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Pope attacks Trump saying he is 'not Christian' for wanting to build a wall with Mexico - then Donald hits back calling Catholic leader 'disgraceful'



    Pope spoke on Papal plane after trip to Mexico which took him to US border where he celebrated mass
    Condemned Trump's plan to build a wall between the United States and Mexico saying: 'This is not in the Gospel.'
    Trump, campaigning in South Carolina, hit back furiously, calling the Pope 'disgraceful' and accused him of being a 'pawn' of the Mexican government
    Trump is a Presbyterian who has highlighted his religion repeatedly and is battling Ted Cruz in South Carolina for evangelicals
    Pope had held right on the border at Ciudad Juarez, with celebration simulcast to stadium on American side of Rio Grande


U.S. Republican presidential candidate Donald Trump is 'not Christian' because of his views on immigration, Pope Francis said on his way back to Rome from Mexico.


The Pope said, however, he did not want to advise American Catholics on whether or not to vote for Trump.
Trump fired back immediately, telling a packed room at a coastal South Carolina country club: 'For a religious leader to question a person's faith is disgraceful.'


The Pope's dramatic intervention came in a freewheeling conversation with reporters on his flight back from a visit to Mexico.
Francis was asked about Trump and some of his statements, such as vowing to build a wall between the United States and Mexico if he becomes president.


'A person who thinks only about building walls, wherever they may be, and not building bridges, is not Christian,' Francis saidin answer to a specific question about Trump's views. 'This is not in the gospel.'



Asked if American Catholics should vote for someone with Trump's views, Francis said: 'I am not going to get involved in that. I say only that this man is not Christian if he has said things like that. We must see if he said things in that way and in this I give the benefit of the doubt,' he said.


Trump issued a furious response, reading a lengthy statement from the podium on a campaign stop.
He reflected on the seismic impact of crossing swords with the leader of the world's largest religious denomination, and shrugged it off.
'Now it's probably going to be all over the world. Who the hell cares? I don't care!' he said. 'We have to stop illegal immigration ... and crime.'


Trump blasted the Vatican for what he said was a naive outlook on the ISIS terror army, saying in a statement released to reporters that 'If and when the Vatican is attacked by ISIS, which as everyone knows is ISIS's ultimate trophy, I can promise you that the Pope would have only wished and prayed that Donald Trump would have been President because this would not have happened.'


'ISIS would have been eradicated unlike what is happening now with our all talk, no action politicians.'
On his last day in Mexico, Pope Francis said a Mass on the U.S. border, where he railed against immigration policies that force many underground and into the hands of drug gangs and human smugglers.


Trump has also said he would deport millions of illegal migrants if he wins the November U.S. election. Last week he told Fox Business television that Pope Francis did not understand the Mexican border issues.
'The pope is a very political person. I think he doesn't understand the problems our country has. I don't think he understands the danger of the open border that we have with Mexico,' he said.


Asked if he felt he was being used as a pawn of Mexico, Francis said he didn't know.
'I leave that judgment to you, the people.'
But he seemed quite pleased to hear that Trump had called him a 'political' figure, noting that Aristotle had described the human being as a 'political animal.'
'Thank God he said I was a politician because Aristotle defined the human person as 'animal politicus'. So at least I am a human person.'

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3453193/Pope-says-Trump-not-Christian-views-plans-immigration.html

Who cares?

I certainly wouldn't vote for someone based on their religion/mental illness

I might vote against a person who says stupid shit based on religious beliefs... like Ben Carson...

Dr. Ben Carson: Egypt's pyramids were storage, not tombs
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fhol3WdB4QU (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fhol3WdB4QU)

Dr. Ben Carson: Satan Invented The Big Bang Theory
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hb1LgGlk3tw (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hb1LgGlk3tw)

I think Trump is too smart to be a Christian.  But you never know what is in person's mind.

My guess is he just plays along to get the Christian votes.

Trump does a LOT of that... he tells people what they want to hear, not what he believes

Though, Obama did the same thing... he claimed to be a Christian when he's clearly not...

Very true. The Pope knows what he's talking about. Things are different in Europe because of all Syrian refugees, and terrorism, but with both Mexico and the US in peace, they should make deals rather than building a wall. Besides, there are more Americans crossing than Mexicans. I've seen with my own eyes loads of American teenagers crossing the border South of San Diego to go drinking and partying in Tijuana. Does Trump wants to stop that, too?

The goal should be to make Mexico a richer country, so that the people will not want to leave it have a better life up North.

