Bitcoin Forum

Looks like the bottom was 8XX, now that the hard fork fears are going down and bitcoin unlimited is pretty much dead beyond any reasonable expectative, I can see more and more people jumping back in the Bitcoin train. Looks like ETH already peaked and BTC bottomed.

Yep, most people who invest in alts only do so to be able to use them on a pump to then sell & increase their bitcoin stash.

not all of them, did you see decred? it rose very high 0.02 per decred in 1 day, so unless more money are pumping decred, i see that a portion of the value of bitcoin is still in the altcoin section, you can just move 1B from bitcoin, and do an insane pump on all the altcoin, because they all have a very ow marketcap, and 1B is only 5% of btc value

Are businesses


It has always been this way, people want profits and will use the necessary means to make a profit.

Some alt coins are rising in value and are gaining more space

ETH is still trade in much higher volumes than Decreed. It just money from DASH, ZEC and other smaller shitcoins that went to Decreed.

The market had to change eventually. We hit way down at 66% BTC dominance vs alts thats pretty insane. I'm expecting a run to about 80% again sometime.

I'm not sure if it's even the people who were selling their coins.
I suppose it's mainly a relatively small groupe of traders who were dumping their coins.
hopefully they have to buy them back at a higher rate than they sold it...

Panic sellers who sold all their holding of bitcoin for fiat as well for altcoins would now think back and realize how potential is bitcoin. The price withstand without falling steep even on hard situations itself shows the trust it has gained than the Bitcoin Unlimited which as a temporary solution got existed.

Alts such as ETH and Dash will go down anyway as their price levels simply aren't sustainable. At some point even less knowledgeable people will realize that both alts are heavily overbought, and thus not worth investing in. It's just a matter of time before the pumpers realize that barely anyone is buying their extremely overpriced coins. People with common sense avoid using these coins as hedge. It's too late for that.

It was pretty obvious that the altcoin surges were just fads.  I think that people saw that they were getting pumped and a lot of big money joined in to soar to the top and, now that they've reached it (consistently for several days), they've decided to start dropping out.  I still think there are some naive newbies who think that DASH is going somewhere though (ETH probably is going somewhere but never as high as Bitcoin), but they'll drop out along with the people who just want to increase their stake in Bitcoin.

Right move for now is to open SHORT position on margin trading for ETH so that you can keep earning bitcoin while ETH get dump all the way down to 0.02BTC level.  ;)

Did I miss something !? no HF ? BU dead !!?
hope it is

BU isn't dead yet unfortunately but the last time I looked Core had over taken them. BU has lost some support I believe.

You are most probably right but I do watch every sunday bitcoin prices are trading positively. But I am too very much sure bitcoin prices have tested the bottom already and we can see some range bound before making another round of rally like breaking $1200 or $1250 levels.

When bitcoin prices are doing well, it is common people are coming back to bitcoins by reducing their holds of altcoins, hopefully this trend will continue to make bitcoins to bounce back to find new ath again.

i always love seeing the downfall of altcoins just as much as i love seeing the pumps. for the past few days i have been warning people on here and another forum to be careful with alts and don't fall for their lies of more rise. now i laugh at those who didn't listen. so far dash has gone down 0.031BTC and ETH is following it with slower speed but it is happening.

BU needed to be alive in order to die! and it never saw the light of day!

Yes they are not likely to get any support from other miners and few miners who were supporting them have already started to left them. On top of this, recent tweet from owner of one of the largest bitcoin mining pool (F2Pool) made it clear that HF will never get 75% support to get activated.  ;D

The bigger the alts become, the more likely they are to have their own maximalists. This is no longer 2013. Some of the stuff floating around is here to stay. Throw in all the USD options now too and there's no real desire or need for many people to go back to BTC.

All this was temporary and people understood bitcoin will always be on top of all alts.

Yep everyone getting into bitcoin, i bought a few coins while price was at $920 couldn't miss the opportunity ;). dash is going down hard lol.

Lol nice!

Funny is that when the price of Bitcoin is increasing, people are cool and excited about Bitcoin's future. But if Bitcoin is dropping and altcoins as result go up, the same group of people will then lose faith in Bitcoin and start thinking that altcoins can potentially surpass Bitcoin. Not only the price of crypto in general is volatile, but also the people here. It's mind boggling how easy people lose faith in Bitcoin just because the price drops. Some even push it so far, that they even believe current fud will make the price sink to sub $100 prices....

That is my point, too. Technologically, alts got few steps forward comparing to the 2013, when we had plenty of clones and premined coins and pretty much nothing else.

Well it was always like that. Most of us who have been around since the beginning became immune long ago. BTC has problems, but there were problems in the past as well. Eventually, it gets sorted out and we move on.

Ya this is totally what is happening and i don't think we can call all this what happened a coincidence , if you see the price of most of the alts like eth,dash went really high almost reaching to the price they have never reached before and during this we the price of bitcoin literally fall to 900$. And now dash going down to 80$ and bitcoin again increasing. This is surely all planned by someme millionaires for sure and a coincidence like this is not possible

Because they can see that bitcoin's price is pumping again, it's a normal move by traders. Probably they earn some already with their alts and together with the increase of bitcoin's price, they want to come back again for purchasing bitcoin while the price is low. They are seeing the potential of it and it can possibly pump anytime from now.

Agreed, because alts have been pretty good in proving their technologies against bitcoins like Monero and Dash which are being used more against Bitcoins because of their anonymity feature that Bitcoins does not possess to such extent that these give. It's alt's time, but still OP is right too that people are moving their money back into BTC when selling their alts, the next step of getting out of BTC is on them only, but according to the price increase, I don't see they must be selling currently.

It's still to be seen how they'd handle actual usage though. I can't be arsed to research myself silly, but there seem to be no shortage of potential scaling problems with other coins too, let alone how they'd stand up to a regular beating the way BTC does all day and every day.

This is called network effect. The first one has always to stand up the toughest beating, but if that goes well it eclipses the rest.
I agree that altcoins have yet to prove if they can be valid alternative, and there will be probably many new hurdles on the way, but we are slowly getting there.
The top altcoins are already for at least couple of years around (some even more), which is ages in terms of altcoins, and slowly getting more popularity, with excahnges where you can trade directly fiat to altcoins gaining in volume. It is a matter of time till we get there and try to challenge network effect mentioned above.

