-24 shows that it never entered Turkish airspace, and was attacked while flying over Syria. EXCLUSIVE: Footage of Syrian Army Rescuing Second Russian Pilot and Helicopter Crew https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=umsp9wIjolY The above filmed by Anna-News reporters, who were with the Syrian Army on that day. (English subtitles) A comment: Quote zeroboris You can shoot down any jet from an ambush even F-22 whatever. When our bombers were covered by SU-30 fighters turks were whining about getting locked and dared not attack. But then we made a mistake: agreement with the US about flight safety and stopped covering our bombers. This mistake has costed us 1 SU-24 bomber, 1 MI-8 evacuation helicopter and 2 lives (a pilot and a mariner). Bugger, they didn't trust Americans, did they?! Naïve fools! About a month ago I read that all bomber groups flew covered by Su-30 (can dig up the article if anyone's interested), so I wondered how this Su-24 bomber would have been shot down by F-16.... Now I have the answer. Title: Re: Putin: Turkey, who is aiding terrorists, has stabbed us in the back Post by: Nemo1024 on November 27, 2015, 12:15:36 AM Another exercise in math, which does not add up:
Let's talk, Turkey: Downing of Russian SU-24 bomber just doesn't add up https://www.rt.com/op-edge/323543-turkey-downing-russian-jet/ Quote The SU-24 supersonic bomber (NATO reporting name: Fencer), the kind that was shot down by a Turkish F16, is capable of traveling at about MACH 1.3. That’s almost one and a half times the speed of sound. That’s 1,654 KMH, and a bit less at sea level. It’s unlikely to have been at maximum speed when it was shot down, so let’s assume it was at normal cruise speed, normally 75 percent of full power, which gives you about 1,200 kmh, give or take. So let’s be generous and say that it was traveling at about 1000 kmh, or just over 600 mph. The Turkish authorities contend that in the five minutes before the attack, ten warnings were issued. According to all the maps, at its widest point, that little peninsular of Turkish land pushing into Syrian territory is about 5.39 km or 3.5 miles. Though if the incursion took place at all it is likely to have been further towards the tip. At normal cruise speed (generously rounded down to 1000km) the alleged incursion would have lasted 19.4 seconds, barely enough time for a fast moving jet to take aim and lock on. Now let’s look at the 5 minutes of warnings that the Turks allege they gave the downed aircraft. Again, if we assume the same speed, the plane travelled 83 kilometers after the first warning and before the Turkish warplane fired. Given the size of the little outcrop of Turkey into Syria and the apparent track of the aircraft, as confirmed by Turkish radar information, at the time the warning there could have been no indication that the SU24 would go near Turkish airspace. At that time it was travelling almost due east, again according to Turkish radar data. The testimony of the surviving crew member must also be taken into account. He is adamant that no warnings were received. It is possible of course that something was said on an obscure aviation frequency, but not the emergency frequency that all combat aircraft monitor as a matter of routine. We are therefore asked to believe that an aircraft, in a known conflict zone, which was not at that time approaching Turkey’s border, was given a warning not to. Why would you tell an aircraft that isn’t heading towards your border not to cross it? By the time the Russian aircraft had turned onto a course that was certainly going to cross into Turkish airspace, there would have been less than a minute of time available to tell it not to. That minute (approximately) is critical! As a NATO member, patrolling aircraft are not generally authorized to open fire at will. Instead, they report to base and await instructions. After having confirmed sighting, the SU24, the Turkish pilot would then have had to report to his controller on the ground. Someone at a Turkish Military base then had to make a decision and issue the order to engage and destroy. The pilot then has to lock the target into his weapons system and push the button to launch his air to air missiles. Thus, all of that had to have happened before the Russian actually penetrated Turkish air space. ... The alarming point is that even if there was an air space incursion - and let’s accept the possibility that there was - it was very brief and could not have been confirmed as probable any more than a minute or so at most before it happened. The decision to shoot it down therefore was taken an appreciable amount of time before the incursion. That being the case and given the distances and speeds involved, it would have happened anyway. This brings the sequence of events into question. Normally and properly, a defending air force will first identify a potential threat at which point weapons may be armed. The threat must then be confirmed and seen to be a sustained threat to the defending country. That information is radioed back to tactical command who issue orders either to engage or to continue monitoring the situation. Given the speed and distances involved, the Turkish claims of repeated warnings just don’t stack up. ‘Turkish jets gave us no warning before shooting’ – rescued pilot of downed Russian Su-24 https://www.rt.com/news/323431-saved-pilot-turkish-su24/ Title: Re: Putin: Turkey, who is aiding terrorists, has stabbed us in the back Post by: galdur on November 27, 2015, 12:43:31 PM Italy police seize nearly 800 Erdoguns heading from Turkey for Belgium
http://www.lastampa.it/2015/11/26/italia/cronache/carico-armi-da-guerra-sequestrato-a-trieste-IdEfgpOYiwhPKZquX8eNTO/pagina.html http://www.lastampa.it/rf/image_lowres/Pub/p3/2015/11/26/Italia/Foto/RitagliWeb/8013__DSC0040-kj5C-U10602363450753CMI-700x394@LaStampa.it.jpg Title: Re: Putin: Turkey, who is aiding terrorists, has stabbed us in the back Post by: Balthazar on November 27, 2015, 01:57:11 PM https://news.mail.ru/politics/24106606/
Visa-free agreement between Russian Federation and Republic of Turkey will be suspended since January 1, 2016. Title: Re: Putin: Turkey, who is aiding terrorists, has stabbed us in the back Post by: galdur on November 27, 2015, 02:30:35 PM Here´s a little recap
Tue Nov 24, 2015 8:51pm EST Related: WORLD Russian jet hit inside Syria after incursion into Turkey: U.S. official The United States believes that the Russian jet shot down by Turkey on Tuesday was hit inside Syrian airspace after a brief incursion into Turkish airspace, a U.S. official told Reuters, speaking on condition of anonymity. The official said that assessment was based on detection of the heat signature of the jet. Read more at Reuters http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/11/25/us-mideast-crisis-syria-turkey-impact-idUSKBN0TE04M20151125#MlTwdCSzj3mFf3tA.99 Title: Re: Putin: Turkey, who is aiding terrorists, has stabbed us in the back Post by: galdur on November 27, 2015, 02:42:07 PM The Americans also said in another news story that the jet had spent what was it seventeen seconds inside turkish airspace, hahahaha. I guess they had to come up with some number since they had to for some reason leak that it was in actual fact shot down over Syria. So, they´re hanging the turkey out to dry. You could call it
