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The reason why I asked this is purely based on Observation. Particularly the following:
1. Soviet Unions collapse.
2. China embracing a capitalist form of economy.
3. Fall of other communist and socialist regimes.
4. Increased foreign relations of Socialist countries with the United States (as the case of Cuba and Vietnam)
5. In my observation, no gains in terms of the struggle of the communists and leftists around the world.

This is an honest question as I do not have sufficient knowledge of the Socialist's plight and experiences.

Thank you for your response.

First, look up the differences between communism and socialism

Second, look into the socialist countries that are doing well... Sweden, Norway, Denmark, most of Europe, etc

Third, name a capitalist country besides America

Fourth, America is in the shitter right now, and dragging the whole world down with it... America is most definitely not doing well... I'd go so far as to say America is fucked and another recession/depression is about to smash us in the face again

This is mainly due to the inherent corruption in the capitalist system... it's not a good system at all... it breeds corruption and the most corrupt will always end up with all the money... this is why 50% of the world's money is held by only 63 people

Thanks for the input. I've never imagined that Communism and Socialism are somewhat two separate ideas (Maybe because that is what I heard of during my college days). Also never thought that the progressive countries you mentioned are socialist.

I am also somewhat surprised that even most of Americans themselves do somewhat agree with your idea that their country is in a bad state. There are also people who regard the rise of China as a good thing too, though I just heard it from opinions of some of the folks in my locality. Maybe most would think the opposite.

It is no secret the USA is in a depression right now, but capitalism and socialism/communism are just two sides of the same corrupt coin, both sides run by bankers. I might add that a large part of the reason the USA is failing economically right now is its more recent turn towards socialism. Capitalism is designed to build up capital while communism/socialism is designed to strip that wealth and tear down societies. It is just a global system of controlled opposition. Red vs blue, republican vs democrat, capitalism vs communism, only on a global scale. Just look at the soviet flag, it is composed of two ancient symbols, the hammer and the sickle. The hammer represents building society up, and the sickle represents tearing it down. It is right in your face. The Federal Reserve Bank even funded The Soviet Union for many years as Russia went bankrupt some time in the late 1800's. As far as socialism and communism being different, this is a lie because socialism is designed to segway the target society into communism. Read some of the writings of Lenin where he clearly describes it as such.

Capitalism > Democracy > Socialism > Communism > Repeat

Both sides are equally corrupt. The benefits of socialism/communism are short lived and end in the society consumes itself once there are no more people left to rob, just like cancer. Also don't fool yourself, America is not the only country in the shitter right now economically speaking, and you can not truthfully put the entire blame for this on the USA. USA does not have a monopoly on corruption. Additionally there are PLENTY of other capitalist nations, your implication that there aren't is asinine.  Also China is very clearly a capitalist state even if they still harbor some communistic tendencies. The only difference is the capitalism is under control of the state. The state is not your friend no matter where you reside or what ideology you support.

As far as Europe doing well, I beg to differ. It's socialist tendencies are what is driving the massive immigration influx, and frankly Europe can not defend itself from the on coming onslaught coming down upon it, especially since most of Europe bans the private ownership of firearms. This  leaves most of its residents defenseless against the radical militants which make up the majority of the so called "refugees", most of which are fighting age males not even from Syria. The welfare state in Europe is very clearly what is motivating this massive wave of immigration, in addition to militant goals of jihadist conquest.

In conclusion, both "sides" of this ideological conflict are corrupt and just two faces of the same bankster elite. However, given that capitalism is at least focused on the creation of wealth and keeps all the services we all depend on functioning, it seems to me that this is the better choice of two evils at the moment until things can be changed or reformed. Socialism and communism gives zero incentive to people to actually work and provide services resulting in societal decay at a much more rapid pace. Don't be sucked into this US vs THEM controlled opposition Hegelian dialectic. Ultimately both are losing strategies and tools of the elite.

no i do not think so that socialism is losing against capitalism.
capitalism is in some countries not all.
and socialism is in almost many countries.
so i think that a win against capitalism.

