Bitcoin Forum

So with China devaluing currency and the Chinese citizens looking to get their money out of Yuan, do you think buying BTC will be one of their means for doing so?  I dont know much about the capital controls, but if the citizens cant easily take their Yuan and buy other currencies maybe buying BTC will be easier and more efficient for them?  This would be very good news for the BTC price.  Thoughts?

I'm not sold on the premise that Chinese citizens are "looking to get their money out of the Yuan." The Chinese government is actively pumping the Chinese stock market and attempting to entice people to invest in it. It seems more likely that people will chase the bubble there than look to get their money out of the Yuan all together.

Second, if people are looking to get their money out of the Yuan, bitcoin is only a temporary transfer method, at best. They're not looking to convert to bitcoin and hold, they're looking to convert to bitcoin, move their money outside of the country, and convert to something more stable like the Euro or USD. In that case, any purchasing pressure this activity causes would be canceled by the selling pressure, with a net of zero. But this still seems unlikely to be happening on a scale large enough to matter.

I'm really not sure whether all chines are buying bitcoins. But what you said is correct than this will be a very good news for btc price stability because more and more people hold bitcoins price may not fluctuate so much in future. If that happens traders may not like it because they want every day price movement to make profits for them but for general public who is not a trader it will be a great news. Currently prices are constantly moving and reaching again around 500 level soon. Any idea what is the real cause for this up move? is it a bubble or real one? 

i'm sure this is will affect to bitcoin price,china is big country with big population,and they interest to start buying bitcoin,i think this is one of many reason why bitcoin price is higher for now.

You got this right.  I think when currencies collapse, or when folks are ready to get out of their native currency, they look for something stable.  Bitcoin is not that.  The Chinese are huge buyers of precious metals if I'm not mistaken.  Bitcoin, too, but I don't think there's going to be a flight to it such that the price will balloon. 

Actually the price is ballooning as I write this ($464.60), but I'm not sure China is responsible.

 Chinise  are not devaluating currency.Yuan has lost only 4%to dollar last time.Look Euro and dollar.Look Yuan rates and dollar and Euro rates
Now will be big crash,so hold your btc,crash done by westerness debt economy, derivatives,one big boom

Maybe that's why bitcoin has gone up so much ;D

I don't really think the Chinese are really trying to cash their Yuan out, nor are they as desperate as you think, at least.

But to be honest, the bitcoin price would go up if a whole country cashed out. But I don't think the Chinese are cashing out.

After seeing larger volume on chinese bitcoin exchange platform continuously after first week of november we can be sure chinese are behind the latest rise in price. But due to that other traders are also get interested to buy bitcoin as they think it is sure for price to rise by chinese massive demand.

Sure that it will be, not good, but very good for the bitcoin if the Chinese people will buy bitcoin continuously. Because of the devaluation of yuan or for another reason have no importance. That is important is to buy. That mean increase of the demand for bitcoin and as a direct consequence even increase of price and the value for bitcoin as a currency and invention. Will have more visibility, more spread and again, with big probabilities, further increase of demand because of the reasons given in the beginning of this sentence. Don't needed to much analyse and intelligence to arrive in such conclusions.   

It will surely effect Btc price but not as soon as we assume ,it will take years for people to get into coins and put their assets into bitcoins.
with China blocking google and else could be that they care about their citizens privacy and maybe accept bitcoin sooner than others and yes could be a very good thing for BTC then.

Yes... There is a $50,000 USD limit each year of how much foreign currency they can get. So they're basically stuck with a bunch of useless paper and numbers.

Many people in China saw bitcoin as an opportunity to move funds out of China, and of course these people are quite wealthy and just one buy or sell order can impact the market quite a bit.

Why do you say that the Chinese want to get their money out of Yuan? I don't really see why they would want to do that. I would say that the Chinese aren't really into Bitcoin, except for mining, so I don't think they will be buying Bitcoin anytime soon.

Yeah. The Chinese are definitely not trying to cash out their Yuan. But the Chinese play a big role in the mining sector of Bitcoin. With all their mining farms, they are making a lot of money and making our lives (Bitcoin users) much easier.

There is no large scale selling in the exchanges outside China at the moment. So there is no large scale capital out of China through bitcoin.