a limited hangout ;D Title: Re: Putin: Turkey, who is aiding terrorists, has stabbed us in the back Post by: BADecker on November 27, 2015, 02:59:50 PM The Americans also said in another news story that the jet had spent what was it seventeen seconds inside turkish airspace, hahahaha. I guess they had to come up with some number since they had to for some reason leak that it was in actual fact shot down over Syria. So, they´re hanging the turkey out to dry. You could call it a limited hangout ;D Seventeen is a good number. It is the seventh prime number if you don't include "2" as a prime. The Russian plane shouldn't have been that close to the air-space border. Who can tell for sure if it was over the border? :) Title: Re: Putin: Turkey, who is aiding terrorists, has stabbed us in the back Post by: galdur on November 27, 2015, 03:04:46 PM The Americans also said in another news story that the jet had spent what was it seventeen seconds inside turkish airspace, hahahaha. I guess they had to come up with some number since they had to for some reason leak that it was in actual fact shot down over Syria. So, they´re hanging the turkey out to dry. You could call it a limited hangout ;D Seventeen is a good number. It is the seventh prime number if you don't include "2" as a prime. The Russian plane shouldn't have been that close to the air-space border. Who can tell for sure if it was over the border? :) Shouldn´t have been that close to the border? How about the trucks, men and materiel traveling across that border? Do you think that they should have any business being there? What do you think that plane was doing there, maybe sightseeing? Title: Re: Putin: Turkey, who is aiding terrorists, has stabbed us in the back Post by: BADecker on November 27, 2015, 03:06:35 PM The Americans also said in another news story that the jet had spent what was it seventeen seconds inside turkish airspace, hahahaha. I guess they had to come up with some number since they had to for some reason leak that it was in actual fact shot down over Syria. So, they´re hanging the turkey out to dry. You could call it a limited hangout ;D Seventeen is a good number. It is the seventh prime number if you don't include "2" as a prime. The Russian plane shouldn't have been that close to the air-space border. Who can tell for sure if it was over the border? :) Shouldn´t have been that close to the border? How about the trucks, men and materiel traveling across that border? Do you think that they should have any business being there? What do you think that plane was doing there, maybe sightseeing? Shot down justified. :) Title: Re: Putin: Turkey, who is aiding terrorists, has stabbed us in the back Post by: galdur on November 27, 2015, 03:08:52 PM The Americans also said in another news story that the jet had spent what was it seventeen seconds inside turkish airspace, hahahaha. I guess they had to come up with some number since they had to for some reason leak that it was in actual fact shot down over Syria. So, they´re hanging the turkey out to dry. You could call it a limited hangout ;D Seventeen is a good number. It is the seventh prime number if you don't include "2" as a prime. The Russian plane shouldn't have been that close to the air-space border. Who can tell for sure if it was over the border? :) Shouldn´t have been that close to the border? How about the trucks, men and materiel traveling across that border? Do you think that they should have any business being there? What do you think that plane was doing there, maybe sightseeing? Shot down justified. :) I wonder why some people seem to be completely unaware of the connection between cause and effect. Title: Re: Putin: Turkey, who is aiding terrorists, has stabbed us in the back Post by: BADecker on November 27, 2015, 03:15:32 PM The Americans also said in another news story that the jet had spent what was it seventeen seconds inside turkish airspace, hahahaha. I guess they had to come up with some number since they had to for some reason leak that it was in actual fact shot down over Syria. So, they´re hanging the turkey out to dry. You could call it a limited hangout ;D Seventeen is a good number. It is the seventh prime number if you don't include "2" as a prime. The Russian plane shouldn't have been that close to the air-space border. Who can tell for sure if it was over the border? :) Shouldn´t have been that close to the border? How about the trucks, men and materiel traveling across that border? Do you think that they should have any business being there? What do you think that plane was doing there, maybe sightseeing? Shot down justified. :) I wonder why some people seem to be completely unaware of the connection between cause and effect. Good thought. If they were aware, they would realize that God exists, scientifically. :) Title: Re: Putin: Turkey, who is aiding terrorists, has stabbed us in the back Post by: galdur on November 27, 2015, 03:31:04 PM The Americans also said in another news story that the jet had spent what was it seventeen seconds inside turkish airspace, hahahaha. I guess they had to come up with some number since they had to for some reason leak that it was in actual fact shot down over Syria. So, they´re hanging the turkey out to dry. You could call it a limited hangout ;D Seventeen is a good number. It is the seventh prime number if you don't include "2" as a prime. The Russian plane shouldn't have been that close to the air-space border. Who can tell for sure if it was over the border? :) Shouldn´t have been that close to the border? How about the trucks, men and materiel traveling across that border? Do you think that they should have any business being there? What do you think that plane was doing there, maybe sightseeing? Shot down justified. :) I wonder why some people seem to be completely unaware of the connection between cause and effect. Good thought. If they were, they would realize that God exists, scientifically. :) OK, for you I´ll come up with a theory that includes God. You see; God told Obama to tell Erdogan to shoot down that jet so that Obama could leak that the Turks were really the bad guys and this would be a signal to the Russians that the Americans were interested in them screwing the Turks by helping the Kurds carve out their state in the region and preferably recognize its independence. And after that was in the bag God´s own country would of course have the Russians kicked out of Kurdistan and have the perfect spot for themselves to dominate several countries in the most important region in the world. If this all works out as planned Turkey will be renamed Turkistan and the turkey will replace the bald eagle as American national bird, God told me. Title: Re: Putin: Turkey, who is aiding terrorists, has stabbed us in the back Post by: Nemo1024 on November 28, 2015, 12:53:13 AM Especially for BADecker, who fails at information aggregation and at reading the articles, which were posted above.
Here are some easy math calculations to show why this attack was pre-planned: Let's talk, Turkey: Downing of Russian SU-24 bomber just doesn't add up https://www.rt.com/op-edge/323543-turkey-downing-russian-jet/ Then if BADecker still thinks that Turkey's shooting down of an unarmed plane, returning from a mission, of which Turkey (through NATO) was informed, and crossing its airspace for 17 seconds (according to Turks) is justified, then Greece should start getting busy shooting down Turkish warplanes: https://www.rt.com/news/323429-greece-turkey-airspace-violations/ Quote Turkish claims that the downed Russian Su-24 jet “violated” its airspace have sparked outrage among Greeks, who took to social media to say it is a clear-cut case of double standards as Turkish jets breached Greek airspace 2,244 times in 2014 alone. http://dailycaller.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/11/CKh0VcX-1.jpg By the way, for the plane to spend 17 seconds in that place, it would have to fly really slowly, at almost stall speed... Title: Re: Putin: Turkey, who is aiding terrorists, has stabbed us in the back Post by: galdur on November 28, 2015, 01:27:35 AM This Erdogan guy is clearly nuts, he told CNN International his country will consider it an act of aggression if Russia takes down a Turkish plane violating Syrian airspace. Of course he has the backing of other NATO mental cases otherwise he wouldn´t be making such a ridiculous statement.