And hath made of one blood all nations of men for to dwell on all the face of the earth, and hath determined the times before appointed, and the bounds of their habitation;

http://biblehub.com/acts/17-26.htm

I love it.  The pope and Donald Trump trolling the fuck out of each other.  I cannot stand DT but he has some good points about immigration--but I still would not vote for him in a million lifetimes.  And the pope.  Yeah whatever.  Not sure why religious leaders are still relevant in 2016.  Have we not evolved beyond that?

From Wikipedia:


I bet one won't find a lot of 'Syrian immigrants' (aka, displaced ISIS mercenaries) in that city.  What a slimy fucking hypocrite Bergoglio is!

So... the pope recently said that Catholics are allowed to use condoms to help prevent the spread of the Zika virus...

Why would Catholics need condoms?  Is he implying that God won't protect them from Zika?

Exactly. If he's wrong with the zika virus he is wrong with the MAGNIFICENT TRUMP WALL.

 :)

Mom Whose Son Was Tortured to Death by Illegal Endorses Trump, Says ‘Pope Doesn’t Care About Me’





In an exclusive telephone interview with Breitbart News, Laura Wilkerson, whose son was tortured to death by an illegal alien, explained why she cast her early ballot today for GOP frontrunner, Donald Trump.

“Trump will get in there and do something about [immigration]. I believe him. I want someone in there who has said they’ll do it and will do it… So many people stay home because it doesn’t affect them,” Wilkerson said. “And I understand that. I was the same way until [my son] Josh was murdered. But at some point, we have to close the door and deal with who we have here before anyone else comes.”

By contrast to her support for Trump, Wilkerson said that she “gave no consideration to voting Sen. Marco Rubio (R-FL)… I do not trust him for one second… He does not speak to the victims [of illegal alien crime],” Wilkerson explained. “Obviously, Rubio wants more immigration, no borders. That’s what his backers want and that’s the way he’s going to vote.”

Wilkerson, who described herself as a deeply religious person, defended Trump from the attacks by Pope Francis.

“I don’t think I’ve ever heard the Pope say one thing about our families [families who have lost loved ones at the hands of illegal immigrants]. I’m not sure he understands the loss we have felt. Is he just ignoring that? It rubbed me the wrong way,” Wilkerson told Breitbart.

Wilkerson’s 18-year-old son Joshua was tortured to death by a so-called DREAMER — i.e. an illegal immigrant who allegedly came to the country as a minor.



http://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2016/02/18/exclusive-mom-whose-son-tortured-death-illegal-endorses-trump-says-pope-doesnt-care/

I have never seen a bigger hypocrite than the current pope. Here are the examples:

1. Lives behind a walled estate in Vatican and argues against border walls everywhere else.

2. Apologizes for the Catholic genocide of the native Americans, and the next day proclaims the main perpetrator (Junipero Serra) as a Saint.

3. Sheds crocodile tears in front of media, while talking about the poverty in Africa and Latin America. At the same time, he refuses to spend a penny out of the massive $3 trillion worth of property owned by the Roman Catholic church, for the benefit of these same people. Things does not stop here. He shamelessly accepts funds from various churches in Africa and Latin America, and adds them to the Vatican treasury.

4. Says that he is against Catholic priests sexually abusing children. At the same time, he promotes priests who are accused of pedophilia.

5. Says that the nature must not be destroyed. At the same time, causes deforestation and poaching by encouraging population explosion.  

I'm not Catholic, but I confused at how Catholics criticize the Pope when they believe the Pope to be infallible.  If the Pope can't be wrong, the how can Catholics disagree with him?

yes , i totatly agree with you.. he pretend to be christian for the sake of gaingg much more votes..

good quotes.. pope and other religious guys should eat their own shit.. and leave us alone..

yes he is definetely implying this.. god save the catholics from all bad things in this world except zika virus.. because zika virus isnt created by god.. it is created by atheists :P

FIFY

Fantastic!

I forgot about how tall the Vatican City walls were... what is that?  Around 50 feet tall?

I suppose the pope also forgot that part in the bible where it says... and I quote:

Has anyone here ever been to the Vatican?

I've been there, and it's not a walled estate at all. It's more like a large meeting place, with restaurants, shops, a post office and museums. Nothing's closed. Most of the place is open to all. I mean you need to buy a ticket to get into the museum, there are staff only areas, and the free parking is for employees only, but you can get into the church for free, and no one asks you your ID. So it isn't like a border wall the way Trump's planning one.

Sounds like an awesome place.  I'll bet it's loaded with so called 'Syrian refugees' right?