True, but the thing is that Bitcoin is growing and thus more new people find their way to this forum as well. Most people that were here early indeed know how to deal with all kinds problems, but that of course doesn't go up for those that are here new and don't really know what exactly makes Bitcoin superior to altcoins. They just look at the price that goes up, and oh, X coin has a fantastic future. If that same coin goes down in value, it's rubbish and will soon become obsolete. That's their "logic".

The thing is though that it's quite conceivable that an alt could eclipse BTC in market cap and volume yet still be effectively unproven. That may not end too well if they actually started to use it in the way BTC is now. The majority care more about profit than anything else.

I wonder how things would look without Poloniex.

In reality altcoins are not offering you much, altcoin developers can only promise that their coins will be used on daily basis.
That adoption will be great and coins will be used by merchant and services. But where you can use your Dash or Monero beside black markets?
Real usage of altcoins is almost non existent -  they are speculative asset and nothing more.

Dash has been dropping, but Etherium seems to be holding around $50. I wouldn't buy either right now since the prices are so high, but they are worth watching for a bargain.

I think its 1 week or 2 weeks ago that dash was drop from $100 value an now the price is $81 ethereum was drop from above $50
And looks like they are going back to bitcoin since the price for bitcoin past few days is low and now the price was increase back to 4 digit..

It looks like those who bought many of those coins are getting back to bitcoin since they got some good profit on the pump that happened on the two altcoins mentioned. Though I think this might contributed on the current dump in price that we seen in btc, I think many of those smart ones that heard the fud or spread it had bought any of these two altcoins and are now selling it because they got profit. That's how it always is.

Awesome!!
Bitcoin is heading towards into the moon again.  And now lets wait for  1500$  price  im seeing this price after a month or two..
The best thing to do is buy and buy then hold.

the altcoin dump is speeding up today.

this is the problem with altcoins and when you pump them, people are only in it for a short term profit and nothing else. and this means they don't care about anything else, like the future of that altcoin or the features they offer. they just want to find a top to dump.

and right now there is a small fear of missing out about bitcoin which is going to increase each passing day. and when people start having bigger fear that they missed bitcoin rocket, they dump everything else to come back to it and we will see a fast rise up in bitcoin while all the altcoins go back down.

Yes,its time for people to get down from the altcoin electric train and caych the bitcoin bullet train.Interesting fact here is when bitcoin bullet train moves forward,the altcoin electric train will move backward.Bitcoin rally begins.

Couldn't have said it better. People however don't look at things from that point as they just see what they want to see (cherry picking). People think that the more features altcoins have, the more their beneficial/usability aspect is compared to Bitcoin. But the far majority of the features that altcoins offer are nothing more than gimmicks. They are meant to trap in people that will end up holding a bag of insanely overpriced coins that enjoy no real world usage. Like seriously, who buys Dash at +$100 (now it's closer to $80), and Ethereum at $50, and still think they are a fantastic investment? ???

based on what i have seen the reason why this is happening is because market is full of "trader wannabes". if you look around when someone asks how to make profit they suggest trading, and then when you look around more you see them call trading as gambling.
this only tells you that these people are "gullible". you tell them ETH or Dash is going to replace bitcoin and they rush to buy them to become rich when supposedly their prices reached $2000 but they face the reality soon enough and have to sell with a big loss and come back to bitcoin and start licking their wounds.

keep buying and just remember fluctuation always present inside crypto and looking at it right now, its seems that its ready to go
up again to 1100$ let see if how many months we need to reach 1500$ just keep holding and just watch the movements.

It's mind boggling how stupid certain people can be. In normal circumstances it's common sense that would tell you to stay the heck away from coins that are badly pumped already, no trading expertise required here. But these people go completely nuts on whatever comes at their way, and dive with full confidence into something that is on the edge of falling down in pieces. There is a saying; Greed makes blind - and that's really the case here. It will be a very expensive lesson for them.

Looks like OP was right. Bitcoin is going up and all alts have been on the red, except 3 big winners:

Bitcoin Plus
Bitcoin Dark
Bitstar

People holding coins got rich last night from those, and they are still looking healthy for the uptrend.

many alt have still a high value, they are not exactly dumped, they are still at 2x their value of what was their value when bitcoin was dumped, this is still a win win situation, because you have more money made on alt, and now more money that coem form the bitcoin that is pumped again, double profit

The only people holding them would be the ones who initiated the bonkers uptrends. As far as I can tell they were borderline forgotten until this 'adoption' occurred. Oblivion will return in a few days or weeks.

Trade situation is like that, sometimes the news and business interests is required here, no one wants to lose their investment. Trading will be like that forever, sometimes rise sometimes down, always looking for opportunities to make a profit and it is an opportunity for people to gain advantage. So I guess there's nothing to worry about.

It happens all time, when bitcoin trend goes down some traders move to alts, and now bitcoin price goes up they sell alts and return to bitcoin.

It is really good to see a bottom price just above nine hundred dollars which i cannot expect those range a couple of months back and now the new minimum is above the $900 range and it is always recovering above the three digit value and it shows the support we have even with the market speculation and if we are able to settle things we would cross new barriers with another bull run without any doubt.

traders are always in both markets they usually don't "go there".
what changes is that when bitcoin is not performing well, altcoin pumpers use it as an FUD to pump their own thing. and when they do, obviously that attracts a lot of money. and when pump is done traders have more money because of the big profit altcoin pumps give them, and they invest that money in bitcoin which causes the bigger rise.

Who they are? its the first time that i read it

just open coinmarketcap.com or any other altcoin exchange there is and sort their lists based on 24 hour change and you will see which coin was the "pump of the day" that day.
and these 3 has been pumped recently. there is no need for you and I to have even heard their names, the pumpers start pumping these coins without any reason. it is all the money they have been earning in the past weeks from big coins that they are now investing in random smaller coins to pump them and increase the profit.

Don't heard about them either, Is that a new coin? Since totally i doesn't read any good/bad articles about them or maybe i miss the details since im quitely busy on these past days.

But i believe their down thrends is just part of the tricky flactuation on certain exchanger and we can't point out that this is happening since stakers are returning back to hodl bitcoin for good.

well you know what, there is nothing bad in these people... if they want to go out of BTC then let them. BTC price drop means another great entry for us... Someone's stupidity is someone else leverage.

today many people who leave altcoin. they are increasingly interested in bitcoin so their focus to trade bitcoin. they sell almost all of its altcoin. they panic look the prices of altcoin declining .