I think that you are mixing communism and socialism.
Communism and Socialism are not the same thing.
Communist failed in most countries in the world.
China modified their social system and accepted free market and capitalism in economy.
In the same way, with police they strongly protect their political system.
Real socialism we have today in Scandinavia, Sweden, Finland, Norway etc.
Social benefits people in this countries have from the government are great.
Socialism is always concentrate (and protect) on peoples needs first while capitalism is concentrate (and protect) on capital first.
Communism always was unrealistic utopia and in every country turned to brutal dictatorships.
In the long term, I think socialism will win because people will demand it, that politicians and government protect and help more average people, their voters, than corporations and big companies.

Another thing to point out is that the form of communism you are familiar with (soviet union), it not the ideal communist setup by Karl Marx...

It's not that communism is bad, it's simply that the soviet union was not really communism... it was a dictatorship in disguise as communism

Similarly, the US is not a democracy, nor is China a republic (people's republic of China)

People misuse labels to confuse you...

America claims to be a democracy... yet it is set up as a republic, not a democracy... and, it's not even a republic because the people who write the laws are lobbyists... paid by corporations and billionaires... making America effectively an oligarchy...

This is the stuff they won't teach you in school... America is an oligarchy, masquerading as a democratic-republic

There's never been pure capitalism. Check how the US defence industry works. Looked at in the cold light of day it would be classed as appallingly socialist. The contracts are doled out equally between the contractors to keep them happy.

In certain cases like Lockheed they were told flat out that they were the better candidate but the contract had to go to Northrop to make sure they stayed afloat.

lol yeah, they're doing real well, with Europe on the brink of collapse and the native population getting fucked over by incompetent leaders who refuse to acknowledge that any real issues exist like yourself along with high tax rates and idiotically expensive living costs.

Honestly, the fucking denial is unbelievable.

You act like its worse than America...

You don't think American leaders are doing the same and worse?  American leaders bankrupt other countries for profit...

Honestly, the fucking denial is unbelievable.

It's a shame you believe all the nationalist propaganda you have been fed by the American media... sorry, I've actually visited other countries... it's pretty nice there

It is fucking worse than America, while America's not great by any means and it's going to collapse along with the rest of Europe acting as if socialism is some fucking paragon of economics and is bringing joy and happiness to the world is a total fucking lie and nobody here is pretending that Capitalism is perfect so pretending as if Socialism is great is fucking disingenuous at best. Go and look at the country called Venezuela, that is what happens when you have a country that decides to go fully socialist, I will not be dragged into your bullshit ideology by force if I don't want to when there are so many examples of it failing miserably.

Also, at least in America people still have the second amendment despite constant attempts by the left to get rid of it so they can defend themselves, meanwhile in Europe we are completely fucked if people decide to go on a rampage.

Venezuela is one of the countries that America has bankrupted for profit...

Their hyperinflation is a direct result of American meddling

Yeah yeah, you keep telling yourself that.

Sounds like something a man might say when he's wrong and doesn't have a legitimate response...


The difference between socialism and capitalism is simple:

The leader of Iceland (socialist country) was just forced to resign because he used Mossack Fonseca...

Americans are not on the list from Mossack Fonseca... do you know why?

In America (capitalist country), the billionaires do not need to outsource their corruption to Panama for tax evasion... all they need is to set up the corporation in Delaware... we have corruption built into the system... no need for a 3rd-party country to hide our assets... we're openly corrupt in America

You just said Socialism works and that Capitalism is corrupt and in the same thread just said that the leader of a country you assume to be Socialist a leader of one of them was forced to resign over tax evasion. If there's one thing I've learned on my short time on my planet is the biggest difference between Socialists and Capitalists is that the majority of Socialists are brazen and insufferable hypocrites while Capitalists aren't, at least they don't lie about their intentions and just want to make money.

Stop bullshitting me and trying to make it out as if I'm in the wrong when I point out you are, you aren't going to convince me of anything by lying.

Apparently you didn't read, so I'll repeat it...

Rich people are corrupt in every country... the difference is, America built tax-havens into the system, so they don't need Panama to do their dirty work... Delaware does that job for America...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corporate_haven (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corporate_haven)




Also... when the banks destroyed the economy... America handed them even more money... Iceland put the bankers in jail

Capitalism is corruption at its finest

You're attacking Capitalism purely to cover up Socialisms flaws and it's pretty obvious the more desperate you get about it.

