Bitcoin Forum

Everyone is raving about these overpriced avalon units in batch 3...

However I cant find the price anywhere at all... Can anyone shed some light on the price? thanks!

http://www.btcmu.info/avalon-news/179-the-latest-avalon-announcement-in-china-translated-batch-3-price-and-more.html

88 btc (3 modules)
113 btc (4 modules)

psu +2btc; freight charges +2btc

Hope you bought btc when they were cheap

..or already own some Avalons printing 2BTC a day each.  ;)

thats bullshit ... and unreasonable...

It isn't if you look at the current state of the market.  They have pricing power and the ROI at the Batch #2 price is insane and Batch #1 is the golden goose.

Supply and demand! They're the only shipping ASIC, and they're selling like hotcakes. They can do whatever they want with the price, and people will still buy them.

FWIW, I paid 114 BTC for a batch 1 unit, and 75 BTC for batch 2.

you paid $1,299 + 120 for batch one and $1500 for batch 2.  You sold your coins for that value at the time of the sale.

Those were the terms. Applying bitcoin value retroactively doesn't apply.

Yeah it's completely bullshit, but they have the market cornered.

@Aseras:

Did you end up getting your units yet?

Why does this bullshit statement keep popping up? batch 1 and 2 payments were in BTC (some people were able to do wire transfers). For most, either you had the BTC or you bought BTC.

Supply and demand is fine. Claiming the price is based on ROI is just bullshit though. When was the last time you bought a car and the seller asked if you would be using it as a taxi?

When you buy a taxi.

There are tons of special use vehicles that command a premium because fewer units are made (limited supply).   Try looking up a Black Lincoln Towncar 2005 or newer compared to any other color of the same year (except white).

 

thank you.

Batch 2 had crazy demand for one MAIN reason.  The first two Batch 1 deliveries, PROVED Avalon ASIC was legit.  Only at that point, did the light-bulb come on collectively.   The day of the Batch #2 pre-sale was a animal-house, like Black Friday with the $100 60-inch LCD TV at Walmart :)

Yifu has said that those prices were examples based on current difficulty and that the actual price will be based on difficulty when the units go on sale.

I missed it. Care to point it out?

No

Even if it made 100 btc per day, if the value of them crashes, what then? Bitcoin issue is volatility. Are you in it for money or bitcoins?

The first two batches avalon sold for bitcoins, but the bitcoins were sold instantly by a processor. You may have sent bitcoins but you paid USD for them.

bitcoins value is only useful at the time of a transaction.

comparing historical values one way or the other is foolish.

remember the 10,000 btc pizzas?

Those of you bringing USD into this need to shut the fuck up. This isn't a USD mining machine, you don't buy it with USD, the USD-BTC exchange rate is inconsequential. The exchange rate is only the problem of people who want to be part of the corrupt governments rigged economy. The exchange rate is unrelated to this transaction.

You are buying a device in bitcoins to mine bitcoins to have bitcoins to take part in a bitcoin economy. Anybody who says different is just a profiteer trying to take away from what has been built here.

It is an issue if you need to purchase bitcoins.

It doesn't matter if you purchase something in bitcoins, USD, bottlecaps or seashells. Any currency has a value associated to it.

bitcoin right now has incredible volatility. it can change by the hour. Lately its been going up. tomorrow it could be much less or much more. in a month or two, who knows? We could pop right back down to $5 per btc, or rocket past $200. it's value matters then.

Batch 3 has been made into a gamble because of this on price alone. If you count avalons customer service and shipping rate and order management it's even more of a gamble.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=155345.msg1656559#msg1656559

Thank you, I'm waiting for the newsletter.

IMO, If the hardware costs Avalon $800 to build the ASICS. Then they should charge a markup on top of that for their time and R&D. But stating that ROI is the reason of their price shady to me... We do not know if the Fed will step in within the time of buying an ASIC and your earnings to recoup the cost of the ASIC. And if Bitcoins become unusable due to ISPs blocking bitcoin traffic then you have a very expensive paperweight. Keep in the the word ASIC means Application Specific Integrated Circuit. So its only good for one thing and thats mining bitcoins.... IMO thats a BIG risk to take without knowing the legality and the future of Bitcoin.