China is devaluing the yuan. They've kept it pegged to a very tight range for over 20 years, but are now actively devaluing it.

bitcoin users in china is very much,
of course it will make the market YUAN / BTC has a very large volume
i think that is

Its just what the news wants the rest to believe. Of course, you are right though, the net effect would probably be zero.

Well I wouldn't be surprised if some Chinese investors were dumping their savings into Bitcoin, but I would expect the Chinese too be buying more Precious Metals as opposed to anything. They can probably find a huge amount of them in their country, considering all the purchasing that has been going on in their country, so all of that would make sense.

I'm kind of surprised that China keeps devaluing their currency, but whatever, I hope they kind of know what they're doing.

To the chinese, Bitcoins are like stamps. They are far from dumping significant money into them.

I can't see an entire country relying on bitcoin at the moment, especially a country as large as China.
That is an immense under taking if they are suggesting getting rid of their currency so to make way for a new all digital currency. They have the infrastructure in place, at least in the large metropolitan cities, to incorporate this endeavour but the smaller cities will not be ready technological wise. That would take decades to make the whole country bitcoin friendly and accessible to everyone, even the farmers and the elderly people.

If the Chinese currency devalue, it means the cost of manufacturing bitcoin will be lower there. So more mining will move to China.

China is pretending to stop capital flight. But only of non-members of the red barons families who work for jpm & goldmanS anyways. The target there are the ones that actually create wealth: the productive middle class. They should not afford to hedge their capital abroad - they are only allowed to flush their yuans down domestic realestate & stockmarket toilets and watch the bubbles pop.

i never think that china currency have effects on bitcoin,some couple of month ago,bitcoin price going up and everyone so busy to find out the cause of this case,and they also think that china behind of this all,i never believe that.

I am not sure that bitcoin market is so developed in China. What I mean here is, sure they have the biggest share in hash power in the worlds. Biggest bitcoin farms and pool.
But bitcoin awareness among normal people are rather low I would imagine. So I doubt that Average Chinese Joe will put money into bitcoin investments.

I haven't really thought much about this, but I believe it is valid.
With a devalued chinese currency, there will be more mining going on in China, people will start buying more bitcoins there.

Agree with view of Chinese looking more into traditional assets like real estate but also have to think even a small percentage looking at bitcoin will bounce the value.

Chna is not devaluating his currency look yuan rates china economy from  is  from export to consumer spending but whan yuanis lowering there is more interesting in btc
big chance for btc is china very fast growning ecommerce

That's a very interesting observation, sulfurtank.

The top leadership is extremely corrupt, and most of them are likely quietly buying assets outside of China (like condos in Vancouver).  This would likely be related to many South Americans buying S. Florida condos: have a SAFE place to move to when trouble arrives...

And, yeah, I would *guess* that ONLY well-connected people have a way, and the protection, to getting assets out of China.

Any Chinese people with Bitcoin have another option, those who can get BTC wholesale have even more options.  Bitcoin is worth about the same in China as in the USA, Canada and Australia.

How many people are financially literate? Maybe 1% or less actually know what's going down with international finance. Your average Chinese farmer is not gonna start panicking about getting out of his currency. And that also assumes most people have savings. I'll guess most don't.

I think china currency will greatly affect the bitcoin. China is the country most widely used bitcoin, if the value of the Chinese currency price decline, perhaps most people will use the china and make bitcoin bitcoin prices higher

I feel like there are some misconceptions in your logic:

1. China is leading country if we are talking about mining and hash power. China is not a  leader if we are talking about 'bitcoin usage'.
2. "if the value of the Chinese currency price decline, perhaps most people will use the china and make bitcoin bitcoin prices higher" - what does that even mean?

I think what he`s referring to is the actual "fiat yuan" in that sentence.

He`s stating if the chinese people notices their own yuan is declining people will tend to look for options and eventually buy bitcoin if told about.

Chinese will though have a greater impact if there is a sudden rush only cause the population size.

The Chinese Yuan is quite stable at the moment. So I think it does not affect the price of bitcoin.

what the stability of the yuan as to do with the bitcoin price in any case?, tyhe bitcoin market cap is ajoke in comparison, if chinese dump youan for bitcoin you will not notice it

Amph, would you mind quantifying this statement? You saying the Bitcoin market cap is a joke in comparison to the Yuan currency... and then you say.. IF the Chinese starts dumping the Yuan for

Bitcoin, we will not notice it? { The Chinese exchanges will immediately see a higher Bitcoin demand and it will rise significantly higher than the price of Bitcoin on the other non-Chinese exchanges }

The significant amounts of Yuan being dumped, will also be picked up by the Chinese government and they will close these exchanges to protect the Yuan.  ::)

even now yuan is one of top 5 currency in the world,i think china currency will not effect to the price of bitcoin.