Oh yes... I'll wager that the Pope invited all the Muslims over to his palace for dinner...

Did someone say open bar?

And they say priests are not interested on politics. Riiight.

Unless you're a heretic like Bill Maher, I'd consider it an honour to end up on a shit list and banned from a place like that.

The fact that there are places where you can eat doesn't mean it isn't a fortress.
Yeah, you can get into the church for free, but not other places - they have to pay somehow for the lights.
Interesting as how this place that isn't a fortress has a private army and armed guards at the entrances.

I love it when people say stuff like that, it's so obvious depending on your perspective, people just don't stop and think for about five seconds before responding about it. For instance, people often argue with me about schools when I say they're like prisons at my age, but think about it, when you're a kid, if you're in school why do they have fences or walls to keep everybody in? Why do they have in some cases guards? Why do scary people come after you if you try to run away?

The pope and his Roman Catholic church is yet to donate a single penny to the recent wave of immigrants from Syria. Vatican has not given refugee status to anyone from the Middle East. He is not ready to share the expenses of housing the immigrants in Europe. He expects the European tax payers to sponsor it instead. Can this guy become any more shameless?

Don't be silly... Religions only take your money to live the high life... They don't spend it helping those in need... That's why God invented Atheists

Before the museum and the plastic gadgets made in china....

Today I Learn

Here's The Reason Walls Were Built Around The Vatican




Controversy continues to swirl around the apparent conflict between Pope Francis and Donald Trump, after the Pontiff implied that the billionaire's focus on building a wall on the Mexican border puts him at odds with the tenets of Christianity.

In Trump's defense, some have pointed to the fact that the Vatican City, the seat of papal authority, is itself surrounded by walls. However, this defense is being criticized by some on the left, who claim that the walls surrounding the Vatican are not analogous to those proposed to secure American borders.

In an article entitled "In Defense of Trump, Some Point (Wrongly) to Vatican Walls", write Liam Stack writes that Pope Leo IV built the walls around the Vatican "in an attempt to protect it from attacks by pirates and other marauders."

Indeed, the early walls that surrounded the Vatican became known as the Leonine wall in honor of the Pope responsible for their construction. Some of the Leonine wall still stands and makes up a portion of the structure that surrounds the Vatican to this day. But those walls were built with a far more specific enemy in mind than Stack lets on.

Leo built the walls in order to protect the city against the encroachment of "Saracens", an early term for the Arab Muslims who were hell bent on the conquest of Christian Europe. In 846, a year before the start of Pope Leo IV’s reign, the Saracens attacked the outskirts of Rome. The Muslim raiders targeted the Basilicas of St. Peter and St. Paul, which were located outside of the massive walls that defended Rome itself. The Saracens looted the two churches, robbing them of their relics and desecrating the tombs of two of Christendom’s most revered saints.

The 1910 Catholic Encyclopedia says that shortly after the raid, "[Pope Leo IV] began to take precautions against a repetition of the Saracen raid of 846. He put the walls of the city into a thorough state of repair, entirely rebuilding fifteen of the great towers. He was the first to enclose the hill by a wall." The walls that Pope Leo built, which were completed in 852, were nearly 40 feet high, twelve feet thick, and defended by dozens of towers that turned the site into a fortified city.

In response to Francis' criticism, Donald Trump, fittingly, noted that the Vatican remains a prime target for ISIS. It wouldn't be a stretch to say that the rampaging zealots of the Islamic State are the modern day successor of the conquest-minded Saracens of the 9th century.

Donald seems to have softened his tone with the Pope. At Thursday's CNN's townhall, Trump called Pope Francis "a wonderful guy".



http://www.hannity.com/articles/war-on-terror-487284/heres-the-reason-walls-were-built-14400553/

Does the Pope know he lives in a fully walled off Church with a very low population and the tightest citizenship policy in the world?

The question isn't really about Trump being a Christian. The question is about whether or not the Pope and Papacy are Christian.

The place in the Bible that the Roman Catholic Church uses as its excuse for the Papacy is Matthew 16:16-19:
Looks like they might be right. But other people say that Jesus was referring to Peter only when Peter expressed Jesus salvation. Are they right when they say this? Might it be that Peter is not the first Pope after all? Look what happens directly after the above Bible quote. From Matthew 16:21-23:
Now we see. The Papacy is based on Satan. The Pope is the anti-Christ that is predicted in several places in the New Testament, especially in the Revelation.