Title: Re: Putin: Turkey, who is aiding terrorists, has stabbed us in the back Post by: manis on November 28, 2015, 06:40:40 AM This Erdogan guy is clearly nuts, he told CNN International his country will consider it an act of aggression if Russia takes down a Turkish plane violating Syrian airspace. Of course he has the backing of other NATO mental cases otherwise he wouldn´t be making such a ridiculous statement. Putin wouldn't be bothered by such statements. He can afford a showdown with Turkey. Title: Re: Putin: Turkey, who is aiding terrorists, has stabbed us in the back Post by: Nemo1024 on November 28, 2015, 12:02:02 PM Looks like Turkey has been studying the art of hypocrisy with Master Sam:
Unreal: Erdogan Warns Russia Against Downing Turkish Jets in Syrian Airspace http://russia-insider.com/en/unreal-turkey-warns-russia-against-shooting-down-turkish-jets-violating-syrian-airspace/ri11501 Quote ... According to Erdogan, This kind of an incident which may happen of course will further push us to take measures. … Of course it will be an aggression against our rights of sovereignty and it is a natural right of [Turkey] to protect those rights Yes, Turkish warplanes zooming around Syria is a matter of “Turkish sovereignty.” You heard it here first. Why does Russia hate international law? ... Title: Re: Putin: Turkey, who is aiding terrorists, has stabbed us in the back Post by: bryant.coleman on November 28, 2015, 05:10:36 PM https://news.mail.ru/politics/24106606/ Visa-free agreement between Russian Federation and Republic of Turkey will be suspended since January 1, 2016. This is something which should have been done long back. Russian tourists are frequently maltreated in Turkey, despite accounting for the second largest group of tourists. The Turks never bother the British and German tourists, but they show their true colors when the Russian tourists visit Turkey. Time has come for the Russians to boycott Turkey. Title: Re: Putin: Turkey, who is aiding terrorists, has stabbed us in the back Post by: Nemo1024 on November 28, 2015, 06:36:24 PM Breaking: Russian Pilot Rescued by Iran’s General Soleimani
http://www.veteranstoday.com/2015/11/26/breaking-russian-pilot-rescued-by-irans-general-soleimani/ Quote TEHRAN (FNA) – Russian sources revealed on Thursday that the pilot of the Russian Su-24 jet that was shot down by Turkey over the Syrian airspace on Tuesday was rescued in an operation by Iran’s globally renowned IRGC Qods Force Commander Major General Soleimani. On Tuesday, a Russian Su-24 bomber jet crashed in Syria. Russian President Vladimir Putin said that the plane was downed by an air-to-air missile launched by a Turkish F-16 jet over Syrian territory, falling 4 kilometers (2.5 miles) from the Turkish border. The crew of the plane ejected and one pilot was killed by fire from the ground, according to the Russian General Staff. The co-pilot Captain Konstantin Murahtin survived. But the story of how he survived in a land surrounded by various types of terrorist groups for tens of kilometers was unknown until today. Emad Abshenas, a reporter for Russia’s state-run Sputnik news agency, wrote a piece in the Persian-language website of the Russian agency quoting the entire story from a senior Syrian officer. “I contacted one of the Syrian officers who is my old friend and is stationed in Lattakia and asked him to tell me the story, and here is what he said,” Abshenas mentioned. After the downing of the Russian fighter jet, the Russian helicopters took off immediately to save the pilot but they faced the heavy fire power of FSA (or the so-called moderate opposition, the Free Syrian Army, supported by the West) and the Turkey-back Turkmens who targeted the helicopter with missiles and advanced weapons that they have gained recently. During the operations one Russian aid worker was killed. Credible information was obtained that a number of special Turkish units had been sent to the scene to take the Russian pilot captive to blackmail Russia later. While the Russians were planning for another operations to free the pilot immediately, General Soleimani contacted them and proposed them that a special task force unit be formed of Hezbollah’s special forces and Syrian commandos who have been trained by Iran and are fully familiar with the geographical situation of the region to be tasked with the ground operations and Russia provide them with air cover and satellite intelligence. Soleimani promised them to return the Russian pilot safe and sound; a promise that was kept in the end, according to the Syrian officer. After tracing the place of the Russian pilot using his GPS, it was revealed that the pilot was being kept in a place 6km behind the frontline of the clashes between the Syrian army and the opposition. Six fighters of Hezbollah’s special operation unit and 18 Syrian commandos approached the frontline to carry out the operations and the Russian air force and helicopters concurrently created hellfire in the region and destroyed the terrorists’ headquarters in a way that most of the enemy forces deployed in the region fled the scene and the ground was paved for the special unit’s advance. The Syrian officer added that every move of the special units was monitored and covered precisely by the Russian satellites in a way that the slightest moves made 100 meters away from the area of operation was reported to them and every moment of the operation was reported to a very high-raking official in the Kremlin (that he thinks was president Putin) and it was clear that he was monitoring the entire operations through satellites from Moscow. ... Abshenas then comes out of the report with a number of interesting points, saying: 1. General Soleimani is fully healthy and is actively commanding operations in the frontline of the war against terrorists and responds rumors about himself with action and not by words and slogans. 2. There is no extremist and moderate oppositions in Syria; all of them are terrorists appearing in the public in different clothes and under different masks. 3. The Group 4+1 cannot trust other countries in any field and they should rely on themselves to eliminate the terrorists in the region based on their own specified plans. 4. Iran and Russia’s operational coordination in Syria is highly integrated and can break all enemies’ fronts. 5. Most of the FSA’s Syrian members had withdrawn from the region after they came under Russia’s airstrikes and the commandos fought non-Syrian forces who were using classic military tactics and not guerilla warfare and therefore, they could well be Turkish militaries or army forces of other countries. The commandos, of course, had no other choice but to kill them given the importance of rapid action in the operations and they didn’t had enough time to hold them captive. 