Don't bother arguing with Moloch, he doesn't listen and only reads from very specific sources, thus his knowledge base is akin to swiss cheese.  He's still asserting mixed-economy nations are socialist even after I corrected him (and he only asserts this because he's parroting the aforementioned sources, not because he's actually given it any thought.)  He's also saying Sweden--that place where Muslims are literally overrunning the nation and breaking their welfare system--is doing "well", along with the rest of Europe.  Yeah, apparently Europe is doing well, according to Moloch and his very specific sources; bet you can't guess which ones *cough Forbes The Guardian Huffington Post CNN cough*.

I wouldn't say socialism is losing against capitalism exactly; socialism is self-defeating in the sense that, while capitalism allows us to build up prosperity rapidly, socialism allows us to burn prosperity rapidly (usually for ideological reasons like "feed and house the needy" and whatnot.)  Thus, socialism only ever follows capitalism and only works until there's nothing left to "burn", in which case you either collapse as a nation or go back to being capitalist.  In this sense, socialism always loses against capitalism, socialism is made possible only because of capitalism, and a socialist system which rejects its capitalist counterpart will inevitably fail as it always has and always will, in the same way that someone who spends more than they earn will inevitably go broke and, in the case of having nobody to help them, die.  In the sense that supporters of socialism are losing against supporters of capitalism, I think this was the general case up until recently, as far as the highest-functioning nations went.  It's mostly just the lower-intelligence people who don't like capitalism, because they know they can't compete; lower-intelligence people always prefer socialism in the presence of higher-intelligence people because it's perceived as an easy way to even the playing field: just steal from the higher-intelligence people.  What's in it for the higher-intelligence person to accept socialism?--ultimately they just lose.  There is a real incentive for this individual to reject socialism, just as there's a real incentive for the other individual to accept socialism: the socialist has something to gain, because the socialist is worse off in the presence of someone who is better off.

In other words, socialism prevails when you have a great disparity of intelligence, which can be translated as a great disparity of wealth since higher-intelligence people fare better in their careers.  In a nation where everyone's stupid, or in a nation where everyone's smart, socialism would be pointless because there's either nobody to steal ("redistribute") from (in the case where everyone's stupid) or there's no incentive to steal (in the case where everyone's smart.)  To say that socialism is losing against capitalism (as far as supporters of either go), is to say that there's a small or shrinking gap in intelligence differences.  In nations which low-intelligence people are flooding (e.g. much of Islam) in high-intelligence nations (e.g. much of Europe), socialism is ramping up (until the point that there's nothing left to pillage, which is happening soon for many countries.)

So in this sense, socialism has been winning as of late, particularly considering the west.  But as more and more high-intelligence people grow tired of these low-intelligence people, things are bound to swing in the other direction, or bound to head down the path of the Soviet Union and Cambodia etc.

I am simply pointing out the differences between the two systems...

You are attacking me personally (ad-hominem) rather than attacking my argument

What's with the personal attacks?  Are you 12?

If you believe capitalism is better... bring some facts and evidence, not insults

You are absolutely right The private central bank known as The Federal Reserve Bank destroyed the economy. You know who was a big proponent of central banks? Karl Marx. You don't even know the basis of your own ideologies.

P.S. That wasn't a personal attack, he pointed out your flawed arguments and lack of knowledge. Also I noticed you didn't even attempt to refute any evidence I brought forward in my first post. Are you afraid that I might actually know what I am talking about?

He's trying to claim we're somehow 'personally' attacking him, this is a stupid and standard tactic people like him use to play the victim and derail the conversation because they don't like what's being said and being criticised. You can act like this all you want, I've studied these tricks the regressive left in particular like to use for awhile now, the best way to respond to this is to simply either walk away or just take the piss, because he's run out of arguments so now he's trying for emotional manipulation instead.

I say this because it's true...