There is more N.T. explanation the shows that this is so. Even the O.T. has some clarification in a few places showing this to be true. MakingMoneyHoney pointed out one time, the place that says that when the Pope comes in His own name, and claims to be from God, that this is the sign of the anti-Christ.

Anyone who sets himself in the place of God is the anti-Christ. The Pope fits this description. But people always want a king other than God. In this case, their king, the Pope, is dragging them away from salvation.

Trump's few mistakes here and there are nothing when compared with the lies of the Pope and Papacy.

:)

You're behind Trump and not the Pope? That's an unexpected turn of events...

Hiding pedophile priests after they are caught raping children is not in the gospel either, but the pope managed to work his interpretation of it into his ideology.

Pope must read this book:

Pope Joan by Emmanuel Rhoides
http://www.goodreads.com/book/show/27253.Pope_Joan  ;D

No, there aren't any Syrian refugees there, for the most obvious reason that it isn't a good place to house people. Most of the Vatican is a museum. It's like saying that the Louvre in Paris, or the British National Museum should house refugees. Let's put it clearly that this isn't a proper place for that.


Have you been to a government building in Europe recently?
Armed police forces are everywhere. I bet there are more soldiers around the city hall in Paris than in the whole Vatican.
I've seen loads of police forces and soldiers with machine guns in hand in Paris, Ventimiglia, Barcelona. That's a sad sign of our times.

I may be old fashioned, but I prefer my religion, FAR away from my politics... ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Exactly my point.Thank you.

Have you ever been to Vatican? Not all of Vatican is a museum. There are offices, restaurants and hotels. There is a lot of space available for residence. Most of the guesthouses and villas in Vatican remain vacant 90% of the time. These buildings can be used to house the refugees. I am not asking the Vatican to take in thousands of refugees. Even if they could take a few dozen, it will be fine with me.

Pope ain't nothing but a scammer. Period.

Pope should not attack Trump. Trump has big chance to be the next President of America. Pope would be needing Trump help once ISIS surrounded Vatican.

Trump should not be the worst man ever. He should at least try to be decent.

My thought on that : Trump is not a good Christian, because he's not against the pregnancy interruption. The actual Pope is not a good Pope, because he's a bit leftist, in a political or in religious way, surely a mix of both.

Yeah the Pope isn't a good Pope because he tries to be good with other humans. Horrible Christians.

Lol..... Once ISIS conquers Rome and Vatican, the Pope will cut a deal with the ISIS and convert to Islam. This guy only bothers about money and influence. He never cares about the 1 billion+ adherents, who believe in Roman Catholicism.


In Brazil, pregnant women infected with Zika are being denied abortions. Do you support this? If you support this, then you should also set up orphanages to take care of these children. IMO, an abortion would be the most humane thing to do in such instances.

"There is always never room for one more."
                                                  - Mother Theresa
                                                  - Pope Frances (aka, the wannabe anti-christ.)

The pope should mind his business and take care of his fortress.

 I have a hypothesis that goes...  One of the other candidates bribed the pope to talk bad about Trump...

It's a dirty trick, but that's politics...

The pope will sway a lot of republican votes


Who would do such a dastard deed?

Not sure about that. Most of the Roman Catholics in the United States are Hispanics, especially the Mexicans, Guatemalans, and the El Salvadorians. These guys are vehemently against Trump from the very beginning. The Mexicans hate Trump, and he hates them back. On the other hand, this incident might propel the anti-Catholic groups such as the Baptists and the Mormons in to supporting Trump.

According to Wikipedia, 22% of Americans are Catholic...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catholic_Church_in_the_United_States (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catholic_Church_in_the_United_States)




My math might be a bit rusty, but 69% (non-hispanic) of 69.5 million people is ~48 million people/votes

Now, not all of those people vote, or are republicans, or had any intention of voting for Trump... but even 5-10 million votes is a lot

ISIS will never conquer the Vatican. Russia will make them disappear before they ever do anything. However, I wouldn't be surprised by a bomb attack there, real or faked ::)...

What's better, half live, or don't live at all ? When I talked about abortion, I talked about the classical abortion, where bitches kill their babies "because they're not ready", "because they don't have enough money" or even because they want to just fuck more and more.

In that case, I stand corrected. Forgot the fact that the United States is home to millions of Irish, Italians, and Poles, who are overwhelmingly Catholic. Even many of those with German and French origins are Catholic. And you are correct. Many of these non-Hispanic White Catholics are traditional GOP voters. But the question is whether the Pope will have any influence on these voters or not. The Catholics in the US are not as religious as say, the Baptists or the Mormons. On top of that, many of them are not in favor of immigration from Mexico.