6. The terrorists present in the region possessed very modern and advanced military equipment for ground-to-ground and ground-to-air warfare which are not even supplied to a large number of countries which are Washington’s NATO allies. 7. According to informed sources who had traced the wireless contacts between the opposition forces, the Arabic, Turkish, Russian and French are respectively the most frequently used languages by the terrorists, revealing that the countries which are mostly posed to the danger of the return of these terrorists and shows that Russia is forced to continue fight until the complete annihilation of the terrorists in Syria to safeguard its own national security. See also: EXCLUSIVE: Footage of Syrian Army Rescuing Second Russian Pilot and Helicopter Crew https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=umsp9wIjolY Title: Re: Putin: Turkey, who is aiding terrorists, has stabbed us in the back Post by: Spendulus on November 28, 2015, 06:39:27 PM https://news.mail.ru/politics/24106606/ Visa-free agreement between Russian Federation and Republic of Turkey will be suspended since January 1, 2016. This is something which should have been done long back. Russian tourists are frequently maltreated in Turkey, despite accounting for the second largest group of tourists. The Turks never bother the British and German tourists, but they show their true colors when the Russian tourists visit Turkey. Time has come for the Russians to boycott Turkey. Why, would you know? I have always thought Russian tourists were very polite and friendly. Title: Re: Putin: Turkey, who is aiding terrorists, has stabbed us in the back Post by: Nemo1024 on December 18, 2015, 10:46:22 PM Duplicating the post here as well:
The flight-recorder from the downed Russian bomber has been opened today in the presence of international journalists and experts. This is the first such public unsealing in the world practice. Foreign experts note unprecedented openness of Su-24M flight recorder unsealing process http://tass.ru/en/world/845400 Black box of downed Russian Su-24M jet damaged http://tass.ru/en/defense/845208 British and Chinese experts will participate in decoding. The results are expected by the 21st of December. Quote "In order to ensure maximal transparency and openness, we addressed foreign experts from 14 countries with an invitation to take part in the work [investigation] as observers. However, many specialists refused to participate in the investigation citing various reasons, excluding only Mr Liu Chang Wei from China and Mr Jonathan Gillespie from the United Kingdom," Dronov said. Title: Re: Putin: Turkey, who is aiding terrorists, has stabbed us in the back Post by: Balthazar on December 21, 2015, 06:00:33 PM https://www.rt.com/news/326661-lavrov-meeting-kurdish-leader/
Russian FM plans to meet co-leader of Turkey’s pro-Kurdish HDP party Title: Re: Putin: Turkey, who is aiding terrorists, has stabbed us in the back Post by: bryant.coleman on December 21, 2015, 06:16:08 PM https://www.rt.com/news/326661-lavrov-meeting-kurdish-leader/ Russian FM plans to meet co-leader of Turkey’s pro-Kurdish HDP party The HDP represents the moderate side of the Turkish Kurds. Most of the right-wing Kurds are supporters of the Kurdistan Workers' Party (PKK), which is banned in Turkey and most of the Western nations. I would like to see the Russians maintaining contacts with both the sides. The ultimate goal is to establish an independent Kurdistan, composing of Kurdish inhabited regions of Iraq, Turkey, and Syria. Title: Re: Putin: Turkey, who is aiding terrorists, has stabbed us in the back Post by: zenitzz on December 22, 2015, 08:23:38 AM Erdoğan vows Kurdish rebels 'will be buried in trenches they have dug'
Turkish president says operations against militants will continue as state-run news agency reports 115 Kurdish rebels killed Turkish military operations in the south-east have killed 115 Kurdish rebels since 15 December, a state-run news agency has reported. Most of the casualties were centred in the Şırnak Province towns of Cizre and Silopi, both under 24-hour curfew, with 98 rebels killed, the Anadolu Agency reported. Other casualties occurred in the provinces of Mardin and Diyarbakır. Turkey’s government says militants linked to the outlawed Kurdistan Workers’ party (PKK) have placed explosive devices, dug trenches and set up barricades in these areas. Turkey has vowed to press ahead with the operations until the region is clear of rebels. On Monday, Turkish president Recep Tayyip Erdoğan said the operations would continue and vowed that the “terrorist organisation” along with its supporters “will be buried in the trenches they have dug”. In Cizre, the flashpoint of operations, columns of smoke rose from residential areas as a military helicopters and armoured vehicle scoured the area. The sound of heavy gunfire and sporadic shelling echoed in the streets, according to residents. In the eastern province of Bitlis, two soldiers were killed and another six were wounded in a roadside bombing, according to Anadolu. The agency said more than 200 soldiers have been killed since the collapse of a two-year ceasefire in July. Fighting between Turkish security forces and the PKK, including its youth wing, has increasingly focused in urban centres, displacing thousands of residents from the south east. The escalating violence has dashed hopes for the resumption of peace talks between the state and the PKK, which have fought a three-decade conflict that has killed more than 30,000. The latest violence reminds many here of the worst bloodshed of the 1990s. http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/dec/21/erdogan-vows-kurdish-rebels-will-be-buried Title: Re: Putin: Turkey, who is aiding terrorists, has stabbed us in the back Post by: bryant.coleman on December 22, 2015, 03:26:46 PM ^^^ The article claims that 115 Kurdish "rebels" were killed. Most of those who died were women and children. How did these children became "rebels"? The Turks have been conducting a genocidal campaign against the ethnic Kurds for many months now. Hundreds, if not thousands of Kurdish civilians have been butchered by the Turks. And till date, no one has protested against it.
Title: Re: Putin: Turkey, who is aiding terrorists, has stabbed us in the back Post by: vero on December 22, 2015, 03:31:15 PM they are civilians massacred by the Islamic state of Turkey any body that a Kurd is a terrorist according to the terrorist state of Turkey.
Title: Re: Putin: Turkey, who is aiding terrorists, has stabbed us in the back Post by: galdur on December 22, 2015, 06:19:12 PM It´s a tried and trusted model.