You are still going on and on about me, rather than the argument which I presented


The differences between the systems are minor, and no country is just one or the other, all countries are a mixture of socialism and capitalism

Furthermore, the countries which are better or worse have little to do with economic policy and everything to do with corruption

The problems tend to lie with individual people, rather than any problem inherent in either system of governance

Power corrupts, absolute power corrupts absolutely


The downfall of EU has nothing to do with socialism and everything to do with countries like Greece and religion...

The countries which do the best are the most secular (non-religious)... America just happens to be in that category... it's success has more to do with secularism than capitalism

Please quote any alleged personal attacks. As far as I can tell you aren't providing any evidence yourself, you are just producing more rhetoric. Why don't you try debating me instead of arguing with those guys? I noticed you haven't bothered to respond to anything I have said. Are you afraid you can't hang?

Edit: He sure got quiet pretty fast didn't he?

No. Capitalism loves you. Capitalism will let you work for whatever type of thing you desire. There's no way to fight capitalism when it's so unbelievably glamorized with all the lovely and talented famous rich people bragging about their big homes, their shiny cars, fabulous clothes and the great food they get to eat. Great loving capitalism allows you to work for your worth.

I am assuming you are being facetious here, so let me enumerate what the alternative is. Under socialism and communism, you have less or no property rights, and as all other rights stem from property rights (at least in the USA), the removal of your property rights, no matter how small they may be, is a removal of all of your other rights. So, which is better, having no rights and being completely dependent on the state but MAYBE being provided for if the state can afford and manage it, or being independent and responsible for your own well being via work and maintaining your rights?

Socialism already lost and its capitalism's turn

Socialism is all looser. But capitalist system also doesn't give people happiness

Socialism is a FAILED system that has never proven to work, not once.

But first, yes there is a difference between socialism and communism, but they revolve around a general principle. That is, socialism is more focused on the reorganization of wealth throughout a nation. Taking more money from the wealthiest and giving it to smaller income earners through various government benefits in return for a slight (not really) tax increase is a socialist principle. Communism is more focused on the redistribution of ALL things. It believes everyone should have an equal amount of everything.

Of course, all these are paper definitions. We've seen each and every time these systems fail. They cause governments to run high deficits, creating hyper inflation. Take a look at Cuba, as an example. Not a single private business to be found and the government controls all. It is a disaster. Then take a glance at Venezuela. That is all radical left, communism.

Right now, America is a capitalist society with increasing socialist parts. Take healthcare. Obamacare, which is WAY more expensive than just paying insurance, is a socialist idea. A capitalist plan would be to allow us to pay for our own healthcare by using insurance. The price of insurance would be determined by the free market, as it should, not the government.

I understand places like Sweden and other countries haven't turned into places like Venezuela. But that's no excuse to say something like "Democratic Socialism" is less shitty than Socialism. They have VERY high taxes and if we're talking about healthcare, try getting in line waiting. You'll be sitting there for HOURS just to see a doctor.

I understand people don't like capitalism. I get it. It seems like it would be easy if you just take money from rich people and use it. But ask yourself. How are those people rich? They worked! And, if they're richer than you, harder than you! America, and any other capitalist society, is a country with great potential. You need to work hard to survive, and that's what makes the country thrive. Nothing is handed out on a gold platter. Yet people want that because they may be going through debt which they want to forget. It won't work!

Yes capitalism only benefits the wealthiest, but it provides an opportunity for ALL people to become apart of the wealthiest. You just have to work. Each and every time capitalism has been implemented, it's worked much better than socialism. Just work for your money and stop bitching. It's not that damn hard.

It wasn't the banks alone... the banks did not have the power to destroy the economy, until the repeal of Glass-Steagall!

The banks bribed congress to repeal the legislation which prevented them from destroying the economy...

This means that congress is at fault... our capitalist system failed us once again... and once again, due to bribery and corruption...

You might want to do a little research into the economic crash before pretending you know anything about it

Do some research... simply do a little research before talking about things you don't understand... you look stupid when you make false claims like this as your opening sentence

Something is not true simply because you believe it to be true...

Something is not true simply because you refuse to look at the facts

Something is not true simply because you ignore the evidence

You do not define reality... sorry, you are wrong

You have that backwards...

Capitalism ran the planet for 70 years... it's done... it's over... capitalism failed

China... China is the new world leader... and China is... ... ... Socialist!

