Bitcoin Forum

Enough guys... the more we feed these greedy sellers the more they will increase their prices...

If everyone stops buying btc from India they will be forced to revert to old prices.

Waiting for price to be as good as preev market place price then it's fine this is India not North Korea or Pakistan... even then I suspect those countries will be easier n cheaper to buy btc.

Demand > Supply

 

 :o ::) >:(

It's not about greedy people making money, but bitcoin being cheap and available to all.

Thank you.

Dont buy No demand.

Lolz, it's not about sellers selling their bitcoins, it's about people who are willing to buy even at those prices because of demonetization, and as sellers do know that this is the only time to make money, do you really think that this will get back to its original prices so easily?

Let me add something to the ongoing discussion:

Demand>>Supply

There is not a viable channel to buy bitcoins from existing international exchanges like bitstamp because wire transfer is cumbersome and a time taking process.

so i am form india form where should i buy the bitcoin and why should stop buyinf bitcoin from india its better to level up ur own county

Feel free to buy from wherever you want to buy. Also if you try buying form international market who will pay the wire transfer fees and who pay the fees if paid from Credit cars if that is possible. And if you need btc will you just wait to prices to drop. Good decision go ahead and buy from India.

At the moment it's still cheaper to buy via paypal from international exchanges.

That's not the point how were they buying before and selling for 1-2k inr above preev rate ?

The point is people who are buying are overcharging for selling. One person would've started and everyone follows.

If we just stop buying from them they will have no choice but to reduce the prices.

Now due to the skyrocketing prices even new xchanges etc will look to add the same prices.

https://btc-e.com/



will give solutions for better rate else find a person who accepts paypal ,neteller or other payment options in localbitcoins who have good rating reputation among other dealers.

Yes but I am finding a solution which we can buy for market rate + 20$ 

Working on it soon.

Will keep you guys updated.

In the mean time dont feed the greed

Anybody who buy's at that price is Either
1) A fool
2) Too much money to throw.


That's why I said no 1 should encourage them otherwise they will keep increasing it.

Btc is already rare in India,  If we buy from International exchanges now it's much cheaper..

I can even buy from em and sell for 55k inr and still make profit no reason for those greedy people to charge 20%.

Demonatization is just an excuse, Infact due to demonatization they should reduce prices so that demand will be high and more buyers will buy more btc regularly.

Instead they want to target the rich and ignorant people who never heard of btc by over charging.
Look at other countries ,

I had seen a similar pricing several years ago, when the norm used to be mtgox + 30%+.
It was not sustainable then, and it wont be sustainable now.

This current wave is being run, under the guide of demonetisation and is going to hit quite a few people by surprise when the price tanks.
We dropped KYC few days back for BTC deposits and withdrawals on Coinsecure and a majority of trades under that tier have matched or placed higher prices than what we were seeing. Not all of these users are Indian accounts, so it is not just India that is contributing to this wave.

Lot of Bitcoin users in India are freelancers, their job is to do stuff that they are good at. Imagine if another part of their job was to find an way to exchange their Bitcoin internationally. How much time will they lose on this?

There are big problems with purchasing Bitcoin from outside the country and should only be undertaken if the person really knows what they are doing and if they are willing to risk.

Add the costs of interchange, tax consultancy, regulatory filings and a bunch of questions that your bank WILL ask you and it becomes a bit tougher for anyone to exchange outside the country.

Mass adoption has come to India, at the cost of a premium, primarily because India was quite laid back when India was matching international prices, etc. We have seen huge premiums grow globally in any conflict/ controlled region and there is hardly anything that can be done until Bitcoin circulation increases in that region.

I personally do not condone the premiums as the creation of arbitrage funds Bitcoin by itself.
Coinsecure is a platform for users to set their desired prices and to win a match if there is willing counter party and surprisingly, even at these prices, people are willing to buy and sell. And yeah, our volumes and traffic have shot up like crazy and a majority of trades have been buy orders. Try anything to normalise the market and those trades will get completed immediately, so how does anyone reduce premium?