I don't worry about the price of Bitcoin is increased because I am trade Iconomi coin (ICN) at Kraken.
We can see that how highly the price ICN now, it's amazing. Yeah now the price ICN is +60k.
So, Not all of altcoin will be down when the price of Bitcoin going up.

They already know that bitcoin is the strongest of them all,, and still no other coin can beat it.
Some of them knows by now what is the importance of bitcoin, thats why  others go back in bitcoin.

Too many fake pump on the altcoin will be end as soon as possible and they focusing on the bitcoin trade right now.

These are just pump and dump coins. Not many people will benefit from holding them.

Precisely my thoughts. Coins like these appear out of nowhere and don't particularly need legitimacy (I say this also holding a silly sum of an extremely silly alt that has no reason to live and rise in price other than because someone(s) involved in pumping it). Whatever it is, don't be naive and think you can get into the "game" unscathed. Focus on what's at play for the long term.

I do not think so. The proportion of bitcoin in the total digital currency is still dropping now.

He does indeed have a point, but you directly as well. Bitcoin has lost a certain percentage in regards to the totality of the crypto value, but that's not really surprising. If you look closely how things have gone lately, people (mostly those that do think forward) use altcoins to hedge Bitcoin. It may turn out to be a temporary thing, till Bitcoin finally has been updated to support larger blocks. If you look closely at the real world usage of altcoins, then it's clear that people aren't sitting in altcoins to use them. It's a pure hedge. Altcoins barely enjoy any usage worth mentioning.

That is correct. If you look at the top 100 alts before the big alt pump, the 100th alt had a market cap of around $1Mn,
Now they are trading at around double that. The alt dump is far from over.

Yes,its time now for bitcoin rally to begin again.The rally was postponed for few days due to BU.Now,its clear that BU is a failure and its clear that lots of rumours were spread to promote panic selling among new investors.Now its time for Bitcoin spaceship to take off.

I think the people are buying BTC now and its above $1100. As I have said, FUD spreading about the BU vs BTC schism seems to died down as the days goes by. So maybe they are just going back to btc to invest and try to profit. I don't know if the whales are still manipulating the market price of bitcoin behind, but by the looks of it they are now. Another factor I'm seeing that is causing the price of bitcoin to a steady rise is Japan acceptance of bitcoin. So its a combination of different parameters that makes the price of bitcoin jump now.

I think the whales are manipulating the price a bit less now.  Before, it was mainly altcoins that they were manipulating and Bitcoin more naturally followed.

hail bitcoins!

well, i'm the weakest link, man! I got stuck in ETH... this is so punk rock!

people always figure out what is FUD and what isn't in the end. it may not be clear to everyone in the beginning when that FUD comes out but it has always became clear eventually. and that is why they spread it in the first place, to create panic (fear and uncertainty) and create an opportunity for themselves that it could never exist without it.
and the main reason for this come back is the come back of everyone to bitcoin. when price is falling many get out of the market and stay on the side to find the bottom and become certain and then they get in which causes the come back and then it speeds up at some point when weak hands also join in once again.

That's true, when bitcoin was experiencing gradual fall in price naturally altcoins were manipulated by the big whales. The growth of alts by that time was found big making Bitcoiners to move towards altcoins. Now with the natural growth bitcoin gaining back the users who changed their bitcoins for altcoins to profit.

I didn't like the whole "Let's jump on the Ethereum train run!" either. :-\
If I were to go into anything into an alternate coin  I would put it into LTC now.
Cause it has just as long as bitcoin has and it is the one and only true alt of the mighty BTC! ;D

you can waiting for next train and it will help you to sell your ethereum in higher price, i think it would not too long to waited and make sure that you don't missed that time because the train is ready to go. i think this is not just for ethereum, but almost all altcoin will have increase price and we need to be patience.

You will see next redcandle in the next week. Expecting there will another attack from the BU shills and it will give another panic feels to the market.

Is this for real? I'm thinking that those shills already gave up and wants to back up while it is still early.

And I guess the price seems to be good again and there's more to go for the next week. But still expect, there will be fall again but it will be not the same.

people vying to compete for bitcoin lot. bitcoin price forecasts might be $ 1,500 in mid-2017 will become a reality. Well, so many people who sell altcoin they hold, to get bitcoin more and used as an investment.

I think Bitcoin can get up to $1500 easily this year at this pace. However, don't expect it to stay there. We will always see dips in price after big increases.

They're out of ammo for now. It's not the type of thing you can muster up week in, week out. To get the momentum they'd need you have to capture enough attention and hold it. That's now gone.

Yes, volatility of Bitcoin is crazy in these days and most people trying to make some extra money from this situation. It isn`t bad, but I believe that the market is very fragile at the moment due to potantion hard-fork that is ahead of us. Sooner or later some more news are going to leak to Internet which might bring an agressive dump to Bitcoin. I don`t want to be one of those people holding most f their asset in Bitcoin at that time. There is always risk in trading and you can win as big as you are willing to risk.

Probably this can happen and this is my expected price before selling. And for those people that are trying to sell some alts right now or did have a chance trying to shift to BU for sure they are feeling sorry right now or they are planning something again. What do you think the price again when people are going to dump?

Yessir, that's exactly what it looks like.  Poor Dash got slaughtered!  But I figured this was going to happen, because >$100/Dash is just f--ing ridiculous.  Even for a quality coin like Dash <ahem>.

And yeah, bitcoin is rebounding nicely.  Whee.  I just bought something with it, then the price spikes.  I need to learn to not sell bitcoin...

That's a good explanation for the price drops, and I add the fact that most coins recently pumped, with rare exceptions, have critical points of failure... instamine, centralization, scaling problems, among other things.

Alts have some value but there's nothing as stable as BTC.
BTC will be the most prominent crypto for the foreseeable future and therefore attracts the largest amount of interest.
Alts are popular too since they fluctuate the most and have the quickest profit returns when flipping them but practically speaking apart from a handful, most are just there to be used as a quick profit tool.
 