If the Chinese dump Yuan for Bitcoin, Bitcoin will go to the moon. Bitcoin's market capitalization is extremely small compared to global forex markets.

that's make sense,so far china become most bitcoins miners,and its why china exchange have better price than other exchange. but i wondering about time of this conditions,is china will keep their existency on bitcoin miner,or other country will take over china position.

It all depends on the cost of mining. If the cost of mining in Iceland is lower than in China, mining will flourish in Iceland.

Everything is cheaper in China even the electricity. I don't know if there is another country with cheaper electricity though. Maybe if some rich guy invests a lot of money into renewable energy like wind turbines or solar panels and try to mine alt coins with that powering his rigs he could make more money than the Chinese. By the way Chinese Yuan is fully backed by gold apparently so people may start buying Yuan instead of USD or Bitcoin.

Due to the high inflation, the things are not cheap in China any more. The Chinese tourists buy a lot of things aboard.

for me i think it is a good idea for china citizen to hold  bitcoin for investment, and with china big population its going to help bitcoin to become famous and it will help bitcoin to maintain their stable price

i dont think china currency influencing bitcoi price,its not tottlay rght if media tell abou that,bitcoin dumping last year was not have any related with devlued of yuan,even we know china have so many miners there.

Not so much,chinsie miners are in charge,whan thay are joining forces than thay are able to control all network,than we have pump and dump

People are buying yuan and buying electronics and other stuff directly from China. It's cheaper that way.

I hope in the future the bitcoin can be accepted in China so that we can buy goods in China with it directly.

Yes, Chinese citizens have only $50,000 USD a year of forex limit. Many go to black markets though and source their forex from there.

BTC is quite a good option to move their funds. In doing so it also educates the public about cryptocurrencies.

If one day BTC can be used nearly everywhere in Earth, then it would be even better. Because they wouldn't need to dump their coins again to get worthless fiat. Instead, they can say, buy a house using just bitcoins.

China is having a lot of cheap stuff, currency, services and so as the quality of living. They have way less freedom than most of us that's why some of them go to other countries to migrate.

Is it really true that China controls the Bitcoin and has effect on the currency. I have read some things about it but I do not know what to believe.

I do not think the Chinese controls the bitcoin. They just control the manufacturing and the mining.

China is world second largest state by area and have ~ 1.38 billion people and they use their local currency. In China people are using mainly local shops & markets as in every very large country. BTC mining farms in China are just BTC mining for profit for mining farm owners. BTC can expand in China, but probably after many years. ;)

Where did you get that information from?

Electricity prices vary greatly in China. Mining efficiency is also (becoming increasingly) dependent on climatic factors because of the necessary cooling. It's possible that mining in a region with low temperatures all year around could be more efficient even if electricity is more expensive than in another more temperate region - especially, if excess heat from mining is utilized for heating purposes.

Regarding China I think it's important that the Chinese mining operators are a diverse group. Just because they are all Chinese does not mean that they will all act in concert.

ya.ya.yo!

China is not devaluating Yuan,look his rates,last year Yuan was most stable currency of the world
look westerness world with negative rates

Due to the size of its economy, China now has an important impact on the global financial system. At the same time, the influence of China over the value of and use of bitcoin is growing rapidly.So they are thinking about their own digital recurrences to market place.

Yeah China is a force to be reckoned with. Their industry is large and they managed to grow even when there was a worldy crisis. In bitcoin their power/ influence is even larger. It was 'them' only who held back the lock size increase.

So in a way you can say they are dominating the scene.

I think the devaluing of Chinese currency by its government is only for their products industries with that they will get more benefiting profit with their imports and exports but for bitcoin for their country people it will not help them as those people will require a big amount to spend to buy bitcoins.

China is running the show big time.

Even before bitcoin they were booming. While the Oil countries used to control the US's debt. It's now China and Japan running the show.
And honestly,  I don't know if that is good.

I though this debate has been going on since 2014.

Either china has influence or not, you can see somethings in the present that it does.