If there needs to be a drop in prices, someone has to flood the market with cheap Bitcoins. Now where do you find those?

lol ? You wouldn't miss a chance to promote coinsecure right ? Get off your comfy seats with high investors in your business,getting shit commercialized.For once,think about the community and decentralization.I'd die before using any Indian exchange systems.

No, because thats the only data I am sure about.
And do not make off topic posts with personal comments and thoughts.

We're talking about "buying bitcoins in India" [that's what the title says,if I comprehended it correctly].How my thoughts about coinsecure makes the post off-topic?If not for personal comments,whom should I post my opinions for ? As a moderator you surely understand what off topic posts are.(I assume).

https://app.xapo.com   provides you to fund with neteller accepts indian debit and credit cards,
while opening neteller account kindly use preffered currency as usd or euro.

^^ What she said,

As a currency exchange site Benson you should have the guts lead the investors to doin it the right way instead of fueling their greed. I guess you get good comissions too.

I don't get commissions :(
Not sure how commissions can work on a realtime exchange.

Can you explain to me what does lead investors to doin it the right way means? Especially when we have 0 ways to control rates.

This screenshot shows a pretty good visual on who is setting prices in India.

http://imgur.com/SS8ZGWh (http://imgur.com/SS8ZGWh)

And you ladies think that I am evil -.-

There is being a huge difference between the spreads of exchanges from yesterday. Not sure why such a difference exist?

Unocoin -  67952 - 61666 ( Diff is 6286 Rs)
Zebpay - 65031 - 61779 ( Diff is 3252 Rs)
Bitxoxo - 65617 - 61177  ( Diff is 4440)

First of all non of them exchange. Exhcnage in India in my knowledge only 2

1 Coinsecure
2 Btcxindia.

Where price depends on peer to peer means buyer and seller decide.

In other site owner decide according to demand and supply.

There are only two exchanges in India: Coinsecure & BTCX. Unocoin and Zebpay are brokers if I may with their own prices as per their will.

CS does share exchange data along with and you can see what has brought the price change. BTCX iirc does not even share volumes.

Looking at the volumes from their(CS) data, the price fluctuations do not make any sense whatsoever. Its a good time to be a BTC retailer. Everything goes :(

Not saying you evil but it's definetly not good what's happening at this rate the price wont go down anytime soon. This is not what bitcoin was designed for.

pirces are dropping  in all indian exchanges  :o :o   :'( :'( :'(   i expected this will happens, but not to be very soon >:( >:(    :'(

:D
As mentioned, those high prices were never sustainable for anyone setting it.

dude a 1-2% drop is nothing.

It used to be 1-2k above preev rate... that was normal pricing... What happened to that... Greed took over what else?

lol it's dropped more then 5k, I enjoyed this artificial price so much.

If you know what will happen you can earn big money but you must also hold big money for earning money from these kind of movement.


P.S. Benson can't do anything for this movement when price depends on peer to peer. People buying at higher price on their will.
      Benson or coinsecure or other site don't have any involvement on this.

yeah me too enjoyed this indian exchange prices , but not at this moment losing arbitrages;) :-[

Prices still up more then 10% from international market. So there is more space to earn. Just need to focus where you can earn good money.

yep waiting for the higher price once again  ;D ;D ;D :D

If big whales dump their wallet, price is sure to fall again. I really don't think this is the work of a single group or organization. Maybe this became a trend where everyone wanted to increase the price, as they know we buyers won't stop buying them. It's of no use to stop buying since we are not the only buyers of BTC.

So what international market are you referring to ? Where do you buy from ? I tried em all... still no good luck purchasing from India.

yes definetly they all got together to hike up prices...

Like they all agreed to increase price .

Its india and lots of black money coming in bitcoin. That is why price is that high brcoz they dont care about how much they are loosing.

https://xapo.com/   ----->    https://www.neteller.com/en  ------->   https://www.ranexchanger.co.in

earlier they accepts inr deposit through wb21 banking system , due to demands in indian markets they have withdrawn inr deposits temporarily

There is so many ways buy from International market. But it's complicated becoz if you buy international market and sell in Indian market explaining to tax authority not easy if you go through indirect way.