I just watch over top 5 coins which highest exchange rate on coinmarketcap, and It seems that only Dash shows significant decline after reach over $100 and continue to decrease after that. Byteball, Zcash, Dash, Ethereum and now come a new higher one , Jinn (Like Jinn in the bottle maybe : first impression :o). Right away after bitcoin climb up again  pass through $1100 and then unconfirmed transaction exceed 10K again, still affordable but as soon as bitcoin price increase, the problem come back and haunts. Whether those valid transaction or another mempool flooding, but we have to pay more fee and wait longer than usual for every single transaction.

There doesn't really seem to be any reason why people suddenly reinvest in bitcoin because nothing really happened to bitcoin recently.

Yeah the price is recovering a bit, but the fundamentals are still shaky so it's all hot air.

many came back to bitcoin after the initial altcoin dumps and those were good traders knowing what they do. but there are still two groups left, one is those bagholders still holding worthless altcoins even after the dump thinking it will be worth more!
and others are those who invested in other altcoins like Doge and Litecoin and Ripple and are still making profit from them specially litecoin since the other two have ended their pump.

it was being done from the very beginning .people bought altcoins at a very low price and when the price hit its all time they use to sell all the altcoins. with that profit they would buy the bitcoins and sell it in exchange for the fiat.

only weak hands got out and there is a reason for them coming back and that is the price itself, the panic sell and then panic buy.
and also there is nothing shaky about the fundamentals, at least i don't see anything anyways!

No, even they buy altcoins, they still trade bitcoin because they know if bitcoin get lost support surely the price bitcoin will down much.

Yes, they got out of ETH and went back to BTC... now behold! wait for the dump

There are a lot people that just convert all their hodlings back and forth. If the price of Bitcoin goes up, they immediately convert everything back to Bitcoin, that's how they operate.

Those with a bit more understanding are trading both altcoins and Bitcoin at the same time. These people don't limit themselves to doing one thing when they can profit from several things at the same time.

Dump of the ETH? Price reduction is happening right now. But I expect it won't drop below $40 where the next support is.

That is exactly how bitcoin trading works. Traders are selling the news, they were motivated by FUD about hard fork and ETF decline.
When FUD  turned out to be not important (as always) they decided that only bitcoin offers the best stability out of other cryptos.

people selling bitcoin to buy alts is a better headline.

If you are really following the price of bitcoin and alt coins you wont make a statement like this. The alt coin markets move when ever there is a price dump in bitcoin and when the price of bitcoin increases the price of alt decreases and it has being like that from the beginning and crypto currencies are really volatile and on a daily basis we could see a pump in one of the many alt coins we have and since we have a lot of coins it is difficult of follow everything to be frank.

I'm noticing same last couple of days. I have pretty good activity on alt coins trading site, last couple of days bitcoin price seens like upfront otherside most of alt coins going dump. I'm preey confident about that bitcoiin doing a great role in alt coins trading market.

I agree with you on this, but I guess people who are in for profit will just goes in and out of Bitcoin and altcoin if they see that it will give them profit.  Now that negative news about HF is fading, people are getting comfortable with Bitcoin again and with the shown increase in price begin to move their funds to Bitcoin again getting ready for new ATH and profit that they can get from Bitcoin  before going back to Altcoin for another batch of profit.

The recent days price increase of bitcoin happen due to the sudden moving of people towards bitcoin from altcoins. Now it seems to gain sustainability along with the market moves. Bitcoin moving good with the support of technology and​the increased acceptance compared to the altcoins that's been getting circulated.

the good news of bitcoin has brought them back. I mean the main concern is the good news and it will generate the value for bitcoin (pump or dump).

Firstly, there has been no good news that resulted in the price to increase again. It's just a normal market movement in current circumstances. Second, Bitcoin isn't really good news sensitive anymore as was the case back in 2013/2014 and the prior years. Bad news on the other hand, which in most cases isn't even bad news at all, still seems to influence the price in a negative manner. In that regard, for some reason a lot people still think that literally anything can happen with Bitcoin. I think the direct result of this is ignorance.

Amen to that. I am glad to read something objective around here.

actually good news is still as effective, the problem is that there has been no proper good news. but there have been many proper bad news (bfx hack, split FUD,...).

the good news that most people think is good has been a random small country on the other side of the world that nobody has heard about started accepting bitcoin. but in reality this is not big. so you can't expect a big effect from it either.
and if there is a big one, i assure you that the effect will be the same as the FUD that causes crashes.
for example the halvening, or the recent one about ETF. we saw in both cases (proper good news) price went up a lot.

I can honestly only think of one instance of good news having a direct effect on price and that was during the senate hearings on Bitcoin in 2013. When the old goats started to sound positive the price climbed $50-100 in seconds.

Even in that case I think they were looking for an excuse to explode more than anything. Bad news instantly affects everyone involved with BTC. Good news is usually some nice snippet that might take effect in 2-3 years if ever.

The only good news that I could see having a truly monstrous effect would be the confirmation of the happening of a non contentious scaling solution. That would be genuinely epic.

This. Alts originally were a way to get bitcoins cheap (you waited for the alt pump and sold).

However, there have been a couple of alts that appear to have staying power on their own, so we shall see what happens, especially when bitcoin's flaws become more and more apparent (a couple of days ago, when moving some bitcoin to an exchange, it took 1 hour and 45 minutes to get six confirmations, which is ridiculous - that kind of thing kills a coin expecially as there are now so many attractive alternatives).

It is really confusing only dash is the one to be on a the biggest downward spiral as opposed to the other alts that made their significant upward trends when bitcoin's price was on the decline.
Then again people have been saying dash is just a hype coin. But what was the hype behind it getting past $100 per coin in a mere two weeks. :-[

Yeah actually these are all those people who were scared of decrease in bitcoin price due to the possibility of hardfork. Many people invested in altcoins. But now as bitcoin prices are increasing, they all are coming back as there is no other better investment than bitcoin.

Countries (regardless of their importance/size) will not incorporate Bitcoin. That's one thing you don't have to focus on or dream about - it will never happen. At this point the only bit of good news that will massively bump the price as gentlemand also pointed at, is when pools finally reach consensus and allow Segwit to activate. It will mean that Bitcoin is finally able to move further. Everything else is not of any importance right now.

I literally just sold all my ETC and a bagful of DOGE in order to buy some more LTC.
Hopefully LTC will continue to rise (as segwit gets adopted) and the profit gained will be converted back into BTC.
This adds to what I originally said. I will stand by BTC as it will continue to retain its value. Other alts are good but nowhere near as reliable/predicable as the price of BTC is.
 