1. They have a chinese bitcoin exchange - take in buy/sell orders that alone should effect the price on btc
2. As for the element of effecting the price overall including other countries not their exchange alone is another thing.

I heard the reason for the recent price rise of bitcoin is due to the depreciation of the Chinese Yuan, people want protection from bitcoin.

China is a big country and it has a huge bitcoin user. So i think it will surely effect on bitcoin price. That's what i am thinking

China has got large number of miners than users. So they will be having big volume in circulation. Also china is planning to generate their own country digital currency. In my opinion the circulation might have impact on bitcoin but the china currency don't make price variation on bitcoin.

china can change RMB YUAN to BTC already

many people buy btc in china already

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The recent price rise of the bitcoin is led by the exchanges in China. People think the Yuan will devalue.

Today's rise started in the west. Do people in the west think the British exit will cause financial problems?

China is a massive market for bitcoin, so any negative things happening to their currency will make some percentage of investors sell and diversify to bitcoin. Contrary, postive domestic news hurts bitcoin.

I am not sure it was the fast.
Some claim it was the chinese yuan's devaluation, others claim it was the having effect.
Now i hear it is fear for a brexit. Perhaps it's a combination of all three and the fear that it is causing it.

If think if  this is the  case that they will after converting the Yuan in bitcoins, move the bitcoins back to USD or Euro then i think we should take advantage of the ever increase price of bitcoins and sell them at a maximum price to gain profits from this.

Its true, we see many chinese investors dumping their coins and converting it too bitcoin thats why china is now experience a price drop on yuan, you can also see this analysis that china has one of the most held bitcoin market capacity.
https://www.cryptocompare.com/coins/btc/analysis/USD

Probably you are right, But I am inclined more to think that price now is a product of halving only.

No sane person thinks that China is planning on getting rid of the Yuan in favour of Bitcoin!
Much like gold/silver or foreign properties and companies, they will try to diversify so that the weaking Yuan is less of a problem.

I do think that that explains the rise somewhat, but it also shows that only a small amount of ths money is involved, otherwise the price would be much much higher.

I read on cnLegger twitter, that today chinese tv news explained the last bitcoin price rally, that could get more chinese interested on bitcoin: https://twitter.com/cnLedger/status/744528738113642499
Going to see if that gives another pump to bitcoin price.

As if all this was not resulted in inflation and a collapse of the bubble given the gambling nature of our Chinese friends.

Im sorry if im sort of ignorant but what would be the impact of brexit to west people? Isn't the affair is only in EU and Britain?

There will be no brexit. That was just a way to negotiate with the European Union, to bargain with EU.

Any significant price increase of Bitcoin always seems to come from China, and this time is no exception. Chinese kriptovalyutnye exchange set the pace for new highs in 2016, and demand for cryptocurrency not reduced. Some experts believe that this is due to the outflow of capital from the country.
In China has become increasingly difficult to withdraw funds from the country through traditional means or precious metals such as gold bullion or cash. There are few options for legal withdrawal of funds and Bitcoin is a good alternative to all the old methods.

Yes to an extent China's currency has being a major role in playing btc rates shooting up and down. But majorly its China that dominates the world btc prices . If they decide to sell prices will crash within no time ,

The bitcoin price took off when many Chinese citizens rushed to the Bitcoin markets to shore up their wealth.

And so many Bitcoiners strongly believe that the next global downturn will be the seminal turning point in Bitcoin’s history.

It's not good that so much of bitcoin's potential, future and even price depends of 1 entity. Wasn't that exactly what we didn't want? Centralization?
With china so dominant in the bitcoin scene, too much control is in the hands of 1 entity which we should avoid at all time. The only possible solution is another mining manufacturer stepping up. Along with new (non-chinese) investors.

Yes, however Chinese carry the entire front, only 3 Chinesse pools  control 67% hashrate,   if another mining manufacturer emerge it takes years and years to recover their investment, they carry a lot of front and took advantage, besides most BTC were mined, so to a new big investor is better only to buy BTC instead of invest on mining.

China controlling both mining and the amount of bitcoin is very dangerous indeed. The pools but also the miners make them untouchable. Which is why I don't put a lot of money in bitcoin.
1 bad law from the chinese government and the price will crash.