I think that more Catholics than one might think are not buying Bergoglio's bullshit.  As near as I can see, many American Catholics are perfectly happy to pick and choose church stuff which makes sense to them and stuff which does not, and that has been going on for a long time.  Some Catholics seem genuinely stunned at the hard left turn and new-age eco weirdness their church has taken and are saying things like "I want my church back."  It's probably not just Catholics either.  Some churches are actually given financial breaks by government for preaching green religion to their parishioners so I read.  Very interesting even if it is not terribly wide-spread.

http://dailycaller.com/2014/11/19/maryland-county-to-churches-preach-environmentalism-and-get-a-tax-break/ (http://dailycaller.com/2014/11/19/maryland-county-to-churches-preach-environmentalism-and-get-a-tax-break/)

Some people are scratching their heads and wondering aloud whether Bergoglio is not actually trying to chase people out of Catholasism, or at least some notable segments of the flock.  I find such a suggestion fascenating and worth more exploration.

Mr Coleman, if you say you've been to the Vatican, you're a LIAR!

I'm sorry to point it out, but had you been there, you you would know there are no hotels. I'm not saying there's only a few hotels, I'm saying the truth which is that there isn't a single hotel in the whole country. No hotels, and there's never been one. Guest houses? No guest houses either. Not a single one. I suppose they have some guest rooms, but I know that when they have a congress, some priests have to sleep outside the Vatican, so there should not be many of them.

Besides, when it comes to restaurants, don't think about Las Vegas. It's impossible to buy a stiff drink there. Coffee with pastries, and you can get a decent meal, but don't expect huge T-bone steaks like in Texas. All the food and drinks are modest.

The only free space is in the garden. That place is absolutely spotless, large with beautiful flowers. One of the best garden I've ever seen. But opening it to refugees would ruin it. Just imagine London allowing all British homeless to camp in Hyde Park. Nobody wants that.

This allows me to repeat that the walls around the Vatican are totally different to the wall the Donald is planning to build. Regarding catholics, the average American only thinks about himself, so nobody shall be surprised but religion is falling.

I have to add that people around the Vatican are profiting from all the poeple that goes there. If I remember well, a tiny 25cl water bottle was something like 3€.

This is why USA should remove tax exemption from all religious organizations. Most are criminal and not using the monies as solicited. Now we have muslims claiming they are a religious organization and are tax exempt. What religion murders, beheads, rapes kids, stones to death, burns to death and we are giving them tax exemptions.

This is not the Vatican itself who sold the water, them is quite cheap compared to the other's one. Who sold this are street sellers with a boxes filled with ice and water bottles.

No evolution. Only cause and effect.    8)

God gives you what you ask for. If you ask for Zika by not using protection, He'll give it to you. But often He doesn't give you bad things that you ask for because He understands how stupidly foolish you are.

8)

He's close to infallibly wrong as you can get. We should elect him rather than Trump.

8)

No, no. Good Catholics do not believe in Jesus salvation. Good Catholics will go to Hell.

8)

People made Zika, not God.    8)

Not believing in God gives you the biggest log-in-eye.    8)

Religions get donations. Atheists steal.    8)

The biggest scammer the whole world has seen.    8)

Yes! Somebody needs to set a good example for the Pope.    8)

Papacy sends people to Hell by holding the Pope up as God.    8)

And as Roman Catholics, most of them aren't Christians. They admit it.    8)

Catholicism is very different in America than in Spain, Portugal, Italy, and most of the South American countries.

8)

I don't see your point ???. If you are a Roman Catholic then you're a Christian. You can't be Catholic without being a Christian.

Can't remove tax exempt from religions in America. It is against the law to do that.

8)

Not necessarily. Many Christians in word are not Christians in fact.

The only people who are true Christians are the ones who believe in Jesus salvation.

Most Catholics in predominantly Catholic countries believe in good works salvation.

Not Christian, even though many of them think that they are.

8)

The only real Christians are those that agree with you isn't it? The rest are all heathens.

I'm sure Trump really gives a damn about what the Pope says about him.

The Pope can say someone can't be Catholic, but even excommunicated Catholics can be Christians. It's not up to men to say that.

Then it is discriminating against the atheists. The atheists have to pay taxes for their institutions, while the religious people are exempt from doing so. Why there should be an exemption?


Calm down ya batty! There are a large number of palaces in Vatican. When I meant "hotels", I was referring to them. Examples are Palace of Saint Charles, Apostolic Palace, Belvedere Palace.etc. Then there are other buildings such as the Swiss Guards Barracks, Domus Sanctae Martae guesthouse, and the Residence of the arch-priest. You are claiming that none of these buildings can be used for housing a few dozen refugees?