Until they realize the mempool is still full and transactions still take hours to verify (literally).

I don't think this recovery is going to last for very long until some drastic changes are made.

When the Core change the PoW as suggested by the core developer and activate the SW, then the price will drop a lot. I think altcoin is much safer.

I don't think so, I prefer to altcoin investment than Bitcoin, because we can
see the price increases or price movement of altcoin is faster than the movement of Bitcoin.
With market price movement is so fast then the profits will be faster too for us get it.

Worst move ever. Dumping ETC for a SegWit hype. Litecoin goes up because of SegWit not because of Litecoin. If SegWit doesnt moon litecoin, nothing will. Litecoin is a dead zombiecoin thats moving because of SegWit. It wont stay on this levels and we all know it.

It's also starting to become clear that it is a direct response to everything that is wrong with BTC (and by some large members of the community).

How ironic it will be if a huge part of LTC's adoption is because BTC is overly backlogged, and refuses to go with the community consensus to improve it.

This is the normal rule of market trading that when Bitcoin price is high then just buy Altcoin which are good and potential and whose price is down and when altcoin market is rising that time start selling altcoin and you are back in bitcoin. Like this both side profit earning. This is the golden rule followed by big traders and earning smartly.

i think this is what is happen in the market, people wants to raise their capital by sold their altcoin stock so they can have much more bitcoin and then they can exchange from bitcoin into fiat. i think its normal condition when we see that we can make big money by selling our bitcoin and this is what i am doing too when i look bitcoin price is increase high. if bitcoin price is increase then altcoin will be down for a moment and wait after bitcoin gets stable price and gets up again.

If the Core developers do not increase the block size, the price will not be much higher.

Another rise and fall in cryptocurrencies trading, it's normal cycle how the market suddenly change everyday. We love when bitcoin price increase but is it good decision to cash out or waiting for higher price, or else hold it until $2000.
When a good altcoin with low price but seems has potential to grow up, that is the right time to buy and for some coins it's already over when people sold and buy bitcoin. However, no need to panic because the cycle will be repeated again.

That is called fluctuation when we are talking about the price and  yes it is normal.  Altcoin value are not pegged to Bitcoin but to dollar so definitely when Bitcoin goes up, altcoin will be less in value, reason why many altcoin holders starting to sell their altcoin at the start of Bitcoin price increase.  Then rebuy when Bitcoin is about to decline or attain their target price to increase their altcoin holdings.  Veteran traders makes the best profit out of this event.

I'm think of getting rid of my ethereum and going into litecoin.
For now it is looking attractive but as we all know the tides can turn all so suddenly.
So be wary what you do with this alt coins.
Just have to go with the flow while they are riding high then dump them when it starts to look they are sliding
Just like the ship in the titanic. :-[

Of course they did, bcs they see that the price of BTC is more stable and every day is more higher than the previous day. Nobody won't to risk his money, and they know that btc is more credible than the other alts.

You forgot to mention that 90% of the alts died after a couple of years lol.
It very fun to watch historical snapshots on coinmarketcap.
So many alts dead, so many souls lost. So many players rekt and destroyed for ever.

Because some of alts is depending on the bitcoin price when the bitcoin price is decreasing alt price will be increase rapidly when they already saw that bitcoin price is pumped they will sold their alts to be sure that they will still earned profit.  And if im going to choose which coins i will be choosing i'll always choose bitcoin.

the thing is most people are new to altcoins, and they either don't know the history or don't look for it.
there have been lots of altcoins with the similar claims (e.g. talking about replacing bitcoin) and they got pumped a lot and the volumes were crazy but none of them are even around anymore.

and those who know this are silently trading and dumping these altcoins for newbies who buy them after the pump ;)

bbbut crypto 2.0 bbbuut good dev and some great marketing.
Muhhh undervalued  ::)

Choice is upto yours. Even altcoins may increase in price within some years but not compare to bitcoins however you may get the profit by that if you are a long term bitcoin holder stick to bitcoin itself. Sure you will be a millionaire within 10 years, It may 10000$ worth at that time.

yes that is right that there are also good potential alt coins whose prices are also expected to increase too much in a short period of time, but still i will like to say that bitcoin is more reliable than any other alt coin therefore we  can trust more on bitcoin than any other alt coin. therefore i think it is more better to invest in bitcoin rather than any other alt coin and specially when the rice of bitcoin is also expecting to increase more and more.

I prefer trading altcoin than trading Bitcoin, and I wouldn't move my altcoin balance to Bitcoin.
Because I see the price movement of altcoin is faster than price movement of Bitcoin. So by trading
altcoin we will quickly get the money. Of course it must be a great and profitable coin.

Correct that is also whatvi am doing, i stay to trade in altcoin than bitcoin,
Bitcoin trading is profitable but you can only earn small money while in altcoin you can maximize you earning because value is extreamly increasing but it is much higher risk.

Well altcoins were always safe haven for short time if btc slows,
but I think that some alts are really alts that people will keep supporting, wont get affected by btc, like ethereum.

that's right im thinking the same way that's how people doing their job in bitcoin. they make trade in alts and then after some pumping they're gonna sell it and invest in bitcoin . but I'm almost 4 years in bitcoin still i don't know how to be a trader. im always onto investing and i like to be a traders some day but there's a lot of method i must do . because being a traders is risky and so the investing also but id like to learn trading someday.

Remember if ethereum already included on the major altcoin which it has a big community behind it.

The price of ethere always get an effect for the bitcoin trend, while the bitcoin goes to the bullish and ethereum will be bearish in the future.

indeed, there's some alts which really working a part from btc as we knew that they played some roles coming out from
btc, alts like eth,xmr,xrp are coins which also working in progress even btc is rising back they can manage to keep
their value moving as well together with btc.

You can read your statement also like this.
Because the price movement of altcoin is so fast it means I can lose my money twice as fast as by trading bitcoins.

The part about "great" is funny but "profitable" only means you;re buying before the pump and dump it at the top.
Nothing , absolutely nothing different than what you;re supposed to do while trading bitcoin, oil, gold, shares...:).

none of these coins are moving with bitcoin, they are actually moving in the opposite direction. go fetch both the charts for each of these coins and bitcoin chart and put them on top of each other with same dates and you will see.

as soon as bitcoin price rises all of these altcoins are getting dumped down to nothing.