Dropped more than 5k ? I never supported that 5k hike in the first place.

Either old prices or no go

Lol it's not only about you, if there is buyer who like to buy at high price then there is lot's of seller too who like to sell @ 20-30% premium.
In every country price determined through their demand and supply.

Even I saw when international price was 22k and indian price was less then 18k and that is in huge quantity.

What does that have to do anything with price of bitcoin in India ?

Obviously but those buyers dont know any better. and it's not good for an entire country to be dependent on a few price fixers.

lol then you don't know anything about bitcoin price, manipulating in btc price even too much in international market then indian market.
Indian market manipulation run around 15-30 days max but in international market it's going months and months even you can't think.

I disagree atleast in international market you have some exchanges offering 0 % like Circle.

What do you have in indian market ?  Even scam exchanges like Igot.com claiming they not scam now offering same price as indians because they greedy.

Looks like the price is coming back down. Down by about 7K from what it was per btc from a couple days back. Supply and demand really did hit the price hard for the exchanges . I personally feel it was related to the demonetization move.

Yes demonetization gave an excuse to sellers to increase price... anythin is still possible.

What I really want to see is preev + 1-2k inr .

That's a really good rate dont you think?

So the fun time over .. back to reality now slowly for India ..
well i must say enjoyed a lot during the price hike .. Thanks to Moneypolo gave me clean path to enter to btc-e with sweet rate and then come back to my favorite coinsecure for sale :P
Enjoyed while it lasted ... now hope the original BTC price hikes to 800$ then another enjoyment starts .. :)

you crazy guy price is still hiked its still 100$ above market rate.


Do explain me how you purchased from BTC-E I would like to do the same ...

I bought some coins via paypal yesterday at cheaper than today's price ...

Simply register at Moneypolo , Get yourself verified , Get physical VISA CARD for 15$ for withdrawal at local Indian ATMs , Then deposit with your debit card [ 4% + conversion rate INR TO USD ] then generate BTC-E Code in your moneypolo wallet 1% fees and then Deposit to BTC-E with 0% fee and enjoy BTC . Remember their verification is very hard , to get yourself Level 2 verified you need to video chat with their verification team :P , i am Level 2 verified in Moneypolo now and its quite amazing and fast and legal .

 ;D

cheers    ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

Most amazing thing is the VISA Card :P , i tested and it withdraw flawlessly in Indian ATM :) remember per withdraw charge is 3.5$ so withdraw big only .. per day limit 2000$ max .

So how much fees do you get charged totally ? Still inefficient as you lose money on top of fees converting inr to usd .

for withdraw let say you load Moneypolo with BTC fees 1% and then withdraw via VISA Card fees 3.5$ whatever amount you withdraw fixed .. max withdraw per day 2000$ :) ; small withdraw = loss but big withdraw profit and anonymous . As there is nowhere PAN involved with Moneypolo .. :); i tested withdraw 2000 INR , i ended up 1700 INR in hand with my new card ...

there are several scam accusation against moneypolo and so i am not sure about it and are you telling me that you could withdraw 2000 dollars or 2000 rupees using that service.We can sell the coin in the exchanges here in India and i am happy with the current price  :)

Whats wrong if price is high in india? Almost everything has different prices in different countries.Price of petrol for example, it is cheaper in some of our neighboring countries but we are paying more so whats wrong if due to high demand price of bitcoin is also high in india?

i can say scam accusations are false and no solid proof , i also checked those and those who did accusation failed to proof actually about it , I don't think MP scam cause they are registered with FCA and legal Financial institution you can really mark a company with some one or two scam accusation in here lol , One more thing you may check when you see BTC-E deposit via bank wire they use MP as their Bank wire deposit method and you will see Mayzus Bank details on BTC-E Wire deposit page and i don't think that Giant exchange like BTC-E will use some processor which is you say scam for their Bank Wire deposits for their customers and i did transaction over 2000$ now and zero issue always fast support . Also i told that you can withdraw 2000$ not rupees lol per day max via MP VISA Card .. https://moneypolo.com/int-en/products/prepaid-cards/    ; and you can use that card anywhere in the world visa accepted , shop online . There is no other company provide Card to Indians [ As far i know ] , every international company has restriction for Indians for their card service . This is the main benefit of it besides Direct BTC-E contact for Indians with lowest fees than anything else out there .