Chinese buying bitcoins, their numbers are large which may bring an increase and huge demands on bitcoin. Given the supply of bitcoin at this moment if the consumers were actively demanding for bitcoins it is likely that the price will go up and many will enjoy. It is one of the most awaited event in bitcoin its increase in price. Chinas passion to bitcoin will help on the increase of its market value which is positive.

I agree, if the price is really making a real demand continuously then we shouldn't see a big dump on the coin, we should only see a slow price increase on it. I really think that the price on the bitcoin is being manipulated by chinese considering the news that I've been reading that more and more chinese are adopting to bitcoin to make a good profit.

Not for long my friend, not chinese people are the major holders of bitcoins, they can move the price but not that much, if you look at the price now, it is starting to move to $700 again and we could easily see that in the next few days.

The Chinese are not the major holders. They are just the miners. The major holders are in the West.

We do belief in De-centralization of bitcoin, but if chinese people get united and invested a lot in bitcoins, this is probably fair and it is not violating any rules. Other countries should also show such commitments if they want to hold a major share of bitcoins.

That is right. The people in the West or other part of the world should mine and use the bitcoin as well.

China have probably some largest BTC mining farms, so of course China have effect on BTC. Chinese BTC mining farms can also exchange BTC to USD, not to local currency, keeping in mind their mining power.  ;)

If chinese are not the most holder that hold bitcoin then who? I see on the market cap. that chinese is the one who hold most of the  coin followed by US.

Most of the bitcoin service providers are in the west. The Chinese are just employed as miners to secure the network.

I believe it too, the chinese people will not control the majority and even if they do they cannot unite because they have a different interest so they cannot control the market.

Lol what? Most chinese investors moved to bitcoin and most of their money has been converted to bitcoin. Isn't that a unity for them? And they plan to pump the coin too to make a better profit once they sell their coins.

Most of bitcoin transactions carried out in the past through the state currency Yuan over the past 30 days in China.
In total, 71% of operations were carried out at some points it cryptocurrency in the state. And of course, the famous Chinese statistics on their territory shows that the majority of transactions throughout China have been conducted in yuan


Effect of China on Bitcoin prices should not be underestimated. China is home to some of the largest bitcoin exchanges on the planet.

Most everything that happens nowadays seem to involve China, not just bitcoin. There are territorial disputes, the economy, our mobile phones, the food we eat, the list goes on. This powerhouse nation has brought a lot of good things and along with it the problems and enemies that resulted in them dabbling in everything they think is worth their time.

It would be bold to imagine that people are massively buying out Bitcoin blindly, ignoring the risks, just like that. So, again, there is no rational argument here supporting that Yuan devaluations are driving up the bitcoin price.

That is right. The hack of the Ethereum DAO give us a good lesson. If there is a big bug found in the bitcoin, it will be disastrous.

My thoughts on China buying large volume of bitcoin can bring positive effects to consumers. In terms of price inflation we can expect that to happen if Chinese people will going to use bitcoin as an exchange. Given the population of the biggest country in the world their activity will bring higher demands and as we all know since bitcoins supply is limited this huge demand can bring about a tremendous price increase. For us it will be advantageous so its time to save some bitcoins in our wallet for an expected price increase.

i dont actually get why about 40% of bitcoin is mined in China ( maybe im wrong but someone's here said like this i think ),
i know the china is pretty greedy for earnings ( hehe as we all ) but why china especially,not let's say USA?

The USA people are not interested in the development of the bitcoin miners. They might think the bitcoin is useless.

Because china has the money to buy rigs for mining and they are the early adopters that use to profit in mining so they just continued it even mining is no longer profitable.

Knowing what were the prices of electricity in Eastern Europe under socialism and what now they are,  We can assume that overhead costs there are considerably smaller.

;D Yes! But there is something else.
http://cointelegraph.com/news/bitcoin-is-potential-national-threat-says-us-regulator

The Chinese currency is devaluing against the US Dollar at the moment. That could be reason for the bitcoin price rise.

It's not only due to political reasons, China has an interest in keeping low prices in electricity since they need it for growth (mainly based on industrial production and exportation). This also means that they have lower environmental constrains so they can use all available power sources (including coal).
A high price of electricity means that we cannot mine bitcoins in Europe, but it also means that we don't have periodic smog slowly killing everyone  ;)

Most of the big bitcoin farms are in South West China, where the hydro power electricity price is less than $0.04/kwh.