Bitcoin has become more stable than it used to be without a doubt and with more users it is difficult to manipulate the price like the did in the past and so is the reason we are seeing a stable price,but still if you are seeing a good alt with a good entry point it is always good to make some good money with it as you can see a pump almost everyday in the alt coin market.

The price of Bitcoin I think never be stable, we can see that in last week or last month
that the price will be down and rising fast, it's because the price of Bitcoin always be volatile.
IMO The people sellings altcoin and go back in Bitcoin just for long term investment.

Bitcoin is the best crypto currency for today, all the others are just its shadows and are only able to increase profits for a while.

I do not think they will survive till then because people will start forgetting them when they will find another altcoins with some new promises but bitcoin will stay strong always to challenge any altcoin.

Back to topic, I do hear now crypto users are moving on both the directions, but I am very much sure people who are leaving off bitcoin for entering altcoin will regret similar to how early adopters were regretting for missing opportunities.

Bitcoin is less volatile than the altcoins. Altcoins are highly volatile, which didn't get more attraction from large number of users. It is just used as a profit making token. Recently very few altcoins grow high and soon after this lot of bitcoin users moved to altcoins expecting profit and once again seeing the bitcoin price increasing started coming back.

Compare back then when bitcoins are not much distributed to different persons globally, this time is different and yes we can say that bitcoin today are less volatile. We can see and noticed that when there is an ongoing attempt to make the bitcoin price decrease. Somehow there are lots of times now that bitcoin withstand the deepest price low even the FUD was a major one.

Yes when there is a crazy movement on some of the alts, most traders taking advantage on it to make profit in the first place but it doesn't mean they will put their money in that coin for long term purposes. Still bitcoin is the one they preferred mostly in terms of long term investment. That's we called taking chances of every opportunity to earned a decent one.

they're doing it because they know that the price of bitcoin will pump anytime soon ive been selling my doge coins and investing all the money in bitcoin right now seems a good choice since this topic is started i read some facts that i know so thats the reason why im selling my altcoin and investing again in bitcoin . they're both cryptocurrency but dogecoin is much cheaper than bitcoin.

btc has no reason to pump mr permabull lol. It will only pump when scaling is solved. Not because of some people like to. Btc need to be "fixed" first.

That's the hard reality that people don't see, or don't want to see (not sure what is worse). Short term wise it means that we shouldn't expect any significant increase from current levels. I point more chances towards the price to go down, than the price to go up due to all the uncertainties around the potential hard fork. It's rare nowadays to find people with a realistic mindset here. Most people here are just dreaming away ignoring reality....

True. I think almost 95% of the people here are permabulls or 500k believers. I really fear for the day that those people start to dump because they face reality. To reach 95% for SegWit will take at least till the end of the year. The price will likely plumb or stagnate. We also need to be aware that not so many people here are objective. Permabulls want btc to go up because they only hold. Same for people with btc casino's, or btc magazines, btc mixers and I could go on.

It looks like to me that bitcoin and altcoins (top 5 ) are organs of a same body or better put it this way as their marketcaps are in sync and they share their marketcap like when BTC drops ETH and DASH/ MONERO and others increase as well but recently some whales went on ETH full frenzy simply by changing hands giving their bitcoins in exchange for ETH but then when ETH started to rise the same people now were holding bitcoins panicked and because of FOMO they went back into buying those ETH tokens and got literally manipulated by BTC whales and further in the road some people started to invest their fiat into ETH/ DASH and artificially pumped air into the bubble.

I mean damn these bitcoin whales arer smart eh?

yes actually people are expecting that very soon the price of bitcoin is going start increasing therefore they do not want to miss the opportunity and they are collecting their bitcoin they have invested in different places so as to hold them in form of bitcoin and when the price of bitcoin increase their saved bitcoins value also increase and they can get good profit.

To be fair the lines between Bitcoin and altcoin market caps are starting to fade and they're getting more independent.  I think it's a really good thing if it does happen because it shows that altcoins are starting to get viewed as separate coins instead of just ideas of things to trade with Bitcoin.

Well we're in for very bearish times ahead as stated by many people, it wouldn't hurt to sell a little bit and keep the rest of your Bitcoin. We might be seeing a trend reversal soon with all the gox-like spread on bitfinex and other exchanges and several other factors. I'd keep an eye out for Litecoin in the near future though, although price has pumped a little bit there could still be potential in it.

It is not just Litecoin. Almost all alts have been pumped massively.
If a reversal does happen, there will be bloodshed in the alt markets.

I do fully agree that whenever the bubble of altcoins market will burst it will be epic for many investors who are enjoying and going all in with those markets. Bitcoin is reaching to end the drama of Segwit/BU now that is what is prolonging the speculation. Bitcoin always gains whenever whether it goes little up or little down.

Some believes on the pontential of bu and other altcoins but they didnt know the true power of bitcoin and what it can do. Now people selling alts and going back to bitcoin because they realize how big profit bitcoin will give them.

I don't think about that, I would instead prefer to hold my profitable coins
than sell it for back to Bitcoin. With trading altcoin we will quickly get money than
trading Bitcoin, because the price movement altcoin is very fast. So, I love to trading altcoin.

That is very true. I was trading on yobit just a couple of days and there are a lot less people putting out buy orders now. I have also sold most of my altcoin so that I can buy Bitcoin.

The only people believing in BU are those connected to the BU gang, and people that are getting paid by them to troll the community. No one in his right mind aside from the mentioned types will ever support an amateurish proposal that is only meant to take over Bitcoin as we know it.

What gives you that impression? The price that has gone up yesterday and today? If so, then that's all due to the uncertainties around Bitfinex as people can't get fiat out anymore, and thus people buy Bitcoin to get their funds out of that exchange as soon as possible. If you look at how pumped altcoins still are, then it clearly shows that the money has not returned back to Bitcoin, and probably won't until Bitcoin finally operates larger blocks. People keep using altcoins as a hedge, which at this point is starting to turn into a hype. Near dead coins suddenly come back to life with massive amounts of volumes and 100-1000% increases in a matter of days.

This will happen sometime in the future. The altcoins are just like parasites living off Bitcoin's popularity. If you check the market cap vs user-base ratio, then alts such as Ether and Litecoin don't even have 1% of the number of users which Bitcoin is having. So there is nothing to justify the current market capitalization of these currencies.