I think that it is the way it should work. The atheist tell lies all the time, then you can't reward them for that. We definitly need an official religion.

The pope shouldn't get involved in actual daily politics, especially not in elections. Also, he shouldn't label people as 'not Christian' because of there are many christian churches outside his domain.  

Congratulation Atheists, that what the church of the flying spaguetti monster was created for. Become a pastafari ;)

The doctrine of papal infallibility is about the matters of faith and the belief system. But it doesn't apply to other things like politics, science, economy, etc.

Even for you it is a new low.
Sometimes i wish we would get another great flood lol

I hope other members are taking this as a example to not lie in pretty much every post ;D

trump is not a christian for sure.. his god is money.. definitely like that..

This is getting ridiculous! You grabbed some names somewhere, and you say you mixed up hotels with museums, but that just shows you don't know anything about the subject. The names of palaces you give, there's a museum, a library, and the Sistine Chapel (!) in there. I have to agree the Sistine Chapel is a huge room, and that it could house many refugees, but I'm not sure it would the most appropriate place for them. I don't think anyone but you has ever suggested to use it as a shelter for refugees.


Just like Buckingham palace. Please write to the Queen to tell her she should house refugees. And don't forget the Harrods store. It's closed at night, but thousands of homeless would be happy to sleep there.

I am not talking about the chapels and libraries. Don't divert the topic. I was talking about the guesthouses, residence of the arch-priest, palaces, and the Swiss guard barracks.


Listen, if the Queen complains about others not accepting the refugees, then I'd definitely write to her. I will tell her to lead by example, by housing two or three dozen refugees at the Buckingham palace. A single family does not need a huge palace with 775 rooms.

Damn straight.  Not only that, but she should make sure that police response time to sexual molestation of the resident females is roughly equivalent to what the common [wo]man in the street realizes.

Indeed, there are a lot of Catholic nunneries which have plenty of room.  I know of at least one which I visited when I lived in the Bay Area.  Come to think of it, every one of the many Catholic monasteries or whatever-the-hell they were had walls and fences all around it and not a lot of riff-raff within the confines.  I will admit that one with a nunnery did have some crazy religious lady in the parking lot who told us about the nuns.  It was down in or near San Jose IIRC.

Trump keep saying some stupid things and he should apologize.

Apologize to whom? Agreed that he talks a lot of stupid things but I don't think he should apologize to the pope.

When Hitlery Clinton apologizes for her 1 million+ lies (and counting), Trump will consider apologizing for his comments. At least Trump hasn't instructed the American Air Force to bomb the orphanages and hospitals, as Hitlery and her fossilized husband has done in third world nations such as Libya, Afghanistan and Kosovo.

I'm not diverting the topic, you are. You talked of hotels, the Palace of Saint Charles, the Apostolic Palace. Not me, you did. There are no empty palaces in the Vatican, and we may doubt there is single free room in the Swiss guard barracks, since security has been increased several times those past few years.

You had a choice. You could have made an apology and say you didn't know anything about the Vatican, but you didn't, so you've lost all credibility.


Yes, definitely. In Northern Italy, there are some large buildings which are not much used these days, but we must keep in mind those buildings are anything but modern. They all have very high ceilings which make them difficult (or costly) to heat. That wasn't an issue with monks who were used to live without any comfort, but it would be more difficult nowadays. Also, don't expect anything looking like a bathroom close to the bedrooms.

Is it even important to be Christian to become president in the US? Am I missing something? Are government so religious? Where is laicism then?

Vox populi became popular now in the world, and if majority wins you must follow it or else you will be hated by many people. As the time goes by, there are still people that have to stand with their own opinion and defend it as they believe they are right.

ROFLMAO! Seriously?

WTF do you think you are? If you cant fathom the truth, then please don't post here. Also, I am not living in Saudi Arabia or Pakistan, where blasphemy is punishable by death. You are having some serious issues. By any chance, did you happened to hold the position of a choir boy in any of the Catholic churches, during your childhood?


The majority of the population identifies as Christian. So some people expect the POTUS to be a Christian by default. If I am not wrong, the US never had a non-Christian president till now. No Jews, no atheists, and no Native Americans. All of them were Christian, including Baptist (Bill Clinton), Presbyterian (Ronald Reagan), Dutch Reformed (Theodore Roosevelt), Episcopalian (GHW Bush), Methodist (GW Bush), Quaker (Richard Nixon), Roman Catholic (John F. Kennedy), Unitarian (William Howard Taft).etc

Well after all Trump isn't really a Christian.