As stated i think they should charge the cost to build the ASIC system and then a percentage on top to cover their R&D. But as stated they are the ONLY company on the market and this is a free market so they can do what they want... i am sure alot will still order, but they are really hurting future orders as most do not have that much BTC in the first place. AND alot of exchanges will not sell you that many BTC in one shot.

What about them? You used to be able to buy a loaf of bread for nickle. Prices change.

This applies to all ASICs and all vendors.  If the Feds step in/ISPs block Bitcoin traffic, then everyone's dedicated mining hardware becomes an expensive paperweight.  It's just one of the risks you need to take into account before purchasing mining hardware - whether it's an 88 BTC Avalon or a $39,000 Mini-rig.

And who in the hell are these exchanges which won't let you buy 100 BTC?

The price didn't change. Your money went through inflation over the years.

Your nickel has lost about 97% of it's purchasing power (give or take).

The gas you are pouring into your tank is also paid for in inflated fiat. Every time you see the price go up at the pump, that just means your dollars are worth less to the petroleum producers.

Chances are, if you paid in gold you wouldn't notice the change in price from the 1970's till now. If anything, it should be slightly cheaper.

Money printing is to blame. Each new dollar (from thin air) shaves a little more value off the ultimate pool of currency already in circulation. The value grows but the quality of each dollar does not.

Let's see. Let me put this in perspective for you. When batch #1 went on sale, the price of BTC was around $12. It had recently "crashed" from around $15. Several months before, the price of BTC was less than $6 for a long time. Finally, let me remind you when Avalon was supposed to ship...FIVE months AFTER BFL was supposed to ship. If you want to talk about relative volatility and risk, batch #1 customers risked a lot more paying $1300 for non-existent technology from a bunch of recent college grads in china. You talk about gambling for batch 3...HA! All you have to do now is math now and a tiny bit of guessing.

I'm not saying batch #3 is a bargain. I most likely will not buy myself, but you need a reality check.


Edit: I see that you have a batch #1 order. You should know better than most others that batch #1 was way riskier than now.

Whole lot of greedy people here unwilling to share the profit with the people enabling them to make it.

Avalon should just keep batch 3 and mine with it themselves. Then sell the equipment for whatever once the difficulty makes it less profitable.

Oh I get that completely. My point was that just because something was one price yesterday, doesn't mean it will be the same price tomorrow.

I bought an Avalon with BTC to get more BTC than I invested. This is not a USD forum.

Off and on i hear about exchanges not allowing more $5000 at a time. I am sure larger exchanges like gox will but not all.

+1,000,000 - this is true and I said this last summer.   It is a arms race where only the deeper pockets will get in until we reach equilibrium in difficulty.

they cant block p2p and torrenting with all the money and lawsuits, bitcoin is easy to hide and tunnel. the only way they could block it is to cut the cords.

the problems isn't buying coins it's money transfer/laundering laws kicking in for the $amount transactions now that btc isn't worthless.

https://blockchain.info/charts/market-price

See that, that's a bubble. avalons getting greedy and its gonna bite them in the ass.

yeah I have a wave 1 batch 1 order, for units I still don't have and dhl doesn't see yet either. so I'm well aware of how "risky" it is to be two batches in the hole while avalon is pumping batch 3 right before the btc price collapses after the bubble i see forming.  I've been following bitcoin for a long time, way before the first spike and crash. same thing here, except before it was GPU, now it's asic.

I'm not in btc for the money. I'm a researcher. I'm in it for the fun and novelty. everything Ive made has gone back into the "hobby". New computers, or gpus and avalons.

For those of you complaining about the exchange rate, They just got $715 cheaper in the last 10 minutes  :D

yeah no one believes me when I say btc is too volatile right now....

Indeed.  It's pretty apparent from ASIC threads in general, though, that many people are buying ASICs to get more USD - and those people are the most vulnerable if there's a massive price crash so they want to break even ASAP.  Like any other investment, what works best for an individual will depend on their objectives.