It isnt about the people my friend. Its about the money $£¥. About the kaching kaching, about the kabling kabling. All about the moneyy whalemoneyyy yeahhh!

I'm glad that I sold my ETH and I did not have any damage, after the losses I had in December with many altcoins, I've been researching a lot before buying any altcoin.


I agree

I think that one of the very important reasons why we may see people dumping their alts and going back for bitcoins, is that there is not so small possibility for hard-fork to happen.
In the moment of fork, every bitcoin holder would still have his bitcoins ( BC-bitcoin core ) but also, he would gain the other bitcoins ( BU ).
That is why people dont want to miss their chance, to hop in also into BU without even big effort. All they have to do, is hold their funds stored in bitcoin,  to also jump on other ship, with different cryptocurrency.

It is not strange at all for me, after all, people want to diversify their wallets, which is a very good move for every investor/trader.

Yes, you need a bit of variety to earn. It's stupid to keep all the funds in one cell when you can try something new and make good money on it in a short period of time.

I think people is going to alt-coin just to get a leverage for a possible hard fork but it didn't happened, so now they are going to bitcoin investment again. Also diversification is also good, do not put all your eggs in one basket. That's why investors are putting some in altcoins as well.

Expectation arose when the price of few altcoins increased unexpected and ​at the same the capital volume got increased. This doesn't last long so the user who have been moving to yield some good profit started to invest on bitcoin in a short.

Yes, on alt-coin now you can earn more and then increase your investment in bitcoin or gold, well, it's enough to spend a little on yourself.

I think most of the alts are very overpriced now. For example, Ethereum has moved past the BTC0.04 level. The user base and the number of merchant sites accepting Ethereum doesn't justify such a high valuation.

Not all alts fell down after broken expectations of the fork and BU. But not all people gave up about alts and jumping back to bitcoin's train. I hold couple of LTC and it's price only grown since that time, so I don't plan to give up about it yet.

BU does only one thing that Core doesn't, it has a bigger blocksize. That's it. Core can change the blocksize without a fork if we needed it, but we don't. BU's paid terrorist organisation spams the blocks to make us think that we need it. We don't.

If you check altcoins' all time chart you'll see that most of them were sleeping for ages and suddenly woke up recently. When the game is over, whoever has woken them up will put them back into sleep again. So, if you have your profit, don't wait any longer, time to leave.

I heard the owner of the F2Pool claimed that his pool was DDosed because he did not support SegWit. Now he supports SegWit.

Mob business in crypto world.
They made him an offer he couldnt refuse.

Yes, it was a temporary game for diversity and a rapid increase in profits. Bitcoin is much stronger and everyone will return to him.

Yeah. Bitcoin is the beginning of all altcoin then investor will be going back when they are not getting any profit on other coin.

Deducing from your statement, pretty much there are still people who are in the process of converting bitcoin to alts and there are some that converting back to bitcoin because of the ride of bitcoin going up! and in my simple understanding about it is just normal that you are seeing people bounce back to bitcoin but you don't see that they are really bouncing back and forth, there are many Altcoins out there try to look at their value and see if they change in value or not!

Too many the newbies have did altcoin trade and the bitcoin whales has seen it as an opportunity to fool them with fake pump and grab more money from that. The bitcoin whales just use altcoin to generate more money.

this thread has been made almost 1 month ago when the price of altcoins was pretty low but currently is different because several altcoins such as ETH or Dash has pumped several times ago and i think the situations has change that people more likely concern for both of them because apparently altcoins and bitcoin has been pumped at the same time

It was very horrible, if the Bitcoin whales take advantage from newbie with a fake pump.
Do you know the signs or characteristics of a fake pump ? So all of us to be vigilant and cautious in trading.

What do you mean to say. Is this price pump for bitcoin is fake. No one would agree for your words I think. Trading would be option for newbies also to invest the money on it. They just need to learn the tactics to improve their skills in trading and simply need to read the price chart instantly make trading the value.

Just check the market capitalization of the altcoins and then compare the number of users each of these coins are having. If an altcoin which is having less than 10,000 users is achieving a market capitalization of $500 million, then the possibility is that it is a fake pump.

Market capital of altcoins too cannot be considered as a fake volume, because every bitcoin user will be holding few number of altcoins due to the decreased price. This serves to get hold of good capital market. I believe fake pumps were created during the start of the project to make good value for the token. Later on only the user increase helps the capital increase.

For me, there is still fake pumps in many alt-coins. Currently, they are all green, so it makes me wonder who are behind pumping the alt-coins again. But sooner or later they are going to dump, making newbies panic and sell as well because they are all afraid that they are losing their money. Newbies are really hit hard when this happens, so they need to watch and observed the market for such scenarios.

These people go back to btc because they've been exchanging their alts and they always thought that eventhough that it's a big help for them as profit. In my own idea on alts, there is nothing wrong on it as long as you've earned better and you saved your bitcoin for another future profitable investment just to grow your holding; then wow you are going to have bright future of bitcoin whether from alts or directly with bitcoin.

not true at all.
only traders hold altcoins, and that is only because they are trading those altcoins to make profit and not every bitcoin user is a trader, nor are willing to risk their money and bitcoin on something too risky such as altcoins.
i believe you are speaking from watching things from afar. if you get your hands dirty with some trades and some watching of the market, you can see things aren't so hunky dory as you think they are. there is a lot of manipulation in altcoin market and most people are losing money until they either get better at noticing these things or give up trying.

there is no way to know the amount of users involved for any altcoin, and for bitcoin either, so your strategy to find if it's fake or not doesn't work

usually a fake pump is something that resolve in a immediate dump or anyway the value return back where it was, and this is not the case of bitcoin

actually here it's the opposite there was a fake dump with bitcoin, and we are once again at $1200+

Eventually bitcoin will rise and so the bitcoin domination, from there ppl will mass sell unpopular alts and guaranteed that every alt out there will get a beating.
However some alts are growing at a steady pace and will be able to keep up with bitcoin's rise.

Lol you are just saying there is no way to check them.  You cannot get the number of users through this method.  Even altcoin with more than that users can fake pump the coin.  As what Amph said, fake pump eventually result to immediate crush when the orchestrator of the pump decide to exit sell and leave the market.