Those who aren´t with us are with the terrorists. In fact they are the terrorists. So, play ball or else. We invade and those who oppose us are the terrorists. We mow down unarmed civilians, tough luck they´re terrorists, it´s not our fault that we were forced to invade. Title: Re: Putin: Turkey, who is aiding terrorists, has stabbed us in the back Post by: bryant.coleman on December 23, 2015, 02:22:09 AM they are civilians massacred by the Islamic state of Turkey any body that a Kurd is a terrorist according to the terrorist state of Turkey. The ultimate irony is that the NATO is sitting back and doing nothing, when the Turks are mowing down the innocent Kurdish civilians. The NATO is using the Kurds in order to fight the Islamic State. But at the same time, they are harming the Kurds, by providing funds, arms and ammunition to the Turkish Armed Forces. Title: Re: Putin: Turkey, who is aiding terrorists, has stabbed us in the back Post by: galdur on December 23, 2015, 06:21:00 AM Syria’s Kurds Have Nearly Tripled Their Territory Fighting the Islamic State in 2015
By Avi Asher-Schapiro December 22, 2015 | 8:59 pm Amid the chaos in Syria, the country's Kurds have managed to resist the advances of the Islamic State and carve out a zone of unprecedented autonomy in their own lands. Over the past year, the YPG Kurdish militia beat back the Islamic State (IS) and nearly tripled the size of Kurdish-controlled territory in Northern Syria, all the while helping shrink the size of the IS caliphate by around 14 percent. That's according to a new report by the IHS Jane's, a private intelligence company that analyzes international security issues, and has been tracking the ground war in Syria. As a result, the Kurds are essentially in control of their own mini-state — which they call Rojava — that runs across the Turkish-Syrian border. Administered by the Democratic Union Party (PYD) the political arm of the YPG, the government in Rojava has reached an understanding with the Assad regime that allows the Kurds to govern their own territory, while beating back IS from the borders. "The Kurds have had autonomy thrust upon them," explained Michael Gunter, a professor of political science at Tennessee Tech University, and the author of Out of Nowhere: The Kurds of Syria in Peace and War, a recent study of Kurdish politics in Syria. "There's no way they will go back to a subservient position of not controlling their own lands anytime in the future." Syria's Kurds had long been denied self-determination by president Bashar al-Assad and his father Hafez, who both discouraged celebration of Kurdish identity — Hafez even banned their language from schools. But the Syrian Civil War forced Assad to focus his energies elsewhere. And as the Syrian military was re-deployed away from Kurdish territory beginning in 2012, the Kurds seized the initiative, mobilizing militias and asserting control over their own territory with the tacit approval of the Assad regime, which is much more focused on shoring up its major cities than butting heads with the Kurds. Assad and the Kurds now jointly administer the city of Qamishli, and share control of the oil rich region of Hasakah. That uneasy alliance has been made possible by a mutual enemy: The Islamic State. Since the Islamic State captured Raqqa — the city it consider its capital — back in 2013, the Kurds have shared a long border with the group that stretches across most of northern Syria. Over the past year, the Kurds have fought — and won — two key battles against IS, shoring up their own territory, and cutting off much of IS access to the Turkish border. https://news-images.vice.com/images/2015/12/22/syrias-kurds-have-nearly-trippled-their-territory-fighting-the-islamic-state-body-image-1450813953.jpg?output-quality=75 Related: Protests Erupt in Turkey as Military Campaign Intensifies in Country's Southeast Beginning in the fall of 2014, the Islamic State laid siege to Kobani, a Kurdish city on the western edge of Rojava. Kurdish fighters, backed by US airpower, lifted the siege and pushed IS back, effectively liberating the area by the end of January, 2015. In the following months, as IS focused its energies on major cities in Iraq and Syria, the Kurds were able to capture the villages and countryside outside the city, dealing a major territorial blow to IS. The IHS Jane's report explains that IS lost so much ground to the Kurds because it did not have the military resources to fight on all its fronts. "Geospatial analysis of our data shows that Islamic State activity outside areas it controls is heavily concentrated around Baghdad and Damascus, but much less so in Kurdish territory," explained Columb Strack, senior Middle East analyst at IHS, and lead analyst for the IHS Conflict Monitor. "This indicates that the Islamic State was overstretched." WIth IS fighting a multi-front battle against a dizzying array of adversaries —al Qaeda, the Free Syrian Army, the Assad regime and its allies — the Kurds continued to seize the initiative. In the Spring of 2015, the YPG launched an offensive to take out the IS-controlled border crossing of Tal Abyad, a strategic key city that lies between Kobani in the West and the bulk of Kurdish territory in the East. Fighting between IS and the Kurds — who were backed by US air support — displaced more than 16,000 people. This past October, Tal Abyad was officially cleared of IS fighters, and integrated into Rojava. The Kurdish victory was made possible, Strack said, because IS had redeployed its forces to far-flung battles in western Syria and Iraq. "The remaining forces in Tal Abyad were so depleted that they had to be re-enforced with... religious police units from Raqqa," Strack explained. Related: Caught Between the Islamic State and Erdogan: Turkey's Most Important Opposition Politician Talks to VICE News For the Kurds in Syria, the fight against IS has been existential. "It's a struggle for their very lives," Gunter said. But it's also been an opportunity to forge an entirely new political culture in the burgeoning lands under their control. Rajava is governed by a co-presidents Asya Abdullah and Salih Muslim Muhammad, who espouse a secular, leftist, and unabashedly feminist worldview drawn from the writings of the Kurdish nationalist thinker Abdullah Ocalan, who sits in a Turkish jail. "They see themselves as a post-state, utopian project," Gunter explains. But so far, building a new society sandwiched between IS, Assad, and Turkey is far from utopian. IS continues to launch deadly suicide raids into Kurdish territory, and Turkey has more than once bombed YPG positions across the Syrian border as punishment for Rojava's links to the Turkish Kurdish militant group the PKK. With no end in sight in the Syrian Civil War, the Kurds are hunkering down. "They live amidst a series of broken states," Gunter said. "There's no way to know what the future will be." Watch VICE News' documentary PKK Youth: Fighting for Kurdish Neighborhoods: https://news.vice.com/article/syrias-kurds-have-nearly-tripled-their-territory-fighting-the-islamic-state-in-2015 Title: Re: Putin: Turkey, who is aiding terrorists, has stabbed us in the back Post by: Balthazar on December 23, 2015, 08:49:19 AM by the Islamic state of Turkey https://syrianfreepress.files.wordpress.com/2014/04/erdogan-jabhat-al-nusrat.jpghttps://pbs.twimg.com/media/CIVuzEaUwAAsZw7.jpg https://i2.wp.com/syriatimes.sy/images/2015/May/13-05/erdogan%20murderer2.jpg Title: Re: Putin: Turkey, who is aiding terrorists, has stabbed us in the back Post by: galdur on December 23, 2015, 07:57:31 PM There´s really no denying it, but of course 14 straight years of confirmations aren´t enough for some people.