There is nothing wrong in having higher prices in India, but due to these sudden price hikes that took place just because of demonetization, have you noticed that many other International exchanges have now restricted Indians to be able to buy Bitcoins at their websites? You cannot buy bitcoins even from Coinbase anymore? Don't you think that's unfair?

Which exchanges used to allow Indians to buy bitcoins? I have heard only Coinmama and 1-2 other sites and Coinbase has never allowed any other country except US to buy/sell bitcoins. When did they allow Indians?

Are you noob or what, when coinbase allowed indian can buy from them even you can't sell there. They never allowed it's always restricted there.
You can only use their wallet service nothing else.

i was also wondering the same thing , Coinbase never ever had Indian customers to purchase btc from them lol .. I don't know when he saw coinbase offered Indians to purchase bitcoin in their platform .  ;D

Considering so much of fees and formalities involved in doing this, its not at all easy it seems. Also just for example could you provide how much did 1 btc cost you buying including all the fees from Moneypolo and at what rate did you sold to Coinsecure?

Buying from BTC - E did profit when price was premium in India , but now its not much difference. I am not saying its the best option but at least it the best option to hold a foreign VISA Card and stay anonymous for your spending and purchase online items with it , withdraw via ATM  . Besides it gives you direct and lowest fee access to BTC-E .

Nothing wrong with having high prices in India ?

Seems you didnt understand the concept of bitcoin my friend.

That would be interesting. However I haven't come across any exchanges that accept PayPal, except VirWox. And that too comes at around 10% premium price due to transfer commissions and INR-USD-SLL-BTC conversions.

Are you using any other exchanges than VirWox for PayPal transactions?

This seems like a really interesting way to go about the current prices but as a user earlier pointed, Demand > Supply so people who urgently want BTC will obviously won't mind paying more than preev rates and end up giving more $ to the seller.

There is lot of Ignorance about other options available for purchasing bitcoin. One could buy from bitcoin exchanges as well (though very few are offering prices compatible with preev price).  Purchasing bitcoins from internation market is bit difficult. There was a thread in forum where a veteran member shared a cheaper way to purchase bitcoins from international market. Problem was the restrict verifications or rules followed by that company. I'm not able to find it readily now.

If anyone knows how to purchase the bitcoins from international market without much hassle then it would make much difference. For some going through procedure hassle is secondary if rates are at preeve level.

Dont forget both demand and supply can be manipulated.There are only few exchanges in India and I think they have secretly made some kind of cartel to keep the price higher than international price.
What is more frustrating is that their sell price is much lower than buy price.

Should only the exchanges be blamed and not people trading there?
What do you think? Are these exchanges only liable for those prices?
No. We also need to be blamed for it because we want those prices to be there (either demonetization is the reason or greed), but we need it.
And I don't think there is anything wrong if the price is high in India compared to International markets, because it is an opportunity for everyone to make good profits from these, and this is kind of a commodity market, so no one should be blamed here.

I agree here. These exchanges charge high rates as they even buy bitcoins from users at those high rates (usually above the market rate). If the users wouldn't be buying bitcoins from the Indian exchange sites. International exchange websites too sometimes have a rate which is 5% higher or lower than the market rate and their withdrawal fee is also high at time (sometimes it's as high as 3% which makes it the same case with Indian exchanges). But I agree it's more in the case of Indian exchanges. It's not only the users fault but the demand and supply as well play an important role.