Are you still defending your stance of, "I'm not making ad-hominem attacks", by talking about me and only me... in a 4th consecutive post?

Are you daft?

Did you even bother to look up ad-hominem?

Here's a link for you... please read it
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ad_hominem (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ad_hominem)

PS. I don't troll forums all day... sorry... I don't show up whenever you cry wolf... that's not how this works

I have no idea why I haven't ignored you yet.

Every time ANYONE makes a post you disagree with, you can't respond with any facts. You literally say do research because you don't understand it.

No, bud, you don't get it! I know you love Bernie and think his plan is great, but why don't you visit Venezuela? Yeah, go live there for even a month and then come back and tell me socialism is good.

Seriously, read the whole text, respond with some good arguments or shut the fuck up. I am right, and you cannot prove me wrong, that socialism has NEVER NOT ONCE worked. If you believe so, PROVE IT.

The amount of bigotry, hypocrisy and double standards that exists inside of you Liberals is baffling.

Who is a Liberal?

Why do you label people you disagree with, "Liberal"?

Have I made any points that are even "liberal" oriented?

Do you understand the liberal position at all?

Do you understand any position besides your own?

I could see you calling me a socialist, but liberal?!?

Pure, hard capitalism without social touch, without any influence of socialism is the worst thing. It's so called "wild capitalism" that we can see in former socialist and comunist countries in eastern Europe. The healthy mixture of these two is what we need.

The fact that the only evidence anyone has used to support their claim that socialism is bad... is...

"A lot of socialist countries have failed"...

Simply shows... you don't have a clue what you are talking about...

1) You ignore the socialist countries that are doing well

2) You wrongly assume that the reason the country failed is "because of socialism"

This simply shows you have not bothered to research the details of the collapse of any country ever... It is never "because of socialism", and always because of corruption in some form or another...

Do some bloody research before spreading false propaganda

Here we go again. You can't respond with facts, just saying shit like "do you even understand the Liberal position?"

Of fucking course I do. I was a Liberal years ago. I voted Liberal far too many times before I finally grew the fuck up and realized how dumb the ideology actually is. I remember being an ignorant Liberal not understanding how the world worked. You know why? Because I had student loans, debt. I was anxious and wanted government to fix it all for me. Liberalism is a dream made up of millenials who need to wake the fuck up!

And yes, read your thread about "feeling the bern". You clearly identify as a Bernie supporter and are thus a Liberal. You know that Bernie is Liberal right? I don't give two shits if he calls himself a "democratic socialist" he's a Liberal.

But no just make up things like I have no clue what I'm talking about.

I must repeat this. GO TO VENEZUELA. GO TO CUBA. LIVE THERE. Let's see how much you like "Democratic Socialism" after you've been robbed of your soul after being there for less than a month.

I'm not ignoring anything. You haven't presented any facts.

Here. Tell me ONE country that is prospering from socialism. One country where their big government works.

Or will you just call me ignorant as you try and reap all tax funds for yourself?

The problem is... you still don't understand simple things...

Like, both Venezuela and Cuba are communist, not socialist...

Also, read my previous post (right above yours) about how this is not evidence of anything

I'm done with this nonsense...

All anyone has done is call me names because they disagree with the facts which I have presented

Not a single person has tried to debate me over anything... simply calling me names, labels, etc

Stupid trolls ruin the discussion for everyone

Only a great fool hates that which he does not understand... like religion... or picking a favorite sports team... or political team...

It's so easy to hate "the other" when you are ignorant of their position/beliefs

Oh please. You're an incompetent moron.

Yeah I just called you a fucking name. Why don't you read all my previous posts that I wrote. They all had points in which you could've provided rebuttals yet you didn't. I wonder why.

Maybe it's because you just want to suck ALL the money for yourself because you think that government will work better when it funds money to YOU. Sorry, that's not how it works.

Stop saying you know everything and no one knows anything and read a fucking history book. Everyone who lives with socialized medicine HATES it. Free college tuition is a joke. Socialism doesn't work.

This is the problem with leftists (because you hate it when I say liberal). You're all too fragile to handle a tough debate and need a safe space. All my posts were fine yet you rebutted them with shit saying I didn't know what I was talking about. Grow the fuck up.