After years and years of miscalculations and lah lah land policies, Washington appears totally powerless to influence its allies and friends in the Middle East. It goes without saying actually, you´re allied with the roots of the "enemy" you´re supposed to be fighting. That has to be a drag, Where is U.S. policy anyway? Kerry was in Moscow and said well yeah I guess Assad can stay while we get rid of the Syrian civil war. But the next day Obama was repeating the same old mantra all the way from five years ago, he must go. Of course nobody with at least two functioning brain cells takes these people seriously. Well, apart from their vassals in Europe, like always seeks like. It´s clueless Weirdos United. Title: Re: Putin: Turkey, who is aiding terrorists, has stabbed us in the back Post by: isvicre on December 23, 2015, 11:50:34 PM The ultimate goal is to establish an independent Kurdistan, composing of Kurdish inhabited regions of Iraq, Turkey, and Syria. That's never gonna happen inside the Turkish border because Turkish republicans are politically and historically too strong for that but I'm sure most people wouldn't mind a free Kürdistan inside Syria and Iraq borders. Title: Re: Putin: Turkey, who is aiding terrorists, has stabbed us in the back Post by: bryant.coleman on December 24, 2015, 02:43:29 AM The ultimate goal is to establish an independent Kurdistan, composing of Kurdish inhabited regions of Iraq, Turkey, and Syria. That's never gonna happen inside the Turkish border because Turkish republicans are politically and historically too strong for that but I'm sure most people wouldn't mind a free Kürdistan inside Syria and Iraq borders. How can you be so sure? Don't underestimate Vladimir Putin. He can easily provoke a civil war in the Kurdish dominated regions of the South-east Turkey and provide the Kurdish rebels with anti-aircraft weapons and other advanced military equipment. The rebels will use the Kurdish regions of Iraq and Syria as launching pad for their attacks. Title: Re: Putin: Turkey, who is aiding terrorists, has stabbed us in the back Post by: galdur on December 24, 2015, 02:59:54 AM The ultimate goal is to establish an independent Kurdistan, composing of Kurdish inhabited regions of Iraq, Turkey, and Syria. That's never gonna happen inside the Turkish border because Turkish republicans are politically and historically too strong for that but I'm sure most people wouldn't mind a free Kürdistan inside Syria and Iraq borders. How can you be so sure? Don't underestimate Vladimir Putin. He can easily provoke a civil war in the Kurdish dominated regions of the South-east Turkey and provide the Kurdish rebels with anti-aircraft weapons and other advanced military equipment. The rebels will use the Kurdish regions of Iraq and Syria as launching pad for their attacks. I´m sure that something will be in the works and maybe already is. The Russians are always underestimated and happily use that to their advantage of course. To me they are more foxes than bears. Or maybe the bears have foxes in charge of strategy and command. Title: Re: Putin: Turkey, who is aiding terrorists, has stabbed us in the back Post by: isvicre on December 24, 2015, 04:48:38 PM The ultimate goal is to establish an independent Kurdistan, composing of Kurdish inhabited regions of Iraq, Turkey, and Syria. That's never gonna happen inside the Turkish border because Turkish republicans are politically and historically too strong for that but I'm sure most people wouldn't mind a free Kürdistan inside Syria and Iraq borders. How can you be so sure? Don't underestimate Vladimir Putin. He can easily provoke a civil war in the Kurdish dominated regions of the South-east Turkey and provide the Kurdish rebels with anti-aircraft weapons and other advanced military equipment. The rebels will use the Kurdish regions of Iraq and Syria as launching pad for their attacks. I'm %10000 sure because I know Turkish people and history. Turks never let borders breaking by any power. There's ongoing civil war in the South East already but media don't show it to Westerners. Like it or not government is too powerful. PKK is fighting for over 30 years but it's the part of the system. Tax money goes to military payments and some people get their cut. Title: Re: Putin: Turkey, who is aiding terrorists, has stabbed us in the back Post by: galdur on December 24, 2015, 05:39:37 PM The ultimate goal is to establish an independent Kurdistan, composing of Kurdish inhabited regions of Iraq, Turkey, and Syria. That's never gonna happen inside the Turkish border because Turkish republicans are politically and historically too strong for that but I'm sure most people wouldn't mind a free Kürdistan inside Syria and Iraq borders. How can you be so sure? Don't underestimate Vladimir Putin. He can easily provoke a civil war in the Kurdish dominated regions of the South-east Turkey and provide the Kurdish rebels with anti-aircraft weapons and other advanced military equipment. The rebels will use the Kurdish regions of Iraq and Syria as launching pad for their attacks. I'm %10000 sure because I know Turkish people and history. Turks never let borders breaking by any power. There's ongoing civil war in the South East already but media don't show it to Westerners. Like it or not government is too powerful. PKK is fighting for over 30 years but it's the part of the system. Tax money goes to military payments and some people get their cut. They haven´t had very pissed off Russians, biding their time, to contend with for decades so i wouldn´t rule out anything in those quarters. Title: Re: Putin: Turkey, who is aiding terrorists, has stabbed us in the back Post by: isvicre on December 24, 2015, 11:45:09 PM I guess you are living in 1920's. Political situation is very different now. Not only Russia, even China, India, Japan and other 200 countries put pressure on government they won't let that happen. You can pass Turkish borders easily, but you can't break borders. Those are 2 different things.
Title: Re: Putin: Turkey, who is aiding terrorists, has stabbed us in the back Post by: galdur on December 24, 2015, 11:56:40 PM I guess you are living in 1920's. Political situation is very different now. Not only Russia, even China, India, Japan and other 200 countries put pressure on government they won't let that happen. You can pass Turkish borders easily, but you can't break borders. Those are 2 different things. It´s your opinion that you can´t break borders, OK that´s nice, and in my opinion you´re unable to predict the fucking future, at least in a major issue like this one. Now we both have opinions but mine can easily be made into an irrefutable argument unless you have some supernatural powers or a time machine or something like that. Title: Re: Putin: Turkey, who is aiding terrorists, has stabbed us in the back Post by: galdur on December 25, 2015, 12:08:12 AM Anyway, what makes all this especially uncertain is that there´s a WAR going on there on Turkey´s border and one important thing about wars is that it´s usually difficult to predict how they develop or what the outcome will be. There are many wildcards. There are winners and losers and more often than not the losers end up giving up land. There´s lots of war left and at some point there´ll be bargaining for this and that and then we´ll maybe see what´s impossible and what´s not.
Title: Re: Putin: Turkey, who is aiding terrorists, has stabbed us in the back Post by: Subal_Damudar on December 25, 2015, 12:42:07 AM Turkey? ha ! you mean the country that made good cannons ? That country lead by self praising machherjhol president !!! That country ban media and cultivate personality cult same as hitler. So off course they are backstabber!!