I was already aware that there is no any thing that bitcoin will go down permanently. I was aware that the drop of bitcoin is a slight drop and it will once again increase so I did not sold my coins and kept them with myself and I earned a good income from my money in bitcoin.

Most of the altcoins are meant for trading purpose. Recently during the price pumping of altcoins a lot of users moved towards it , but at the same time experts analyzed and stated this won't give sustained growth. So users will soon return back to bitcoin. Same as that the increasing price made all to come back.

Well, its a trend these days. When bitcoin prices are going higher people sell their alts to buy the bitcoins and on the other side, when bitcoin prices are low we see high in alt prices as people tend to move from bitcoins to altcoins.

I have noticed recently that new fiat money is being injected in bitcoin market while other alt coins held their marketcap stable or even increasing and the same time bitcoin's marketcap is rising and that shows community still has confidence and people are seeing that bitcoin doesn't easily bent to the manipulations and politics.
I remember a time when ETH pumped $1B then bitcoin's marketcap dropped the same amount and that was obvious wasn't it? but now we can see new investors are entering for BTC.

Fiat money is being pumped in to BTC only. The alts are not getting any investment in fiat. This can be confirmed from the volume of the BTC/USD trade against either the LTC/USD or ETH/USD trading pairs. Alts like ETH are not being brought for fiat currency such as USD and EUR. They are being purchased with Bitcoins. It means that short-term traders are investing in these alts, hoping that they will give them good profits.

many assume if bitcoin now becomes important because the price of the value that they can so that many are turning to bitcoin but now jiak btc have a problem sometimes but it never happened so the loss of it expired and we can continue the activities

Not for these days but it's just usual trend in crypto trade. If the price of bitcoin gets plunged and a lot of bitcoin traders try to get his profit through using altcoin. and other wise they will go back if the price of altcoin gets dumped and try to FOMO bitcoin and at the same time pumping the price of bitcoin.

That is right. I am sell some altcoin to get back to bitcoin.

I don't know about that, while some coins are nothing but an attempt to earn money by the developers , there are some solid altcoins out there doing very interesting stuff and getting investments because they have good technology and not only as a speculators vehicle.

Basically every altcoin is nothing more than some sort of a get rich quick tool. Coins get either blatantly premined by their developers, or they instamine their coin at the early stage. Main point is that the developers don't have any incentive to push their coin forward if they haven't got a significant stake in their own project. Let's be honest, the financial aspect is what has the highest priority, and not delivering something useful for the community on a voluntary basis.

It is only true in case of new altcoin. We had great coins in the past Litecoin, Dogecoin, even Ethereum - as I remember ETH was founded by a crowdsale.

Instamine is not necessarily the same as premine. But I agree, I don't like neither of these options.
But sometimes it is the only way for developers to achieve some monetary gratification for their job.

Community can be toxic as well. Nowadays crowd expect instant profits and super fast developing times. It is impossible.

Well nowadays there are ICOs(so many of them), like you said folks want to get rich quick so they invest in them. after missing ethereum train, no one wants to miss another train lol. btw ETH ICO price was 2000 ETH per BTC if i recall correctly, look at the current price. ::)

I can agree with Litecoin and Dogecoin, but I seriously doubt that the Ether ICO was completely sold to investors. I am not the only one with the thought of there being a huge load of Ether being fake sold, while they in reality were/are still in the hands of Vitalik & Co. It's pure speculation since there is no way to provide any actual proof to back it up, but everything around their ICO stinks.


Correct. First stage was 2000 Ether to 1 BTC ratio -- 0.0005 BTC per Ether. Second stage was 1337 Ether to 1 BTC ratio -- 0.000748 per Ether. It's mind boggling how its price has gone completely nuts lately. 1 BTC today buys you only 22 Ethers, LOL!!!

People really tend to sell alts to btc because bitcoin is the easiest way to convert from cryptocurrency to fiat. Those who have hold ETH now from when it was in the first stage must be feeling happy because they got huge profit out of it. What if someone still holds 2000 ETH he/she have bought at the first stage for 1 BTC? He/she might convert it now especially that bitcoin price is now or maybe he/she have done that long ago.

Glad I mined some Ethereum from the beginning. I still keep some of the mined coins.

That's reality to people now because from alts they only get few amounts and in btc they had plenty of it. That decision made by these people is not a very wise principles that they are having specially whe price actually drops, their earnings also declined. For this matters of investments like a business oriented person, I should not risk for a declining product amount and I should find a solution for the business product I had, so same as alts that generates bitcoin profit I am doing that. But for now while btc price is very progressive,  people from alts are coming back to re invest again for better profit.

In most cases, altcoin price are just a bubble.  So when this bubble burst, people who are involved on that altcoin will definitely convert their altcoin to Bitcoin thus the selling of alts to go back in BTC.  This process is a cycle so it will happen every now and then.

What if a Crapload of new bitcoin users decide to join that had previously only used altcoins? will btc value skyrocket? in my opinion no other coin is as good for the long term as bitcoin and i'm hoping the majority of altcoin users will start to swing towards that same opinion. if not then will bitcoin users start swing toward the same understanding that altcoin users seem to have for altcoin? im curious to see if there is another cryptocoin that is actually better then btc in the long run anyways.

Yes and the primary concern of investing in altcoins is to get more bitcoins so when they see hike in the price of bitcoins it will take no time for them to sell their altcoins and get bitcoins in return and that is a common practice in trading to make regular profits by growing their bitcoins.

Yeah, everything is still priced in bitcoin, it might be different if the majority of alts were priced in $ instead but right now everything is linked to btc and very few people get alts for the sake of those alts.

Some altcoins have risen in price for several months by 300 or more percent. Therefore, it makes sense to invest some money in alternative coins. Thus it is not necessary to forget that cryptocurrency is a risk

I think it will risen in price because of the fluctuating price of bitcoin, we can really see other altcoins are affected by it's movement and I think that many are simply investing to other altcoins now, but I think like I always do I investin both alts and bitcoin because there is a fluctuation in both of them that sometimes can bring you with earnings, but be very careful with investing over to alts, because of the legitimacy of other alts you can never know if they will dump or not.

Right now everything seems to be going up so it seems to me no one is selling to invest in bitcoin rather what we are seeing is new money being injected in almost any major currency and that means that you are making money no matter where you are in terms of your investments.

I heard some big investors are moving into Ethereum from bitcoin so the ETH price is rising more.