Can't wait for Trump to win.

Are you done attacking a straw-man?  I didn't say any of that...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straw_man (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straw_man)


If anyone should feel obliged to call people names, it's me... yet I don't... why do you think that is?

How can you possibly claim something like, "Everyone who lives with socialized medicine HATES it"?  Not only is this untrue, it shows you haven't bothered to research the subject... It also shows you are ignorant enough to believe that a large group of people could ever agree on anything...

You do call people names. Stop acting as if you're the best person here and that no one else matters.

Why is it that you hate opposition? You can only call people who disagree with you ignorant.

Oh, by the way, I live in a country with socialized medicare. I have to pay high taxes and with our Liberal government, this thing is only going to get bigger. Every time I need to get a doctor, I wait HOURS on end. Stop acting as if you know every thing. In countries with socialized medicine, doctors are underpaid and patients have huge wait times. Many people die because of it.

It's you who's the ignorant one here. But what the fuck am I doing debating with a social justice warrior, black lives matter, Bernie supporter. You're all the same - ignorant towards socialism wanting to vacuum all our taxes out for yourselves. Just wait until a dictator gets into power and throws you on the street like in Cuba. You'll be sucking up to capitalists trying to get out of that country when you realize the socialist dictator, like what happened to the Cubans, will not let them out.

Just mentioning your name and calling on you directly IS NOT A PERSONAL ATTACK. You are extremely ignorant. <Also not a personal attack, an observational statement of your lack of knowledge and unwillingness to learn.

You can't quote a single personal attack above that post BECAUSE IT NEVER HAPPENED. I don't have to look up ad-hominem, because I already have many times. Unlike you I know what the definition of an ad-hominem attack is. Try actually reading what you linked, slowly, your reading comprehension is clearly not the greatest <also not a personal attack, an observational statement of your lack of your reading abilities.

BTW this is called DEBATING buddy, and they do it in schools all over the world as well as many other places. If anyone is trolling it is you.

No you don't show up whenever I post to you, YOU RUN AWAY for fear of having your ignorance exposed.

I simply pointed out that you are doing nothing but denegrating me, rather than my claims and presented fact and arguments

And for a fifth post in a row, you prove me correct

"talking about you" is not the same as a personal attack. Go take a class on logic, you severely need it. BTW my very first post had lots of facts and on topic information, but you just ignored all that didn't you? Could it be perhaps because you are incapable of logical debate and instead would rather feign victim-hood?

Would you like to debate any specific point I have made?

Or will you continue making yourself look foolish for a 7th consecutive post?

What fucking point? Everything you have said is just rhetoric. How about YOU debate MY POINTS. There are plenty in my original reply to this post. Or you could just pretend to be more of a victim. Boohoo.

Remember this? This is me debating and you running away...

https://youtu.be/RqQn2ADZE1A?t=137

All you have done through this entire thread is just make bullshit assertions and try to re-write history in order to suit your 'Socialism is the answer' narrative and ignored any evidence that proves you wrong. Of course people are going to lose their temper with you and by dismissing any points people make further you are only making it worse for yourself. This is why the left is largely done in politics, nobody will take you seriously if you just put your hands over your ears and scream as loudly as possible whenever you have to answer any serious questions about your ideology.

Why are you even posting in these forums if you aren't even going to answer peoples' questions properly? What? You think you could just spam propaganda and people would blindly accept it?

Cue his reply to you with more rhetoric, once again completely running away from even attempting to engage in any actual debate with me in 3...2...1...

Nope, he just decided to run away, a sure sign of his debating abilities.

I don't consider people like you to be much better to be honest, I wasn't very happy when I saw you making a self-moderated thread about Donald Trump, it doesn't do much for your credibility, you win by not letting them derail the conversation with their bullshit assertions, not through censorship.

Well it is an arguement that the US version of capitalism is considered unsustainable in the long run and is due to collapse like the Soviets socialism did.
What I expect is a shift towards a middle value or a form of economics to emerge that is socialist but also capitalist.
We can see some transitions to that from the most capitalist countries so it is interesting to watch.