Title: Re: Putin: Turkey, who is aiding terrorists, has stabbed us in the back Post by: bryant.coleman on December 25, 2015, 04:33:29 AM I guess you are living in 1920's. Political situation is very different now. Not only Russia, even China, India, Japan and other 200 countries put pressure on government they won't let that happen. You can pass Turkish borders easily, but you can't break borders. Those are 2 different things. Russia will not just be contended with "putting pressure". They will arm the PKK and the YPG rebels with advanced weaponry and ammunition. Once Rojava (Syrian Kurdistan) become independent, then the rebels will use that territory to launch attacks against the Turkish state. It is a matter of time, before the Turkish state disintegrates. Title: Re: Putin: Turkey, who is aiding terrorists, has stabbed us in the back Post by: galdur on December 25, 2015, 03:59:34 PM Turkish media appears to be ill at ease over the creation of a Russian-Armenian system of a regional joint air defense, suggesting that the agreement could mean trouble for Ankara and lead to growing instability in the region.
On Wednesday, Russian Defense Minister Sergei Shoigu and his Armenian counterpart Seyran Ohanyan signed an agreement on the creation of a joint regional air defense system for the Caucasus region. The agreement was one of several CIS Defense Ministers' Council cooperation plans for 2016 inked in Moscow, with negotiations ongoing for regional air defense agreements with Kyrgyzstan and Tajikistan. A joint air defense agreement was reached between Russia and Kazakhstan in 2013, Moscow recently handing a S-300 SAM platform over to Astana. Russian and Belarusian air defense systems have already been unified. ... http://cdn4.img.sputniknews.com/images/102080/79/1020807935.jpg http://sputniknews.com/middleeast/20151225/1032308218/russia-armenia-air-defense-turkey.html Title: Re: Putin: Turkey, who is aiding terrorists, has stabbed us in the back Post by: troleybüs on December 25, 2015, 05:51:26 PM We are still waiting Putin to bury Erdoğan. If he has enough power he should do it right now. He's wasting time with fake threats. Show your serious move, sir!
Title: Re: Putin: Turkey, who is aiding terrorists, has stabbed us in the back Post by: bryant.coleman on December 25, 2015, 05:58:37 PM Turkish media appears to be ill at ease over the creation of a Russian-Armenian system of a regional joint air defense, suggesting that the agreement could mean trouble for Ankara and lead to growing instability in the region. The Azeris are linguistically and culturally very similar to the Turks. They speak a Turkic language and share the same religion. In case of a possible Azerbaijan vs Armenia war, Turkey is likely to side with the former. In such a scenario, Russia should help the Armenians, as Armenians are culturally similar to the Slavic people. Title: Re: Putin: Turkey, who is aiding terrorists, has stabbed us in the back Post by: Souldream on December 25, 2015, 06:51:49 PM Italy police seize nearly 800 Erdoguns heading from Turkey for Belgium http://www.lastampa.it/2015/11/26/italia/cronache/carico-armi-da-guerra-sequestrato-a-trieste-IdEfgpOYiwhPKZquX8eNTO/pagina.html http://www.lastampa.it/rf/image_lowres/Pub/p3/2015/11/26/Italia/Foto/RitagliWeb/8013__DSC0040-kj5C-U10602363450753CMI-700x394@LaStampa.it.jpg Russian troll have spy everywhere as i see ... they read lastampa now LoL .... Lucky that all eu country do not stop to post shit about Russia ... as RT never post them ... how much is ruble now ? 30 ... ? and petrol ? 1 or 2 years in same economic model ... and we will see how old demons in URSS will be back in street and administration with corruption ... as anyway only corruption works in Russia ... They sell what now ? Gaz ... do not think so ... hoo yes weapons ... to make the peace ! and nuclear plant ... hope this is not the same as "Tchernobyl" ... Title: Re: Putin: Turkey, who is aiding terrorists, has stabbed us in the back Post by: Nemo1024 on December 25, 2015, 07:40:45 PM We are still waiting Putin to bury Erdoğan. If he has enough power he should do it right now. He's wasting time with fake threats. Show your serious move, sir! Revenge is a dish best served cold. And not everything is done with brute force, you know. ;) There was a demonstration of S-400's in Syria to the journalists yesterday... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m_1zbfHpnl0 Fewer foreign flying objects venture into the airspace over Syria right now, and those that do turn back as soon as they enter the range. Title: Re: Putin: Turkey, who is aiding terrorists, has stabbed us in the back Post by: galdur on December 25, 2015, 07:52:00 PM Yes, the Russians will bide their time. There´s no hurry. This looks like one of those opponents where you do your best to get them to dig their own grave so to speak.