People should always buy bitcoins in india .it is not so popular india but it is also too much in demand than the supply its for sure .bitcoin companies should rise up so that they can the suppy the demand that is rising in india .for me i do not buy bitcoins , i only earn it through signature campaign . 

You can now purchase Bitcoins from Bitstamp using your Credit/Debit Card!:

https://www.bitstamp.net/article/debit-cc-payments-bitcoin-now-extended-beyond-eu/

Its all game of demand and supply. After all each trader wants to sell at high and buy at low. Otherwise how will they make profit.

Sometimes it seems like bubble from Real-estate. Where builders increased prices so get bigger share, and customer kept on buying because prices will keep rising. More purchase more price rise,  vicious cycle ran for quite some time and then bubble bursted.
Unless there is better option of buying bitcoins from international market, locals will keep on pushing for more profit.

It is similar to share market or property buying/selling .people invest as to get profit.there is advantage on seller side as they can sell btc at high rate than international exchange  and disadvantages on buyer side but its is more convenient than buying on external exchange.

Well for Indians there is no advantage/disadvantage because you buy from India and sell in India. As you cannot afford to buy from International markets due to the laws governing and also there are huge fees for making transaction though cards, withdrawal fees etc.

I think you can buy through neteller or other online cash wallet system through direct sellers from other country , that will not be problem for you. but buying and selling in india through indians will be more benefit.

Have you tried purchasing bitcoin using debit card and if so what is the charges for doing these kind of transactions and what is the conversion charges,when using neteller there is a specific charge as they would say 4.9% but they used to debit more than that and it is said to be conversion charges,so i want to know how much are they charging for every transaction.

I tried going into Bitstamp in first week of Feb and using Credit Card option. I got a message saying the service is being rolled out gradually and may be available within next few days. I will try checking again this weekend probably.

Not sure how much Bitstamp would charge, but all Credit Card companies levy a "Markup Fees" of around 3.5% on all international transactions, so that should be taken into consideration.

Do you know if there is any restriction for buying internationally and could fall under some Act of FEMA? Did you do any research or just buying it and then it can fall you in trouble? Kindly consult your CA and get advice.

I should probably do that, thanks.

However I don't think there should be any trouble in doing international spends unless you're doing any money laundering. It would be just like purchasing something from amazon US site and paying with credit card or PayPal. Bitcoin is not yet classified into any particular goods/services, so that would be safe. To be on the safer side, I would just log all my Bitcoin-related purchase/sell trades so that I have all records if someone comes knocking.

RBI is just 'observing' Bitcoin, not putting any restrictions.

Here concern is more on sending money outside india instead of getting in India. However I don't think purchasing bitcoins from International market could land you in legal trouble. Somewhere on one of thread, one of veteran mentioned purchasing bitcoins from International market.
It is always better to get facts correct than feeling sorry later. Consult with proper CA and then proceed. Make sure to share your experience here.

yeah prices here are highly inflated better buy from international sellers who are way cheaper.

Yes Indian exchanges are making hay while sun shines.They are selling at exhorbitantly high price.I think this amount to unfair trade practices but since bitcoin is not regulated in India,we have no legal recourse.

You are forgetting they are just not selling, Indian exchanges also buying in highly inflated price. So how it is unfair trade practice.

How can you say they are also buying from India?They buy it from international market and sell to indians at higher price.Most Indians are not aware of international price or International sellers so they have no option but to buy from these exchanges.

lol, you can sell yourself in exchange if you want to sell your btc. Market price is less then 85k and they are buying around 94k in every indian exchange and site. Like Zebpay, Unicon, coinsecure .

Today out of blue zebpay dropped bitcoin price to 83k and after time it was switched to the 91k. Now imagine situation of people who initiated the trade by putting money when rate was 83 and by the time their transaction was cleared by zebpay, rate was back to 91k.  :P

Wow this would have hit a jackpot those who have purchased it but I am sure that selling price of zebpay would not have increased this way as thier buying price rose. Currently thier buy is @ 91500 and Sell @ 85000. So that a huge spread between them 6500 Rs for just 1 btc.