Excuse me captain better than you. Unlike that toolbag I actually have the capability to have a debate, no one is removing shit here buddy, he still runs away.

Additionally if he could read and follow simple directions HIS POSTS WOULD STILL BE THERE. Funny they all want their safe spaces, but when some one they don't agree with sets up a forum with simple rules they cry and cry about how unfair it is. Let me call the WAAmbulance. Could you possibly be any more hypocritical?

It is impossible to have a factually based discussion when there is nothing but constant derailment of bullshit rhetoric and petty arguing which YOU regularly engage in, aiding the avoidance of fact based debate. Also what makes you think I give a fuck about your judgements of me? You can't do much better than that retard. You just wear your libertarianism/anarchism like a convenient fascia to be disguarded when it serves you.  It is just more trendy to pretend to be something else than what you are. At your core you are nothing more than a closet cry baby leftist like most people who claim to support anarchism.

That's not how free and open debate works you halfwit, by the way, accusing me of all people of being a leftist is just fucking sad.

Your right, it is such a crime to have a single thread with rules of conduct, clearly I am Stalin.  Go cry some more. If you don't like being called a leftist maybe stop supporting leftist ideologies. None of what you call "debate" is debate, it is just mindless rambling and bickering jammed packed full of fallacies derailing ACTUAL DEBATE. When someone whom I don't agree with learns how logic works, they will be perfectly welcome in that thread, until then they can fuck off.

Yeah yeah, keep raging.


With comments like these you're just pretty much proving my point.

I know you are clearly ignorant of this, but logic is a SCIENCE. It is the very basis of language. Without it you are just posting a collection of letters representing various grunts. I am sorry you and others are so poorly educated you can not grasp this basic requirement for actual legitimate debate.

You still haven't even attempted to debate any of this.

https://youtu.be/RqQn2ADZE1A?t=137

Perhaps it is not the same for you, but I will not engage in petty back and forth trolling with you...


Simply because, my time is more valuable... to me anyway... to each their own... if you want to waste your life trolling people you disagree with on internet forums... by all means, it's your life

Please quit pretending you won... or that I'm running away... your entire 4-paragraph rebuttal to my argument consists of, "sure, USA is corrupt, but so is everyone else"

Somehow that proves capitalism is better does it?  (this is a rhetorical question, I probably won't come back to read this trollfest again)

You simply don't have an argument to refute... you didn't say anything with all those words... just wasted words... shameful

If you are so keen on people citing sources, why don't you ever cite a single source? (again, rhetorical)

Please refrain from using words you do not actually know the definition of.

Definition of rhetoric:
1. The art of effective or persuasive speaking or writing, especially the exploitation of figures of speech and other compositional techniques.

1.1. Language designed to have a persuasive or impressive effect, but which is often regarded as lacking in sincerity or meaningful content.

I am attempting to have a debate with you but you are in fact just running away. I explained USING THE SCIENCE OF LOGIC why Capitalism is more functional than Socialism/Communism. You are too ignorant to even begin to have an actual debate, so you just claim there are no points to debate. Conveniently this allows you to maintain your bias unchallenged by simply disregarding everything without critical examination.

Yes and you're not doing Science, you're just making self-moderated threads on issues you care about and deleting the posts of people who try to argue with you.

Yes, IMO Socialism is losing to Capitalism, OP is right. The Socialism I'm talking about is a  social system where one political party (Communist party) rules over the whole country. It is incorrect in this context to say that countries like Denmark or Sweden are socialst, because have always been allies to the USA not to the Soviet Union. In Sweden for example they have the Freedom of the Press Act (Swedish: Tryckfrihetsförordningen), and the Fundamental Law on Freedom of Expression (Swedish: Yttrandefrihetsgrundlagen) and in "socialist" countries you don't have freedom of speech.