He never goes to church, he's just a random guy full of money.
No faith, only greed and ambition.

Which makes me wonder how the heck could he convince more than half of evangelists to vote for him ><

You don't need to go to a church, to believe in Christianity. Even if you go to church daily, and don't follow the principles and fundamental tenets of Christianity, you can't claim that you are a Christian. The churches are just profit-making institutions or businesses which are used by the clergy to fleece the low-IQ believers.

It is you, Mr Coleman, who doesn't want to face the truth. Please, go to the Vatican, and see by yourself. It's evident from what you wrote that you've never been there, and have no idea of how it is inside. And no, I've never been a choir boy. You have a lot of imagination, I prefer to watch and learn.

Hey,

I don't know you but please stop losing your time and energy ;)
Coleman is just a random dumb person who likes to spread huge hoaxes without checking his sources ever. He sees the world in ONE way and everything different is bad and lies, and everything going in his way of seeing things is good and trues.
He will never apologize for anything cause he can't recognize he's wrong ;)

So just add him to your ignore list and keep going! :D

Lincoln wasn't exactly a Christian, same for Jefferson. So it's not mandatory.
http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2016/02/12/almost-all-u-s-presidents-have-been-christians/

But don't forget US president has to pledge on the Bible, so he definitely can't be a Muslim or a Jew that's for sure.

It seems that Trump is invincible even to criticism from the Pope.  He can say things about other Republicans and get away with it way more than his opponents can.

Interesting how the pope had nothing to do with the trump until he decided to run for president. Now all of a sudden he's not christian. Nice.

Cause he hadn't enough public exposure.
It's like saying "funny how nobody cared about Obama being black before it became president".
Well of course, as nobody knew him...

The pope claims that he is Hispanic (although he is ethnic Italian). There are rumors that he was appointed as the Pope, over competitors from Europe and Africa, as the Catholic church wanted to reverse the attrition of the adherents in Latin America. His aim is to fire-up the Hispanic Roman Catholic believers. Trump is just a scapegoat for the grand plan. 

Things would be more easy if religion will not give any opinion about important things. All the trouble religion occurs now a day.

Or maybe Trump is an asshole who believes in nothing but money and Pope said it... ::)

Yes, the idea of Muslims capturing Rome/Vatican City is farfetched. It's as likely as Muslims capturing Constantinople (Second Rome).

Wait.

The ISIS will probably use demographic Jihad to conquer Western Europe, by creating immigrant influx from the Middle East. By 2050, at least a few of the Western European nations will be Muslim majority. Already a few of them are 10% to 20% Muslim.

That said, Italy is less than 5% Muslim right now. And the rate of increase of the Muslim population is quite low, when compared to that in the other countries such as France and Germany. Still... we can't predict the future.

Yes, thanks for advice. I guess that some days I just have time to lose...


Absolutely. That doesn't make the US a Christian nation, but most founding fathers were protestant, and all US presidents have always shown huge respect to the Bible and all Christians. I guess Trump has more belief in the US$, then again, it's written on it "In God we trust".

this is definitely because of trump's anti-religious sayings for sure..

Funny how you keep spreading false informations backed by nothing.

France is the highest Muslim country in Europe with 8% Muslims.
So no, it's not "a few of them are 10% to 20% Muslim."

But keep writing false data, seems like nobody really cares about what's true or false on this forum.

Muslims capturing Rome would mean France tolerating a Muslim invaded neighboor while having nuclear power.

Seems really impossible to me ;)

If you can imagine France using nuclear weapons in order to stop Muslims from taking over any part of Europe (or any part of the world, including France itself), then you have quite an imagination.

The truth is, there aren't reliable numbers. Here's a Wikipedia page that asserts there are several major European cities where the Muslim population is estimated at 15% or more.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_cities_in_the_European_Union_by_Muslim_population (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_cities_in_the_European_Union_by_Muslim_population)

Looking through the references on that page, they seem to date from 2008-2013, so that's before the current invasion.

I realize the discussion was about "European countries" not "European cities," but the distinction is artificial -- especially to invaders who don't recognize inifidel borders anyway.