Title: Re: Putin: Turkey, who is aiding terrorists, has stabbed us in the back Post by: galdur on December 25, 2015, 09:04:37 PM The leader of the 'moderate' group Jaish Al-Islam, Zahran Alloush, has been erased from Planet Earth courtesy of 8 pinpoint missiles. Damascus has confirmed that they planned the attack 48 hours in advance, and were just waiting for the convoy to arrive at a farm before they sent them some Christmas gifts. fortruss.blogspot.com
http://www.joshualandis.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/Zahran-Alloush2.jpg Title: Re: Putin: Turkey, who is aiding terrorists, has stabbed us in the back Post by: galdur on December 26, 2015, 03:12:33 AM Turkish Internet servers reeling under huge cyber-attack
Experts unable to identify source of hack, but newspaper reports suggest Russia may be behind it December 25, 2015, 11:39 am ANKARA, Turkey — Turkish Internet servers are suffering a powerful cyber-attack, slowing banking services and fanning fears that it could be a politically motivated attack from abroad. Nic.tr, a non-governmental organization that administers addresses for websites using the “tr” domain, said Thursday that the attack appeared to be from “organized sources” outside Turkey. The domain is used by websites belonging to Turkish ministries, commercial enterprises and banks. Transport and Communications Minister Binali Yildirim called it a “serious” attack and asked an Ankara-based university to beef up security measures, saying they were “insufficient.” Banking sources said the attack has seriously disrupted transactions. Experts have been unable to identify the source of the attack. Some newspapers said it could have originated in Russia, citing fraught bilateral relations since the downing by Turkey of a Russian fighter jet last month on the Syrian border. According to local media, the Anonymous hacking group posted a message saying it would continue to attack Turkey for “supporting the Islamic State by buying their oil and tending to their injured fighters.” http://www.timesofisrael.com/turkish-internet-servers-reeling-under-huge-cyber-attack/?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter Title: Re: Putin: Turkey, who is aiding terrorists, has stabbed us in the back Post by: bryant.coleman on December 26, 2015, 03:37:41 AM Turkish Internet servers reeling under huge cyber-attack Experts unable to identify source of hack, but newspaper reports suggest Russia may be behind it Seems like a joint Russian-Kurdish cyber-attack, with backing from Anonymous. As per the initial reports, some 400,000 Turkish sites were taken down. Most of them were restored later, but they had to ban traffic from outside Turkey. The war against Turkey has just started. And this will continue until Turkey stops the genocide of the Kurds and take action against the ISIS supporters in their country. Title: Re: Putin: Turkey, who is aiding terrorists, has stabbed us in the back Post by: Nemo1024 on December 26, 2015, 02:12:29 PM Turkish media appears to be ill at ease over the creation of a Russian-Armenian system of a regional joint air defense, suggesting that the agreement could mean trouble for Ankara and lead to growing instability in the region. The Azeris are linguistically and culturally very similar to the Turks. They speak a Turkic language and share the same religion. In case of a possible Azerbaijan vs Armenia war, Turkey is likely to side with the former. In such a scenario, Russia should help the Armenians, as Armenians are culturally similar to the Slavic people. Interestingly, this is what Turkish infiltration and brainwashing is trying to convince Azerbaijanis of. Incidentally, it is where the break-up of USSR was initiated a few years before 1991. Here is a telling fragment of an article, published in “Argumenty i Fakty” – about Herman Alekseevich Ugrjumov, Hero of Russia, who served in many hot spots during those wild years. Admiral German Ugrjumov, going by the name of "Ocean" cared for everyone but himself http://www.aif.ru/society/people/admiral_po_klichke_okean_german_ugryumov_zabotilsya_obo_vseh_krome_sebya Quote ... He started his military career in the Caspian Flotilla. Then he returned to Baku after the end of the High School of the KGB. There the two sons of Herman Alekseevich were born. And there he almost lost his family, when Russians and Armenians were being cut down and burnt alive in the streets of Azerbaijan. The first pogroms “glorified” the city of Sumgait, and then in Baku the following posters appeared: “Russian, do not leave! We need slaves and prostitutes”, “War on Armenia!”. Russian, who managed to get to the airport of Baku, could not fly to Moscow – civilian planes were loaded with boxes of carnations. No one cancelled the season of flower trade. Back then Ugriumov saved hundreds of families by organising their evacuation on military planes and by sea. But a few years before the tragic events, he had sent reports to Moscow, saying that Azerbaijan was ripe with nationalist sentiment, that Turkish and Iranian intelligence is at work. But the center said, Azerbaijan will handle it by themselves. ... Title: Re: Putin: Turkey, who is aiding terrorists, has stabbed us in the back Post by: troleybüs on December 28, 2015, 03:47:10 PM Turkish Internet servers reeling under huge cyber-attack Experts unable to identify source of hack, but newspaper reports suggest Russia may be behind it Seems like a joint Russian-Kurdish cyber-attack, with backing from Anonymous. As per the initial reports, some 400,000 Turkish sites were taken down. Most of them were restored later, but they had to ban traffic from outside Turkey. The war against Turkey has just started. And this will continue until Turkey stops the genocide of the Kurds and take action against the ISIS supporters in their country. This only effect innocent people like us, it doesn't harm those bastards. Russia have to change their war style. We don't want this government but they don't do anything to them. If they are serious about war they have to fight with those bastard politicians, not with innocent people. Title: Re: Putin: Turkey, who is aiding terrorists, has stabbed us in the back Post by: isvicre on December 28, 2015, 10:12:12 PM I guess you are living in 1920's. Political situation is very different now. Not only Russia, even China, India, Japan and other 200 countries put pressure on government they won't let that happen. You can pass Turkish borders easily, but you can't break borders. Those are 2 different things. Russia will not just be contended with "putting pressure". They will arm the PKK and the YPG rebels with advanced weaponry and ammunition. Once Rojava (Syrian Kurdistan) become independent, then the rebels will use that territory to launch attacks against the Turkish state. It is a matter of time, before the Turkish state disintegrates. I'm patiently waiting for that. I hope you'll be right and we'll see new Kurdish state soon in Middle-East. USA needs new puppets. I'll be glad to watch new puppets-war. Title: Re: Putin: Turkey, who is aiding terrorists, has stabbed us in the back Post by: bryant.coleman on December 30, 2015, 07:31:38 AM I'm patiently waiting for that. I hope you'll be right and we'll see new Kurdish state soon in Middle-East. USA needs new puppets. I'll be glad to watch new puppets-war. What makes you think that the rulers of Kurdistan will be mere puppets dancing to the tunes of the American officials? The Kurds are proud and independent minded people. They don't like being dictated by anyone. They might be receiving some sort of help from the Americans right now. But that doesn't mean that they will obey everything which the Americans ask them to do. Title: Re: Putin: Turkey, who is aiding terrorists, has stabbed us in the back Post by: isvicre on December 30, 2015, 11:22:04 AM What makes you think that the rulers of Kurdistan will be mere puppets dancing to the tunes of the American officials? The Kurds are proud and independent minded people. They don't like being dictated by anyone. They might be receiving some sort of help from the Americans right now. But that doesn't mean that they will obey everything which the Americans ask them to do. No country can be free/independent in Middle East. At least not until the petrol sources dries. There's a reason all wars happen in Middle East this era. If you combine ignorance, narrow-minded people and petrol you'll see Middle East chaos. Title: Re: Putin: Turkey, who is aiding terrorists, has stabbed us in the back Post by: bryant.coleman on December 30, 2015, 01:54:50 PM No country can be free/independent in Middle East. At least not until the petrol sources dries. There's a reason all wars happen in Middle East this era. If you combine ignorance, narrow-minded people and petrol you'll see Middle East chaos. The importance of the Middle Eastern petroleum reserves is waning. Right now, the United States and Russia have overtaken Saudi Arabia as the top crude oil producer in the world. The OPEC oil production is decreasing and at the same time that from the non-OPEC bloc is booming. Also, crude oil consumption is declining, as LNG and CNG is replacing gasoline for vehicle transport. Title: Re: Putin: Turkey, who is aiding terrorists, has stabbed us in the back Post by: Vivlore on December 30, 2015, 05:48:52 PM We are still waiting Putin to bury Erdoğan. If he has enough power he should do it right now. He's wasting time with fake threats. Show your serious move, sir! War is the last resort. I wish all the conflicts can be solved diplomatically. I believe IS problem will be solved eventually. |