IMO NO use of debate/s over those that are almost already dead and stinking.
Both these major systems couldn't give man a 'peaceful life' is the sour truth.
Things only worsen,either way we go.
They are just systems born to see if they work against the 'troubles' man created/creating out of 'blunders'(mainly in the religious,political areas)(yes not mistakes..because only blunders lead to almost irrepairable states/situations in any sphere and at every stage Ex:In medical field,at one stage in the remote past,'choice' was to be made between 'germs produce disease' and 'disease produces germs'(Do not remember the names of the two opposing proponents of these two theories)...The first one became our choice and we know where we are now with respect to 'developments'(even becoming the biggest multi billion industry is also part of this 'development',of course)  in modern medicine and trying to find new drugs after the new drugs to kill the ever changing/mutating germs)...And systems do fail because it's always like stitching 'old cloth'( man-made) that tears up at some other place or at the same place after a stitch is made.(and there are/will be systems that always try to make holes in the name of stitches)
That's what the present social scenario brought/dragged to by the wrong 'choices' of man at every stage from time immemorial.Looks only a brand 'new cloth' is the only way out.Till then we just have no other go than to be puppets at the hands of the 'ruling/reigning people' and their policies.And how this 'new cloth' comes in to being is just a thing of future...and let's hope it happens for sure.

You are way off topic and need to get a life if this is your primary concern. Why don't you make a thread about it so you can cry some more over A SINGLE THREAD with simple rules. Its ok for a bunch of rejects to storm in on Trump meetings and rallies and ACTUALLY DENY those people free speech, but I set up a moderated thread with SIMPLE RULES and OH MY GOD THE HORROR! THE HORROR! You are a closet lefty joke.

Seriously?  You don't know what a, rhetorical question, is?

How did you graduate middle-school without understanding a rhetorical question? (this is a rhetorical question)

Here, let me help you:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rhetorical_question (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rhetorical_question)

Please, stop using words and phrases which you don't know the meaning of, it is sad and pathetic. I had a larger vocabulary than you when I was 12. You are just endlessly avoiding responding to my actual points with your ACTUAL rhetoric. This is just a strategy to continue endless finger pointing and arguing so you can avoid having your ideology critically examined. Show me you are as smart as you think you are, respond to my OP in this thread.

Troll much?

You can't even properly edit a quote... why would anyone listen to anything you say?

You haven't said ANYTHING here besides trolling... you have no interest in a debate... you are simply a retarded troll wishing to remain ignorant

You can't even troll properly... here you are trying to troll me, and failing miserably

You have not made a single point... you have not even refuted my point that capitalism has corruption built into the system, whereas socialism need to outsource their corruption to Panama...

The only thing you have said in this entire thread that wasn't complete trolling, was, "yes, USA is corrupt, but so is everyone else"

You fail... you simply fail... you get an F-

Stop running away. Respond.

Socialism as alternative to capitalism has already lost the war.
But strangely, it does not change the fact that inequalities and struggle of classes are still there.
So, socialism as antithesis is still there buried inside capitalism to solve its critical problems like healthcare and education or luxury consumption.

1) What war?

2) USA declared capitalism the winner... so it is?

What is this, religion?... lets see some facts and evidence to support your opinion

Still running away.

Probably no, the principle of socialism is quantity when it comes to business industry. Quantity is better than higher tax. Hard investment is also better than stacks. Because people wants job. And most of them are in the middle class so therefore if hard investment is priority which is socialism many jobs will create same formula as you lower tax so many foreign investors invest and the economy of your country will boom. Thats the basic principle as well as socialist person is not corrupt so he can implement the profit of his government properly and effectively. Priority is very important than your luxury.

All Ism's weather they be capital , social, communal, (or economic or political) are merely systems which are only as good as the people who choose to utilize those systems.

if you seek to make capitalism beneficial for everyone it will be and if you are greedy and seek only to make it work for yourself you will break it.
such is the problem of Greed VS a Free Market System

If you seek to make socialism work for everyones advantage, then along side private donations given to the communal cause, govt programs can be a wonderful thing (such as in the case of many Canadian Hospitals that also have privately donated equipment which makes them even better socialized hospitals) but if you seek to take advantage of these systems for your own greed, than greedy people can make socialism not work as in many past cases.

if you look at Europe there are many cases where socialism is working well currently, but it works because the people who use that system want it to work.

All systems are just systems, they have no feelings they are only as good as people who try and make them work

Very well said, dude, couldn't have said it better myself! There is no one right way only the way that works for our current situauion!