The way modern Islamic invasions work is to take over parts of cities, apply Shariah law in their part of the city, and have violent riots if the native population (e.g., police) even set foot in the part they've taken. The takeover grows outward from these neighborhoods. Sometimes they venture outwards from the parts they've already taken to express their dominance over the natives, like happened New Year's Eve. The only way it could be stopped is if someone decided to do something. It's obvious no one will take such a decision

There are parts of Paris, London, Amsterdam, Birmingham, Malmo, and so on, that are already under Islamic rule. Everyone knows this, including the people who actively deny it.

stop muslims?no! but we need start to destroy ISIS with bomb/nuclear every single place they either are or might be innocents people will die but if not thousands of innocents have died and will die at their hands. .

This is also why all this back and forth over the current numbers is irrelevant. People pushing the idea that it's not that many Muslims (yet) don't think there would be anything wrong if there were 20% Muslims, or 50% Muslims, or even 100% Muslims. They're pretending like there's nothing fundamentally wrong with Islam. Is there any reason to stop Muslims from taking over part of Europe and imposing their religious laws? I think there is. You and others think there isn't. The good news for you guys is that you're winning. The bad news for me is that for the time being I have to live in your fucking idiotic world.

Nothing seems to affect Trump's support.  He is very good at explaining things away and diverting the attacks.  He seems to always be on the offense.

Not only Americans, but the whole "free" world has been trained to enjoy television. Americans, especially, don't understand what reality is anymore.

:)

Muslims have to be the way they are just to live. Here's what I mean.

If you don't become a Muslim in a predominantly Muslim land, Muslims will kill you.

If you become a Muslim to protect yourself, you have to be a good Muslim, or other Muslims might say you are backsliding and kill you.

This means that you have to become violent, at least in your shouting about how good of a Muslim you are.

If you shout too loudly (by accident) other Muslims start to look up to you, and push you into the role of leadership.

If you don't take the role of leadership and become a Muslim cleric, other Muslims might say you are backsliding, and kill you.

The whole above thing is all about the violence written in the Muslim holy books. And a lot of Muslims have been killed over the years because other Muslims needed someone else to focus on so that the violence of Islam wouldn't be focused on them.

Clerics who have been forced into the role want peace because they never really wanted to be violent in the first place. So they are trying to tone Muslim violence down.

Clerics who like to be clerics want peace, because they see that there is no advantage in violence. So they are trying to tone Muslim violence down.

Any Muslim who wants peace is going against the holy writings of Islam. But it is happening anyway.

A few Muslims actually think that they like the violence. A few others are trying to obey the holy books. That's where we get the radical terrorist Muslims from.

Who is the best Muslim according to the holy books? The terrorists. That's why we need to get rid of Islam altogether.

:)

So for you "there are several major European cities where the Muslim population is estimated at 15% or more." can perfectly well be translated by "most Europeans countries already have a 15 to 20% Muslim population?

Seems like you've got some troubles with numbers.

Fact is, if there is more than 50% of Muslims in a country, why couldn't they impose their religious law?

If you disagree with that don't live in a country with 50% muslims.

Ok, that is a bit of generalization.  Not all Muslims suffer from this delusion to the same degree.  Those severely deluded act on it and become terrorists.  Those Muslims with mild delusions are the ones who say that "Islam is a religion of peace", and some of them believe in what they say.

Problem Islam has is that it cannot be changed.  The codified rules are written in stone.

The transformation that Christianity went through is not really possible in Islam.  So you either follow a 6th century moral code or you don't.

Most Christians don't follow the Bible (for good reasons).  Nobody is killing people because they work on Sabbath anymore, stone women or cut hands off when a women touches someone's private parts during a fight between her husband the some other guy.

Muslims have to somehow modernize their religion to align it with secular legal frameworks we have in civilized societies in the 21st century.
Problem is the law (Sharia Law) provided by Allah.  There is no easy way around it without abandoning Islam altogether.

ISIS are the only true Muslims as they follow the laws as outlined in the Quran.   All other Muslims cherry pick from that book.

That is true. For example, when the ISIS barbarians capture female non-Muslim civilians, only the Yazidis are kept as sex-slaves. The Christians and the Jews are let-off, as they are "people of the book". This is exactly what is said in the Quran. The non-Muslim "people of the book" however have to pay the Jizya tax to the Caliphate.

I haven't read the book but I don't think innocent people should die just because. And no religion should be imposed onto anyone that doesn't want to practice it.

l.Donald Trump makes the Masonic
descendent triangle sign in this early photo.

http://www.henrymakow.com/trump.jpg

See more: http://henrymakow.com/donald_trump_is_masonic_false.html

Is Trump now in jeopardy of losing the nomination after Saturday?  Maybe all of the attacks on Trump are starting to make a dent in his favorability.