Part of the frustration people are expressing now is undoubtedly due to the perception that BTC mining is no longer a game to which Joe Newbie has access - the barrier to entry is getting higher.  While BFL has a couple of "starter" products, they're unlikely to be profitable and those really are more the kind of units on which people might drop money primarily to secure the network.

If Avalon sticks with this particular pricing model, then drops in price will be predictable.  Other vendors will eventually have to drop their prices, but it's not possible to predict when that will happen.  I think this is a pretty ballsy move on Avalon's part to be honest and it will be interesting to see how it works out.


Which is a potential problem for miners in general rather than Avalon miners in particular and should be factored into everyone's risk assessment when they're deciding whether or not to purchase mining hardware.  At this stage, it's not really an issue for those who don't mine more BTC than they spend/save.  The people for whom it's going to be an issue are those who are effectively mining for USD (and primarily those who convert their BTC to USD through exchanges).

It is rather simple. I bet they have a model which tells them at what price ROI on mining is negative over the lifetime of the product and they sell at this price because it is more profitable than doing all the mining themselves. Well... if they are really generous they might drop the retail price a few percent from that. If it was me I would up the price a few percent just to screw everyone, lol.

Them citing difficulty as a factor in the price formation is pretty much a proof of the above.

To keep proportional comparison,
from 70 to 5 is -14x, then from 70 14x = 980$
from 70 to 210 is x3, then from 70 to -3x = 23$

That said, I beleive in 1000$+ / BTC in few years, but always keep in mid it could be 0 too.. So I hoard some, spent most, and gamble the rest ;)

This

+1

I sold +5k BTC under 1$ and was happy of each trade.. as of today, I do not regret any of those trade made years ago !  I was profitable and happy to do those trade..

In 10+ years, we may say, I was able to buy a pound of meat for 4$, now it cost 80$..  So what ?

the details are up peeps
http://store.avalon-asics.com/?product=avalon-asic-unit

must've changed the page

not work shop
http://anonymouse.org/cgi-bin/anon-www.cgi/http://anonymouse.org/cgi-bin/anon-www.cgi/http://img4.imageshack.us/img4/6910/45318743.jpg
not work proceed to checkout

I can't checkout at all - some password is required

My question is how Much BTC is my Icarus Trade in now worth? Is it still tied to the 300USD, or do I get a BTC value for it?

Look at this https://i.imgur.com/ngdsWhh.png
Is this real?  Auction ended, 76 bids....

Item page for sceptics http://bit.ly/16Rr0oE

Yes, it's real. Avalon pre orders and even early BFL pre-orders are going for 15x+ what people payed for them.. pretty crazy!

I was surfing around ebay when I thought I'd see what pre-orders were going at. I saw that auction with 20 minutes left at $15,000 and I almost crapped my pants.  :D ;D

All the more reason batch 3 price is justified I suppose.

Price for a batch-2? I can see how it makes sense if you can get ahead of the curve but it is an awful risk.

Batch 3 delivery is a long way away.  A lot can happen.  Even things that nobody saw coming.  Hell, BFL might even ship.

For anynone who ordered a batch 1 or 2, is the freight charge exactly 2BTC, and is it the same for Canada?

Batch 2 did not have a separate freight charge, it was incorporated into the price.

Batch 1 was 1200 plus 120 ship

Batch 2 was 1500 shipping included.

Four modules and a PSU selling for BTC115.000 or US$7920 as I write this.  Dammit man!  I'd only set aside US$4000 for this...now I'm priced right out of the market.

You Must Be Special To Own one Of These At Those Prices   I  Will Never As I  Dont Have It Like Some Do   

You could have bought btc way back when. I bought mine for 13/btc making my cost cheaper. It's still worth it.. you'll make your investment back in no time.

I'm reeeeeally kicking myself for not buying $4000 worth back when it was US$5 per BTC.  Stupid stupid stupid.  I'd have a Corvette worth of BTC if I'd done that.

Ah, well.